Well new update is broken on epic

[ArkoHighStar]

From Release NotesNew Adventure Packs
Sentinels
In this new series of swashbuckling adventures from DDO, join the Sentinels as they seek to defeat the pirate scourge. But don’t think you’re safe once the seas are clear: the skies themselves will rain scurvy death—and scurvy undead. Because when this pillaging pirate captain runs short of troops, he just brings back the ones you’ve already disposed of. Pirates—and zombies? How could it get any better?

Cut the pirate lair off the map in a daring assault!
Close down the booty business at the Pirate Mart
Zombie Pirates! Board their black ship to cut them off at the source!
Root stinking pirate spies out of the House of Deneith!
Will you defeat Captain Tew and discover the infamous pirate leader's ultimate secret?
Find out in this exciting new Adventure Pack available for levels 6 through 8, and also available for level 20 characters on Epic difficulty!

From Known Issues
NEW - Sentinels
Epic Tokens will not drop on Epic Difficulty.

[Visty]

thats working as inteneded actually, just not like players would expect it

[Beherit_Baphomar]

thats working as inteneded actually, just not like players would expect it

Do what? Why is it a known issue if it's WAI?

Arko, ya gotta just laugh man.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

because turbine doesnt officially admit that they are screwing their players

I can get behind that.

[ArkoHighStar]

Do what? Why is it a known issue if it's WAI?

Arko, ya gotta just laugh man.

laughing is all we have left I think:(

[smatt]

Likely they want to see what the real players do with the quests before they stick "Easy" to loot epic tokens and loot in them... Since there's no real incentive for anybody to bother with Lama, they didn't get a good enough look at what the "Smart players" were going to find in the new quests......

[Krag]

Is it known whether epic shards/seals/scrolls drop in new epic quests or not?

[Shade]

Likely they want to see what the real players do with the quests before they stick "Easy" to loot epic tokens and loot in them... Since there's no real incentive for anybody to bother with Lama, they didn't get a good enough look at what the "Smart players" were going to find in the new quests......

Whats your goal in making up silly excuses for the devs?

I and sunblade ran the quests on epic and posted enough feedback to see that they aren't so "easy"

And they could of even tested them theirself.. If they have any QA.

There no shorter or easier then VoN1-2. Infact most are longer and harder.

[Shade]

Is it known whether epic shards/seals/scrolls drop in new epic quests or not?
They didn't on lamannia.

[ArkoHighStar]

Is it known whether epic shards/seals/scrolls drop in new epic quests or not?

Turbine put it in the Known issues list that they are not dropping, so it looks like a bug, on Lama they stated something about it being intended, but it is hard to tell whether that just meant on lama. so that we woudl not spoil the surprise.

Some clarification from Turbine would help.

[Shade]

Turbine put it in the Known issues list that they are not dropping, so it looks like a bug, on Lama they stated something about it being intended, but it is hard to tell whether that just meant on lama. so that we woudl not spoil the surprise.

Some clarification from Turbine would help.

Yea Tarrant was purposely vague in his response... Really great dev commincation we get.

There's also no logic to just not putting them on lamannia because we might spoil it. Because in the history of the game no epic has ever been crafted on lamannia, even for hte other updates that were up on there much longer. Just too much work to make one on a server that won't be playable soon enough.

They purposely took them out, for their and for live.. But for what reason?

[Tarrant]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

[Do'Urden]

because turbine doesnt officially admit that they are screwing their players

+1 and /signed :)

[Hendrik]

What Tokens?

The New Updates 'Sigils'?

Or are these 'tokens' the Scroll, Seal, and Shards?

:confused::confused::confused:

EDIT

Ahh, ok and TY Tarrant. Lack of coffee and all. Epic Dungeon Tokens are what we are talking about. Might want to clarify that on the Known Issues.

[ArkoHighStar]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i214/kandacepeaslee/PR%20Pictures/Forum%20Pics/GibbsHeadslapTony.jpg

[smatt]

:eek:
Whats your goal in making up silly excuses for the devs?

I and sunblade ran the quests on epic and posted enough feedback to see that they aren't so "easy"

And they could of even tested them theirself.. If they have any QA.

There no shorter or easier then VoN1-2. Infact most are longer and harder.


I'm not making up silly excuses for the Devs... I'm blaming you for being on the "We need Epic difficulty on old quests so we can spend more time in the same old quests" Bandwagon..... So.... Instead of them maybe CONSIDERING some real new content, we got the epic grindfest of total borkdom..... I guess it's OK... But it isn't NEW....

And I'm not saying that you haven't provided a lot of good testing and information in your own special way for the community either.....


They will fix the drop in Update 4.3 which will be combined with Update 5, so that they can save us all the inconvienance of having more downtimes :cool:

[Shade]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

There no shorter then von1-2, but you haven't taken the tokens out of those have ya?

Also since you consider them "short" another bug would be that there all listed in the game as "medium"

[smatt]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.


OK, so there's new quests with epic difficulty that don't drop epic loot? :confused: LOL nice! :eek:

That's kind of like saying "Hey there's coffee over there, but it's decaf, and the cream is over there as well, but it 2% milk" :rolleyes:

[Diarden]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

This doesn't state if there are epic versions of the named items or not, so it still needs to be ran on epic to find out. However, if there's no epic versions of the new loot, then this is another wasted update.

[Shade]

I'm blaming you for being on the "We need Epic difficulty on old quests so we can spend more time in the same old quests"

lol fine I'll take full credit for that. Since for Epic mode since I did make a very similar suggestion to it about 6 months before it was released (I called it Legendary mode and it would of been much, much harder).

Tho I'm not sure I deserve the honor. There are allot of other players who wanted this besides me.

But far as thinking we got epic instead of new content.. That's just plain silly. For one, epic isn't content that takes up the level designers time, they don't do that. Their team each has different roles, and the programmers who update old quests for epic couldn't instead design new levels if their life depended on it.

Sentinels is new content. Just not content we veterans care much about.

It's new content for the new players to urge new players to purchase or go VIP to enjoy as they lvl up.

[Hendrik]

OK, so there's new quests with epic difficulty that don't drop epic loot? :confused: LOL nice! :eek:

That's kind of like saying "Hey there's coffee over there, but it's decaf, and the cream is over there as well, but it 2% milk" :rolleyes:

So far, only thing they do NOT drop is EPIC DUNGEON TOKENS.


So far, with servers only up for a few minutes, there is no evidence that EPIC loot does not drop.

[ArtosKincaid]

Well, there goes my desire to play any of them on epic.

[Tarrant]

OK, so there's new quests with epic difficulty that don't drop epic loot? :confused: LOL nice! :eek:

That's kind of like saying "Hey there's coffee over there, but it's decaf, and the cream is over there as well, but it 2% milk" :rolleyes:

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. It also drops epic items just like other epic dungeons. And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

[Chromus]

so whats the point of running these new quests on epic if theres no epic drops? Favor? LOL


Edit: too slow, guess I'll get my strategy down when theres a reason to spend time in there.

[smatt]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. And one day it'll have better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."


Now that's the company line :D

Good Monday to you! :p

[ArtosKincaid]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. It also drops epic items just like other epic dungeons. And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

Or we can just run it with level 8s for XP or solo it with level 20s and learn what everything does in the quest and thus be ready for when you put real loot in it?

[Shade]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. And one day it'll have better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

Guess that's confirmation that they don't drop seals, shards or scrolls either.. (Which happen to be in the compedium already, so I guess you got that far but never completed the items on epic yet)

Might wanna put that in the known issues too as they are also expected.

[smatt]

lol fine I'll take full credit for that. Since for Epic mode since I did make a very similar suggestion to it about 6 months before it was released (I called it Legendary mode and it would of been much, much harder).

Tho I'm not sure I deserve the honor. There are allot of other players who wanted this besides me.

But far as thinking we got epic instead of new content.. That's just plain silly. For one, epic isn't content that takes up the level designers time, they don't do that. Their team each has different roles, and the programmers who update old quests for epic couldn't instead design new levels if their life depended on it.

Sentinels is new content. Just not content we veterans care much about.

It's new content for the new players to urge new players to purchase or go VIP to enjoy as they lvl up.


You're preaching to the choir... It's all your fault... Accept your fate **** it :D

[ArkoHighStar]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. It also drops epic items just like other epic dungeons. And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

No offense but Turbine made epic all about the grind for epic tokens and shards, scrolls etc. There is no other reason to do these quests. Why would people waste resources for no gain?

[Memnir]

Well, it actually is pretty silly of us to expect an established game mechanic to be included everyplace we'd expect to see said established game mechanic.

I mean, there are those raids without final bosses, right? We expect to see one - and "Whoa, curve ball!" No end boss, just a chest. After all, just because every quest labeled "raid" up till that point had a boss - it was just plain silly of us to expect to see one in all raids.

Not to mention those Raids without chests. Yeah, kinda goofy of us to think all raids would have em.

And those new Explorer zones without Exploration Points to discover - those should have taught us to expect Turbine to shift gears on us without warning... cause ya know, just because it's been that way since they put em in, it's unreasonable that we mere players should think the Devs would make that an established parameter for that sort of thing and sheepishly expect them to be in all Explorer zones.


Yep. Us expecting Epic Tokens to be in Epic quests is just foolish on our part.

:rolleyes:


Once again, I have to wonder who is driving this bus over there...
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http://i744.photobucket.com/albums/xx86/EnPsyane01/atthewheel-1.jpg
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[Beherit_Baphomar]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. It also drops epic items just like other epic dungeons. And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

I lol'd. Take this time to find out how best to run the quest while you guys figure out how best to stop us running it that way?

Epic.

[Memnir]

And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."Is this kinda like the Devs saying "Hey, roll up a Pale Master now - because one day in the unspecified future they won't suck as bad,"?

:rolleyes:

[Eladrin]

No offense but Turbine made epic all about the grind for epic tokens and shards, scrolls etc. There is no other reason to do these quests. Why would people waste resources for no gain?
Epic Dungeon Tokens are not the same thing as Shards/Scrolls/Seals.

The latter should be dropping in the Sentinels content, allowing upgrades to the basic Sentinels loot.

[Borror0]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. And one day it'll have better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."
Tarrant, no offense, but that's a poor defense.

Try this:

"We originally didn't see the need for Epic tokens to drop from the Sentinel quests. However, we have revised our position based on the feedback we've seen on Lamannia. Unfortunately, it was too late to make such this change without delaying Update 4. Expect to see that addressed in the future."
Putting it like the way you did puts the emphasis on "Turbine made a mistake" when you could rather give the impression you're listening to our feedback.

[ArkoHighStar]

Epic Dungeon Tokens are not the same thing as Shards/Scrolls/Seals.

The latter should be dropping in the Sentinels content, allowing upgrades to the basic Sentinels loot.

less epic fail, but still the tokens are what drives most people, lets hope the loot is worth it, because epic loot has been spotty

[Diarden]

Epic Dungeon Tokens are not the same thing as Shards/Scrolls/Seals.

The latter should be dropping in the Sentinels content, allowing upgrades to the basic Sentinels loot.

You can upgrade the basic sentinels loot, but not the lower level upgraded sentinels loot? Thus Tarrant's post about it being enhanced in the future?

Still sucks

[smatt]

Epic Dungeon Tokens are not the same thing as Shards/Scrolls/Seals.

The latter should be dropping in the Sentinels content, allowing upgrades to the basic Sentinels loot.


Without the grindtastic tokens you need to upgrade them, which you need to run quests with traps that only 4 rogues per server could possibly disable.... Come on man, with all due respect, the dart board is on the other wall....

[Gol]

Epic Dungeon Tokens are not the same thing as Shards/Scrolls/Seals.

The latter should be dropping in the Sentinels content, allowing upgrades to the basic Sentinels loot.
So you can run Sentinels to craft epic gear, but you have to run epic DQ/VoN to slot it?

How the you-know-what does that make sense?

You've been upgraded from "Epic Fail" to "Elite level 20 fail".

[Eladrin]

You can upgrade the basic sentinels loot, but not the lower level upgraded sentinels loot? Thus Tarrant's post about it being enhanced in the future?

Still sucks
Epic Sentinels bits upgrade the "fixed" items. (i.e. "Jidz-Tet'ka", not the "Torn Chitin Bracers")

[knightgf]

I bet you right now, at Turbine HQ, there's huge teeth growing out of the walls, portals to Xor'iat being spawned in the walls, purple mysterious orbs gliding along the ground and mindless workers babbling about how great their update is.

We need to get in their and stop the madness before they ruin another update!

[Spisey]

As expected. Epic fail for Turbine. Why even bother advertising the new content as having epic versions if the devs, in their haste or laziness, can't make quality content? Admitting that they made the quests too short and too easy to deserve epic tokens only shows how **** poor their planning is and telling us that it will be "fixed" to encourage future tactics in the future is pathetic.

STOP PUMPING OUT CONTENT YOU CAN'T MAKE REALISTIC DEADLINES FOR!


We have lost the quality of the old and it has been replaced by quantity. And very mediocre quantity at best.

[Zaodan]

Well, it actually is pretty silly of us to expect an established game mechanic to be included everyplace we'd expect to see said established game mechanic.

I mean, there are those raids without final bosses, right? We expect to see one - and "Whoa, curve ball!" No end boss, just a chest. After all, just because every quest labeled "raid" up till that point had a boss - it was just plain silly of us to expect to see one in all raids.

Not to mention those Raids without chests. Yeah, kinda goofy of us to think all raids would have em.

And those new Explorer zones without Exploration Points to discover - those should have taught us to expect Turbine to shift gears on us without warning... cause ya know, just because it's been that way since they put em in, it's unreasonable that we mere players should think the Devs would make that an established parameter for that sort of thing and sheepishly expect them to be in all Explorer zones.


Yep. Us expecting Epic Tokens to be in Epic quests is just foolish on our part.

:rolleyes:


Once again, I have to wonder who is driving this bus over there...
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http://i744.photobucket.com/albums/xx86/EnPsyane01/atthewheel-1.jpg
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Epic pwnage.

[smatt]

OK, so much for new content... Back to leveling my easy button WF Barb.... I've never played a Barb before..... :eek::cool:

[Krag]

It's not that i'm very interested in running epic content that doesn't drop epic tokens,
but out of pure curiosity: is it possible to buy Sentinels with Turbine Points or being VIP is strictly required?

[Zaodan]

It's not that i'm very interested in running epic content that doesn't drop epic tokens,
but out of pure curiosity: is it possible to buy Sentinels with Turbine Points or being VIP is strictly required?

Until the 9th, only available to VIPs.
After the 9th, purchasable in DDO store like any other pack.

[Gol]

It's not that i'm very interested in running epic content that doesn't drop epic tokens,
but out of pure curiosity: is it possible to buy Sentinels with Turbine Points or being VIP is strictly required?
VIP only for 4 days, then it opens up for sale as store content.

[Zaodan]

Tarrant, please take this message to the Devs:

Epic isn't a regular difficulty level like normal/hard/elite.
Its a special mode which generates special loot, and players run it solely for that loot.

You cannot release quests in DDO that are labeled "Epic" without epic tokens, epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot which can be upgraded in the standard way.

Please pass that on. I'd hate to see Turbine continue to think that Epic can mean more than 1 thing, because it can't. Epic means Epic tokens, epic loot. Not "a harder difficulty mode with crappy loot that doesn't upgrade to an actual epic item".

kthx.

[ArkoHighStar]

Tarrant, please take this message to the Devs:

Epic isn't a regular difficulty level like normal/hard/elite.
Its a special mode which generates special loot, and players run it solely for that loot.

You cannot release quests in DDO that are labeled "Epic" without epic tokens, epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot which can be upgraded in the standard way.

Please pass that on. I'd hate to see Turbine continue to think that Epic can mean more than 1 thing, because it can't. Epic means Epic tokens, epic loot. Not "a harder difficulty mode with crappy loot that doesn't upgrade to an actual epic item".

kthx.

to clarify Eladrin did state there are seals/shards/scrolls just no tokens for now.

[weyoun]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

No tokens = no play. Why would we waste our time?

[Tarrant]

You cannot release quests in DDO that are labeled "Epic" without epic tokens, epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot which can be upgraded in the standard way.


I'd like to clarify that Epic Sentinels does drop epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot, just not the epic tokens.

[Mellkor]

/signed. No tokens means I will not run them.

[Krag]

I see. Hopefully someone will be able to craft epic rapier within next few days.
Because if it does not suck like 9000+ epic items that might justify purchasing Sentinels.

[LunaCee]

I'd give it a week or more minimum... no guaranteed token = only have *chance* at getting something for the resource investment. Only having a chance of getting anything of value running at epic... why even bother.

[Horrorscope]

OK, so there's new quests with epic difficulty that don't drop epic loot? :confused: LOL nice! :eek:

That's kind of like saying "Hey there's coffee over there, but it's decaf, and the cream is over there as well, but it 2% milk" :rolleyes:

Not really because I prefer decaf and 2%.

[rest]

I bet you right now, at Turbine HQ, there's huge teeth growing out of the walls, portals to Xor'iat being spawned in the walls, purple mysterious orbs gliding along the ground and mindless workers babbling about how great their update is.

We need to get in their and stop the madness before they ruin another update!

i lol'd

[Renegade66]

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

Epic tokens are the key. Without them, the content won't be run. The good thing for Turbine is that you set the required number of tokens very high and the power of the enhancement very low. For example, I have to get 30 dungeon tokens to add "Good Luck" to my Epic Dragon's Eye so that it is worth swapping it in for my Head of Good Fortune.

There's nothing over-the-top uber or game breaking that you get from having Epic Dungeon Tokens. Right now the grind vs reward ratio is extreme on the painful side. Adding shorter Epic quests with Dungeon Tokens just evens it out and makes it more paletable for the playerbase.

If you're not going to drop dungeon tokens on these Epic quests, then change Epic Raid Tokens so they are usable as Raid tokens or Dungeon tokens.

[Diarden]

I'd like to clarify that Epic Sentinels does drop epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot, just not the epic tokens.

I can understand this to a degree, but shouldn't the devs anticipate this kind of response on release? I mean, we all know that every single update, we not only look a gift horse in the mouth, but we pummel it to death. I can understand from the Dev's perspective that upgrading a CR 6-7 quest to Epic and offering tokens is like easy Von 1-2 farming.

But Turbine has a knack for not having someone who works at the studio to look from the peoples perspective. Offering high end content that only folks that are interested in the upgrades will run is not very lucrative. What is the point for non ViP's to purchase this content? What incentive are you offering if when they reach 20, or are already, they will salivate at the chance to run this content.

All I'm saying is, if you need a resume feel free to ask.

[Inkblack]

I'd like to clarify that Epic Sentinels does drop epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot, just not the epic tokens.

Just what I need, more stuff to upgrade that I don't have tokens to upgrade. I know some of you devs actually play the game, but I think whoever is making these decisions doesn't know as much about the game as they think they do.

http://www.akacrasher.com/stuff/FAIL/Fail-2.jpg

[Gol]

I'd like to clarify that Epic Sentinels does drop epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot, just not the epic tokens.
Yes, you told us that already.

epic, er, rather, level 20 elite fail.

[Qzipoun]

Never have I seen the term "Epic Fail" be so relevant on the interwebs

[lolwatboomer]

late april fool's joke? maybe? :eek:

[Hendrik]

Never have I seen the term "Epic Fail" be so relevant on the interwebs

Or "Drama Queens".

:D

[Judo]

So...4 years later, in the latest update...and tonight, when i log on?


Vons...yup

vons

ubah

[Quikster]

So now if there is something i want out of there, i farm it for however many runs (say 15 runs to get everything needed for an upgrade) then I need to do another 20-30 epic dungeons with tokens to upgrade it???? On top of the 80 more i need to slot current epic loot??


lol!

Just lol! Now that is funny.

[DrakmireTS]

Huh. So we have to go to other epic packs in order to fully socket epic gear from this one? That makes about as much sense as farming VoN for Sands scrolls/seals. I mean, not that I'm not sitting on a boatload of dungeon tokens thanks to seal/shard mismatches, but the logic behind this really doesn't follow. I'll give the new stuff a try tonight, but if it's longer than 20-30 minutes run time, then that means there are existing epics with a shorter length *that also drop tokens* and that argument won't really be valid.

[Cedwin]

No epic tokens = not buying it

If you think that they are too short to drop epic tokens, then add some barter items that can be exchanged for epic tokens.

Lets say Epic Shards, 2 Epic Shards = 1 Epic Token. Easy.

[Diarden]

No epic tokens = not buying it

If you think that they are too short to drop epic tokens, then add some barter items that can be exchanged for epic tokens.

Lets say Epic Shards, 2 Epic Shards = 1 Epic Token. Easy.

Now that is a great idea. A lot of times, I will get seals/shards for useless upgraded items. Why not institute a system that will break those down into epic tokens for players. If Turbine cannot create decent epic items, let us use the leftovers for things we can use.

[Sirea]

I can confirm that a seal dropped in the Black Loch a while ago, for the docent.

But yeah, sorry I'm not buying the company line on why there are no epic tokens in the new quests. If you go by that line, you'd have to take them out of VON1&2 as well.

[Krag]

I can confirm that a seal dropped in the Black Loch a while ago, for the docent.

But yeah, sorry I'm not buying the company line on why there are no epic tokens in the new quests. If you go by that line, you'd have to take them out of VON1&2 as well.

Be careful with your words. They might actually listen :eek:

[Renegade66]

So now if there is something i want out of there, i farm it for however many runs (say 15 runs to get everything needed for an upgrade) . . . .




If only it were that easy. For example, I've been hot on the trail to craft Epic Marilith Chain. I got the item on my 20th completion, the shard because it dropped for a friend and the seal on a guild roll (i.e. only the item I got on my own accord). I'm only short the scroll. I'm well over 25,000 epic DQ1 kills and have not seen one drop. I've also not seen a Chaosblade, Bramblecaster, Jerky or Staff of Arcane Power scroll drop either. I've seen one Torc drop (to someone else) and one Lion-headed Belt Buckle scroll drop is all for raid items. We're probably looking at a 1% drop rate for scrolls and of those 1% only 1% are for raid items (or 1 in 10,000 kills dropping a raid item scroll).

No hurry I guess though, because I need 30 epic quest completions to put Good Luck on the armor for +2 saves. That takes a back seat though to the 30 tokens needed to put GFL on my belt.

I do understand the need for a grind, otherwise we'd all have everything we need, get bored and complain. However, I DON'T understand; a) the ridiculously low drop-rate of Desert raid item scrolls, and b) not allowing epic raid tokens to be used as dungeon tokens, and c) why they felt the need to not drop dungeon tokens in the new epic content.

[Cedwin]

Now that is a great idea. A lot of times, I will get seals/shards for useless upgraded items. Why not institute a system that will break those down into epic tokens for players. If Turbine cannot create decent epic items, let us use the leftovers for things we can use.

That's not what I was actually referring to, but that's a great idea too.

What I mean when I said Epic Shards, was pieces of a token. Combine 2 pieces for 1 token.

But exchanging seals/shards for tokens seems like a step in the right direction.

[Mockduck]

Have to agree, why even offer epic level questing (and it's epic level difficulty) and not offer some kind of epic level bonus for completing these difficult quests! *shakes head* - it's not like level 20's need the experience....good to hear this is being worked on.

[Seosamh]

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion.

So, no point in even running them on Epic. Why even make Epic difficulty available?

[ArtosKincaid]

Have to agree, why even offer epic level questing (and it's epic level difficulty) and not offer some kind of epic level bonus for completing these difficult quests! *shakes head* - it's not like level 20's need the experience....good to hear this is being worked on.

Why was the content released when it obviously isn't done yet, is my question. Sure you can go in and do it, but there's really no motivation to do so.

[Shade]

So now if there is something i want out of there, i farm it for however many runs (say 15 runs to get everything needed for an upgrade) then I need to do another 20-30 epic dungeons with tokens to upgrade it???? On top of the 80 more i need to slot current epic loot??


lol!

Just lol! Now that is funny.

Well probably best items will be the docent/armor. They usually put 2 slots on those, so about 60 tokens to fully upgrade em.

Only 30 more runs of sets of VoN1-2 per item, yay!

[ThunderTank]

What is wrong with giving tokens for the new content Epic quests ?
As Shade said, von 1 and 2 are already ridiculously short and easy.
Is turbine worried about players getting too many tokens and stop buying TR Hearts ... ?
=/

[smatt]

Joy...... Endless more runs of the OLD quests updated to epic, to get epic loot so that you can run the same old quests 2 minutes faster than before.... That is the 30% or so of the epic items that are even real upgrades of current in game gear.....

Ummmmm...... Yes sir! Epic is really working out.... :D

[Delacroix21]

Im just wondering where all the posters went that bashed me when I warned them about this a few days ago.


This was actually the only Epic dungeon I had a good feeling about crafting an item from. The desert just has way to much trash seals/shards to sort through to actually get the ones you want. VoN isnt as bad, but that doesnt make it good either.


5 Epic items from only a few quests was a VERY SMART decision, that means that they will have a good chance of actually being upgraded. I hope some retroactive changes can be made to desert and von epics as well to make hunting for them more worthwhile as well. At the very least I would triple epic scroll/shard/seal drop rates in the desert due to there being SO many items. I have 4+ of some seals, but not the ones I want.


EDIT---

Oh and please rethink the wind and water stance bonuses of the bracers. A jump bonus is useless (as you have capped jump) and the water paralyze on 20 (with a DC) means that it has a 5% of a 5% chance (monster rolls a 1) of occuring, which is a= .0025% chance to proc. Seems a bit low doesnt it?

[Quikster]

Well probably best items will be the docent/armor. They usually put 2 slots on those, so about 60 tokens to fully upgrade em.

Only 30 more runs of sets of VoN1-2 per item, yay!

Lol but wait, as soon as you slot those, there will be a new effect you just gotta have.

I do like that you can change the upgrades, but jeez, whats the point of having epic quests with no token. If it was too fast cant they just take the end boss and inflate his hitpoints a little to add a few minutes, or add some dm text to the thing so we have to wait a few min ? (i havent run the new stuff, and prolly wont unless a guildie wants to, or at lvl, but not wasting my time on epic atm.)

[dakkon75]

You can check my post history and find out that I am not a big Turbine basher for some of the crazy things that they do.

But seriously, I have to join some of these folks and just sit here in awe at the thinking that was going on in the Devs heads with this decision. An epic dungeon without epic tokens........for being too short.

Really? Isn't there an epic timer on quest completions so that us vets cannot just farm the heck out of the quest. So I have a "short" epic quest in which to gather more tokens, I still cannot play it again for 16 hours. The timer itself is a token regulator.

Also in a semi related topic....Epic Scrolls, Seals, and Shards, why is the drop rate on some of these so abysmally low? Why not at the very least why not just up the drop rate of scrolls to equal the drop rate of treasure bags in epic quest.

[BlackSteel]

saw 1 seal out of a six person party doing both the black loch and the bazaar. no scrolls/shards.

these quests would be on par with some of the vons if they had less shrines (the black loch was missing one shrine on epic, perhaps remove another one?)

[Angelus_dead]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.
Any non-bugs in the known issues list need to be explicitly labeled as intended behavior. The majority of entries in the list are bugs, so the assumption would be that all of them are.

In addition, the word "issue" in popular usage (especially relating to software marketing) has shifted from the original meaning into a euphemism for "error or flaw".

[Stanley_Nicholas]

If only it were that easy. For example, I've been hot on the trail to craft Epic Marilith Chain. I got the item on my 20th completion, the shard because it dropped for a friend and the seal on a guild roll (i.e. only the item I got on my own accord). I'm only short the scroll. I'm well over 25,000 epic DQ1 kills and have not seen one drop. I've also not seen a Chaosblade, Bramblecaster, Jerky or Staff of Arcane Power scroll drop either. I've seen one Torc drop (to someone else) and one Lion-headed Belt Buckle scroll drop is all for raid items. We're probably looking at a 1% drop rate for scrolls and of those 1% only 1% are for raid items (or 1 in 10,000 kills dropping a raid item scroll).

No hurry I guess though, because I need 30 epic quest completions to put Good Luck on the armor for +2 saves. That takes a back seat though to the 30 tokens needed to put GFL on my belt.

I do understand the need for a grind, otherwise we'd all have everything we need, get bored and complain. However, I DON'T understand; a) the ridiculously low drop-rate of Desert raid item scrolls, and b) not allowing epic raid tokens to be used as dungeon tokens, and c) why they felt the need to not drop dungeon tokens in the new epic content.

I'm also at a loss as to why the raid item scrolls have such a low drop rate compared to everything else. Aren't there already enough items watering down the desert tables? I have a guildy who has farmed very heavily for the Torc scroll, and still hasn't gotten it. But he has gotten other raid item scrolls in the process, and he says that on average they drop from 1 in 3000 kills. So from any given kill on epic, you have a 1 in 48,000 chance of getting the scroll you need. :rolleyes:

[Cupcake]

OK, so there's new quests with epic difficulty that don't drop epic loot? :confused: LOL nice! :eek:

That's kind of like saying "Hey there's coffee over there, but it's decaf, and the cream is over there as well, but it 2% milk" :rolleyes:

+1 okay that one made me laugh. :D

[Anthios888]

So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?

[rest]

So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?
Bingo.





Turbine wants to make money. More adventure packs sold = more money.
(Honestly, they probably didn't even consider this. They probably just thought most people who run epic are going to be VIPs. I'm not saying that, but it may have been on their mind.)

[lolwatboomer]

I can confirm that a seal dropped in the Black Loch a while ago, for the docent.

But yeah, sorry I'm not buying the company line on why there are no epic tokens in the new quests. If you go by that line, you'd have to take them out of VON1&2 as well.

don't give them ideas! :p


So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?

yeah, I don't know what the thought process was either. heh.

[Visty]

arent ppl soloing epic oob in like 15mins?
they should remove the tokens from there too, its too short

[Wizzly_Bear]

it's In The Known Issues List Because It's Not The Kind Of Functionality That A Player Would Expect. The Known Issues List Is Not Reserved Exclusively For Bugs.

The Sentinels Quests Are Short, And So We Didn't Feel It Was Appropriate To Give Epic Tokens For Their Completion. We Have Seen The Feedback For This Quest And Are Working On Another Solution.
-1

[sephiroth1084]

I'd like to clarify that Epic Sentinels does drop epic seals/shards/scrolls and epic named loot, just not the epic tokens.
Are epic items ML 20 randomly generated items, named lvl 20 loot, or something else? Obviously you're making a distinction between epic items and epic collectibles/upgrade ingredients. If you mean ML 20 random loot, that hardly counts as a reason for running the quests.

While I do appreciate the increased turnover in churning out new content that you folks have been working on since DDO: EU hit, I (and I think I speak for most vets, if not everyone) don't really like the apparent trend of releasing content/features that are half-finished or unsupported (Pale Master, epic quests without tokens, etc...).

You've established that epic items require tokens to fully upgrade them, and that epic end chests yield one of those tokens (and are the only way of obtaining them), so giving up epic quests that break from this pattern is both confusing and frustrating, as I'm sure everyone who has been running epic quests in order to gain enough tokens to TR or upgrade their items would really love to have some options in addition to VoN 1 and 2 for token collection.

If you were concerned that players would only run these new, shorter (subjectively) epic quests for tokens, you could have done something else to encourage players to run other epic quests, such as by spreading out the VoN scroll and seal drops to the 4 quests (ie. VoN 1 might only drop the scrolls and seals for the less desirable epic VoN items, while VoN 3 or 4 would drop stuff like the SoS and Belt of the Moranon upgrades).

All of that said, I have not yet tried the new content (heading on in a little while), but I do very much like the new ability/tech you guys have for releasing content at multiple levels (low/mid and high) in order to give a wider range of players new stuff to run. At least for a little while, I imagine that the new epic quests will be fresh and fun. Still, if we have to run the lower level versions on our 20s to get the base items and their upgrades just to upgrade them to epic, we're going to get really tired of running this series very quickly. And if there is little other incentive to run them (like epic dungeon tokens) they will likewise lose their savor swiftly, as we're not getting anything else out of them--no XP, unnecessary favor, likely useless junk random loot.

[Sirea]

So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?

That's actually a very good point...

This could work out in our favor being as they changed SoS flagging for the very same reason.

[Sweyn]

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

Wait... lemee get this straight. The quests are too short that yoiu don't feel there should be epic tokens? While Von 1-2 can be done in 20 min each, and OOB around 20-30 min... while the new quests took our group around 30 min each, and that was with Weighted, and mass hold...

So to add insult to injury, we now have to grind more for epic loot. We have to grind out these quests for seals/shards/scrolls... and then the OTHERS for tokens? That seems Ridicules.

Here's a thought, how about you all focus less on content that will keep the F2P noobs, and more content that will keep the long time vets that have been PAYING for 3+ years? It's been what?... 7 months since we've gotten a new raid?

[degu]

Tsk, tsk, tsk, Turbine. Was looking forward to grinding up some tokens through new quests, as Sands bores me to death and don't have much interest in VoN. And I was nutty enough to believe the DDO dev team was somewhat more reasonable than the Lord of the Radiance Grind crazies.

[Sirea]

Wait... lemee get this straight. The quests are too short that yoiu don't feel there should be epic tokens? While Von 1-2 can be done in 20 min each, and OOB around 20-30 min... while the new quests took our group around 30 min each, and that was with Weighted, and mass hold...

Don't forget that oftentimes with a solid group EVON6 can be done in about 20 minutes (hell, the quest is only designed to be 45 mins long tops!). Should they take the raid tokens out of there because the quest is "too short"?

I'm curious as to what seems to be their threshold for a quest being too short to be deserving of epic tokens.

[IThinkThisIsMe]

Possibly we can't see the forest for the trees. It may be possible that these epic items from this questline do not contain augmentation slots. Therefore there would be no need for epic tokens to drop.

[sephiroth1084]

So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?
Another good point against the decision to leave epic tokens out of these new quests.

[Diarden]

Don't forget that oftentimes with a solid group EVON6 can be done in about 20 minutes (hell, the quest is only designed to be 45 mins long tops!). Should they take the raid tokens out of there because the quest is "too short"?

I'm curious as to what seems to be their threshold for a quest being too short to be deserving of epic tokens.

Excellent point. Von 5 can be ran on Normal, and ADQ can be ran on Casual, yet the actual part where our shards for raid loot come from quests that take 15-20 minutes tops. We also get raid tokens for each run, granted there's a 3 day timer. But the most tokens we need per slot upgrade is 5, if im not mistaken.

So why screw the population on tokens in this manner Turbine? There are other things you can do to lengthen a quest instead of removing tokens all together. Like I stated in a previous post, you are offering no incentive to folks to run the new content except for the one or two people that may want an upgraded piece.

[Sirea]

Possibly we can't see the forest for the trees. It may be possible that these epic items from this questline do not contain augmentation slots. Therefore there would be no need for epic tokens to drop.

It'd still be nice to have another place to farm tokens for Desert or VONs upgrades, or True Hearts of Wood.

[Kalari]

Well, it actually is pretty silly of us to expect an established game mechanic to be included everyplace we'd expect to see said established game mechanic.

I mean, there are those raids without final bosses, right? We expect to see one - and "Whoa, curve ball!" No end boss, just a chest. After all, just because every quest labeled "raid" up till that point had a boss - it was just plain silly of us to expect to see one in all raids.

Not to mention those Raids without chests. Yeah, kinda goofy of us to think all raids would have em.

And those new Explorer zones without Exploration Points to discover - those should have taught us to expect Turbine to shift gears on us without warning... cause ya know, just because it's been that way since they put em in, it's unreasonable that we mere players should think the Devs would make that an established parameter for that sort of thing and sheepishly expect them to be in all Explorer zones.


Yep. Us expecting Epic Tokens to be in Epic quests is just foolish on our part.

:rolleyes:


Once again, I have to wonder who is driving this bus over there...
.
.
http://i744.photobucket.com/albums/xx86/EnPsyane01/atthewheel-1.jpg
.
.
.

<3 u lol this is why im apart of ya fan club you summed it up better then I could good sir and still pushing for a permanent way to just pos rep ya :)

[suitepotato]

So they made the epic setting level 20, for quests whose design is for UNDER the mid range, that is under level 10, and they decided that they should not drop tokens...

Exactly what is the purpose of epic if not for tokens? Will they do the same thing when they get around to doing an epic version of Kobolds' New Ringleader? How can it be epic? A few undead beholders? CR32 kobolds?

Their thinking is still lame.

[geoffhanna]

Hey I'm reading all these posts, and it occured to me, maybe people think the new quests should have epic tokens when run at epic level?

I'm kinda slow on these things.

(it does seem kinda weird though. WAI or not, someone at Turbine must agree or it wouldn't be on the known issues list)

[lolwatboomer]

I've run through several of the quests on Epic, and I don't know how they are "short". They take longer than VoN1/2, and some are them are more of a challenge than the usual snoozefests. This is with a very competent party, and we didn't stop around to check out the scenery.

Seriously devs, what was the thought process here? Like Rocka said... are you telling me people are going to have to buy another adventure pack so they can augment these items? Just terrible.

[Dutch01]

From Known Issues
NEW - Sentinels
Epic Tokens will not drop on Epic Difficulty.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_sOnKY2Xwog8/SjvKwYxz2MI/AAAAAAAABKM/rzv1Ni02i_Q/s320/homer_doh.jpg

[Xaearth]

That's actually a very good point...

This could work out in our favor being as they changed SoS flagging for the very same reason.

Unless the basis for leaving the epic tokens out of this series has nothing to do with length (as many have already mentioned these quests are longer than some existing epics)...
Perhaps it has more to do with the price of the adventure packs and guest passes?

Because it is a short (at level) series of quests, more likely than not the Sentinels adventure pack will be much cheaper than VoN and DQ raid adventure packs.

As more and more epics are released, Turbine won't want people cherry picking and getting this pack to grind tokens just because it is cheaper. :mad:

Edit: Not to mention premium players not interested in epic or even end-game content who instead may consider buying this pack to grind for TR woods. :mad: :mad: :mad:

[ragwa1]

I don't get why anyone is whining.

They could have done NOTHING.

Want want want. Take take take.

[Xaearth]

I don't get why anyone is whining.

They could have done NOTHING.

Want want want. Take take take.

Huh? You mean no "If you break all the breakables and get ransack, you get an epic token!" :rolleyes:

[ragwa1]

Huh? You mean no "If you break all the breakables and get ransack, you get an epic token!" :rolleyes:

Oh! I get it. You must think you're clever.
What is this? Highschool?

Stop whining about the game or quit.

Pick one.

[Sirea]

Unless the basis for leaving the epic tokens out of this series has nothing to do with length (as many have already mentioned these quests are longer than some existing epics)...
Perhaps it has more to do with the price of the adventure packs and guest passes?

Because it is a short (at level) series of quests, more likely than not the Sentinels adventure pack will be much cheaper than VoN and DQ raid adventure packs.

As more and more epics are released, Turbine won't want people cherry picking and getting this pack to grind tokens just because it is cheaper. :mad:

Edit: Not to mention premium players not interested in epic or even end-game content who instead may consider buying this pack to grind for TR woods. :mad: :mad: :mad:

They changed the Stealer of Souls pack to not require people to buy GH, Necro IV, and the Desert to get the explorer gems needed to flag for SoS. How is this any different?

[Natashaelle]

So, someone who buys the Sentinels adventure pack would have to buy other adventure areas to upgrade their armor...?

Ouch -- Turbine just got themselves pwned, and you just got yourself +1 Rep.

---

Everyone else complaining-slash-laughing at Turbine about this, consider yourselves : /signed

[Visty]

Oh! I get it. You must think you're clever.
What is this? Highschool?

Stop whining about the game or quit.

Pick one.

those arent the only options

[Sirea]

I don't get why anyone is whining.

They could have done NOTHING.

Want want want. Take take take.

Yeah, let's break mechanics as we see fit for unjustifiable reasons.

There is no good reason for why these quests have no Epic tokens. None.

Epic Quest should = Epic Tokens.

If they are arguing that these quests are too short, then by their own definition half of the preexisting epic quests shouldn't drop tokens, either.

If you can't understand the logic of that, then I don't know what to say.

[ragwa1]

Yeah, let's break mechanics as we see fit for unjustifiable reasons.

There is no good reason for why these quests have no Epic tokens. None.

Epic Quest should = Epic Tokens.

If they are arguing that these quests are too short, then by their own definition half of the preexisting epic quests shouldn't drop tokens, either.

If you can't understand the logic of that, then I don't know what to say.

Instead of crying about it, why don't you just say "Thank you"?

[Kalari]

I don't get why anyone is whining.

They could have done NOTHING.

Want want want. Take take take.

Hmm care about the game make threads about updates constructively to help the game better

or suck it up its just a game and /rage quit

Yeah I think i'll stick with my method even if it is like screaming into a wind tunnel. Id rather care about a game I invest my time in then act like oh its just an mmo lets take what we can get and be jolly about it.

But you have your way I have mine beauty of being humans not sheep no?

[ArkoHighStar]

Instead of crying about it, why don't you just say "Thank you"?

for what giving us quests none of us will play other than twice for favor,

yeah thanks a lot Turbine, thanks

[Xaearth]

They changed the Stealer of Souls pack to not require people to buy GH, Necro IV, and the Desert to get the explorer gems needed to flag for SoS. How is this any different?

Because the primary purpose of Stealer of Souls pack is to do the quest Stealer of Souls, which can't be done without the gems.
Unfortunately, the primary purpose of the Sentinels pack is lowbie content, and, as such, will be priced like lowbie content.
Similarly, the primary purpose of DQ and VoN adventure packs is raid content, and, as such, are priced for the value of the quests and raid experience.
Sentinels epic, unfortunately, appears to have been an afterthought.

In order to justify (in Turbine's business mindset) giving epic tokens for the quests in Sentinels, they would have to value the pack similarly to the other quests that give epic tokens.

I know it sounds like crackpot nonsense, but, considering the fact that the quests have been shown to not be short on epic, at least not in relation to existing epics, money is the only explanation that makes sense. :cool:

[ArkoHighStar]

Because the primary purpose of Stealer of Souls pack is to do the quest Stealer of Souls, which can't be done without the gems.
Unfortunately, the primary purpose of the Sentinels pack is lowbie content, and, as such, will be priced like lowbie content.
Similarly, the primary purpose of DQ and VoN adventure packs is raid content, and, as such, are priced for the value of the quests and raid experience.
Sentinels epic, unfortunately, appears to have been an afterthought.

In order to justify (in Turbine's business mindset) giving epic tokens for the quests in Sentinels, they would have to value the pack similarly to the other quests that give epic tokens.

I know it sounds like crackpot nonsense, but, considering the fact that the quests have been shown to not be short on epic, at least not in relation to existing epics, money is the only explanation that makes sense. :cool:

unfortunately I think you hit the nail on the head.

[ragwa1]

for what giving us quests none of us will play other than twice for favor,

yeah thanks a lot Turbine, thanks

Thank you, Turbine, for bringing us a new quest series to play on the game you work hard on each day.

Thank you for supplying us, the gamers with a great game that we love(well, some of us at least).

And yes, I'm sorry about all the negitive feedback you are recieving from these consumers of your fine online game.

Also, I thank you for not deciding to shut down all servers and scrap the game due to the constant crymode that is your player base.

Keep up the good work, Turbine!

(Something like this would have been great, guys.)

[Sirea]

Instead of crying about it, why don't you just say "Thank you"?

For me to even consider saying thank you, the least they could do is use some lube.

[Visty]

Thank you, Turbine, for bringing us a new quest series to play on the game you work hard on each day.

Thank you for supplying us, the gamers with a great game that we love(well, some of us at least).

And yes, I'm sorry about all the negitive feedback you are recieving from these consumers of your fine online game.

Also, I thank you for not deciding to shut down all servers and scrap the game due to the constant crymode that is your player base.

Keep up the good work, Turbine!

(Something like this would have been great, guys.)

a quest series which will played twice total for favor, YAY
thanks for that -.-

you really should consult a doctor for some pills, dude

[ragwa1]

a quest series which will played twice total for favor, YAY
thanks for that -.-

you really should consult a doctor for some pills, dude

No, YOU should have listened to your parents when they were trying to instil you with some form of gratuity.

[ArkoHighStar]

Thank you, Turbine, for bringing us a new quest series to play on the game you work hard on each day.

Thank you for supplying us, the gamers with a great game that we love(well, some of us at least).

And yes, I'm sorry about all the negitive feedback you are recieving from these consumers of your fine online game.

Also, I thank you for not deciding to shut down all servers and scrap the game due to the constant crymode that is your player base.

Keep up the good work, Turbine!

(Something like this would have been great, guys.)


Trust me they get plenty of those when they deserve it, not today, sorry, although your right some people on the staff deserve some kudos.

To the artists as usual you did a great job

[ArkoHighStar]

No, YOU should have listened to your parents when they were trying to instil you with some form of gratuity.

Sorry this isn't a free service, these quests cost money, either as part of my monthly sub or with Turbine points, so no we don't owe them thanks.

[ragwa1]

Sorry this isn't a free service, these quests cost money, either as part of my monthly sub or with Turbine points, so no we don't owe them thanks.

Then Turbine may as well shut down the entire game today, because they obviously are not going to live up to any of the publics standards.

Me? I'm having the most fun I've ever had on an online game.

[Visty]

Then Turbine may as well shut down the entire game today, because they obviously are not going to live up to any of the publics standards.

Me? I'm having the most fun I've ever had on an online game.

thats good for you, others arent happy

you go away cause youre done anyway and we try to get something into turbines head

[ragwa1]

thats good for you, others arent happy

you go away cause youre done anyway and we try to get something into turbines head

Oh visty...

I'm done? No sir, I'm having a great time! It's just sad to see that I seem to be the only person on this forum that actually ENJOYS this game anymore.

[Visty]

Oh visty...

I'm done? No sir, I'm having a great time! It's just sad to see that I seem to be the only person on this forum that actually ENJOYS this game anymore.

what i meant with youre done is that you are done in that thread.
you voiced your opinion, you enjoy the new mod, good for you

[ragwa1]

what i meant with youre done is that you are done in that thread.
you voiced your opinion, you enjoy the new mod, good for you

Game set. Match and point.

[Natashaelle]

Oh visty...

I'm done? No sir, I'm having a great time! It's just sad to see that I seem to be the only person on this forum that actually ENJOYS this game anymore.

Actually mate -- you appear to be the only person on this forum who seems to have an opinion on this matter that's painted in stark black & white. (which is to suggest an unrealistic opinion, in case you might miss the intended meaning)

Shock ! Horror !! It is actually *possible* to point spot criticisms of a bad job at people whose work one generally admires !!!

[rest]

Well he is the guy who insists that breaking everything in a quest nets him better loot from the end chest and the end reward...

[Pyromaniac]

Well on the positive side, it reinforces that update 4 isn't worth buying. This issue of no epic tokens was known a long time back. I'm expecting the 'fix' when my sorc prestiges are all there - in about 10 years.

[ragwa1]

Well he is the guy who insists that breaking everything in a quest nets him better loot from the end chest and the end reward...

Nice troll.

[rest]

Nice troll.

Just trollin the trolls :cool:

[ragwa1]

Just trollin the trolls :cool:

Go look up the meaning of "trolling" in regards to forum posting.

[Sweyn]

Oh visty...

I'm done? No sir, I'm having a great time! It's just sad to see that I seem to be the only person on this forum that actually ENJOYS this game anymore.

You only enjoy the game so much because you only have been playing for 3-4 months per your forum date, come back in 2 years

[ArkoHighStar]

Oh visty...

I'm done? No sir, I'm having a great time! It's just sad to see that I seem to be the only person on this forum that actually ENJOYS this game anymore.


tell you what when you get to lvl 20 and are grinding for epics, lets see how excited you are, come back and talk to us then.

[ragwa1]

You only enjoy the game so much because you only have been playing for 3-4 months per your forum date, come back in 2 years

Ever heard of seperate accounts?

[ArkoHighStar]

Ever heard of seperate accounts?

Gunga is that you?

[Sweyn]

Ever heard of seperate accounts?

Read my post again, i was judging by your forum date

I find it funny how you are getting all worked up over nothing, peace

[Sirea]

Ever heard of seperate accounts?

Ah, so you're someone so spineless that you can't use your primary account to troll. Gotcha.

[ragwa1]

Gunga is that you?

Now wouldn't that be hilarious?

[ragwa1]

Ah, so you're someone so spineless that you can't use your primary account to troll. Gotcha.

Do you understand that THIS very post that you just wrote is considered trolling?

ie: Goading another poster into an arguement for the sole purpose of reaction.

[Sirea]

Do you understand that THIS very post that you just wrote is considered trolling?

ie: Goading another poster into an arguement for the sole purpose of reaction.

All anyone has to do is look back a couple pages to see who started it. Here's lookin' at you, kid.

[Wizzly_Bear]

Oh! I get it. You must think you're clever.
What is this? Highschool?

Stop whining about the game or quit.

Pick one.
-1

We are not whining. We are expressing disatisfaction in effort to see it changed. Do you always just take what's given to you? If you order a medium steak and they bring you a crusty well done one do you just eat it?

[ragwa1]

All anyone has to do is look back a couple pages to see who started it. Here's lookin' at you, kid.

Started it?

Hardly.

[Eldun]

It's more like saying "Hey here's a new lower level quest that you haven't played before and might not be that fun to run on your level 20 character. Why don't you run it on Epic where it's challenging and you can make the most of it. It also drops epic items just like other epic dungeons. And one day it'll have even better rewards than it has currently, so feel free to take this time to work on your strategy and be prepared for the future."

And this is like sitting down for a good old game of PnP and the DM begins his opening monologue with "Your party is approached at the tavern by a man offering you the tremendous opportunity to spend hours of your life helping save a damsel in distress who's castle is currently under foreclosure with the IRS, her assets have been frozen by her estranged husband, and the reason he left her is because she's a tramp with a bad case of the clap".

Grats!

[smatt]

And this is like sitting down for a good old game of PnP and the DM begins his opening monologue with "Your party is approached at the tavern by a man offering you the tremendous opportunity to spend hours of your life helping save a damsel in distress who's castle is currently under foreclosure with the IRS, her assets have been frozen by her estranged husband, and the reason he left her is because she's a tramp with a bad case of the clap".

Grats!



LOL... OK Laughter... +1

[Quikster]

Ah, so you're someone so spineless that you can't use your primary account to troll. Gotcha.

Prolly more along the lines of he cant use his primary acct anymore, or if he does, it comes with such a rep he usually gets blasted just for the name, before anyone looks at the content of the post.

[ragwa1]

Prolly more along the lines of he cant use his primary acct anymore, or if he does, it comes with such a rep he usually gets blasted just for the name, before anyone looks at the content of the post.

If I ever, for one second, started caring what someone ONLINE thought about my ONLINE rep, I would straight up dive off a mountain.

[Cyr]

It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.
So the known issue is that the devs know that they put something in the game that makes very little sense to the palyer base? Are we going to see things in the known issues like...

DA annoys players.
Many EPIC items effects make no logical sense to put together on an item and are mostly useless.
There are no raids in this update.

[Xaearth]

Unless the basis for leaving the epic tokens out of this series has nothing to do with length (as many have already mentioned these quests are longer than some existing epics)...
Perhaps it has more to do with the price of the adventure packs and guest passes?

Because it is a short (at level) series of quests, more likely than not the Sentinels adventure pack will be much cheaper than VoN and DQ raid adventure packs.

As more and more epics are released, Turbine won't want people cherry picking and getting this pack to grind tokens just because it is cheaper. :mad:

Edit: Not to mention premium players not interested in epic or even end-game content who instead may consider buying this pack to grind for TR woods. :mad: :mad: :mad:


I don't get why anyone is whining.

They could have done NOTHING.

Want want want. Take take take.

Hmm...
Anyone else beginning to think the devs, Turbine management, and/or customer service might have accounts they use to troll just to have an excuse to skip over, close, and/or derail threads that are "no longer productive"? :rolleyes:

/checks tinfoil hat

[maddmatt70]

I like the new quests beautifully done, but my guildies and friends are already saying they do not plan to run the quests because of the lack of tokens. They are most definitely not too short for an epic dungeon token and in fact a couple of them are definitely longer then OOB, Von1 and Von 2 which makes it even more funny and the other two are approximately the same length/time. Do you guys even run your own quests is the question?

[Dark-Star]

To call Blood Road on epic short is false.

I also urge you to reconsider adding tokens.

[Wizzly_Bear]

So the known issue is that the devs know that they put something in the game that makes very little sense to the palyer base? Are we going to see things in the known issues like...

DA annoys players.
Many EPIC items effects make no logical sense to put together on an item and are mostly useless.
There are no raids in this update.
lol

+1

[geoffhanna]

I know it sounds like crackpot nonsense, but, considering the fact that the quests have been shown to not be short on epic, at least not in relation to existing epics, money is the only explanation that makes sense. :cool:

Not at all true. There are several other alternatives:

There is already an upgrade path for the loot involving sigils and they didn't want to confuse it
Maybe the coding is harder because of the sigil upgrades
Maybe they really expect us to be completing these things more quickly than we are
Maybe they just made a mistake and forgot to get them in on time
Maybe they just made a different mistake and meant to get them in but missed
Maybe ...

I could go on for awhile. I am not eliminating money (although it seems like a reach), but rather am pointing out that a lot of simpler and more innocent answers exist.

p.s. I think there should be epic tokens in the quests btw

[ArkoHighStar]

Not at all true. There are several other alternatives:

There is already an upgrade path for the loot involving sigils and they didn't want to confuse it
Maybe the coding is harder because of the sigil upgrades
Maybe they really expect us to be completing these things more quickly than we are
Maybe they just made a mistake and forgot to get them in on time
Maybe they just made a different mistake and meant to get them in but missed
Maybe ...

I could go on for awhile. I am not eliminating money (although it seems like a reach), but rather am pointing out that a lot of simpler and more innocent answers exist.

p.s. I think there should be epic tokens in the quests btw

No the devs were clear they felt that tokens should not be given out because the quests were too short on epic

[Horrorscope]

No offense but Turbine made epic all about the grind for epic tokens and shards, scrolls etc. There is no other reason to do these quests. Why would people waste resources for no gain?

Sense of adventure?

[Magusrex777]

I am guessing they did not want this quest ground for epic tokens. I do not feel this is an awful failure. I think the hostility of SOME of the posts in this thread encourage Turbine not to include epic level on the next mid/low level quest they release. I guess they were hoping people did new content for more than just the rewards. There are quests in the game that I have repeated just because they were cool, the time spent and the loot offered are pretty bleak but the quest is fun.

I believe they are working on something really cool for high level people. I think PAX point special points to this. They want people to buy up as much of the old high level content as possible before they release really cool new high level content with even better rewards. I think this was just a bonus thing IE not planned while they are working on the cooler stuff. That is my hope anyway. I am admittedly a glass half full guy though.

[ArkoHighStar]

Sense of adventure?
have you ever played epic?

[Horrorscope]

I like the new quests beautifully done, but my guildies and friends are already saying they do not plan to run the quests because of the lack of tokens. They are most definitely not too short for an epic dungeon token and in fact a couple of them are definitely longer then OOB, Von1 and Von 2 which makes it even more funny and the other two are approximately the same length/time. Do you guys even run your own quests is the question?

I do agree that even if they were too short, you can just drop the percentages of obtaining one then to compensate. But really I'd run it just to see something different to start.

[Horrorscope]

have you ever played epic?

So no sense of Adventure? That's too bad then.

If it's so bad, then pretty much anything one would give me, would not be enough.

[Cyr]

No the devs were clear they felt that tokens should not be given out because the quests were too short on epic

Indeed it's hard for the devs to make 4-5 quests (no raids) for an update that are long enough to justify an epic token... Sounds like a whole other issue here with the new 'content' since EU came out.

[Do'Urden]

If I ever, for one second, started caring what someone ONLINE thought about my ONLINE rep, I would straight up dive off a mountain.

You don't care about your rep so you disabled it :confused: I don't expect a response, but I do expect to read about some ***** driving off a mountain tomorrow.

[vettkinn]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.

[Wizzly_Bear]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.
No longer surprised thay avoid us? Welcome to no longer being a newbie. Give it a few more months and then you'll no longer be surprised about all their errors in judgement and performance being the impetus for us making fun of their mistakes.

[bobbryan2]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.

Because "working on a solution" is rarely synonomous with "it'll be fixed really quickly"

[Lifespawn]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.


When they blatantly lie to us by saying the quest is too short to deserve a dungeon token.

Thats why they avoid us.

As stated earlier in the thread the only reason they could have done this is because of the cost of the pack with tokens they need some cash from non vip but don't want to gouge the low level p2p people with a high price for a pack that alot of them won't ever get to 20 to even enjoy on epic.

How they thought this would slide by us is beyond me who cares about the length of the quest it has nothing to do with it the only variable here is von 5 it takes forever and gives 2 tokens which i am grateful for BUT plain and simple there is an epic dungeon timer for a reason so we can't farm very very few people would be able to nonstop farm these quests whenever they came off timer.


increase the timer to 20 hours for all epic quests if you need to because length of quest obviously is not a factor and stop trying to pull the wool over our eyes.

Myself and everyone else that pays for this game has a right to be satisfied or not these updates aren't free we PAY for the service i for one won't sit by and just take it i will voice my opinion if nothing changes then i'm not playing the employees to do a less than satisfactory job i'll pay someone else.

[lolwatboomer]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.

do you work for Turbine!? :mad:

[Inkblack]

Comrades, I could see that you guys are dissatisfied with the new epic content and the devs said that they are working on a resolution. But is it really necessary to make fun of them for these mistakes?

I'm no longer surprised that they avoid us.

I must have missed it, where did they say they are working on a solution?

[ArkoHighStar]

So no sense of Adventure? That's too bad then.

If it's so bad, then pretty much anything one would give me, would not be enough.

Sure make new high level quests designed from the ground up to be high level, not rehashed old low level quests and raids, or repurposed low level content, and I will be happy to adventure in those quests. And make them semi difficult not like the Inspired quests that were getting blitzed after the first hour.
The best times I have had in this game has been the first night of new content as we die horribly rushing into the unknown, to bad we haven't had anything like that in a while.

This isn't railing against epc content in general, just how it is being used as a replacement for true new high level content, even the inspired stuff has its place, but my hope is with mod 5, but until I hear from turbine what mod 5 will contain quest wise my hopes are not high.

[vettkinn]

I must have missed it, where did they say they are working on a solution?

We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.


do you work for Turbine!? :mad:

No comrade, it's dev~dev sympathy. Complaining is fine, but trolling on them is not helpful. They're people too you know.

[ArkoHighStar]

I must have missed it, where did they say they are working on a solution?


It's in the known issues list because it's not the kind of functionality that a player would expect. The known issues list is not reserved exclusively for bugs.

The Sentinels quests are short, and so we didn't feel it was appropriate to give Epic tokens for their completion. We have seen the feedback for this quest and are working on another solution.

there is one solution put in epic tokens

[Tolero]

I see we've reached a point where the thread is too laden with fighting and insults to allow it to persist. The quests currently have no epic tokens, but we don't intend to leave the quests with no way to gather epic components. This is something that will be addressed in the future.