Sorcerer Archer

[Tormaz]

I'm looking at putting together a sorcerer archer build. I am not sure where to start being pretty new to the game.

Any help?

[Phidius]

Sorcerors are difficult to multiclass. Wizard, however, goes very well with ranger. If you're looking at my signature, I highly recommend Gemstone over that slacker Phidius :D

[binnsr]

Personally, I'd recommend that you either be a nuker or an archer. There are a couple of reasons behind this. First, trying to be both means that you'll not be all that good at either and might make your way onto folks' DNP list (both non-performing arcanes and archers in general tend to make those lists). Second, as a new player, you don't necessarily understand the nuances of playing either an archer or a caster in DDO and I usually recommend to folks trying to combine skill-sets to play both of them separately before trying to combine them. Archers are typically Fighters or Rangers. Rangers get a bunch of the ranged feats for free, fighters get 11 more feats than anyone else, as well as access to the Weapon Specialization feat tree and the Kensei Prestige Enhancement. Third, Sorcerers and Archers really don't have very many synergies -- a sorcerer wants a high constitution and a high charisma, while an archer wants dexterity, strength and constitution.

Finally, both classes have quite a few feats in order to perform well -- none of which overlap at all.
- Sorcerers want maximize, empower, extend, spell penetration, spell focus, etc.
- Archers want as many of: Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Precise Shot, Improved Precise Shot and Weapon Focus: Ranged.



With all that said, a 32-point build and access to plenty of tomes, you could probably get stats high enough all around to make it somewhat workable. If you really want to go this route, I'd suggest a 14Sorc / 6 Ranger split (you could also toss in 2 monk levels for evasion and another two feats). Your spell DCs aren't going to be high enough for the insta-kill spells at end-game, so focusing on buffs or no save debuffs would constitute the majority of your spells (I also recommend playing a wizard before a sorcerer so you get a better feel for what spells are better in what situations and why you want different ones at different times -- it makes the choices a lot easier when presented with the less flexible sorcerer path).

I don't have ton of time to put together different build alternatives, but here is a rough outline
Elf - access to longbow enhancements for both to-hit and damage.

STR 14 (6 build points) +2 tome +6 item = 22 (24 with a rage spell)
DEX 18 (10 build points) +2 tome +4 level +2 enhancement +6 item = 32
CON 12 (6 build points) +2 tome +6 item = 20 (kind of low, but with toughness and gear, you'll be in the 300 hp range)
INT 8 +2 tome (not necessary but handy for skill points)
WIS 8 +2 tome = 10 (you'll need an item with at least +1 wisdom to cast 1st level ranger spells - probably only rams might)
CHA 16 (10 build points) +2 tome +1 level +3 enhancement +6 item = 28


Class level order for this split could be any that you want -- just take Ranger at first level for the greater skill points at level one.

Feats could probably be:
Force of Personality
Extend Spell
Maximize Spell
Empower Spell
Toughness
Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Heighten Spell
(if adding 2 monk levels, I'd recommend Lightning Reflexes and Toughness (with Luck of Heroes on the non-monk level where you previously had Toughness))

Enhancements:
Racial Toughness II
Elven Dexterity II
Sorcerer Charisma III
Sorcerer Energy of the DragonBlooded IV (less if you run low on APs)
Elven Ranged Attack II
Elven Ranged Damage II
All of the ranger favored enemy damage and accuracy enhancements you can fit in.
As many of Improved Maximize, Improved Empower and Improved Heighten as you can fit in
Pick one damage line for spells and get as many enhancements as possible there (both of the lineage lines and the manipulation line for the chosen path)


For Saves, you'd actually be doing pretty well as saves are one of the few places where a ranger/sorcerer split has synergy. The ranger gets 1:1 saves in Fort/Reflex while the Sorcerer gets 1:1 in Will save.
Using the layout above (including the two Monk and the two save-related feats), you could have:
Fortitude: 25 = 3 Monk +5 Ranger +4 Sorcerer +5 Con +5 Resist +1 Luck of Heroes
Reflex: 33 = 3 Monk +5 Ranger +4 Sorcerer +11 Dex +5 Resist +2 Lightning Reflexes +1 Luck of Heroes
Will: 30 = 3 Monk +2 Ranger +8 Sorcerer +9 Cha (Force of Personality!) +5 Resist +1 Luck of Heroes
* Add +4 to all of these for Greater Heroism at higher levels.

You should have around 1800 spell points with all the end-game gear (shroud spell point item and archmagi belt from Amrath). Since you'll be using a bow a lot of the time, you'll probably want to try to find a superior potency vi item - there are a couple of named necklaces out of Amrath that could accomplish this or keep an eye on the AH)


In conclusion, this build could be a fun one to run, but I'd recommend you limit yourself to soloing or running mostly with guildies as you level -- in my experience having played this game for 4.5 years now and capped a WF battle sorcerer as well as having partially leveled an arcane tempest (halfling 12 wiz/6rgr/2mnk) and leveled up with a couple of battle sorcerers.



edit: and as Phidius said, wizard and ranger go much better together -- especially for the extra feats. Wizard/Fighter/Monk might also be a reasonable way to go, but I'm out of time and wouldn't be able to expand on that at the present.

[Tormaz]

Thanks for the advice.

I guess I was just trying to think of a build that would allow a caster to have other means to do dps if they ran out of spells.

I saw you mention a Fighter that builds as ranged.. wouldn't that just get you laughed at? I only ask because I see people giving Rangers grief all the time for going AA.

[binnsr]

Ranged anything will get you laughed at in a lot of situations. :)

My advice (having played a couple of ranged characters as well as a TON of melees) is if you're going to focus on ranging is to learn to kite mobs in a tight circle so that the melees in your party don't have to spend time chasing them -- its a tactic that I've used pretty successfully with my repeater-based fighter.

If I get a chance later today after church, I'll detail out a Wiz/Ftr/Mnk split as well as a Wiz/Rngr/Mnk.

As an aside - if you were to go elf, you could pick up the full Elven Arcane Archer line with any of the splits mentioned so far.

[gavagai]

Thanks for the advice.

I guess I was just trying to think of a build that would allow a caster to have other means to do dps if they ran out of spells.


The problem is the number of feats it takes to do DPS with ranged.

However, if you want to sacrifice only 2 feats, you can take Rapid Reload and Exotic: Repeater Crossbow, and load up on Repeaters with stat-damagers, paralyzers, and improved destruction. You can contribute to DPS without actually having to do the DPS.

[unbongwah]

A good archer wants high STR & DEX, pretty good BAB, and beaucoup feats; ironically, an archer needs higher base DEX and more feats than a dual-wielder to be effective. A good arcane caster wants high INT or CHA and as many arcane class levels as possible, which results in crappy BAB. The two don't mix well, IMHO.

If you still want an archer / caster, I recently posted a newbie-friendly 28-pt elven Arcane Archer bard build (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=2805268#post2805268) which I think is pretty decent: good ranged DPS, buffs & heals, CC via Fascinate (can go Virtuoso for more CC songs), high UMD. Isn't the best at anything and I wish I found a way to work in max TWF or Warchanter (without sapping ranged or metamagic feats); but ought to be a good support build, I hope.

EDIT: could take cleric instead of bard; shift CHA points into WIS. Though be prepared to have everyone expect you to be a healbot when they see "cleric" in your description, then rag on you for not being specced for max healing. X-P

[ArichValtrahn]

Ranged only does good DPS when manyshot is active and thats around 20 seconds out of every 2 minutes. Adding ranged to your arcane is not a good idea.

[unbongwah]

Ranged DPS has never and probably will never beat melee DPS in DDO, but it's still possible to have fun as an archer if properly specced. And I understand some crazy people play archers in DDO to have fun, possibly because they're crazy.

[Tormaz]

Ranged DPS has never and probably will never beat melee DPS in DDO, but it's still possible to have fun as an archer if properly specced. And I understand some crazy people play archers in DDO to have fun, possibly because they're crazy.

This is something that I think is lost on many people. So many people worry (myself many times included) about what is the best for something instead of just playing something you think you will enjoy.