PvP is all DDO is missing.

[JohnPain]

There is so many things that can be added to the PvP on DDO to make it so much funner and interesting. These are my suggestions:

1) First, they must hide enemies names. There are so many good stuffs about the Rogue class, but the most fun and deadly one is the sneake attack and as the name say SNEAKE, it means Hidden, Invisible to eyes, and Undetectable ( information for the poeple that does not know what the true meaning of sneake mean ). Is no fun to have a strategy planned with some friends and send them to sneake behind and attack while you keep them occupy and everything blows up beacuse they can see your name on top of you.

2) If you want to have a PvP match it means you want to prove your strenght and strategy against other players as a team or by yourself. Whould you not expect a prize, some experience, or something else for your hard work and wastes of bolts, arrows, potions, scrolls, wands, ingredients for magic, and many other wastable stuffs? Or/and at least a recognition on a list of players who have fought bravely like you?

3) Is also nessesary a place were you know you are going to come and is going to be full of people wanting to PvP, or some clan wanting to prove their strategy as a team against other clans. Would not be fun to compete against other guilds and have a record of loses and wins so you can compare their accomplishments as a team?

Finally, in my opinion DDO would be so much funner and entertaining if there was a bar were you would can go and find other players or guilds ready for a pvp match, rather than going to the lobster bar in the harbor and start sending messeges through the general and advice chat inviting poeple to pvp your party and wait for like an hour for a player, plus two more if you want a 3v3. Players does not care about pvp because they dont get anything from it, unless you are all bored and dont have anything else to do in game.

If you have any other suggestions to make a great DDO with awsome PvP and guild matches and ranking list, please post in here. Let DDO owners, technicians, and producers know that we the players want some fun and rewarding PvPs.
Besides that, DDO is an awsome game, i so much fun to play with my friends that for us this is all DDO is missing to make it great.

[blitzschlag]

There is so many things that can be added to the PvP on DDO to make it so much funner and interesting. These are my suggestions:

1) First, they must hide enemies names. There are so many good stuffs about the Rogue class, but the most fun and deadly one is the sneake attack and as the name say SNEAKE, it means Hidden, Invisible to eyes, and Undetectable ( information for the poeple that does not know what the true meaning of sneake mean ). Is no fun to have a strategy planned with some friends and send them to sneake behind and attack while you keep them occupy and everything blows up beacuse they can see your name on top of you.

2) If you want to have a PvP match it means you want to prove your strenght and strategy against other players as a team or by yourself. Whould you not expect a prize, some experience, or something else for your hard work and wastes of bolts, arrows, potions, scrolls, wands, ingredients for magic, and many other wastable stuffs? Or/and at least a recognition on a list of players who have fought bravely like you?

3) Is also nessesary a place were you know you are going to come and is going to be full of people wanting to PvP, or some clan wanting to prove their strategy as a team against other clans. Would not be fun to compete against other guilds and have a record of loses and wins so you can compare their accomplishments as a team?

Finally, in my opinion DDO would be so much funner and entertaining if there was a bar were you would can go and find other players or guilds ready for a pvp match, rather than going to the lobster bar in the harbor and start sending messeges through the general and advice chat inviting poeple to pvp your party and wait for like an hour for a player, plus two more if you want a 3v3. Players does not care about pvp because they dont get anything from it, unless you are all bored and dont have anything else to do in game.

If you have any other suggestions to make a great DDO with awsome PvP and guild matches and ranking list, please post in here. Let DDO owners, technicians, and producers know that we the players want some fun and rewarding PvPs.
Besides that, DDO is an awsome game, i so much fun to play with my friends that for us this is all DDO is missing to make it great.

so you play a rogue and want to own ppl? glad you can't in ddo!

the moment they start balancing a pve game for pvp is the moment all goes down the drain.

[uhgungawa]

PFFT!!! You can take your PVP and go play WoW, MW2, AoC or whatever just keep it out of here for other than a sideshow ;)

[Krag]

DDO isn't balanced for PVP. End of discussion.

[KoboldTrapper]

See previous 2 statements.

DnD was NEVER about player vs player. It was always players vs Dungeon Master. (I decied who lives and dies, etc...) Yea, him. The one thing DDO lacks is what separates it from the "trash" MMOs out there for those of us NOT into smashing each others brains out with a 2x4.

[epochofcrepuscule]

Sweet a pvp lover!

Heres my suggestion, find an mmo that brags about its pvp content, and play that! YES!

Common sense can take you far in life. The less pvp based a pve game is, the better.

[Enochroot]

PvP should be, and should've always been, PvP questing. Race, puzzle, damage, whatever.

[Aesop]

yep we're definately missing PvP... but our aim is getting better . Soon we'll shoot it, kill it, mount it and hang it on the Wavecrest Tavern wall and use it to hand wet cloaks on to dry

never been a PvP fan... I perfer working against the baduns over kicking the **** out of the players.

Aesop

[Jakarr]

SNEAKE, it means Hidden, Invisible to eyes, and Undetectable ( information for the poeple that does not know what the true meaning of sneake mean ).

I guess you dont know what Sneake means...here I'll help you

http://www.sneake.ru/

[Skirmish]

Personally, I think the PVP system for DDO is fine the way it is. (well, mostly, since most of the spells I list to use can't be cast in the arena)

Those of us that don't want to have anything to do with it, save when we get a little curious, don't have to deal with it. There's a nice sectioned off area in half the bars that let people go at it in a tavern brawl or they can do missions/games against each other. What more do you need?

As stated above. If you want PvP so you can show off the size of your 'junk', then either be happy with what we've got, or go where it's more of what the game is centered on.

(Note, I have played a bit of PvP with friends or when talked into it by someone I'd been running with. But, I have yet to play with the new dueling system. So I have no idea how well that works.)

[Missing_Minds]

2) blah blah blah... Or/and at least a recognition on a list of players who have fought bravely like you?

A leadership board was promised in Mod 3. We have now passed Mod 9 and Updates 0-3.

Still waiting. Hell, even Codemasters got a board working for the Europe servers.

[Kahuna68]

yep we're definately missing PvP... but our aim is getting better . Soon we'll shoot it, kill it, mount it and hang it on the Wavecrest Tavern wall and use it to hand wet cloaks on to dry

never been a PvP fan... I perfer working against the baduns over kicking the **** out of the players.

Aesop

I completely agree with this!


There is so many things that can be added to the PvP on DDO to make it so much funner and interesting.

If you're going to try to make a valid point, perhaps you might want to avoid using words that don't exist? Highlighted above is the word to which I am referring. :D

[Lorien_the_First_One]

The absence of a focus on PvP is one of the strenghts of this game. I hope they never focus more on it because it will mean they will need to continue to divert resources from the rest of the game and get into the silly class vs class balancing that pvp requires.

[Uska]

The lack of pvp is why some are here and dnd cant be balanced for pvp without changing the game. so no thanks

[Gunga]

I think the OP is absolutely right.

Though I would trade PVP for Druids, Half Orcs and all the Reincarnates.

Besides that, I agree 100%.

[DagazUlf]

My suggestion... take your 1 post and your PVP and go elsewhere.

Thanks.

:p

[PyrosianFelicity]

Sheesh, why all the PvP Hate? This is the PvP Board, isn't it kinda expected that PvP-lovers come here to discuss it? Why's everyone else here, stopping by on the PvP board just to bash it?


As for my opinion ('Cause that's what forums are for)...

-DDO shouldn't try to balance PvP. Having come from a PvP server on Neverwinter Nights, it's just a bad idea. People are too smart, too clever, and will find workarounds, new combos, or some way to have an uber build. PvP balance as it is now isn't bad. Casters that aren't so hot in endgame do better in PvP. Rogues that are essential in many dungeons get blown to pieces in the arena. It's not so much about every character having an equal chance of killing any other character of equivalent level and wealth, but about every character having an equal amount of usefulness in DDO.
Besides, once you start trying to balance PvP, it's just a slippery slope of changes and fixes that leave everyone angry and nobody happy.

-A couple more aspects to encourage PvP would be nice. No unique items, or easy xp, but a couple small perks to reward those that do well would be cool. Maybe have XP awards like the Slayer bonuses for killing a certain number of players within a level or two of you. There are ways to balance things like that (ex: They have to be different players, so you can't kill your buddy 100x for easy xp). A little more to get people interested would be kinda nice.


There's something thrilling about PvP that makes it more interesting than boss fights against an AI opponent. It requires thought. When you're going up against a dungeon boss, it's a procedure of buff, fight, heal, loot. In a PvP fight though, there's much more of a thrill to it. You can see your opponent buffing, they can see your preparations, and you're mentally running through a list of tactics and strategies that you can use, while at the same time trying to guess by your enemy's preparations what they'll be doing. You examine their gear to see if you can recognize it and tell something about their character, you sit on the sides of the arena to watch them fight so you know what you're up against... It's so much more in-depth and challenging than the Rinse'N'Repeat cycle of killing a boss. You've got an opponent who doesn't behave in predictable patterns that can be guessed, you have an opponent who's just as smart as you, if not smarter, and just as prepared.



PvP can be really awesome, if it's done right. I don't think DDO should be too different from what it is now, but a little more encouragement for PvP would be nice.

[hydra_ex]

There is so many things that can be added to the PvP on DDO to make it so much funner and interesting. These are my suggestions:

1) First, they must hide enemies names. There are so many good stuffs about the Rogue class, but the most fun and deadly one is the sneake attack and as the name say SNEAKE, it means Hidden, Invisible to eyes, and Undetectable ( information for the poeple that does not know what the true meaning of sneake mean ). Is no fun to have a strategy planned with some friends and send them to sneake behind and attack while you keep them occupy and everything blows up beacuse they can see your name on top of you.

2) If you want to have a PvP match it means you want to prove your strenght and strategy against other players as a team or by yourself. Whould you not expect a prize, some experience, or something else for your hard work and wastes of bolts, arrows, potions, scrolls, wands, ingredients for magic, and many other wastable stuffs? Or/and at least a recognition on a list of players who have fought bravely like you?

3) Is also nessesary a place were you know you are going to come and is going to be full of people wanting to PvP, or some clan wanting to prove their strategy as a team against other clans. Would not be fun to compete against other guilds and have a record of loses and wins so you can compare their accomplishments as a team?

Finally, in my opinion DDO would be so much funner and entertaining if there was a bar were you would can go and find other players or guilds ready for a pvp match, rather than going to the lobster bar in the harbor and start sending messeges through the general and advice chat inviting poeple to pvp your party and wait for like an hour for a player, plus two more if you want a 3v3. Players does not care about pvp because they dont get anything from it, unless you are all bored and dont have anything else to do in game.

If you have any other suggestions to make a great DDO with awsome PvP and guild matches and ranking list, please post in here. Let DDO owners, technicians, and producers know that we the players want some fun and rewarding PvPs.
Besides that, DDO is an awsome game, i so much fun to play with my friends that for us this is all DDO is missing to make it great.

1. Sure. Hide the names. Too bad we can still see your whole body.

2. OH! Waste of a whole 1k pp to buy all that easy stuff. Scrolls? pffft. Only noobs use scrolls.

3. Clans? Toto, I don't think we're in runescape anymore.

See? All 3 points addressed without even brining up balance issues. That's how invalid your argument is. It doesn't even need a valid argument to counter it!

[PyrosianFelicity]

1. Sure. Hide the names. Too bad we can still see your whole body.

2. OH! Waste of a whole 1k pp to buy all that easy stuff. Scrolls? pffft. Only noobs use scrolls.

3. Clans? Toto, I don't think we're in runescape anymore.

See? All 3 points addressed without even brining up balance issues. That's how invalid your argument is. It doesn't even need a valid argument to counter it!

That's not addressing the points at all, that's interpreting them at something other than the valid issues they are.


1. Hiding player names. Gee, what's that bring to mind? The fact that stealth in DDO only works against monsters. Having working stealth against players would be a huge game-changer. People would invest in Spot and Listen on any PvP character, and spells and items to boost them would suddenly become popular. And, to address all the concerns about, "Ohhh, I don't want your PvP to mess up my PvM!" it wouldn't, because the problem now is that stealth doesn't work against players. Don't PvP, and you'd never even see the change.


2. Wrong. UMD is one of the strongest skills in DDO. A Rogue with high UMD can scroll a ton of buffs they wouldn't have otherwise, and that can get expensive if you PvP regularly. The point is still valid, that it'd be nice to have some kind of PvP reward, especially if a player chooses to expend their own resources. Fighting a Wizard? Hit him with a Wand of Grease to slow him down. For the wizard, it suddenly matters whether or not he has enough UMD to scroll a Freedom of Movement. Clickies help with some of this, but it's a pain to grind for dozens of clickies when you can purchase scrolls instead.


3. Clans/Guilds/You And Your Buddies. The point is valid no matter what label you slap on it. It's competition between groups of people.

[hydra_ex]

That's not addressing the points at all, that's interpreting them at something other than the valid issues they are.


1. Hiding player names. Gee, what's that bring to mind? The fact that stealth in DDO only works against monsters. Having working stealth against players would be a huge game-changer. People would invest in Spot and Listen on any PvP character, and spells and items to boost them would suddenly become popular. And, to address all the concerns about, "Ohhh, I don't want your PvP to mess up my PvM!" it wouldn't, because the problem now is that stealth doesn't work against players. Don't PvP, and you'd never even see the change.


2. Wrong. UMD is one of the strongest skills in DDO. A Rogue with high UMD can scroll a ton of buffs they wouldn't have otherwise, and that can get expensive if you PvP regularly. The point is still valid, that it'd be nice to have some kind of PvP reward, especially if a player chooses to expend their own resources. Fighting a Wizard? Hit him with a Wand of Grease to slow him down. For the wizard, it suddenly matters whether or not he has enough UMD to scroll a Freedom of Movement. Clickies help with some of this, but it's a pain to grind for dozens of clickies when you can purchase scrolls instead.


3. Clans/Guilds/You And Your Buddies. The point is valid no matter what label you slap on it. It's competition between groups of people.

Although masked in jest, this is what I was saying.

1. Get your facts straight before you post a suggestion.

2. Scrolls are inexpensive at worst. Most are useless. And many fights don't last long enough for any amount of heal scrolls to be used.

3. Before making a suggestion, try to get your names right. People are more likely to consider your suggestion if you have the correct terminology ("guilds" instead of "clans"), spelling ("I" instead of "i") and grammar ("more fun" instead of "funner")

[Anderei]

How about no?

Go play guildwars instead.Every MMO it's niche DnD/DDO is NOT PvP, and no don't destroy me game because of that.


it means you want to prove your strenght and strategy

Go on an epic quest instead.

[Stormanne]

Turbine already has a mechanic for PvP that I would love to see implemented here...Monster Play (http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Monster_Play). Take the mechanic that they use in LoTRo Monster Play and tweak it to fit here. It would solve both the alignment issues for PvP and keep the congruity of PvE balancing...

[Orratti]

ok I have at one time highly enjoyed pvp in this game. However most of that enjoyment came not from defeating other players as much as when I finally reached a point when they finally quit trying to defeat me for fear they would die in doing so. Pvp is only really fun if you are winning and believe me being an untouchable killer won't win you brownie points inside or outside the arena. As to your sneak question. Being able to sneak wouldn't do you any good as most good pvp players can't be backstabbed as they are wearing heavy fortification items.

Pvp isn't a matter of skill no need to say it is. It is a matter of power. Those with the loot will win. Some skill is involved but not very much and when 2 equal opponents dual the one who pulls the cheapest tricks will win. I don't see a reason to create a leaderboard to hail a jumpcaster who bounds off a platform and hits you with a maximized empowered whatever while you were looking elsewhere or a melee chasing you down tripping and pounding on you while recovering hps from some food he just ate from the bar.

[Rice]

There would have to be way too much time put into balancing pvp that it's just not worth it. You can't have players healing themselves for 300 HP when their HP is 350 on a 4 second cooldown. You can't have players proccing 600 damage lightning strikes. You can't have players use CC that doesn't have a save. You can't have players use insta-death spells on other players. You can't have players critting each other for 1000+ damage.

Would be too much work.

[Gleep_Wurp]

newb.

[r3dl4nce]

Let DDO be free from PvP and e-peen match...

[MsEricka]

/not signed

pvp is not what ddo or d&d is about.

[MysteryNotes]

If i wanted to kick other people's asses i'd go play DotA or HoN.

I like DDO because its PvE/PvM.(Whatever you like to call it.)

[calvinklien]

Sheesh, why all the PvP Hate? This is the PvP Board, isn't it kinda expected that PvP-lovers come here to discuss it? Why's everyone else here, stopping by on the PvP board just to bash it?

you answered your own question...


As for my opinion ('Cause that's what forums are for)...

and pvp is only fun every once in a great while, to me, but mostly not fun, cuz it's usually not balanced. for example usually when i go in to pvp someone's two or three lvls lower or higher than me.

and i would have no problem of you little rogues being able to sneak and hide and run up behind my back to stab me just so long as i can bathe the area in extended, maximized, empowered firewalls/discoballs and fogs while i spam wail of the banshee. ;)

[Daiur]

There would have to be way too much time put into balancing pvp that it's just not worth it. You can't have players healing themselves for 300 HP when their HP is 350 on a 4 second cooldown. You can't have players proccing 600 damage lightning strikes. You can't have players use CC that doesn't have a save. You can't have players use insta-death spells on other players. You can't have players critting each other for 1000+ damage.

Would be too much work.

+1, excellent post.

Energy Drain, Irresitible Dance and the like, or just spamming FoD waiting for the 1. PvP is fun when playing against friends and setting strict limits ( I'll not throw up a fascinate+dance combo and than whack you with my bare fists to death). But it simply can not be balanced in D&D.

[zblade]

I am a huge PVP fan but I do agree with everyone else though. DnD is not a pvp type of game and it will never be one.

You just need to play the game as it is, there is PVP and yes it is not balance and yes it does not have all the skills/spells and etc in PVP where it is in PVE.

But you need to know that the majority of the people who plays DDO is for the DnD base game and PVE (which is DDOs strongest point), which you can easily see from the replies from in this thread.

Turbine put in PVP just for the people to waste time while waiting for a group or for the extremely bored.

But deep down, I do wish they do improve PVP but in the end, I know the devs would never compromise the game for a small group of PVP lovers like myself.

[shadowsaun]

The new guild system just might add something to this love/hate kind of debate about PvP.

So let me ask you, if the new guild system affected pvp at all...would you change your mind about it?

I mean you guys who avidly hate the idea of PvP in DDO...would you maybe take a second look, or have a second thought? Or if the new guild system did affect PvP somehow..would this be a new all time failure for Turbine? (putting my money here)

For me, Pvp in DDO is very very lackluster (I started being a huge fan), I have been playing it at all levels and found the most fun from beating people at a higher level than me. Its a great training ground, and fun place to experiment!

But now that Im L18, I find myself playing more of a "protector" kind of roll. Its like, I only kill people who are giving grief to others (beware all you bards that think its funny to fascinate everyone and then leave, you are my main target and PWS has no save). I have yet to find a group of like level/type people to have a fun Cap the flag or death-match with. I ALMOST hope that we could have GvG...ALMOST (yes, I am a 4 year GW vet)

Anyways...thoughts anyone?

[KKDragonLord]

*Sigh* i feared this since the F2P launch

we are being overrun..it is futile to resist

at least i know Turbine isn't "mentally challenged" enough to make PvP anything other than completely optional and marginal

[DoctorWhofan]

Turbine already has a mechanic for PvP that I would love to see implemented here...Monster Play (http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Monster_Play). Take the mechanic that they use in LoTRo Monster Play and tweak it to fit here. It would solve both the alignment issues for PvP and keep the congruity of PvE balancing...

ONLY PvP I would accept.

[shadowsaun]

*Sigh* i feared this since the F2P launch

we are being overrun..it is futile to resist

at least i know Turbine isn't "mentally challenged" enough to make PvP anything other than completely optional and marginal

Im only going to say this ONCE.

PVP MUST BE OPTIONAL AND NOT AFFECT PVE/CHAR DEVELOPMENT AT ALL!!!!!

If they do the same **** that GW did, Im out. Also, I left GW for this game. I love PvP, and I love the idea of PvP with DDO, but it needs to stay how it is regarding the characters people make. If the new Guild system added some PvP element, it would be cool, as long as it doesn't divide our player base like things are in Guild Wars. People who are not interested in PvP at all SHOULD NOT HAVE TO DEAL WITH THOSE WHO ARE AND VISE VERSA.

**also, I would so love the Monster Play idea here, that would be so cool!

[r3dl4nce]

Im only going to say this ONCE.

PVP MUST BE OPTIONAL AND NOT AFFECT PVE/CHAR DEVELOPMENT AT ALL!!!!!

If they do the same **** that GW did, Im out. Also, I left GW for this game. I love PvP, and I love the idea of PvP with DDO, but it needs to stay how it is regarding the characters people make. If the new Guild system added some PvP element, it would be cool, as long as it doesn't divide our player base like things are in Guild Wars. People who are not interested in PvP at all SHOULD NOT HAVE TO DEAL WITH THOSE WHO ARE AND VISE VERSA.

/signed

[flynnjsw]

Snip

I mean you guys who avidly hate the idea of PvP in DDO...would you maybe take a second look, or have a second thought? Or if the new guild system did affect PvP somehow..would this be a new all time failure for Turbine? (putting my money here)

Snip

Anyways...thoughts anyone?

If the new Guild System makes any kind of PvP mandatory, that would more than likely be the end of my sub.

[DoctorWhofan]

If the new Guild System makes any kind of PvP mandatory, that would more than likely be the end of my sub.

Agreed.

[William_the_Bat]

The main problem with PvP in DDO isn't balance, but the fact that a huge proportion of the player base hears the term "PvP" and immediately thinks of trash talking rude boys having e-peen contests. For a lot of people, the first response to any mention of PvP is to FREAK OUT.

Seriously, if they made guild rewards based on PvP, people would throw up their arms and cancel their subs and go play hello kitty online, since that's probably the only place left to get away from the trash talk and PvP politics.

If you want PvP with fast paced combat like DDO, go play Asheron's Call on the Darktide server.

[DoctorWhofan]

The main problem with PvP in DDO isn't balance, but the fact that a huge proportion of the player base hears the term "PvP" and immediately thinks of trash talking rude boys having e-peen contests. For a lot of people, the first response to any mention of PvP is to FREAK OUT.

Seriously, if they made guild rewards based on PvP, people would throw up their arms and cancel their subs and go play hello kitty online, since that's probably the only place left to get away from the trash talk and PvP politics.

If you want PvP with fast paced combat like DDO, go play Asheron's Call on the Darktide server.

I hate Hello Kitty. So bad...Too much Pink

Probably LotRO, that has a PvP that makes sense to me that is

[Chai]

1. DDO is not WOW. I dont have a WOW account, I have a life.

2. PVP games suck for PVE. in all the PVP based games, 90% of the zones that didnt come with the current expansion are deserted. Sucks being a new player in that environment.

3. Class balance issue patches every 2 weeks are lame. People cry that their class is gimped because they cant win in PVP, - then when its changed everyone else crys that the class is overpowered. Sucks in PVE when I am raiding and one week I am an awesome raid healer and the next week I cant keep a blade of grass standing up straight due to nerfing a character I worked on for 2 years.

4. I dont want to farm gear for PVE and PVP and have 2 or more different complete suits of gear hanging around. The level of farming DDO has is already high enough for people that dont play video games 16 hours a day. I also dont want to create specific builds for PVP and specific builds for PVE.

5. PVP is just another schwantz waving contest. If it is put into the game in any other place than the taverns, you will have people at max level greening newbie toons. EQ tried to solve this where they put a 5 level spread into the game and it just made it so that the level 15 twinked as all get up PKers were PVPing in zones where the level 10s and 11s hang out, etc.

No Ty. No need to add PVP focus to this game.

[jcTharin]

PvP needs one thing and one thing only.

more people like me

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=237585

that up there is how you should play PvP in this game

[Ninetoes]

^^
I Have No Fear!

Good For The Good God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[jcTharin]

i hereby declare myself the king of PvP. because by my standards i have won every mach i have ever played

when i get to -500 hp i supper win

[Josh]

http://cdn2.knowyourmeme.com/i/3375/original/cool-story-bro.jpg

Much gooder.

[Bracosius]

Wow, just wow. How dare you have the nerve to come into the PvP forums and make a post about PvP.

Can everyone relax a little the OP is allowed to have an opinion and he even posted in the correct place.

[jcTharin]

i do agree with the OP a little. the classes are a insanely mismatched when it comes to them fighting each other.

however i agree with everyone else that we should do nothing about it.

but i do think that when i try to sneak up to someone that they should, you know, not see me.

[shadowsaun]

Really...how can we even have a public discussion about this?

All the cry baby 10 year old E***** people are also posting on this thread. The same people who derail an honest talk about our game, are the same people who take a way from what little PvP experience could be had in DDO.

I mean, people who complain about the attitude of PvPers have never honestly participated in a forum. Were its mostly pee verses pee. This thread is a perfect example.

[Gleep_Wurp]

what are you 12?

[Josh]

Wow, just wow. How dare you have the nerve to come into the PvP forums and make a post about PvP.

Can everyone relax a little the OP is allowed to have an opinion and he even posted in the correct place.

True, and eveyone else is entitled to express their disapproval.

Right?

[jcTharin]

what are you 12?

are you asking mentally or physically?

I know a guy who is 14 and has the maturity of a 4 year old.

personally I'm 17 and i think i have the mentality of a 8 year old and a 25 year old at the same time

[shadowsaun]

you and me? pee v pee?

[Sweetsoul86]

I respect that you have the right to your opinion, however, I do not agree in any way, shape, or form. Almost every toon I have is a cleric or a healer of some sort, I do not pvp, I have pvp requests blocked because blind invites are rude and annoying and I have no interest in it, I only bother to pvp with a couple of friends that like to pvp and only when I'm bored to tears and they have no one else to fight (this happens like 2-3 times a year, if that).

If I wanted pvp I'd go join WoW, I've always loved the fact that pvp is not required in any way and I'd be sorely disappointed in DDO if they made it any kind of requirement. I don't believe that rewards should be given for something like killing fellow players. If pvp was required I too would likely give up my sub. I have friends that enjoy pvp so I understand those of you that get a kick out of it but there are far more people who have no interest in it which is evident by your complaint that there aren't enough people pvp'ing for you to find people to fight. I sincerely hope that guild vs. guild pvp isn't part of the new guild system coming in because I know very few people who would be interested in that and those of us who are in multiple guilds would be divided in our loyalties of who we're supposed to fight for making it harder to be social with more people in the game.

[Mikula]

There is plenty of great PvP opportunities in this game already. I personally have played with such fine PvPers as: The idiot who takes more agro than he can handle, dies and then cusses out the cleric, the warrior who takes his great axe to an ooze and then has to punch monsters for the rest of the mission and who can forget the zerging wiz with 8-10 con. With some many great PvP masters such as these in the game what more could you ask for? If these folks aren't attacking the players not the monsters I don't know what is.

[ddoplayer064]

ONLY PvP I would accept.

Honestly, if you had played LOTRO for any length of time, you wouldn't say that. Turbine promised that monster play would not, in any way, affect regular play. You know what? Turbine lied...

[KKDragonLord]

Turbine already has a mechanic for PvP that I would love to see implemented here...Monster Play (http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Monster_Play). Take the mechanic that they use in LoTRo Monster Play and tweak it to fit here. It would solve both the alignment issues for PvP and keep the congruity of PvE balancing...

Hey that actually sounds cool


Honestly, if you had played LOTRO for any length of time, you wouldn't say that. Turbine promised that monster play would not, in any way, affect regular play. You know what? Turbine lied...

*shudders*

[Bracosius]

True, and eveyone else is entitled to express their disapproval.

Right?

It is possible to disapprove/disagree without belittleing the OP. Some people are just stating they are against all PvP, etc. No problem. Those who are personally attacking him and telling to him leave the game are being rude.

[Dumluck]

Pvp has no place in d&d. I fail to see the point.

[Burradin]

The new guild system just might add something to this love/hate kind of debate about PvP.

So let me ask you, if the new guild system affected pvp at all...would you change your mind about it?

I mean you guys who avidly hate the idea of PvP in DDO...would you maybe take a second look, or have a second thought? Or if the new guild system did affect PvP somehow..would this be a new all time failure for Turbine? (putting my money here)

For me, Pvp in DDO is very very lackluster (I started being a huge fan), I have been playing it at all levels and found the most fun from beating people at a higher level than me. Its a great training ground, and fun place to experiment!

But now that Im L18, I find myself playing more of a "protector" kind of roll. Its like, I only kill people who are giving grief to others (beware all you bards that think its funny to fascinate everyone and then leave, you are my main target and PWS has no save). I have yet to find a group of like level/type people to have a fun Cap the flag or death-match with. I ALMOST hope that we could have GvG...ALMOST (yes, I am a 4 year GW vet)

Anyways...thoughts anyone?

Simply, no, PVP is still a waste of resources anyway I look at it.

[fytorebus]

See previous 2 statements.

DnD was NEVER about player vs player. It was always players vs Dungeon Master. (I decied who lives and dies, etc...) Yea, him. The one thing DDO lacks is what separates it from the "trash" MMOs out there for those of us NOT into smashing each others brains out with a 2x4.

My thoughts exactly.

[Bracosius]

Pvp has no place in d&d. I fail to see the point.

Why? Because it doesn't interest you? I don't like collectibles, should they remove them?

The point is PvP can be enjoyable. When all you run are static quests and you always know there will be 2 ogres, and they will always run right at you, and they always need a 16 to hit, and they always...get the point?

In PvP there is an elemant of surprise and enjoyment that is impossible to duplicate with computer AI. I don't want the entire system changed to accomadte PvP, far from it. But I do think some improvements could be made and it could add another area of enjoyment for the player base.

But since you fail to see the point I suppose it doesn't matter.

[Visty]

When all you run are static quests and you always know there will be 2 ogres, and they will always run right at you, and they always need a 16 to hit, and they always...get the point?

you always know there will be 2 casters, and they will always kill you right away, and you will never even reach them, and you never..., and they always, .....get the point?

[Return_To_Forever]

you always know there will be 2 casters, and they will always kill you right away, and you will never even reach them, and you never..., and they always, .....get the point?

Lol, is the point that the current system needs love? Yeh, that's what he is saying.

[Visty]

Lol, is the point that the current system needs love? Yeh, that's what he is saying.

no, the point is that it would need huge balancing and nerf acts to make pvp fun

[gavagai]

Lol, is the point that the current system needs love? Yeh, that's what he is saying.

Needs more than "love" to make interesting PvP where the game has insta-kills and 500 DPS characters with 500 hps.

It would take a fundamental overhaul of how combat worked and what gear we had.

[pregnable]

I do not mind pvp balance if it does not stray far from dnd. It should not be a pressing matter though.

Would be nice if Hide and Invis worked in pvp(still not working right?).

I like pvp the way it is now though... casual + ganking.

They could make a future adventure pack with a big tavern pvp arena in the center of town, so that people could mess around and watch each other fight.

That would be fun and I would not think it would bother anyone.

[Bracosius]

no, the point is that it would need huge balancing and nerf acts to make pvp fun

Started my own thread, issue addressed there. I don't agree with the OP on what needs to be done. But I do agree improvements could be made.

[Return_To_Forever]

Needs more than "love" to make interesting PvP where the game has insta-kills and 500 DPS characters with 500 hps.

It would take a fundamental overhaul of how combat worked and what gear we had.

Gav I do appreciate your fair input on this, as you have put forth effort to not condescend, unlike so many others who do not even try to put forth valid reasons against PVP balance in this game.

But first and foremost a long look and diagramming of the current metagame would need to take place, so that common threads could be found, in order to change the big picture with only a couple changes. Buffs in pvp areas, that are auto granted is one way to go about this, but if monster proportion is our true balance then its the Devs who have the real numbers for the balancing. eg Elite monster stats.

I do not pretend to know the answer to this, I have been here only to ward off the silly combatants of PVP, cause I frankly got tired of the pointless discouraging and belittling of people interested in other types of game play.

Suffice to say the balance for PVP in any game is a bit out of whack, I have never heard of a PVP system without OP skills, classes, and/or interactions. These things do not have to be perfect to be a hell of a lot of fun, especially since in this game it would not be the main focus, or part of your character progression for PVE.

So yeh, we agree, if you are saying it could take a lot, a lot of love and would be hard, but if you are arguing that its impossible or pointless then I guess we don't.

[19BangoSkank19]

DDO isn't balanced for PVP. End of discussion.

Why must all the DDO PvE'rs be instantly closed to the idea of PvP development.
It is an unfortunate when the community cannot even engage the idea
of innovation into this aspect of the game. The above quote is but one example.
Whenever even the whisper of PvP development comes up, it gets drowned by the same
Forum Ignorance.

[19BangoSkank19]

Gav I do appreciate your fair input on this, as you have put forth effort to not condescend, unlike so many others who do not even try to put forth valid reasons against PVP balance in this game.

But first and foremost a long look and diagramming of the current metagame would need to take place, so that common threads could be found, in order to change the big picture with only a couple changes. Buffs in pvp areas, that are auto granted is one way to go about this, but if monster proportion is our true balance then its the Devs who have the real numbers for the balancing. eg Elite monster stats.

I do not pretend to know the answer to this, I have been here only to ward off the silly combatants of PVP, cause I frankly got tired of the pointless discouraging and belittling of people interested in other types of game play.

Suffice to say the balance for PVP in any game is a bit out of whack, I have never heard of a PVP system without OP skills, classes, and/or interactions. These things do not have to be perfect to be a hell of a lot of fun, especially since in this game it would not be the main focus, or part of your character progression for PVE.

So yeh, we agree, if you are saying it could take a lot, a lot of love and would be hard, but if you are arguing that its impossible or pointless then I guess we don't.

Good points. Much better than the 'PvP is not welcome here. End of Discussion' posts.

[flynnjsw]

Why must all the DDO PvE'rs be instantly closed to the idea of PvP development.
It is an unfortunate when the community cannot even engage the idea
of innovation into this aspect of the game. The above quote is but one example.
Whenever even the whisper of PvP development comes up, it gets drowned by the same
Forum Ignorance.

PvP development leads to time taken away from PvE development. PvP balance leads to PvE inbalance. If you can disprove either this, or that there is some silent majority in THIS game, then you will have an argument. Until then, quit beating on that dead horse.

[19BangoSkank19]

PvP development leads to time taken away from PvE development. PvP balance leads to PvE inbalance. If you can disprove either this, or that there is some silent majority in THIS game, then you will have an argument. Until then, quit beating on that dead horse.

Why MUST that mean time taken away from the PvE? Why not assign a group for
PvP development and be done with it? The resources taken do not have to be
significant. It just should be invested into much more than what is currently being
put into it.

[flynnjsw]

Why MUST that mean time taken away from the PvE? Why not assign a group for
PvP development and be done with it? The resources taken do not have to be
significant. It just should be invested into much more than what is currently being
put into it.

To address just the issue in red; there are already complaints that there are not Devs enough in the game to deal with bugs already in the game, create new (PvE), and everything else; exactly where would this group from that would not take resources away from another part of the game? Would you be willing to donate enough maoney to bring in this group and pay them?

[Sylvenon]

Make hide & move silently and spot & listen checks matter in pvp, and i would be thrilled.

[LILCylon]

Although masked in jest, this is what I was saying.

1. Get your facts straight before you post a suggestion.

2. Scrolls are inexpensive at worst. Most are useless. And many fights don't last long enough for any amount of heal scrolls to be used.

3. Before making a suggestion, try to get your names right. People are more likely to consider your suggestion if you have the correct terminology ("guilds" instead of "clans"), spelling ("I" instead of "i") and grammar ("more fun" instead of "funner")

Now all You're trying to do is suck up to someone who DOES have a valid response. And no one cares what you call a group of people: some call it guild, others call it clan. What dif? It's like the saying Potato (Po-tay-to) or Potato (Po-tah-to). Maybe spelling does show you are more proficient at proving a point, but on the forum it really isn't all that important.

[KKDragonLord]

Why MUST that mean time taken away from the PvE? Why not assign a group for
PvP development and be done with it? The resources taken do not have to be
significant. It just should be invested into much more than what is currently being
put into it.

That could work, although it would be a different game and would maybe require people to pay for it separately, which is not a bad idea.

[wooshrow]

I really fail to see why a game cannot be parameterized with different balance settings: one for PvE and one for PvP. The entities are all the same. You should be able to reuse much of the engine. Most modern programming language offers that kind of flexibility... unless if ddo is implemented in C...

Anyway, the way it is now, PvP is really not that bad. But you need time to learn your PvP art. You need to know well what your strength, and weakness of opponent classes, and learn to exploit the layout of the arena. You will discover that each class has its own best strategy, and what kind of opponents you can deal with, and which you should avoid. A fighter shouldn't obviously just lumbering on an opponent sorcerer with his huge two hander; he'll be held, and burned to dust before he even come close to swinging his sword. No, he should jump, sprint, and strike fast. Use trip or stun on the sorcerer, then she is yours. Similarly, a smaller archer is no match for such an attack by the fighter. But if she continuously has her running and jumping boost active she can outmaneuver the fighter, and shoot him to dead.

But ... i have no tips for rogue. The class is too weak in PvP, because most seasoned PvPers will have 100% fortification, which means rogues cant sneak-dmg them. It could be, if we can have a different balance setting for PvP, that with respect to rogue, fortification is capped to 50%.

[Uska]

Why must all the DDO PvE'rs be instantly closed to the idea of PvP development.
It is an unfortunate when the community cannot even engage the idea
of innovation into this aspect of the game. The above quote is but one example.
Whenever even the whisper of PvP development comes up, it gets drowned by the same
Forum Ignorance.

Because time spent on PvP development is time taken away from what the majority wants the pvp fans never seem to get that also it would take major changes to game to balance pvp if they do that it is sure to bug and again affect us.

Also calling people ignorant because they disagree with you about the value of pvp isnt cool -1

[Chai]

I see the way people moan around these parts when updates change the effectiveness of their build. Now add into this that updates would need to occur weekly instead of once every few months for class balance issues to be addressed.

DDO would have needed to be a PVP oriented game from the start for this to even work. I already see too much griping about nerfing things from classes because someone cant beat them, and the thing they want nerfed is the same thing that makes the class even worth playing. (OMG nerf manyshot, because I cant beat it in PVP!!)

Imagine arcane archers sans many shot. Some of the most rediculous suggestions have come from people who think somone is too powerful because they cant be beat in PVP.

Dungeons and Dragons is not a class balance focused game. Live with it.

[cdbd3rd]

Necroing once is just "being curious"...
Necroing again, might be time to look for a support group for that 'alternative lifestyle choice'. ;)


:p

[Karavek]

you always know there will be 2 casters, and they will always kill you right away, and you will never even reach them, and you never..., and they always, .....get the point?

your post only actually serves to illustrate the need of improvments to pvp in this game. THe PVE content is never going to grow fast enough to sate any but themost casual player.

A well balanced pvp system can offer hours of ever shifting tactical game play. That is currently not possible in this games extremely imbalanced system which is not even fair in pve where some builds will always outshine. Or where long time players with a armory of twink gear will insure new players always feel gimped.

A good pvp world area where players could use only designated pvp gear etc would be great fair fun I imagine.

[Visty]

A well balanced pvp system can offer hours of ever shifting tactical game play.

true

but a well balanced pvp system needs an entirely new game

play ddo2 if you want pvp, but this isnt ddo2

[Yajerman01]

I have killed every Pvp'er on my server at least once. It is fine the way it is, no need to change it. :)

[KoboldKiller]

What makes you think a improvement to PvP is going to make the power gamers happy?

From what I have seen and the people I play with (and I know several power gamers) they could care less for PvP.

We don't need resources wasted on what I consider a pointless system that adds nothing to the game or furthering my characters development.

We need content, races, classes, pre's etc..........

We don't need a system that is nothing more than a glorified bragging rights ritual. There are plenty of games for that.

I find it funny that people come to a game that is all about PvE and then want a better PvP system.

Next thing you know they will be calling for open instances.

[Eladiun]

MMMM... necroed PvP thread.... just what we needed.

[Carelicoa]

THe PVE content is never going to grow fast enough to sate any but themost casual player.

Speak for yourself, some of us have an attention span longer than that of a fruit fly on meth. Using "waah, devs are slow on PvE content" does not help the PvP argument because once you place people on duty to create your e-peen enhancer, you take away from the PvE devs. Self-defeat.

[diamabel]

...
1) First, they must hide enemies names. There are so many good stuffs about the Rogue class, but the most fun and deadly one is the sneake attack and as the name say SNEAKE, it means Hidden, Invisible to eyes, and Undetectable ( information for the poeple that does not know what the true meaning of sneake mean ). Is no fun to have a strategy planned with some friends and send them to sneake behind and attack while you keep them occupy and everything blows up beacuse they can see your name on top of you.

As long as you hide in a shadowy place it should be harder for someone to spot you. More so if you have trained move silently and hide in shadows. Besides, other players can train spot or listen and thus be able to detect you. Are you suggesting to turn sneaking into something like invisibility? Invisibility can be countered (e.g. see invisible, true seeing). Are you suggesting to turn sneaking into something similar to invisibility and be undetectable until you attack (like in WoW)? That would be unfair.




2) If you want to have a PvP match it means you want to prove your strenght and strategy against other players as a team or by yourself. Whould you not expect a prize, some experience, or something else for your hard work and wastes of bolts, arrows, potions, scrolls, wands, ingredients for magic, and many other wastable stuffs? Or/and at least a recognition on a list of players who have fought bravely like you?

There exists different PvP playgrounds. Tavern brawl areas. Team vs Team playgrounds. Just visit the different bars in and around Stormreach.

I'm sceptical if item rewards should be introduced with PvP. Item rewards are a two edged sword in MMOs (effort to get it vs usefulness). This only motivates people that don't care about PvP to get the job done for a certain item. Just look at the battlegrounds in WoW. "Zerg back and forth" to earn some PvP points to unlock items. In the end this just hurts the quality of PvP.
Additionally you'll have players complaining about the usefulness of items (PvP vs PvE item usefulness). Class balance in PvP is already a tricky subject. Item balance issues is opening a whole new can of worms...




3) Is also nessesary a place were you know you are going to come and is going to be full of people wanting to PvP, or some clan wanting to prove their strategy as a team against other clans. Would not be fun to compete against other guilds and have a record of loses and wins so you can compare their accomplishments as a team?

I don't play DDO for PvP, but some kind of game ladder / ranking wouldn't hurt. To earn a certain ranking should be enough reward if you are really interested in PvP. Right now that isn't implemented, so in the meantime the PvPers will need to make the effort by themselves to record the rankings.

[Sleepingcap]

I know people QQ about DDO and PvP saying that DnD has never been about PvP and you should go play some other MMO to get your PvP dose.
But in all fairness, why do I have to play some other MMO as an addition to DDO just to get some decent PvP?

Something semi-simple, a battleground system along with a rating leaderboard with (perhaps) even a reward system. That should satisfy alot of players and would show the developers how many PvP enthusiasts there are in DDO and that they should be upgrading that part of the game aswell.

[Visty]

Something semi-simple, a battleground system along with a rating leaderboard with (perhaps) even a reward system. That should satisfy alot of players and would show the developers how many PvP enthusiasts there are in DDO and that they should be upgrading that part of the game aswell.

rewards will get abused and a leaderboard existed but got removed

the big arenas, where real pvp (to current standards, the brawl is just ****) can happen, arent used at all

why improve something which isnt used?
and obviously failed in ddo?

[Sleepingcap]

rewards will get abused and a leaderboard existed but got removed

the big arenas, where real pvp (to current standards, the brawl is just ****) can happen, arent used at all

why improve something which isnt used?
and obviously failed in ddo?


By battlegrounds I would mean a small portion of a wilderness area for PvP with fixed amount of players.
Also, if there was a decent way to spectate the matches in the pvp zones (non-brawl ofcourse) and a leaderboard that would assign points whether the match is "rated" or "unrated" which can be seen on a global server leaderboard.
If it has failed, then they should try and unfail it. And if all else fails - then give up. Currently it looks like they had something going on, then just stopped improving it until people forgot it ever existed and then moved on to PvE content.

[hehateme]

The main problem with PvP in DDO isn't balance, but the fact that a huge proportion of the player base hears the term "PvP" and immediately thinks of trash talking rude boys having e-peen contests. For a lot of people, the first response to any mention of PvP is to FREAK OUT.

Seriously, if they made guild rewards based on PvP, people would throw up their arms and cancel their subs and go play hello kitty online, since that's probably the only place left to get away from the trash talk and PvP politics.

If you want PvP with fast paced combat like DDO, go play Asheron's Call on the Darktide server.

The only PvP trash talk in DDO Ive ever seen is comming from the anti PvP community. Its been consistent and nasty since day one. Its also rarely had a solid argument usually throwing up a bunch of strawmen. Looks to me like all you anti PvPers embraced all you claim to dislike long ago. You just would rather pvp with words in the forums rather than have fun doing it in a game.

And that attitude is why I took my PvP and PvE elsewhere. Cause I dont always PvP (nor require it in a game) but if it werent for a few real life friends in this game, I could take or leave the DDO community based on the attitudes of non PvPers posting in the PvP forums since release. Seriously some nasty posting going on here, derailing threads, cant believe mods to regulate you a bit more.

[Yajerman01]

Seriously some nasty posting going on here, derailing threads, cant believe mods to regulate you a bit more.

I wouldnt waste too much time countering against the anti-pvpers. its a waste of time, not to mention that the forum represents a very very small percentage of the total actual base players. (id venture a guess and say %5).

I like pvp and pve, makes no difference to me. I rather have them fix the lag which seems to be mounting n Thelanis day by day. But in the latter, there should be some rom for people who enjoy pvp, besides its another marketing aspect that they can cash cow in on.

[Aurora1979]

[QUOTE=PyrosianFelicity;2743435]Fighting a Wizard? Hit him with a Wand of Grease to slow him down. For the wizard, it suddenly matters whether or not he has enough UMD to scroll a Freedom of Movement.


Wizard cast fleash to stone, kills you and eveyone in pvp crys about it and fleash to stone becomes a griefing tactic.

people whine that AA's get too much damage etc. fact is the only way to balance it is get rid of all feats, all enhancments all spells. give eveyone a masterwork long sword, no armour and then fight.

presto, 1 balanced PvP.

[Aurora1979]

The only PvP trash talk in DDO Ive ever seen is comming from the anti PvP community. Its been consistent and nasty since day one. Its also rarely had a solid argument usually throwing up a bunch of strawmen. Looks to me like all you anti PvPers embraced all you claim to dislike long ago. You just would rather pvp with words in the forums rather than have fun doing it in a game.

And that attitude is why I took my PvP and PvE elsewhere. Cause I dont always PvP (nor require it in a game) but if it werent for a few real life friends in this game, I could take or leave the DDO community based on the attitudes of non PvPers posting in the PvP forums since release. Seriously some nasty posting going on here, derailing threads, cant believe mods to regulate you a bit more.

From my point of view, you couldnt be more wrong. go into the harbour on cannith, look at general chat and watch all the swearing and abuse getting thrown around... by people in the fighting pits!.

Im not saying all PvP'ers are infantile children. but a large portion of them are. Personally, i hate PvP after trying it out and giving it a go. Unfortunatly for some of you the people i encountered played up exactly to the stigma given to them.

If it looks like a cat and acts like a cat.......

[Stormanne]

I couldn't care less about PvP. If the devs deem it worthy of attention, it'll get it. All the posturing and preening being done by both sides is pointless. Just remember, they had grand plans for implementing PvP a few years ago. They got the base locations in and set up the rudimentary arenas. You know what happened, so small of a percentage of the population used it that they gave up on even fixing the leader board.

Personally, if they are going to put it in, I say leave the balance as is and remove the spell restrictions. A high level, well-geared caster should be the most feared opponent in a PvP situation. In D&D, only a well equipped and extremely lucky high level melee is going to take down a high level caster. If all the PvP players are so gung-ho about having it, then make them have it under the existing rules and balance and not change it to suit them.

[Visty]

Personally, if they are going to put it in, I say leave the balance as is and remove the spell restrictions. A high level, well-geared caster should be the most feared opponent in a PvP situation. In D&D, only a well equipped and extremely lucky high level melee is going to take down a high level caster. If all the PvP players are so gung-ho about having it, then make them have it under the existing rules and balance and not change it to suit them.

in the real pvp areas every spell is allowed
the brawls arent pvp, they are brawls

just a small correction :)

[Stormanne]

in the real pvp areas every spell is allowed
the brawls arent pvp, they are brawls

just a small correction :)

Okay, now I know (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pele5vptVgc&feature=related)

[BitkaCK2]

I swear everytime I see one of these threads what I read is "I want WoW to be free to play."
I said it before (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=3238477#post3238477) but what the heck i'll say it again.

Square peg, round hole
http://scienceblogs.com/isisthescientist/upload/2009/01/ask_dr_isis/square-peg-round-hole.jpg

bitkaCK2

[Ipokratis]

I really can not understand you guys.
You say that kids want pvp but most of the answers i read from people that do not want pvp are really immature.
First of all excuse me for my English (it is not my mother language).
I am 30 years old , married and both me and my wife love PVP and PVE.
I can not see why you should all start attacking when someone DARES to MENTION the word PVP!!!!!
I have read many topics where people attack those that do mention this word.
No one forces you to play pvp.
But i can not understand why you should be so aggressive with those who like it.

DDO is in need of players if you want it to advance as a game.
And yes a good PVP system causes more players to play.
From my point of view, me and my guildies play many times the capture the flag scenario and it is realy fun.
Does this makes us all Kids that want to Pawn etc etc??
No it just makes us a group of people that have fun after 5 quests , and laugh with eachother.
And sometimes we want to find 6 more people to play and we can not find anyone.

Beeing immature is not a matter of PVP but a matter of character.

[r3dl4nce]

I am 30 years old , married and both me and my wife love PVP and PVE.If you want PvP, it's very easy, change game, there are A LOT with good PvP.


I can not see why you should all start attacking when someone DARES to MENTION the word PVP!!!!!Because changing DDO for PvP would mean balancing classes, changing skill and mechanics, destroying all the PvE.


No one forces you to play pvp.No one forces you to play DDO, if you want pvp.


DDO is in need of players if you want it to advance as a game.That was before F2P. Now DDO has a HUGE playerbase.


And yes a good PVP system causes more players to play.And more players to whine because they don't know how to play. Look just now. Players Whining for slayers arrow, players whining because PvP is dominated by casters, and so on. And now PvP players are like 0.00001% of the player base. If you take Pvp players to DDO, the whines will flood the forums.


From my point of view, me and my guildies play many times the capture the flag scenario and it is realy fun.DDO has PvP, is just for fun, play for fun as you like.



No it just makes us a group of people that have fun after 5 quests , and laugh with eachother.So use the little PvP that already is in DDO to go on having fun. No need to change or balance or give PvP rewards, it's just for fun, and it's there. None force you to NOT use the PvP system there is


And sometimes we want to find 6 more people to play and we can not find anyone.DDO is all about PvE.

[Ipokratis]

First of all i do not whine about changing anything.
I play pen and paper Dungeons and Dragons for more than 14 years so i know really well what DND is about.
PVP in pen and paper DND could not exist, since it is really hard to gather many people and do it.
But even this way , we do make events in hotels where many DND fans gather and play PVP.

The wrong thing is word PVP. The correct word would be GVG. (Group vs Group).
If all of you just let people say their opinions you have nothing to lose and you will see that there are many things about GVG that will not destroy the game at all, and will not bring whinners as you call them.

PVP can not exist in DDO cause the classses can not be PVP balanced and i agree that this is the way classes should be. It is a mistake to play 1 vs 1 or 2 vs 2.
But in a party each character can have his role even in GVG.
GVG , means creating dungeons - arenas with Objectives where groups could meet with eachother and have the opportunity to fight. (something like capture the flag but better built).

In these Dungeons parties interact with the Enviroment , but with the other party as well.
After 10 years playing as a Dungeon Master i can assure you that 99,999% of people loved this kind of dungeons.

So what i am saying is stop telling everyone to go play an other MMO.
This game does not belong to you or anyone else, and everyone has the right to tell his opinion.

[r3dl4nce]

GVG , means creating dungeons - arenas with Objectives where groups could meet with eachother and have the opportunity to fight. (something like capture the flag but better built).There are, as you are saying, the arenas for GvG in DDO. Stop. You wanna play GvG? You can. Everything that is not PvE in DDO, MUST NOT GIVE rewards.

[Ipokratis]

There are, as you are saying, the arenas for GvG in DDO. Stop. You wanna play GvG? You can. Everything that is not PvE in DDO, MUST NOT GIVE rewards.

I know that they exist.
But i can really not undrstand why you do not want people to suugest ways to make them better.
If you read the rest of my post you will see that i suggested, somethings that we have tried in pen and paper DND.
I can NOT play GVG right now because people do not play GVG!!
I just want people to say their opinions on how to make these arenas even better so that more people take part.
Where is the bad thing about this?

[r3dl4nce]

But i can really not undrstand why you do not want people to suugest ways to make them better.People can suggest what they want, but Devs should not listen to suggestion about PvP. Why? Because devs are limited and devs time is limited. If they should use X hours to improve PvP (used by less than 1% of the playerbase) they are removing Devs time from fixing bugs and improving PvE.

[Ipokratis]

People can suggest what they want, but Devs should not listen to suggestion about PvP. Why? Because devs are limited and devs time is limited. If they should use X hours to improve PvP (used by less than 1% of the playerbase) they are removing Devs time from fixing bugs and improving PvE.

This is what i mean when i say DDO needs players...
Free players do not offer money to the company ==> the company can not have enough DEVS.
There is no point in having 1.000.000 free players.

By helping the game advance in all possible ways, brings more people that are willing to give their money in order to play a game they want.
So by making GVG better does not mean that PVE will be left behind.
It will bring more players , and then more devs. And the game will be able to advance as whole with more people working on it.

People just need to be more open minded and not critisize anything different from what they are used to.

This whole situation reminds me , of all the flaming that takes part when a new edition of pnp DND is created.
Everyone is angry and do not want the edition to change etc etc. But adter some time everyone likes the changes.
I know you all might be used to the game as it is, but making developments, is only good for the game.

[r3dl4nce]

This is what i mean when i say DDO needs players...
Free players do not offer money to the company ==> the company can not have enough DEVS.
There is no point in having 1.000.000 free players.You know that is VERY VERY VERY DIFFICULT reaching level 20 and having the needed packs only by farming TP, right? Give more packs to buy, more raids to buy, more races to buy (update 7 with half-orc and half-elf will bring lot of money to Turbine) and you have fulfilled two tasks:
- improving PvE in DDO
- earning more moneys
Still, no need to waste time in PvP.



By helping the game advance in all possible ways, brings more people that are willing to give their money in order to play a game they want.Gaining a number of free PvP whiners while losing the solid playerbase of VIPs (paying every month) who are here and paying for a PvE game?


So by making GVG better does not mean that PVE will be left behind.Wasting Devs time on PvP/GvG is not using that time on PvE, and don't think that huge numbers of PvP player will come to DDO. DDO is advertised as a PvE game, so it's difficult to bring here PvP players.


People just need to be more open minded and not critisize anything different from what they are used to.Ever played on a full PvP game? Like Darkfall, Eve Online, Daoc. Ever read the forums, the whines to "nerf this it's overpower in pvp" and so on? DDO does not need this.

[Dragavon]

I think PVP is perfect as it is in DDO now.

I have happily ignored PVP since it was introduced, and I can happily continue ignoring it for as long as I play DDO. I am a happy bunny :D

I have to admit entering PVP areas a few times though, had to test how much my DR was while shieldblocking on my intimitank once. The poor barb that helped me could not punch through my DR unbuffed though :p

[uhgungawa]

WOW, I've been so blind. I see now we should have the Devs do more fore PVP so we can have 1,100,000 free players. That'll bump up the revenue :D

[Ipokratis]

PVP whinners , will never come in huge numbers in DDO.
In the other games you mentioned PVP is more like Spamming spells and abilities.
DDO can not and MUST not work this way.
As i said i suggested created Dungeons with combined PVE - PVP where the party will fight together , solve puzzles, find traps etc etc. Not just the , i see you i kill you by pressing number "1" 100 times fight....
No whinners will play this kind of pvp.

I personally know many people that would come and play again ddo and pay their money if there was something like this.
Some people got bored of knowing exactlly where each monster is in a dungeon , and how to kill it , and stopped the game.
By adding the surprise factor (with an other party in the dungeon) , it will make it more intresting for some players.
And i do not say that all dungeons should become like this. But some could be created this way.

I do not know if in your eyes i look like a whinner, but i believe i am not one.
And there are more people like me. So just liking GVG doesn't make you a whinner.
I do not ask for balanced characters. Each class has its own role and it should stay this way. In GVG dungeons all characters, and their abilities, will be needed.

[Ipokratis]

WOW, I've been so blind. I see now we should have the Devs do more fore PVP so we can have 1,100,000 free players. That'll bump up the revenue :D

who said something like that??
I said free players offer nothing to the game.

[platonicx]

DDO isn't balanced for PVP. End of discussion.

Did it ever occurred to anyone that PvE could remain untouched and just PvP be changed? There is a lot of games where PvP mechanics are TOTALLY different then PvE. Basically every skill spell would have different description in PvP ... it would require massive coding and a lot of work for something which ddo is never going to be imho but its the best possibility for ddo to have PvP in any way.

The best PvP now is to grease people into a trap xD

[KillEveryone]

I don't play for PvP. I like the PvE experience.

I've not been happy with the nerfs as it is but if PvP became a bigger part of the game, they will nerf all classes to balance things because PvPers will whine about how certain classes pwn them. This cycle will continue because there will always be a dominant class.

I don't want my characters nerfed for PvP.

Even if they could keep PvP separate from PvE, they will mess up somewhere and my character will get nerfed in PvE until they decide to fix things. I don't want that to happen either.

I also don't want to be ganked. If they implement a broader PvP set up here, players will start spawn camping and gank other players. We don't need that. That will only drive away players.

There are plenty of fine games with PvP. Go play them. This game is set for PvE and that is how it should be.

[Hendrik]

By battlegrounds I would mean a small portion of a wilderness area for PvP with fixed amount of players.
Also, if there was a decent way to spectate the matches in the pvp zones (non-brawl ofcourse) and a leaderboard that would assign points whether the match is "rated" or "unrated" which can be seen on a global server leaderboard.
If it has failed, then they should try and unfail it. And if all else fails - then give up. Currently it looks like they had something going on, then just stopped improving it until people forgot it ever existed and then moved on to PvE content.

You mean like our current Arena matches that are available?

:confused:

[Boromirs]

PvP will open up an entirely "new" part of the game. If DDO can be measured in TP's, then DDO will be worth 100 TPs and if you add a fully functional PvP system it will be then worth 200 TPs.

[jamvaru]

This is the best thread necro that I've seen in quite a while

and also a good point by TP guy, TP is valuable

I'd like to see a separate PvP server, or a dedicated ranking system with team placement by level and rank, or perhaps just one or both, user choice

there need be nothing other than a functioning playable system for PvP that unifies players across all servers

[Waukeen]

No deal.

Any additional dev hours wasted on PvP are wasted hours in the opinion of 95% or more of the player population.

[jamvaru]

pvp should be considered not discarded
many more people will play ddo, for money, when pvp is better

[flynnjsw]

pvp should be considered not discarded
many more people will play ddo, for money, when pvp is better

Wake up, it's time to go to school.

[likuei]

Please. no more work or effort for PVP. IT is a great place to try out spells and weapon affects, other than that, leave it the way it is.

[Rogann]

Getter done

[Asketes]

Please no PvP additions to DDO.

that is all, ty

[Rogann]

Please no PvP additions to DDO.

that is all, ty

We all know pvp is never gonna change so, please no more lame quest chains added to ddo


That is all.

[DoctorWhofan]

None of you are Forum clerics, stop trying RAISE THREAD!

[Rogann]

None of you are Forum clerics, stop trying RAISE THREAD!

Indeed

[Dispel]

Indeed

Totally. Stop it guys.

[Blank_Zero]

Totally. Stop it guys.

You're just mad that he said it first.