How useful is Divine Healing?

[Antheal]

With Divine Healing III at level 11, it should be an average of ~90 HP restored over 30 seconds, is it worthwhile having extra Charisma and Turn Undeads to take advantage of this free healing?

What about taking the Extra Turning Feat to be able to use it another 4 more times, if you're a non-Halfling character who can't take the Dragonmark?

[Angelus_dead]

It has very low value. At level 11 you could toss off a Heal scroll for 110+ points in under 6 seconds.

If a Heal scroll seems expensive to you, that's because you're new. An established player would be happy to give you 100 as a gift. It would be a mistake to spend permanent character-building resources (charisma) to get something that'll be obsoleted by collecting plat.

[AAAFate]

to be honest, you don't need an Cha as a Cleric, turning undead is useless everywhere but very low levels, it makes your party have to chase down enemies and sometimes you can't progress till you kill then all kinda deal it's just a mess...DH as the person said before is useless, and DV? not worth putting points in Cha. Although people will think you're the worst for not having it, but I roll with a 6 Cha just fine with 1 turn attempt maybe 2 at times. And I don't waste any enhancements/feats on any turn related thing.

[guardianx2009]

the common acceptance is that Divine Healing is no good, DV is better. I've used both DV exclusively and DH exclusively. DV is good, great for casters obviously. But I found DH very useful me. So far I've been using in lieu of DV up Level 10. I found it saves me alot of SP. I'll DH's first before throwing any cures. Anything that saves SP and lets me provide heals effectively is great in my book.

I have 5 DHs with a base cha of 8. I wouldn't invest into cha over wis of course, but it costs nothing to throw on a +2/+4 cha item, if you happen to come across one. That's an instant extra 1 or 2 DH's. a modest action pt investment here and there is all you need. And action points can always be reprioritized if something else more important is needed.

[phalaeo]

A lot of people think it's worthless, but I rather like it and have taken three tiers of it on my Cleric. It's no good for raid or intense battle healing, but it's a great band-aid. No SP cost, heals through walls and doors and hits WF with no WF healing restrictions.

TBH, I think it's a matter of preference and playstyle. The arcanes I play with seem to make it to each shrine with SP still in the blue and I play with a lot of WF melees.

There are a few raid/high intensity healing situations where I've particularly found it useful-

1. WF tanks in VoD. They're usually being healed by the Arcane throwing Reconstruct, but I use it to help cushion-heal in between Recons.

2. Same for WF "Tanks" in Hound.

3. In Shroud, if I'm still working on my puzzle and I see someone running water at half-health, I throw it on them because it works through walls.

I also like it for Crucible (healing those on valve duty who get plinked by the archers), Quests like Delera's and Wiz-King (getting locked in a room), and quests where people fall through floors (Wiz-King, etc.).

[AAAFate]

I was unaware of DH working through walls and doors where people can get trapped, does DV work the same way? or rather do all the turn undead attempt abilities work this way?

[Antheal]

I think I'd like it because it doesn't require line of sight, I found that out one time in Redmption on Korthos, someone spoke to Lars Heyton before I'd reached them and I was the only healer - my Divine Healing was the only thing that worked on Lars through the forcefield. Do scrolls or wands require line of sight to use? I've never tried.

Also, when you're in a tavern you can throw it on people who have just recalled to their bind point with 1 HP as your Turns fully recharge to after a couple of minutes.

Sure it's no use in the heat of battle, but as you're walking around it may be useful for saving some SP or scrolls?

Plus it helps Warforged pretty well, if I didn't want to take the Dragonmarks of Making.

[phalaeo]

I was unaware of DH working through walls and doors where people can get trapped, does DV work the same way? or rather do all the turn undead attempt abilities work this way?

DVs do not work the same way. DH working through walls and enclosures is proximity based, though. You can't just heal someone anywhere in the instance. It has to be within a certain range.

Go test it with a buddy in the Lobster. Get in the brawl area and take your friend down to half health and then stand up top where you won't be disturbed. Send the friend around the corner into the Tavern proper and then toss a DH on him. It'll work. :)

[Fenrisulven6]

the common acceptance is that Divine Healing is no good, DV is better. I've used both DV exclusively and DH exclusively. DV is good, great for casters obviously. But I found DH very useful me. So far I've been using in lieu of DV up Level 10. I found it saves me alot of SP. I'll DH's first before throwing any cures.

Same here. I used to think DH was a waste of enchancement points, until I started playing around with it. And I like the idea of carrying around enhancements that help MY mana pool, instead of carrying maxed DVs for the sorc.

Also, I like to use it as a warning - "you rushed ahead into the mob or trap and come back to me with almost no health? Here's some slow heals so you can wait in the back and think about what you should do differently" :D

[AAAFate]

Max DH is up to 150 (taking the higher end of the averages) HP right? does it benefit from any other enhancements or anything? to make it more?

[Fenrisulven6]

One thing I wish is that DH continued after you reached max hit points. Not above your max total, but as insurance against the one-shot crit kill.

Ex: Rogue fails evasion and is reduced from max hp's to -12, but the DH is still on its timer so he gets whatever increments are left [bringing him out of the negatives]

[Daggaz]

DV is infinitely superior (tho I dont have it on my cleric for good reason) and the reasoning is simple.

Without going into the exact math, you can basically shoot a lot of SP into a nearby caster. The exact amount doesnt matter, because the following is 100% accurate. If its an arcane, they are going to lay down the pain on the next few mobs, perhaps instantly vaporizing them even. This is that much less pain those mobs are going to lay down on the group. I guarantee you they just saved you more SP in heals than the value of DH. If its a divine, well there is simply no contest. A solid DV cleric pumping my mana gives me more than enough to quite a few high level spells. A single mass heal will cure everybody in the group for 400+ hps. Thats far more than you will do with your DH.

Always think in terms of the group, its team play and thats what counts.

[Shaftronics]

Win win situation can also be 2 clerics who are DV-ing each other. Total powerhouses I tell ye.

[GhoulsTouch]

A cleric that doesn't have divine healing, vitality, and cleansing is only making his job harder in my opinon I took the extra turning feat just for that purpose on mine. If a player is running off low on Hp drop a heal and a DH on him as he runs off to nurse his wounds so you can stick around to heal those actively engaged in combat.

Having enough charisma for divine enhancements and to turn in which there are pretty much all sorts of ways to buff your turning is a good idea. At low levels they run but at higher levels they burn in your radiance with a proper turning ability and buffs. But even if they turn tail on you its better then having to waste all your healing when they mob up and pin in on a essential party member.

Watch your clerics mana when your party faces undead. Notice that being the undead take much longer to kill his spell points start to noticably dwindle. When his spell points run dry and he never drops a divine healing on you or a DV on the paladin, bard, or FVS so that they may heal themselves or others, he becomes a gimp of a fighter or a wand whipping, plat draining down on his luck sort of guy.

I'd rather run with a weaker melee build cleric then a battle cleric without Divine enhancements where with those who can cast small heals for emergencies feel more at leisure to do so whether upon their own person or another in the group. Not to mention the joy arcanes get in being allowed to painlessly cast more in order to help ensure party survival.

Alot of clerics take dex or strength as their dump stat and weild a sheild, perhaps even a tower...some resourceful ones may even use their high charisma to buff intimidate rather then diplomacy and indulge in toughness feats alongside sheild mastery to draw fire while all lay in on the mobs. A Divine Stalwart Defender if you will.

[Antheal]

Also, the Divine Cleansing ability sounds like it could be very useful as a free Panacea spell. Does it have any flaws compared to Panacea other than not restoring the bare minimum of HP?

[Shaftronics]

As a Battle Cleric, I simply do not have that much DVs to give away, so instead of Divine healing or DV's, I usually use Divine Cleansing instead. Though, later on, such cases are rare, as people usually either carry their own cures or are simply immune/going to make a save against it anyway. But its always handy to have.

[r3dl4nce]

And I like the idea of carrying around enhancements that help MY mana pool, instead of carrying maxed DVs for the sorc.A stack of heal scroll help your mana pool and is way more useful. DV can refill the mana pool of a sorc/wiz to kill the last mobs...

[Antheal]

Divine Vitality III at level 9 is supposed to do 7d4+10 right? So with 10 Turnings, you should be able to restore somewhere between 250-300 SP per rest to another character.

Proportionately, it may not be that much for another magic user - but what about for a Bard, Ranger or Paladin? Could they potentially get a greater benefit from a Cleric who has invested some of their restorative potential into the Tunings line to assist their team-mates of those classes?

[Kriogen]

Both Divine Healing and Divine Vitality are a waste. In a weak group at low/mid levels it sounds as a good idea. But thats about it.

CHA is a waste on a Cleric with the exception for Divine Might. So for War Priest. But even here i'd be carefull not to neglect other much more important stats.

So if you have a caster Cleric and have high CHA, then reroll/reincarnate. More Wis/Con will help you and your party much, much more. More durable (dead cleric is just dead) and better spell DC (better crowd control and insta-kill spells). Even Dex would be better for better Ref saves. Or boost your Str and go chop/bash things. Sword/mace is mana free :)

[phalaeo]

Divine Vitality III at level 9 is supposed to do 7d4+10 right? So with 10 Turnings, you should be able to restore somewhere between 250-300 SP per rest to another character.

Proportionately, it may not be that much for another magic user - but what about for a Bard, Ranger or Paladin? Could they potentially get a greater benefit from a Cleric who has invested some of their restorative potential into the Tunings line to assist their team-mates of those classes?

I've DV'ed Rangers and Bards....absolutely.

To whoever said that you need to do what will benefit the group the most- I agree. But benefitting the Arcane's mana pool is not always the best benefit to the group.

Divine Cleansing is great for lower level characters and first timers with no twink plat. To me, it's useless and I spec it out as soon as I can.

[Antheal]

Both Divine Healing and Divine Vitality are a waste. In a weak group at low/mid levels it sounds as a good idea. But thats about it.

CHA is a waste on a Cleric with the exception for Divine Might. So for War Priest. But even here i'd be carefull not to neglect other much more important stats.

So if you have a caster Cleric and have high CHA, then reroll/reincarnate. More Wis/Con will help you and your party much, much more. More durable (dead cleric is just dead) and better spell DC (better crowd control and insta-kill spells). Even Dex would be better for better Ref saves. Or boost your Str and go chop/bash things. Sword/mace is mana free :)

I know that at character creation, the first 6 stat increases cost 1 point, the 7th and 8th increase both cost 2 points and the 9th and 10th stat cost 3 points each.

So with a 28-point Cleric, you could put the maximum of 16 creation points into Wisdom to get a stat of 18 (or 16 if you're Warforged), and have enough left over for the minimum of 6 creation points into Constitution for a stat of 12-16 (depending on race), and still have 6 points left over for Charisma for a stat of 12-14 (or 16 if you're a Drow).

[r3dl4nce]

full caster cleric = 18 wis, not 1 single point less

[rest]

I used DH for a while when I was leveling up. I have since stopped using it. All my turns are for Divine Intervention. (all 5 of them! woo! go dwarf cleric!!)

[MalikiGoddess]

I love DVs on my cleric. I didn't put too many points into Charisma, but I did take the extra turning feat. The way I look at it is...DH-Cure pots are cheap, get some to save your own ass if I can't get to you...DC-Pots people! Use them! These are cheap too...DV-Mana pots are insane expensive and only available on the AH or random drops. So, thats why I went with that line.

Also, I have been in a number of raids where the clerics DVing each other has saved from party wipes or helped us get that last bit of mage power to rip the last few HPs off the main boss.

[Antheal]

That's a good point. Being able to give another Cleric enough SP for an emergency Blade Barrier or Mass Heal could mean all the difference in the heat of battle...

[Hafeal]

Tried 'em all at one time or another. When the level cap was 10, they made more sense. Unfortunately their power has not increased as the level cap was raised to 20. So, beyond 11th level or so, I keep a min. of dv's for emergency use (and they do come in handy) ... but I spend my enhancement points elsewhere.

As for DH, it does not make much difference as there are so many other ways to get healed in this games for those conditions.

Overall, I would advise you to take the 1st, maybe second tier of dv's and skip DH.

[Nezichiend]

So if you have a caster Cleric and have high CHA, then reroll/reincarnate. More Wis/Con will help you and your party much, much more. More durable (dead cleric is just dead) and better spell DC (better crowd control and insta-kill spells). Even Dex would be better for better Ref saves. Or boost your Str and go chop/bash things. Sword/mace is mana free :)

My cleric has a 28charisma, 40wis, 28 con, 2500sp and 518hp.

Should I reincarnate?

P.S. I kinda cheated... Took 18/1sorc/1FvS (it works really really well I tell ya!! No cap though, but meh)

[phalaeo]

Tried 'em all at one time or another. When the level cap was 10, they made more sense. Unfortunately their power has not increased as the level cap was raised to 20. So, beyond 11th level or so, I keep a min. of dv's for emergency use (and they do come in handy) ... but I spend my enhancement points elsewhere.

As for DH, it does not make much difference as there are so many other ways to get healed in this games for those conditions.

Overall, I would advise you to take the 1st, maybe second tier of dv's and skip DH.

And I would advise you to take a tier or two of each and see how much either DH or DVs (or both) fit your playstyle and the type of groups you usually join.

Decide for yourself- at this time, you can respec enhancements every three days anyways. It's not like you're locked into your decision. Hell, I used to switch out enhancements every three days while learning the Cleric class just to see where certain practical efficacy breakpoints were.