Questions bout Tempest Build...

[KaplanPD]

I was browsing the forums and noticed this starter build posted by Tihocan...
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=2800940&postcount=16

Tihocan you always help me out, along with a lot of other new players too im sure. Anyways so maybe if and when you see this you can further assist me, if not, others please advise...

The question I had is that when leveling this Tempest build, I noticed a recommendation of putting skill points into UMD, Open Locks, and Spot. If a player wanted the ability to disable traps also, what would one do as far as skill points are concerned? Would going four ways (UMD,Open Locks, Spot, Search) be the thing to do? This is assuming the players using a Drow (intel base 10) and possibly an intel item+fox's cunning wand+enhancements (if need be). Or is it not worth it in the long run to use skill points for search/disable trap.

Also, is there a cap that the disable traps/search skills need to be at to more efficiently use those skills? I noticed on hard/elite difficulties I can rarely use search let alone disable without not finding the door or blowing the trap box. In the end this boils down to me being confused, because I used the Tempest Drow build, and I get frustrated that I cannot disable traps/search as effectively as I want to. Is there anything that can be done to help me out?
Inquiring minds want to know!

Thanks.

[Newtons_Apple]

I was browsing the forums and noticed this starter build posted by Tihocan...
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=2800940&postcount=16

Tihocan you usually help me out (and a lot of other new players) anyways so maybe when you see this you can further assist me.

The question I had is that when leveling this character, I noticed you recommended putting skill points into UMD, Open Locks, and Spot. If a player wanted the ability to disable traps also, what would one do as far as skill points are concerned? Would going four ways (UMD,Open Locks, Spot, Search) be the thing to do? This is assuming the players using a Drow and possibly an intel item+fox's cunning wand+enhancements. Or is it not worth it in the long run to use skill points for search/disable trap.

Also, is there a cap that the disable traps/search skills need to be at to more efficiently use those skills? I noticed on hard/elite difficulties I can rarely use search let alone disable without not finding the door or blowing the trap box...

Inquiring minds want to know!

Thanks.

You'd have to add a 5th skill - disable device. Open locks only unlocks things.

[KaplanPD]

I've added points into disable device, it's currently at a 7, i believe. My intel is 10+1 (still level 4), and on normal content it's no problem. It's just that every now and then on normal difficulty, I can spot the door/trap but cannot locate the box. And when/if I do, it might blow up unless I use that 20 sec. boost I get from 1 rogue level. Don't even get me started on hard/elite difficulties...

Any ideas?

[Pwesiela]

The question I had is that when leveling this Tempest build, I noticed a recommendation of putting skill points into UMD, Open Locks, and Spot. If a player wanted the ability to disable traps also, what would one do as far as skill points are concerned? Would going four ways (UMD,Open Locks, Spot, Search) be the thing to do? This is assuming the players using a Drow (intel base 10) and possibly an intel item+fox's cunning wand+enhancements (if need be). Or is it not worth it in the long run to use skill points for search/disable trap.

Also, is there a cap that the disable traps/search skills need to be at to more efficiently use those skills? I noticed on hard/elite difficulties I can rarely use search let alone disable without not finding the door or blowing the trap box. In the end this boils down to me being confused, because I used the Tempest Drow build, and I get frustrated that I cannot disable traps/search as effectively as I want to. Is there anything that can be done to help me out?
Inquiring minds want to know!

Thanks.

He doesn't recommend getting search and DD because these skills are based on int, while the character build is not. Because of the relatively low int, you're only going to get so many skill points per level, and you have to make a value call as to what you value most. Open locks is a nice add to the build because you're going to have a decent dex and the build has the skill points to gain it, while still having other critical skills covered (balance). Personally, I feel you can drop concentration and haggle and get the search and DD if you really want. But these skills would be sub-par and should only really be used if you don't have a rogue in the party. So, short answer, yes you could if you wanted.

As for what can be done to improve your search and disable skills, be sure to have the highest int possible and to carry +5 thieves tools. They have no minimum level, and are quite plentiful. You could also consider grabbing the first level of rogue skill boost for the more difficult ones. But keep in mind that elite generally means elite, and that disable focused characters are going to have a much better chance and getting them. This is much more of a melee build than a traps build. The rogue was added mainly for the UMD boost, with OL as an added bonus.

[Pwesiela]

I've added points into disable device, it's currently at a 7, i believe. My intel is 10+1 (still level 4), and on normal content it's no problem. It's just that every now and then on normal difficulty, I can spot the door/trap but cannot locate the box. And when/if I do, it might blow up unless I use that 20 sec. boost I get from 1 rogue level. Don't even get me started on hard/elite difficulties...

Any ideas?

I'll just re-iterate from what I said just above. This build is a melee build with rogue added for survivability (UMD) and the nice little flair of getting to open locks in the way. Serious rogue skills were not intended. You'll need to modify your build and gear for max ability, but then you'd be less of a tempest.

[KaplanPD]

I'll just re-iterate from what I said just above. This build is a melee build with rogue added for survivability (UMD) and the nice little flair of getting to open locks in the way. Serious rogue skills were not intended. You'll need to modify your build and gear for max ability, but then you'd be less of a tempest.

No point in reaching for apples in a tree that's too high for me, eh? I can definately see where the Open Lock skill comes into play, as that skill is based off DEX not INT. But would I gimp this build that much if I spread the SP five ways ? As far as importance I see it as (UMD, Spot, Open Lock, Search/Disable Device). Or would I actually feel a difference if I just upped UMD, Spot, Open Lock ? I don't plan on spending too much on anything else. (Still gonna go all out on STR, use the recommended enhancements, etc). I know I'm asking for a lot from this build, but again, I'd rather ask then do it and be stuck @ lvl 15 with a sub-par tempest. Please advise.

[Bobthesponge]

No point in reaching for apples in a tree that's too high for me, eh? I can definately see where the Open Lock skill comes into play, as that skill is based off DEX not INT. But would I gimp this build that much if I spread the SP five ways ? As far as importance I see it as (UMD, Spot, Open Lock, Search/Disable Device). Or would I actually feel a difference if I just upped UMD, Spot, Open Lock ? I don't plan on spending too much on anything else. (Still gonna go all out on STR, use the recommended enhancements, etc). I know I'm asking for a lot from this build, but again, I'd rather ask then do it and be stuck @ lvl 15 with a sub-par tempest. Please advise.

max UMD as that is the most useful for survivability (heal scrolls, raise dead/resurrect scrolls and fire shield scrolls are very nice to have). since you don't have much int i would suggest you concentrate on the open lock (dex based) and then balance or some other survivability skill. unfortunately with a 10 starting int you will not be able to diable many traps past the first few levels.

[Flaggen]

Here is a build that I started a few days ago. It seems to play pretty well so far. It took a lot of inspiration from Tihocan's build, and he even checked it out on the forums prior to me officially rolling it. It does get Spot, Search, DD, and UMD maxed. The suggestions I had gotten said that OL at 14 would open most doors for me. Thought I'd share it if you wanted to take a look at it.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(1 Fighter \ 1 Rogue \ 18 Ranger)
Hit Points: 332
Spell Points: 265
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 16
Will: 6

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 21
Dexterity 14 16
Constitution 16 18
Intelligence 12 12
Wisdom 10 10
Charisma 6 6

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 6 11
Bluff -2 -2
Concentration 3 4
Diplomacy -2 -2
Disable Device 5 24
Haggle 2 2
Heal 0 0
Hide 5 6
Intimidate -2 -2
Jump 3 6
Listen 0 0
Move Silently 6 7
Open Lock 6 14
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 1 1
Search 5 26
Spot 4 23
Swim 3 5
Tumble 3 4
Use Magic Device 2 24

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Enhancement: Ranger Energy Resistence Boost I
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Resistance I


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Energy Resistence Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 6 (Fighter)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Spring Attack
Enhancement: Ranger Tundra Lore I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Enhancement: Ranger Swamp Lore I
Enhancement: Ranger Desert Lore I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II


Level 8 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I


Level 9 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II


Level 10 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II


Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III


Level 13 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III


Level 14 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Resistance II
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II


Level 15 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense II
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II


Level 16 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness IV


Level 17 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Construct
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild III


Level 18 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Use Magic Device
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack II


Level 19 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage IV


Level 20 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense III
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest III

[Pwesiela]

No point in reaching for apples in a tree that's too high for me, eh? I can definately see where the Open Lock skill comes into play, as that skill is based off DEX not INT. But would I gimp this build that much if I spread the SP five ways ? As far as importance I see it as (UMD, Spot, Open Lock, Search/Disable Device). Or would I actually feel a difference if I just upped UMD, Spot, Open Lock ? I don't plan on spending too much on anything else. (Still gonna go all out on STR, use the recommended enhancements, etc). I know I'm asking for a lot from this build, but again, I'd rather ask then do it and be stuck @ lvl 15 with a sub-par tempest. Please advise.

With this build, you can spread the AP however you want and you won't be gimp in combat. Just realize that you won't be as good at disabling as that rogue in the party, or the wiz/rog, or possibly some other ranger/rogue. If you got one, let them do the job if you're on hard/elite/epic. If you're on normal, you shouldn't have a problem. And I wouldn't advise joining any party that's looking for a rogue on hard/elite, but would /tell if they're going in on normal and say you can handle the traps (but better make darn sure :p).

[KaplanPD]

Here is a build that I started a few days ago. It seems to play pretty well so far. It took a lot of inspiration from Tihocan's build, and he even checked it out on the forums prior to me officially rolling it. It does get Spot, Search, DD, and UMD maxed. The suggestions I had gotten said that OL at 14 would open most doors for me. Thought I'd share it if you wanted to take a look at it.

Actually I had seen the discussion thread between you and Tihocan. Your build is something I want to aim for, pretty neat. I just hit lvl 5 with Tihocans Tempest build and my SP is at 12. I'm digging the build all around though, thanks. Maybe I'll re roll and make some adjustments accordingly. Thanks all for the help!

[tihocan]

I was browsing the forums and noticed this starter build posted by Tihocan...
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=2800940&postcount=16

Tihocan you always help me out, along with a lot of other new players too im sure. Anyways so maybe if and when you see this you can further assist me, if not, others please advise...

The question I had is that when leveling this Tempest build, I noticed a recommendation of putting skill points into UMD, Open Locks, and Spot. If a player wanted the ability to disable traps also, what would one do as far as skill points are concerned? Would going four ways (UMD,Open Locks, Spot, Search) be the thing to do? This is assuming the players using a Drow (intel base 10) and possibly an intel item+fox's cunning wand+enhancements (if need be). Or is it not worth it in the long run to use skill points for search/disable trap.
From the "Variants" section at the bottom of this build:

With slight modifications, this build can be able to handle traps as well. Increase Int to 14 (12 on a human), so as to be able to max out Disable Device, Search, Open Locks, UMD and Spot (give up a few points in Open Locks to compensate for the loss of skill points on the Fighter level). 32 pt build and/or going Dex-based will make this easier to achieve.

If you already rolled the "no traps" version, it's going to be tough, because your Int is just too low. Might work out with a +2 Int tome, dropping Spot and getting only half ranks in Open Lock though.

[Uchuujin-San]

if you intend to seriously pursue trapsmithing, ditch the rogue skill boost. There is a ranger skill boost which is exactly the same thing but you can take the full line getting you +5 to skills. With only one rogue lvl you can only get the first Rogue Skill boost for +2 iirc.

[Pwesiela]

if you intend to seriously pursue trapsmithing, ditch the rogue skill boost. There is a ranger skill boost which is exactly the same thing but you can take the full line getting you +5 to skills. With only one rogue lvl you can only get the first Rogue Skill boost for +2 iirc.

Totally true and completely forgotten!

+1 to you, sir.

[Kindoki]

I've added points into disable device, it's currently at a 7, i believe. My intel is 10+1 (still level 4), and on normal content it's no problem. It's just that every now and then on normal difficulty, I can spot the door/trap but cannot locate the box. And when/if I do, it might blow up unless I use that 20 sec. boost I get from 1 rogue level. Don't even get me started on hard/elite difficulties...

Any ideas?

Put 4 points into OL and 4 points into DD. Put any extra points into search. Use your full ranger skill boost when needed. Use the highest level item that you can for each skill. That set up will get you through 80% of the content out there, give you a chance with 15%, and no chance with the remaining 5%. That's pretty good odds to me.

Keep the best spot item on that you can, and put points into spot only when search is maxed. This setup requires you (or someone with you) to know where traps are because you won't spot them. But, it gets you both OL and DD.

[Pwesiela]

Keep the best spot item on that you can, and put points into spot only when search is maxed. This setup requires you (or someone with you) to know where traps are because you won't spot them. But, it gets you both OL and DD.

Actually, worry less about spot. Rangers have the wild instinct spell, which gives a stacking boost to spot and listen.