Petition to get rid of "fog of war" on explorer maps

[Twerpp]

The fog of war (blacked out areas) on explorer maps should be permanently cleared after completing the explorer points.

From an RP perspective is it hard to believe that adventurer would have mapped it out? Or remember it?

From a gameplay perspective its causing a rift between vets and new players. They cant find their way to the quest and its annoying as hell. Some of the runs are confusing and long, you simply don't remember it even after being there once or twice.

Some people are going to point out the alternatives like
-wait ten mins for a whole party to form and hold hands across meridia singing koombayaa
-everyone can print out or alt-tab to user generated maps (which are actually really great)

Not everyone is savvy on Dorims Maps/forum info/DDO Wiki, and not all can alt-tab to them while staying alive. And lets face it experienced groups and good players in general wanna get the quest going not wait for everyone or for the party to fill.

Imagine running ADQ, or Offering of Blood. You want to help some people flag but its hard to fill right away. And theres no way a newer guy is gonna remmeber those runs. Some people have a hard time with just Gianthold. I think make eveyone run the explorer points once then consider it that they have "mapped" the area. The stuff s really serving no purpose but to confuse people at the moment. It makes no sense that the fog regens after you've already explored the area.

Thanks.

[Kaervas]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

[Hafeal]

I could go along with this.

I do like how they "grey out" instead of black out now when you explore them and then enter a quest afterwards. If anything, keep they "grey out" as permanent. The only real problem is that with such a suggestion comes the additional suggestion of ... better maps. The Desert and GH maps really, well, lack.

[CaseStringer]

/signed!

[Twerpp]

Well I am happy with the maps quality when they are cleared. Its a little hard to see if you're running DDO lite though. I printed out for myself the high res scans of Dorims Maps (and credit to whoever else does them). They actually look really nice. Yeah I hide them when girls come over. 14 fantasy maps tacked onto the walls around my pc what a nerd lol.

[DANTEIL]

/signed!

I think this is a great idea. Coming from someone who gets lost in explorer areas at the drop of a hat/helm, I would welcome this change -- yea the maps are sometimes not very helpful (I'm looking at you, GH) but it would definitely help learning the areas if you could see where you had been before, rather than have it be all black again. And I think it is very reasonable and makes perfect in-game sense to tie this into finding all of the "explorer" points in the area. That would provide good motivation to actually seek out all of the explorers.

My concern would be if there is some behind-the-scenes technical reason why it might be too difficult for the game to 'remember' more than so many previously-explored areas.

[sirgog]

/signed.

I really hate booting people from 'ADQ1 extreme speed flagging run, in progress' groups when they know the quest, but just cannot for the life of them remember how to get there. When they have a map to use, they can usually find it in a semi-reasonable time, but since the Fog of War, I've been forced to boot more of these people that I'd like to.

Likewise I now find it much harder to navigate the Devil Battlefield (despite having done all explorer points there). I know the runs to everything except ToD, but still can sometimes take a wrong turn en route to Genesis Point, and I absolutely hate wasting people's time when they are speedrunning something.

[Riggs]

signed

[valorik]

signed

[BuyerSeller]

/signed

Please get rid of the fog! I always get lost! It would make my game-play experience so much better if I could see the maps and know where I was going.

[Autolycus]

/signed

[Gremmlynn]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.Kind of unreasonable to expect the game servers to store the data of what parts of every map every character in the game has uncovered. Just allowing a full map to any character who has found all explorer points (or even completed a quest for quest maps) would be a lot more feasible I'd imagine as it doesn't have to keep track of, and store the information on, every pixel of blackout that particular character hasn't uncovered yet.

[AphexTwin]

/signed

[Goetheskloeten]

I sign that too. The actual map is completely useless, and im not willing to play this game anymore without a comfortable map section. It's one of the biggest messes in the game, that I have to reveal any formerly explored map AGAIN at every time!

Change this, PLEASE!

[Kale_Gresh]

/signed

[Mister_Peace]

Signed.

[ArichValtrahn]

Ill sign, but you arent going far enough. The fog clears when you walk through the map. It should stay permanently clear in the spots you have walked through. IMO, completing your explorer points should not uncover parts of the map you havent been through yet.

[flynnjsw]

I sign that too. The actual map is completely useless, and im not willing to play this game anymore without a comfortable map section. It's one of the biggest messes in the game, that I have to reveal any formerly explored map AGAIN at every time!

Change this, PLEASE!

I think this is going way too far saying you won't play because of maps, but meh.

/signed though. One of my biggest personal hangups is learning the layout of the explorer areas.

[Kralael]

/signed !

[Emili]

/signed.

I really hate booting people from 'ADQ1 extreme speed flagging run, in progress' groups when they know the quest, but just cannot for the life of them remember how to get there. When they have a map to use, they can usually find it in a semi-reasonable time, but since the Fog of War, I've been forced to boot more of these people that I'd like to.

Likewise I now find it much harder to navigate the Devil Battlefield (despite having done all explorer points there). I know the runs to everything except ToD, but still can sometimes take a wrong turn en route to Genesis Point, and I absolutely hate wasting people's time when they are speedrunning something.
You only need to run to ToD once per character... after that take the portal.


...
While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).
You do not like the pretty map of The Pit?

[kernal42]

/signed.

[Gambill]

/signed

[ArgentMage]

Kind of unreasonable to expect the game servers to store the data of what parts of every map every character in the game has uncovered. Just allowing a full map to any character who has found all explorer points (or even completed a quest for quest maps) would be a lot more feasible I'd imagine as it doesn't have to keep track of, and store the information on, every pixel of blackout that particular character hasn't uncovered yet.

This. There's certainly a real-world reason why all your maps aren't saved in their
last state, as it seems pretty silly that if you were in an explorer area "yesterday"
(in game time), you wouldn't pretty well remember it "today".

Since the game already saves your completion state in the quest log for both quests
and explorers, no extra work - just check the bit, and if set, clear the map.

Enthusiastically /signed.

[Angelus_dead]

From an RP perspective is it hard to believe that adventurer would have mapped it out? Or remember it?
That's backwards.

From the RP perspective we are pretending that the heros don't repeat the same dungeons over and over. We pretend that each time in a dungeon is the first time, so it is more realistic to NEVER show a pre-exposed map.


From an RP perspective is it hard to believe that adventurer would have mapped it out? Or remember it?
If you find it hard to believe the character can't remember, why can't you remember. If you don't believe he wouldn't have a map to reference, why don't you reference a map?

[SlayerInFlorida]

Seems reasonable to store map info client side if it's a server storage issue.

[SINIBYTE]

The fog of war (blacked out areas) on explorer maps should be permanently cleared after completing the explorer points.

From an RP perspective is it hard to believe that adventurer would have mapped it out? Or remember it?

From a gameplay perspective its causing a rift between vets and new players. They cant find their way to the quest and its annoying as hell. Some of the runs are confusing and long, you simply don't remember it even after being there once or twice.

Some people are going to point out the alternatives like
-wait ten mins for a whole party to form and hold hands across meridia singing koombayaa
-everyone can print out or alt-tab to user generated maps (which are actually really great)

Not everyone is savvy on Dorims Maps/forum info/DDO Wiki, and not all can alt-tab to them while staying alive. And lets face it experienced groups and good players in general wanna get the quest going not wait for everyone or for the party to fill.

Imagine running ADQ, or Offering of Blood. You want to help some people flag but its hard to fill right away. And theres no way a newer guy is gonna remmeber those runs. Some people have a hard time with just Gianthold. I think make eveyone run the explorer points once then consider it that they have "mapped" the area. The stuff s really serving no purpose but to confuse people at the moment. It makes no sense that the fog regens after you've already explored the area.

Thanks.

Truth is... My warforged isn't allowed to have writing instruments anymore... well..., ever since the "crayon incident" anyway. So now he has no way to make maps. Also too many lumps on the head makes him forgetful... So everytime he enters a new zone, it's like starting all over again, at least until some divine intervention (*ahem* devs!) happens...

[woundweaver]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

this

nuff said

[Fensen]

//signed

I do not mind at all having dungeon maps black out upon reentry, however explorer area maps should stay "explored". It may be weeks or even months between trips to wilderness areas depending on play frequency, so someplace I have been only once or twice I am unlikely to remember where everything is. Rather than using limited time searching out the dungeon entrances all over again, the character's map should remain completed upon re-entry.

[protokon]

-wait ten mins for a whole party to form and hold hands across meridia singing koombayaa



Hey, this is one of my favorite things to do in DDO.

[Onerus]

Agree/ Signed

[Alorissa]

/signed

[olBillDoor]

/signed!

Maps are ridiculous now that it can't remember ONE map.

[Shanadeus]

Signed, with the possibility of making us "earn" the cleared map. Clearing all of the explorer and encounters in order for your client to get access to a cleared out map doesn't sound too shabby.

[Lorz]

Im thinking...you all need to learn the areas. Sure at first it is huge and hard....but spend the time...LEARN THE GAME...LEARN THE MAPS.

Seriously, its not hard, i can hit every rare and every explorer area.....course ive played a lot of years...but hey yeah they should just give you all level 20's and make everything just a click away so you dont have to learn anything. This is a huge game with a huge ruleset and even more complex character building. You want a simple no thought game....GO PLAY WOW...this game rewards knowledge, creative solutions, and experience.

It generally eats the unwilling to learn for lunch.

And let me say...the Cube does not have a full setting....it simple grows and eats more.

/not signed /not needed /same as learning all the quests/raids...next you people will be saying the quests/raids are too hard.....i cant figure them out....WHAAAAA...oh wait you people have already been doing this.

I hate you people. :)

[Saith-Deri]

/signed

Just because you can eventually memorize where everything is, that doesn't mean this isn't a good idea.

[Draggamor]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

/Signed here

[Draggamor]

Im thinking...you all need to learn the areas. Sure at first it is huge and hard....but spend the time...LEARN THE GAME...LEARN THE MAPS.

Seriously, its not hard, i can hit every rare and every explorer area.....course ive played a lot of years...but hey yeah they should just give you all level 20's and make everything just a click away so you dont have to learn anything. This is a huge game with a huge ruleset and even more complex character building. You want a simple no thought game....GO PLAY WOW...this game rewards knowledge, creative solutions, and experience.

It generally eats the unwilling to learn for lunch.

And let me say...the Cube does not have a full setting....it simple grows and eats more.

/not signed /not needed /same as learning all the quests/raids...next you people will be saying the quests/raids are too hard.....i cant figure them out....WHAAAAA...oh wait you people have already been doing this.

I hate you people. :)

Have you tried 3 Barrel Cove for instance? Just the fact you get in the tavern and out again, you have to RE-DO the WHOLE map AGAIN? That's just stupid!

[ArgentMage]

And Tangleroot, and Sorrowdusk, and Orchard, and Vale, and Gianthold...

But seriously, the best idea I've seen on these forums is the one where once you
get all the Explorer points, you get to see the map all the time.

[Fedora]

Im thinking...you all need to learn the areas. Sure at first it is huge and hard....but spend the time...LEARN THE GAME...LEARN THE MAPS.

Seriously, its not hard, i can hit every rare and every explorer area.....course ive played a lot of years...but hey yeah they should just give you all level 20's and make everything just a click away so you dont have to learn anything. This is a huge game with a huge ruleset and even more complex character building. You want a simple no thought game....GO PLAY WOW...this game rewards knowledge, creative solutions, and experience.

It generally eats the unwilling to learn for lunch.

And let me say...the Cube does not have a full setting....it simple grows and eats more.

/not signed /not needed /same as learning all the quests/raids...next you people will be saying the quests/raids are too hard.....i cant figure them out....WHAAAAA...oh wait you people have already been doing this.

I hate you people. :)

So you agree? :p

I hate Sorrowdusk - travel to the dundeon (ogre cave, troll cave, whatever) and enter the quest. Complete the quest and exit - to find your wilderness map is gone! Huh? :confused:

[Fedora]

Bah! What's with the scroll bars on my post above?

[MrWizard]

Every other mod they seem to play with that...first it was all foggy...then it was remembered, then it was all foggy, then there was no fog for awhile....now it is all fog...

next it will be liine of sight only and no 'memory' on the map, which makes sense in a way.

[Quarterling]

/signed

[Kemoc]

I Agree
There are maps with websites you can print out, but proper mapping should be within the game.

[yfernbottom]

Yes please. Very much like the idea oif a reward for getting all the exploration points.

If nothing else, fixing the current bugged out version needs to be a higher priority. It's making some zones annoying as hell to quest in.

And if it's really a storage issue, make them client side.

[ArgentMage]

And if it's really a storage issue, make them client side.

Client side only works if you only ever play from one computer.

For those of us who play from 2 or 3 computers, it makes things ugly.
I actually carry my keymaps around on my thumb drive, because having to
reprogram 100 keymaps on each computer gets to be a drag. So, no
client-side, please...

[OmegaDestroyer]

/signed

[Aschbart]

/signed

If the map doesn't remember anything, there's no point having a map to start with! Even a blank screen the user could draw a map in himself would be more useful than that!

So, either always show the map once all explorer points have been uncovered, or tie a certain area of the map to each explorer point, and uncover that area upon reentry. This would not require any additional information to be stored on the servers than what's already stored.

[Bodic]

I cant say that as well some people are forgetfull and will not recall the way hence the fog of war. lets buy a map and map it that sounds good to me.

[Rogue66]

/signed

[Rubiconn]

I like the idea of having the map unlocked once all explorers are discovered. Some people will say play the game and you will learn the maps - truth is I have so much totally useless information in my head that I use for work that I dont have room to memorize a DDO map. If you dont like having the map then dont ever expand it or open it, it will be one more point that you can hold over me in your total uberness. You can brag in the general chat, I memorized Vale of Twighlight and you didnt. /meh

[i_am_L]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).
yes, I completely agree.
the are you sure about five maps... sometimes it erases (black fog of war) the map I interred last...
/Sign

[Ranmaru2]

That's backwards.

From the RP perspective we are pretending that the heros don't repeat the same dungeons over and over. We pretend that each time in a dungeon is the first time, so it is more realistic to NEVER show a pre-exposed map.

But isn't it possible to pretend that your characters are being asked on all of the 3 main quests in the Desert at the same time and upon entering/exploring the desert they note the entrance to other important places on a map of the area? You don't go running into a desert without noting important key markers/mastered sense of direction unless you fully plan on getting as lost and dying out there.

We go to zawabi's refuge and speak to zawabi to learn about all of the artifacts he seeks and it just so happens that the three main quest givers in town know of places in the Menechtauran desert where these items can be acquired, so if one picks up all 3 quests you can pretend they're entering the desert for the first time, but with 3 different objectives to differentiate from, noting other areas of interest isn't too far of an expection

[Ruland]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

As a new player, these ^ things stood out like a sore thumb. I couldn't believe that the FOW regenerated after going through an area and clearing it all. And the game badly needs multi-map capabilities.



/signed and /signed.

[Vindraxx]

As someone new to DDO, but as an experienced gamer, I was somewhat caught offguard the first time my explorer map reset. It doesn't make logical sense that as an adventurer your character doesn't keep track of his travels as he explores new areas. Having the whole map after hitting each explorer area makes the most sense if the game isn't able to easily keep track of which areas your character has explored.

As a new player it is extremely frustrating getting into groups and having to be led everywhere or risk slowing down the group while you try to navigate your own way to quests you never have been to before. Yes, I can go to the internet to look up maps, but it really shouldn't be necessary to play the game. If I knew that I could explore an area and keep my map, it would allow me to unlock the map and then start questing in the area.

/signed for a feature that makes too much sense to not already be available in game.

[toaf]

fixed,was nice to see

[AyumiAmakusa]

I propose a 'Map Shop' in-game where you can purchase maps and open them anytime you want to view the map (which is separate from the map we already have) and this map is completely clear and we're allowed to mark/draw on it however we please. I won't mind buying a Map Bag for this to keep all the maps.

[hydra_ex]

/signed.

I've been wanting this ever since the feature was introduced (was it really a year ago now?).

[Partydeluxe]

/signed! Because a wilderness is fun to explore the first time and a pain in my behind every other..

[Lorz]

Seriously I know all the explorers areas...even 3bc. Both old and new versions of it. It really does surprise me that peeps don't know these areas....do you also not know all the quests? Reeally?


I mean I get new players not knowing...been there done that .... It's how I learned them...by not knowing them. Same as a quest or raid....if I don't know it I run it until I do.

Seems people want nice little maps so there is nothing to learn...no burden to remember.
Yes the ddo mapping system is worthless at times.....but in real dnd you have to draw your own map as you go....but no you people seem to think ddo is wow and comes with a complete map. Ah yes....the game slips ever farther away.....thus I say /NOT signed and Turbine has way more important things to fix than this little inconvenience. So man up peeps, learn the aras, learn the quests, learn the game.....if not...just continue to be worthless pile-ons.

[dranreb]

/signed

[Aganthor]

/signed!

[Vindraxx]

Seems people want nice little maps so there is nothing to learn...no burden to remember.
Yes the ddo mapping system is worthless at times.....but in real dnd you have to draw your own map as you go....but no you people seem to think ddo is wow and comes with a complete map. Ah yes....the game slips ever farther away.....thus I say /NOT signed and Turbine has way more important things to fix than this little inconvenience. So man up peeps, learn the aras, learn the quests, learn the game.....if not...just continue to be worthless pile-ons.

Of course once you run quests over and over you will learn them, even if you have a full explorer map, you will eventually learn where everything is and not need it anymore. WoW doesn't come with a complete map, you explore it and the areas you have explored remain available to that character. DDO isn't WoW, so if I join a group working on a quest that I've never been to (or have been to only once), they can't even help me get to the quest because if they leave the instance they take an XP penalty. Then I have to go find a website with a map so I can get there, or be led there by anothe player at which point I'm paying more attention to which way the leading player is turning in front of me than learning the way to the quest. If I had the option to run through and actually explore all the areas and have it remain available, it would be much easier for me, and there would be no excuse for me not knowing how to get to each of the quests. And yes, with time, I would learn all of the quests like you do, and as I do in WoW.

Usually making the game easy to transition to is a good thing... why make new players have to resort to third party websites to actually play the game?

[JollySwagMan]

In-game maps that can be bought from Vendors. I recall something like this in Neverwinter Nights or Baldur's Gate, if server resources are the issue then having a click-able map may be better than the server saving character information.

[riprock]

signed

[phalaeo]

Im thinking...you all need to learn the areas. Sure at first it is huge and hard....but spend the time...LEARN THE GAME...LEARN THE MAPS.

Seriously, its not hard, i can hit every rare and every explorer area.....course ive played a lot of years...but hey yeah they should just give you all level 20's and make everything just a click away so you dont have to learn anything. This is a huge game with a huge ruleset and even more complex character building. You want a simple no thought game....GO PLAY WOW...this game rewards knowledge, creative solutions, and experience.

It generally eats the unwilling to learn for lunch.

And let me say...the Cube does not have a full setting....it simple grows and eats more.

/not signed /not needed /same as learning all the quests/raids...next you people will be saying the quests/raids are too hard.....i cant figure them out....WHAAAAA...oh wait you people have already been doing this.

I hate you people. :)

Lame.

It's not lack of trying, cause god knows I've tried... I'm directionally challenged. I'm willing to work for an unlock, but it should be there.

To the OP-
/signed

[pSINNa]

/signed

Coit out~

[Meretrix]

The map mechanics should stay as they are but if you complete the explorer quests in a zone it should no longer go black.

[Vellrad]

/signed

[Stillwaters]

/signed - would love to see one or all of the following fixes to maps:

Once all explorer points are unlocked you also unlock ability to purchase a map that stays unlocked...

Make the purchasable map MARKABLE!! (or mark out the key locations)

For the TWELVE'S SAKE!! please make 3d maps - these have been around for many years in other games keep up turbine!!

for those that say "I've been playing for 4 years and know all the maps anyway"
a) you wont have to purchase the map..
b) you will not have to jump out of quest to lead ppl as often.
c) just cause MY brain wont remember a map, doesnt mean my CHARACTER's brain sucks!!

[elujin]

/signed
and ignore those two grinches there just two full of uberness they can't help it .
if there is a none black map ddo will explode ! doom dooooom !!

[mjb27]

signed! For both multi-level maps and keeping things greyed out rather than blacked out once you've explored an area.

[Luxx0r]

/Signed

It's very perplexing the way the explorer maps work.


While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

THIS!

This feature is the most confusing aspect of lots of quests. Quests maps don't make any sense at all when levels are piled. Would it really be so difficult to separate them by floor?

[LazyTigerLily]

/Signed

I have enough trouble remembering where my car keys are at any given time remembering where a quest is on a massive map is a thousand times harder!

and OMG multi level maps YES, YES, YES!!

[Lorz]

Lame.

It's not lack of trying, cause god knows I've tried... I'm directionally challenged. I'm willing to work for an unlock, but it should be there.

To the OP-
/signed

But what and so many others miss....is sure the orchard would now not be covered it...but it wont exactly help you.....as you also need to know the terrain.

And honestly if you cant learn the explorer areas...how do you learn the quests? And really....i mean i know lots of directionally challenged people...and maps dont usually help those people....

But hey....its all in style to just dumb down the game....i mean really...why even have instances...lets just get a big button middle of the screen so when you want to get xp/loot you just press it....we can label it "EASY BUTTON".

More dumbing down of the game for the .... yeah ill just stop there...but really if this is your problem....i hear Hello Kitty MMO doesnt use any maps...and requires no knowledge. DnD and DDO have always been about knowledge.

[Lorz]

/signed
and ignore those two grinches there just two full of uberness they can't help it .
if there is a none black map ddo will explode ! doom dooooom !!

Your right it wont explode...but it also wont make better players or players with any knowledge.

But hey...your an easy button kinda person...so why not.

[LazyTigerLily]

Your right it wont explode...but it also wont make better players or players with any knowledge.

But hey...your an easy button kinda person...so why not.

I think you may be wrong here, having a map that you can actually read may encourage people to know it better not be the easy button as you call it here. Knowing the map and knowing the terrain are very different. Knowing a map requires that you study it to gain some knowledge of the layout, knowing the terrain means you go run around until you have it memorized. Knowing the terrain may work for you, but it may not work for others.

[Halock]

The black has no right to return once you've cleared it, like every other game in every other genre, and yes, even in this very game, for 3 maps at a time, it should be replaced with dark gray when the zone resets.

The only reason it is the way it is, is poor design, there is no reason a char cant have all of his/her explored maps saved on their pc, hell, it would save some of the servers processing power to not have to update the 3 maps per player every time someone logs in or out or teleports all over the place.

This would not dumb down the game, it would improve it, because in the end its just poor design in a bad need of joining the 21st century.

[phalaeo]

But what and so many others miss....is sure the orchard would now not be covered it...but it wont exactly help you.....as you also need to know the terrain.

And honestly if you cant learn the explorer areas...how do you learn the quests? And really....i mean i know lots of directionally challenged people...and maps dont usually help those people....

But hey....its all in style to just dumb down the game....i mean really...why even have instances...lets just get a big button middle of the screen so when you want to get xp/loot you just press it....we can label it "EASY BUTTON".

More dumbing down of the game for the .... yeah ill just stop there...but really if this is your problem....i hear Hello Kitty MMO doesnt use any maps...and requires no knowledge. DnD and DDO have always been about knowledge.

Here, have a -1 for your efforts- as pitiful as they were. ;)

[Treesong]

/signed!

[EustaceTrevelyan]

Would prefer if the black fog of war never came back once removed, period. Just keep the half-tone grey out when the zone resets and respawns.

It's extremely annoying how you can only have something like 5 maps uncovered at once before the oldest one gets blacked out when you enter a new zone. There is no sense of having 'explored' an area, it makes the already fairly useless map even more useless.

While we're on map complaints, please add in multi-level map capabilities (map automatically changes as you go up/down floors within a zone).

/this, absolutely. Agree with OP on the fog thing, why? Did i have a brain tumor for breakfast?

And as for multi-level no-map, that deserves its own thread chock full of fear, loathing, petitions, sit-ins, marches, and possibly riots. I will only do Misery's Peak once per character now, on elite, because I HATE that cavern area after getting lost there who knows how many times. Tempest Spine, tho, there is NO MAP at all, not even a crappy one, for the internals. Seriously? It's hard enough figuring out how to get to the entrance (the outside is only typically crappy), but once you do, there's NO WAY to figure out where you are except for running it a bunch of times and memorizing it. And don't get me started on The Pit. I'm just glad you don't really need to run it more than once.

[bigolbear]

signed.

[metrolancer]

/Signed.

[Gauthaag]

heh, lot of players complaining about T...bine adding easzbuttons there and there and now u demand easybutton for matter which requires onlz a bit of orientation and direction sense.

[Maxelcat]

signed!

and please fix the dungeons maps too....

[Pattykakes]

/signed!

[PaulReaper]

Yup the fog of war should be lifted! as a first time player, there's nothing worse than finding an entrance only to try and find it again later! Would it be hard to stor the maps in a cookie type file on users pc? it already stores the xplorer points. And as regards 3d, even a 1 or a 2 (etc) at a tunnel entrance (to indacate wich level) would help a lot!

[nibel]

/signed

[Ganolyn]

I'd be happy if they would just increase the size of the swath we are mapping to be the entire map orb, but signed.