So, about Horoth's banishment...

[knightgf]

I have been told that General Horoth of the Tower of Despair raid has a no-will-save Banishment spell that affects those with either less than 450 HP(According to the wikia) or those who do not wear boots of anchoring.

Is it true that his banishments have no saves? And if so, is this a bug, and if not, why is it not a bug?

[Khurse]

I *think* there's a stun involved. You get stunned , you're auto critted and therefore banished.
That being said, I've never done the raid, so I'm not sure why I'm bothering to post...

[Shade]

Not true.

It has a willsave, DC around 32-40 depending on difficulty.

It hits the entire room, and you will roll a 1 eventually.. So boots or the mantle of the worldshaper are highly recommended if you want the last chest(S)

The mantle is actually superior as it absorbs some additional effects the banish does (called blasphemy, similar to the pnp version)
EG: Stun (not the entire room like the banish, but a very large aoe)

[knightgf]

Not true.

It has a willsave, DC around 32-40 depending on difficulty.

It hits the entire room, and you will roll a 1 eventually.. So boots or the mantle of the worldshaper are highly recommended if you want the last chest(S)

The mantle is actually superior as it absorbs some additional effects the banish does (called blasphemy, similar to the pnp version)
EG: Stun (not the entire room like the banish, but a very large aoe)

Ahhhh, I see. The only reason I would not want to wear boots of anchoring is that, later on, I plan on adding greensteel boots that boost hp and have greater regeneration, and I would hate to lose 25 HP for switching boots, as well as a couple hundred thousand plat on something thats bound.

On the other hand, if I was that desperate to avoid it, a Scarab of Spell absorption would be another viable option...the only thing I wear on my trinket slot is something that grants 5/evil, and I know that doesnt work at all in Devil's of Shavarath, so that could definitely be another option for me...

[Quikster]

Ahhhh, I see. The only reason I would not want to wear boots of anchoring is that, later on, I plan on adding greensteel boots that boost hp and have greater regeneration, and I would hate to lose 25 HP for switching boots, as well as a couple hundred thousand plat on something thats bound.

On the other hand, if I was that desperate to avoid it, a Scarab of Spell absorption would be another viable option...the only thing I wear on my trinket slot is something that grants 5/evil, and I know that doesnt work at all in Devil's of Shavarath, so that could definitely be another option for me...

Get a set of boots if you plan on doing the raid much, it will be much cheaper then a scarab. The scarab will get chewed up as there are many spells cast in there, and the blasphemy takes more than one charge. It wont kill you to lose 25 hp for 1 part of 1 raid, or put that item somewhere else.

[halls]

It's not the entire room, but the AOE is very large.

[Shade]

Get a set of boots if you plan on doing the raid much, it will be much cheaper then a scarab. The scarab will get chewed up as there are many spells cast in there, and the blasphemy takes more than one charge. It wont kill you to lose 25 hp for 1 part of 1 raid, or put that item somewhere else.

Boots are really only important to melee.

Mantle is easier to get, faster and more powerful for anyone who stays out of the other spells aoe range. Avoiding the stun can be critical for healers sometimes.

[Quikster]

Boots are really only important to melee.

Mantle is easier to get, faster and more powerful for anyone who stays out of the other spells aoe range. Avoiding the stun can be critical for healers sometimes.

While true, and I use the mantle on my cleric, something as simple as running in to give a mass aoe buff or an accidental sully agro can easily chew up the charges on your mantle. Toss in a sideways run due to lag or something and youre left with no protection. No I disagree, if youre going to run the raid much its a good idea to get a set of boots.

[SquelchHU]

I have been told that General Horoth of the Tower of Despair raid has a no-will-save Banishment spell that affects those with either less than 450 HP(According to the wikia) or those who do not wear boots of anchoring.

Is it true that his banishments have no saves? And if so, is this a bug, and if not, why is it not a bug?

I think they might be mixing up several things there. I never heard of banish only working on those with less than 450 HP. He DOES have a Power Word spell, and that would cause an effect similar to that. But that's not the same thing.

[Thailand_Dan]

It wont kill you to lose 25 hp for 1 part of 1 raid, or put that item somewhere else.

This. Remember the boots only need to be worn for the end fight, in this one quest, ATM. If you want to go with GS boots, go ahead. You can wear them for 99% of the time. And it is not like the regen is going to help much in that part (The HP would be nice, but I doubt you'll have time to regen if you go incap).

Things can always change, but that's how things are now. Don't sweat it.

[Shade]

While true, and I use the mantle on my cleric, something as simple as running in to give a mass aoe buff or an accidental sully agro can easily chew up the charges on your mantle. Toss in a sideways run due to lag or something and youre left with no protection. No I disagree, if youre going to run the raid much its a good idea to get a set of boots.

eh seems like pretty silly things to do. If you do that often i guess you run off the ramps in von6 often too. Keep ur ff boots on too lolz :)

Some 30ish completions on my casters since the patch. No boots. Never banished.

Had ppl die and horoth run around lots, but theres no reason he should go anywhere near you with some basic strategy. He should run straight for the other tanks that helped dps, who should be right on him, or right across the way on suulo.

Worst thats happened is sulo tankd died almost imediately and my CK agrod him, causing me to lose 1 charge to a chain lightning.. But was still fine after i ran away screaming for help heh.

Yea u cant run into horoth to prayer, but meh.. Your tank should live without a -1 dmg debuff. Often theres paladins to do it anyways.

Boot can be a good backup for screw ups sure. I just don't get that most ppl go for them first, considering the cost. Only arguement i understand is the fact you can farm them out the ingrds on your main and transfer the ingrds, while the mantle u do have to run your healer/caster thru a low lvl, abeit semi complex chain.

[Angelus_dead]

A few more details on Mantle.

It's an exclusive item with 5 charges, recovered 1 per rest, and a charge is expended when it blocks a spell effect (to which you are not otherwise immune). For example, Suulomade's lightning spell won't use charges if you have Evasion and pass the saving throw. His Fear spell will take a charge regardless of the save, unless you had a fear immunity on.

The Blasphemy spell has three effects, and could potentially take three charges. However, the paralyze only works on low level characters, and anyone reasonably in the raid is immune. The Banishment allows a will save, and passing that save means not using a charge for it. But the daze effect has no save, so it will always take a charge (unless maybe you get Earth Dragon).

[Quikster]

eh seems like pretty silly things to do. If you do that often i guess you run off the ramps in von6 often too. Keep ur ff boots on too lolz :)

Some 30ish completions on my casters since the patch. No boots. Never banished.

Had ppl die and horoth run around lots, but theres no reason he should go anywhere near you with some basic strategy. He should run straight for the other tanks that helped dps, who should be right on him, or right across the way on suulo.

Worst thats happened is sulo tankd died almost imediately and my CK agrod him, causing me to lose 1 charge to a chain lightning.. But was still fine after i ran away screaming for help heh.

Yea u cant run into horoth to prayer, but meh.. Your tank should live without a -1 dmg debuff. Often theres paladins to do it anyways.

Boot can be a good backup for screw ups sure. I just don't get that most ppl go for them first, considering the cost. Only arguement i understand is the fact you can farm them out the ingrds on your main and transfer the ingrds, while the mantle u do have to run your healer/caster thru a low lvl, abeit semi complex chain.

Meh you may think its a silly thing to do, but there are plenty of reasons to.

The biggest thing imo is lag. Lag has been getting worse and worse in tower on my server. Last night was lagtastic yet agian. Dont want to get boots, fine, dont whine when you get banished. Its really that simple. Ive run bards, clerics, melee in there tons of times. There are many times a mantle or scarab get wiped out. Even having boots doesnt guarantee saftey from banishment so why risk it?

[Shade]

Meh you may think its a silly thing to do, but there are plenty of reasons to.

The biggest thing imo is lag.

I don't believe lag can make your character move.

What makes your charater moves is your input on the keyboard.. If your lagging your character can't move clienside (its actually very well designed compared to allot of mmos out there), but if you hit the keys they will still send to the server, so after the lag is done, you will move where you indicated. I've played this game allot and seen y share of lag, and never ever seen otherwise.

Yea I get that most ppl don't understand those deeper internal mechanics, but if you do, you would never move into undesirable places due to lag.

[Shade]

The Blasphemy spell has three effects, and could potentially take three charges. However, the paralyze only works on low level characters, and anyone reasonably in the raid is immune. The Banishment allows a will save, and passing that save means not using a charge for it. But the daze effect has no save, so it will always take a charge (unless maybe you get Earth Dragon).

Dunno about that.

I've never ever seen the mantle use more then 1 charge per banish, in 30+ runs.

Usually im on my sorc, who really doesn't have a very good willsave either - I don't even wear a wisdom nor a resistance item! and I usually stand well within the stun range. Maybe I'm simply rolling really well but I dunno, seems rather lucky.

Most every spell in the game will only use 1 mantle charge. Scarabs are diferent in taht they often use many many charges per spell.. Depends on spell level and how its coded, there very different tho.

I know some rarer boss effects will use multiple charges, but i've yet to see his blasphemy do so, maybe im just lucky but I doubt it.
Couple rare boss attacks that use lots:
Velah Dragonbreath - 2 per breath hit (1 to avoid mark, 1 to avoid dispel, damage cannot be absorbed, you can see this happen in my video)
Abbot Inferno - 1 per tic, and somehow it seeps thru (generally uses 4 charges total, but even after its over with 1 charge remaing, the inferno sometimes hits me unles I remove curse)
DQ multi blade finalle summon - Put up 5 blades at teh end, so mantle will handle all 5 at once, depleting all charges, but also avoiding all damage (you can see me do this in my video)

[toughguyjoe]

Not true.

It has a willsave, DC around 32-40 depending on difficulty.

It hits the entire room, and you will roll a 1 eventually.. So boots or the mantle of the worldshaper are highly recommended if you want the last chest(S)

The mantle is actually superior as it absorbs some additional effects the banish does (called blasphemy, similar to the pnp version)
EG: Stun (not the entire room like the banish, but a very large aoe)

The Bolded section is incorrect. I have run multiple ToD on normal and hard with no boots. I kept to the back of the room near the portals, while Horoth was tanked near the opposite wall. Never made a save against Banishment, Never was dazed, and never was paralyzed. I believe it is safe to say His Blasphemy Spell(Which provides all of those nasty effects) Has a range that is in fact Shorter than the size of the room.

Obviously it gets the clerics or casters who are healing the Main Tank...And usually we try and stay as far away and still able to heal as we can. My experiences would say that the Blasphemy a fixed area of effect, that is about the same as the max range on a Heal spell.

I might be wrong, but I KNOW that i've never made a save on Banishment, and I used to run two toons with no boots as Orthon cleanup/Suulo kiting(or tanking) and stayed on the opposite side of the room as Horoth. I doubt this was luck.

[Arlith]

Get the boots. Scarabs will get expensive if you runthe raid a lot. Even in a high DPS group, if he does the banish/blasphemy right off (and he does on occasion) it is possible for him to hit you three times. That's 21 charges.

Everyone who wants to run the tower, regardless of class, should try for the boots. Although a caster/kiter could get away with a mantle/scarab easier than a melee.

My own opinion - ymmv.

While on the subject, has anyone ever noticed the banish/blasphemy go off after completion? Happened to us a little over a week ago. Horoth was dead, we were all around the chest to open it and BAM, we are all stunned and one of the group gets banished. Just wondering if anyone else has ever experienced that.

[knightgf]

Get a set of boots if you plan on doing the raid much, it will be much cheaper then a scarab. The scarab will get chewed up as there are many spells cast in there, and the blasphemy takes more than one charge. It wont kill you to lose 25 hp for 1 part of 1 raid, or put that item somewhere else.

Good point.

I have not ran the raid yet, of course, nor have I made my GS boots yet, but I think it would be a good idea to get the boots anyways, just to be on the safe side. After reading this, I've learned a lot more about what im up against, and I would like to say thanks to all your players. Having to run back to the quest after being banished really does suck, and its better to be safe than sorry.

Plus, I probably will not be in as much danger anyways, since I will probably end up staying back and tossing mass cure moderates rather than being up front and having the chance of being aniliated as a squishe. Reason being: most of the time, while running Shroud, I usually end up staying back and throwing mass moderates since as a bard, while I can survive a meteor swarm, there are many different things that can go wrong after that and its just not worth risking a death for it.

[Hydro]

Unless you are a Paladin you should be wearing Madstone boots almost full time. If you don't have the boots yet I would reccomend farming the Reaver raid for them. The hidden madston proc and clicke is more str and the fastest swing speed buff in the game (5% faster then haste). I generally would reccomend a hp item to be in either cloak or gloves. Both have pro's and con's but I personally prefer cloak and I can swap in a mantle as needed.

[SquelchHU]

Get the boots. Scarabs will get expensive if you runthe raid a lot. Even in a high DPS group, if he does the banish/blasphemy right off (and he does on occasion) it is possible for him to hit you three times. That's 21 charges.

Everyone who wants to run the tower, regardless of class, should try for the boots. Although a caster/kiter could get away with a mantle/scarab easier than a melee.

My own opinion - ymmv.

While on the subject, has anyone ever noticed the banish/blasphemy go off after completion? Happened to us a little over a week ago. Horoth was dead, we were all around the chest to open it and BAM, we are all stunned and one of the group gets banished. Just wondering if anyone else has ever experienced that.

I've never personally seen this. But it sounds like a simple extrapolation of the queued attack bug. If you want to see that in action just keep killing stuff. Eventually you'll see it cast spells after it's already dead. That combined with a hefty amount of DPS lag, and I don't doubt it at all.

[Halock]

Just throw in my 2c, the boots arnt vitally important if you have a high wis save + spell resitance cast on you. In 5 runs without boots i lost a total of 0 charges on my scarab ( lvl 18 monk at the time of those runs ) tho 1 of those runs i was on kite duty.

Not saying you shouldnt try to get the boots, just that there's no need to be afraid of the raid if you dont have them, thats been my experience anyways.