Shorty Flinger

[Kaeldur]

I thought of trying, just for fun, a throwing axe specialized character. I know it's not popular and won't be a great asset to the party, but just for the sake of building wacky toons and, why not, RPing...
I don't intend to take it on to level 20, I can build vet toons and will probably take it to level 8 at most...
Anyhow, I have thought of two approaches: halfling or dwarf. A dwarf is much sturdier and I believe will be a better asset. I'll post both my ideas and if anyone wants to comment or say which they preferred or whatever... Or sometimes I might've missed something obvious that should be pointed out.

** Edit: I have been playing the character for a while and as I progressed I did a few minor tweaks to the build. I then, for some reason, decided to check out what was up with Arcane Archer and discovered that Imbue Force will work on my throwing axes, so I remodelled the build. I was previously very satisfied with the build at level 9, and now with the possibility of "imbuing force", things start to actually look pretty good for the shorty flinger! Below is the latest version of the build, I did the enhancements a bit in a hurry, mainly looking for what is good at end lvl 20, not really taking too much care to keep things optimal during every level **


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.14
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Shorty Flinger
Level 20 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(12 Fighter \ 2 Barbarian \ 6 Ranger)
Hit Points: 294
Spell Points: 155
BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
Fortitude: 18
Reflex: 14
Will: 5

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 17 23
Dexterity 17 21
Constitution 12 15
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 6 6

Level 1 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Dwarven Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I


Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Quick Draw
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack I
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 5 (Barbarian)
Enhancement: Barbarian Damage Boost I


Level 6 (Barbarian)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot
Enhancement: Barbarian Extend Rage I
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage I
Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution I


Level 7 (Fighter)
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I


Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Tower Shield Mastery I


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I


Level 10 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack II


Level 11 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I


Level 13 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider


Level 14 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Axe Specialization I


Level 17 (Fighter)
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Precision


Level 19 (Fighter)
Enhancement: Fighter Strength III


Level 20 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost II
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II

[Gnorbert]

The dwarf can also use the name throwing axe "Dwarven Thrower" at level 6.

http://preview.tinyurl.com/ygso6a5

good luck in your experiments.

[Kaeldur]

Well... believe it or not the shorty is doing well... I'm currently at lvl 6, almost 7. Took Gnorbert's advice and bought myself a Dwarven Thrower... while sporting either a shield or a seeker item in the offhand. Have managed to keep myself in the main DPS of the parties I've joined, to my surprise... And I did some parties with veteran and TR players. I still know this kind of character isn't good, but I still haven't felt gimp yet! :)
And he's fun to play

[Kaeldur]

Updates to the build... Remodelled to include Arcane Archer now! It's starting to become a good build! At level 9 has been doing very fine. The only quest I didn't manage to be extremely effective was in Xorian Cipher elite against the skeletons... Other than that this build has proven to be much better than I expected, including having beaten higher level rangers in melee and ranged combat almost every time!

My current equipment at level 9:
Weapon Set 1: Dwarven Thrower & Seeker [+4] Light Hammer
Weapon Set 2: Dwarven Thrower & +3 Mithral Tower Shield
Weapon Set 3: +1 Keen Dwarven Axe of Enfeebling & +3 Mithral Tower Shield
Armor: +2 Mithral Full Plate
Goggles: Goggles of Insight
Helmet: Graskitch's Skullcap
Cloak: Moss Weave Cloak
Bracers: Bracers of Assistance
Belt: Ogre Power [+4] Belt
Ring: Disease Immunity Ring of Light Fortification
Ring: Engraved Ring
Item Set 1: Anger's Gift (necklace) & Anger's Step (boots)
Item Set 2: Protector's Brooch (necklace) & Protector's Gloves (gloves)

(I swap between the item and weapon sets to suit me best for each situation)


So I currently use two fighting modes (scores are listed unbuffed and standing):
Defensive: AC = 34, +18 to hit, 1d6+14+1d8, (19-20) x3
Offensive: AC = 25, +21 to hit, 1d6+14+1d8, (19-20) x3 [+12 seeker]


The only really good items are the Dwarven Thrower, the Ogre Power Belt. I guess you can count the Mithral items too. The rest are pretty much starter items!

I have to work on the saving throws though...

[Mythal]

good work, thumbs up for both effort originality and making a pretty fun build.
i dont think anyone who see's this isnt going "oh man, that'd be cool"...even if it is sub-par, as we all know, i think we all still realize its fun factor.

another option of going with a thrower is doing a halfling.
of course to use dwarven thrower which will be your mainstay leveling weapon you'd need UMD, but splashing rogue for this wouldnt be at all bad.
the reason for halfling is that their racial ability is thrown weapon dmg/atk, so not only will you get bonus to throwing axe, but throwing hammers as well - giving you both slashing and blunt damage maxed.

add to that of course halfling dex = more atk and AC, and halfling naturally being high AC, you net yourself with a shield wielding, high ac thrower build.

if you did something like 2monk/6ranger/12fighter for it, and could even take DMarks for healing....might be pretty awesome. or even swap in 6rog for that 6ranger (or 2rog for the 2mnk) for UMD and a decent sneak attack (fully ranking up the halfling sneak attack too).

ill go build one in fact, that sounds alot of fun too ;)
thanks for the inspiration, enjoy!

[Ereshkigal]

Looks like a fun build, props to you for going against the grain :)

Hmmm, so... imbue force works with throwing axes, does that mean it works with crossbows as well? I've always wanted to make a great-crossbow build, maybe going elf to get the arcane archer then Kensai 18 to round it out. Begins planning...

[Mythal]

This build has:
- good AC (Mithril Tower Shield+MFP)
- good ranged damage
- good sneak attack damage
- max ranger barkskin buff
- max disable device/search
- max UMD
- half-ranked open-lock
- max stealth skills (move silent/hide)
- max resist buffs
- max jump buff
- kensai I for your choice of thrown weapon (throwing axe selected)
- point blank shot, precise shot, imp.precise shot, rapid shot, WF:thrown, WS:thrown, and arcane archer!
- halfling DMarks for 4x Heal, 6x CSW, 8x CLW (optional)

Master Feat List
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons

lol check this out:


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.14
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 True Neutral Halfling
(6 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 12 Ranger)
Hit Points: 290
Spell Points: 282
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 23
Will: 9

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Strength 13 14 16
Dexterity 18 24 28
Constitution 12 14 14
Intelligence 14 16 16
Wisdom 12 14 14
Charisma 8 9 9

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 20
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 20

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Balance 8 13 13
Disable Device 6 26 26
Hide 8 23 25
Jump 5 19 21
Move Silently 8 32 34
Open Lock 8 19 19
Search 6 26 26
Tumble 8 13 13
Use Magic Device 3 22 22

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Spell (1): Camouflage
Spell (1): Jump
Spell (1): Longstrider
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (1): Ram's Might
Spell (1): Resist Energy
Spell (1): Summon Nature's Ally I
Spell (1): Tumble


Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot


Level 9 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons


Level 10 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 11 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 13 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+11)


Level 15 (Ranger)
Skill: Move Silently (+7)
Skill: Search (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 16 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 17 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2.5)


Level 18 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2.5)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 19 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)


Level 20 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use I
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use II
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use III
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Tower Shield Mastery I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II

[Kaeldur]

I edited the main topic, I had two builds posted... I built two versions: one halfling thrower and one dwarf thrower, but I stuck to the dwarf because I found him hardier. My halfling build was actually 8 fighter / 12 rogue, with high UMD he was able to use the dwarven thrower as well... I'm gonna read your version in a minute and I'll comment on what I think of it :)

[Kaeldur]

Looks like a fun build, props to you for going against the grain :)

Hmmm, so... imbue force works with throwing axes, does that mean it works with crossbows as well? I've always wanted to make a great-crossbow build, maybe going elf to get the arcane archer then Kensai 18 to round it out. Begins planning...

It currently does, but word is it will cease to work as of Update 3, as per dev's words: "Imbue Force was intended to work only on arrows, but since it was only one ability there was no problem. Now that Arcane Archers are going to get a whole series of Imbue type skills, this is going to be changed so that they affect only arrows".
In other words, sorta screwed me, but since I haven't reached the level there's no problem, I'll have time to rebuild again. On the other hand the dev said that Deepwood Sniper is going to be an "agnostic weapon type" ranger, meaning that in theory his skills will apply to all types of ranged weapons, so that will probably be the way I go...

[Mythal]

ah thats bad news...
they basically have no options for a thrower, though they have two racial abilities for it (drow = shuriken and halfling for all thrown weps), 3 if you count in the dwarf axe racials, they have feats for it, but they dont give it any love otherwise.

ya the thing with making a high AC build as a thrower (or archer) is just kinda contradictory...because if youre gonna be at range, AC wont matter, but then again you cant always stay at ranged. i built that one that way to be as much of a use to the group as possible, while maxing out the throwing ability. a full barkskin buff, resist buffs, trapping, lockpick, stealth and UMD ability would give you a purpose in the group other than being a sub-par dps.
having a shield always up, esp a tower shield is **** nice for when/if you do the get aggro. and for that matter you could even take that concept and spec out an intimidate build that does throw damage otherwise. kill stuff before it gets to you, being the first to aggro easily with thrown attack from long range, and then hold up block with shield and intimidate to let the grp dps the rest.

that might actually be a pretty useful intimidate build.
you'd probably want to skip on the ranger levels totally, go heavy on fighter and get at least 2 rog for evasion and UMD. maybe an 18ftr/2rog stalwart defender axe chucking dwarf would be the best for that....or human maybe even better, though the dwarf will get higher AC with the stacking armored agility.

thats finally a way to put the desired high dex to use on a high ac tank + shield build, too, since throwers are dex based.

good ideas all around on this thread ;)

[Kaeldur]

Yeah, but I dev said Deepwood Sniper will be agnostic, in other words, his skills will be good for throwers too... we'll just have to wait and see what the DWS will get that's interesting... The AC is so the character can pull aggro without having to kite all the time. Ranged fighters are hated mostly because they have to kite all the time, which screws up with the group's melee... It would be nice if I could find a way to fit a good intimi score in there, but I think it will be too low no matter what... I dunno... But that's a good idea you gave me, hadn't thought of intimidate on the character...

[Kaeldur]

This build has:
- good AC (Mithril Tower Shield+MFP)
- good ranged damage
- good sneak attack damage
- max ranger barkskin buff
- max disable device/search
- max UMD
- half-ranked open-lock
- max stealth skills (move silent/hide)
- max resist buffs
- max jump buff
- kensai I for your choice of thrown weapon (throwing axe selected)
- point blank shot, precise shot, imp.precise shot, rapid shot, WF:thrown, WS:thrown, and arcane archer!
- halfling DMarks for 4x Heal, 6x CSW, 8x CLW (optional)

Master Feat List
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons

lol check this out:


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.14
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 True Neutral Halfling
(6 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 12 Ranger)
Hit Points: 290
Spell Points: 282
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 23
Will: 9

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Strength 13 14 16
Dexterity 18 24 28
Constitution 12 14 14
Intelligence 14 16 16
Wisdom 12 14 14
Charisma 8 9 9

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 20
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 20

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Balance 8 13 13
Disable Device 6 26 26
Hide 8 23 25
Jump 5 19 21
Move Silently 8 32 34
Open Lock 8 19 19
Search 6 26 26
Tumble 8 13 13
Use Magic Device 3 22 22

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Spell (1): Camouflage
Spell (1): Jump
Spell (1): Longstrider
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (1): Ram's Might
Spell (1): Resist Energy
Spell (1): Summon Nature's Ally I
Spell (1): Tumble


Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot


Level 9 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons


Level 10 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 11 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 13 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+11)


Level 15 (Ranger)
Skill: Move Silently (+7)
Skill: Search (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 16 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Search (+1)


Level 17 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2.5)


Level 18 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2.5)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 19 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)


Level 20 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use I
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use II
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark Use III
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Tower Shield Mastery I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Ranger Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II




While I do like the sneak damage, you'll usually only have one shot at it, cause once you do, the aggro turns to you and there goes the sneak attack... Maybe a thrower with Deception could do the trick, I dunno... With sneak I see some good damage output, but without sneak the strength is too low!
My dwarf has several strength boosts: rage, (want to get a rage clicky too), kensai surge (+8 str) and ram's might (+2 str and +2 dmg)... All that makes quite a difference... Plus carrying a Seeker item in your offhand, those criticals get nasty!! I already have a +10 Seeker item, just waiting to hit lvl 10 so I can use it... +30 damage on critical hits is something I really look forward to =)

[Mythal]

While I do like the sneak damage, you'll usually only have one shot at it, cause once you do, the aggro turns to you and there goes the sneak attack... Maybe a thrower with Deception could do the trick, I dunno... With sneak I see some good damage output, but without sneak the strength is too low!
My dwarf has several strength boosts: rage, (want to get a rage clicky too), kensai surge (+8 str) and ram's might (+2 str and +2 dmg)... All that makes quite a difference... Plus carrying a Seeker item in your offhand, those criticals get nasty!! I already have a +10 Seeker item, just waiting to hit lvl 10 so I can use it... +30 damage on critical hits is something I really look forward to =)

Well you definitely have a point there. Your concept with the stacking of str/dmg bonuses (barb for rage, kensai for surge, rgr for rams) will definitely help out the dmg department.
However, my view on the build as a whole is that it isnt going to exactly be the best soloer. Given that, sneak attack damage will no doubt actually be able to be kept pretty near always in the kind of scenarios i envision. Soloing though, for sure your build will probably even pull it off better simply due to superior damage while not having other targets in melee to take aggro.
If even duoing with, say, a barb...or in a bigger group situation though, id say a sneak attacker ranged hitter is quite potent.

Also, an added perk while out hunting in zones, or in large dungeons, is that you can easily throw weapons at something that is too far away to see you. You can easily kill them while they just sit there and die, and yes you will have 100% sneak attack hits when they are out of this aggro/visible range. That alone is one of the huge perks of why i went with sneak attack halfling.

The other main reason, is that 12 levels of ranger give you alot to round off your character. Namely they give you all the TWF/ITWF/GTWF feats for situation youd ever have to melee, you also get the precise shot/imp.precise shot and all the ranged feats for free. Furthermore, 12 levels also more importantly give you access to higher level arcane archer imbue abilities which are coming out in the next update (not sure if AA abilities will be usable at all by throwers though after next update though so this might be moot), and it gives you nice buffs: +5 barkskin, +30 resist, +30 jump, mass camo, etc which are quite useful to a group.

I build characters typically with 2 things in mind:
1) I either have to be a serious min-maxed powergamer, being able to tank, kill, heal, or support at the highest efficiency....
or....
2) I have to bring something useful to the group that they otherwise might not have at all, if I'm not of the highest efficiency...like bardbuffs, ranger buffs, paladin aura, etc....

having said that - full ranger barkskin and backup resists buffer alone is enough to warrant a lvl 12 ranger in my raid groups simply for that and his less-than-optimal dps. on the flip side, id tend to question someone's usefulness to a group if they showed up with an inferior dps build and had nothing to offer the group.

but then again!!! **** your build sounds pretty nice with all that stacking buffs and damage. im sure its serious fun no matter which way you go.

it would be really nice to know what kind of dmg output you are doing around 15-18, or even 20 if youve had the time to zerg up (if you are zerging, though i wont assume you are). I am also curious how quick draw effects thrown attack speed, and does it stack with other attack speed bonuses? Fighter haste boost has gotta be nice on this build too ;)))
yummy!
hope youre having fun with it!

[kreestopearq]

This build sounds and looks like a lot of fun. Has anyone taken it to higher levels yet? And did the Imbue fix actually take place? Or is it still possible to imbue throwing weapons?

[Kaeldur]

This build sounds and looks like a lot of fun. Has anyone taken it to higher levels yet? And did the Imbue fix actually take place? Or is it still possible to imbue throwing weapons?

I'm currently lvl 17 on it, but I had to make some adaptations. I didn't actually test the Imbue fix, not going for it anymore since they plan on removing it if they haven't done so already. I followed the Deepwood Sniper path. The build worked very well until level 15, at 16 and 17 I'm feeling a bit underpowered, but I don't have any greensteel weapons or anything of the sort. I might be needing better equipment to get back into the top notch DPS. Also DDO stated they will be reviewing ranged combat, so that might change things too, I suppose all I can do for now is wait

[Kaeldur]

Well you definitely have a point there. Your concept with the stacking of str/dmg bonuses (barb for rage, kensai for surge, rgr for rams) will definitely help out the dmg department.
However, my view on the build as a whole is that it isnt going to exactly be the best soloer. Given that, sneak attack damage will no doubt actually be able to be kept pretty near always in the kind of scenarios i envision. Soloing though, for sure your build will probably even pull it off better simply due to superior damage while not having other targets in melee to take aggro.
If even duoing with, say, a barb...or in a bigger group situation though, id say a sneak attacker ranged hitter is quite potent.

Also, an added perk while out hunting in zones, or in large dungeons, is that you can easily throw weapons at something that is too far away to see you. You can easily kill them while they just sit there and die, and yes you will have 100% sneak attack hits when they are out of this aggro/visible range. That alone is one of the huge perks of why i went with sneak attack halfling.

The other main reason, is that 12 levels of ranger give you alot to round off your character. Namely they give you all the TWF/ITWF/GTWF feats for situation youd ever have to melee, you also get the precise shot/imp.precise shot and all the ranged feats for free. Furthermore, 12 levels also more importantly give you access to higher level arcane archer imbue abilities which are coming out in the next update (not sure if AA abilities will be usable at all by throwers though after next update though so this might be moot), and it gives you nice buffs: +5 barkskin, +30 resist, +30 jump, mass camo, etc which are quite useful to a group.

I build characters typically with 2 things in mind:
1) I either have to be a serious min-maxed powergamer, being able to tank, kill, heal, or support at the highest efficiency....
or....
2) I have to bring something useful to the group that they otherwise might not have at all, if I'm not of the highest efficiency...like bardbuffs, ranger buffs, paladin aura, etc....

having said that - full ranger barkskin and backup resists buffer alone is enough to warrant a lvl 12 ranger in my raid groups simply for that and his less-than-optimal dps. on the flip side, id tend to question someone's usefulness to a group if they showed up with an inferior dps build and had nothing to offer the group.

but then again!!! **** your build sounds pretty nice with all that stacking buffs and damage. im sure its serious fun no matter which way you go.

it would be really nice to know what kind of dmg output you are doing around 15-18, or even 20 if youve had the time to zerg up (if you are zerging, though i wont assume you are). I am also curious how quick draw effects thrown attack speed, and does it stack with other attack speed bonuses? Fighter haste boost has gotta be nice on this build too ;)))
yummy!
hope youre having fun with it!

Sorry, I hadn't seen your post. Come to think about it 12 ranger would be interesting too, specially if they come out with something new for Darkwood Sniper (which is the PrE I ended up taking not to be screwed with the potential changes to AA). Up to lvl 15 the damage was pretty good, but it started lacking hard with all the DR and stuff. With throwers it's EXTREMELY hard to get DR bypassers. A raw example I could give you is against the Black Dragon in Gianthold Tor. Using a +5 Axiomatic Throwing Axe of Maiming with a Seeker [+10] Backstabbing [+1] weapon on my offhand the criticals were above 200. Normal hits were at around 30~40. As a DwS the critical range increases on sniped shots (as well as the multiplier), so that's a very good boost. Another perk is that these shots can hit multiple enemies (imp. precision), so it's not common to see 6 different mobs taking damage (and usually at least one will be taking 150+ dmg from a crit).
Quick Draw is a must, it increases the attack speed pretty much, but still isn't fast enough. The main issue I have been finding is the low attack speed. The only time the speed is decent is when I use the Fighter's Haste, but that's only 20 seconds.

[Remmzy]

Just wondering why not Monk for the wind stance that adds to speed for thrown weapons?

[Kaeldur]

Just wondering why not Monk for the wind stance that adds to speed for thrown weapons?

For two reasons:
1. lack of knowledge (I didn't even know that applied to all weapons, thought only for shurikens)

2. lack of class (I don't have monk available, and I'm going for a build I can actually make, so any of the non-unlockable classes/races are out of question for my builds at the moment)

[kreestopearq]

Just wondering why not Monk for the wind stance that adds to speed for thrown weapons?

Also, using any thrown weapon other than Shiruken makes you uncentered, thus taking you out of Monk stances -- making Monk much less useful.

[kreestopearq]

Here's my version that I came up with yesterday. I like it because he's tricked out for throwing, but has TWF capabilities as well. I just wish that Thrown Weapons could also be classified by their damage types (so Throwing Axes would be considered Slashing, as an example). That would make this build more powerful. Heck, it would make any Throwing build more powerful. Anway, here you go.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Dwarf Thrower
Level 20 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(12 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 6 Ranger)
Hit Points: 332
Spell Points: 45
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 18
Will: 8

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Strength 16 16 18
Dexterity 16 20 22
Constitution 14 15 16
Intelligence 14 14 14
Wisdom 10 10 10
Charisma 6 6 6

Feat/Enhancement
Modified Skills
Skills (Level 20)
Balance 14
Bluff 0
Concentration 5
Diplomacy 0
Disable Device 17
Haggle 2
Heal 0
Hide 20
Intimidate 0
Jump 4
Listen 4
Move Silently 20
Open Lock 17
Perform n/a
Repair 2
Search 17
Spot 17
Swim 4
Tumble n/a
Use Magic Device 21

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Hide I
Enhancement: Ranger Move Silently I
Enhancement: Ranger Spot I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Quick Draw
Enhancement: Ranger Energy Resistence Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Swamp Lore I
Enhancement: Ranger Desert Lore I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I


Level 4 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 5 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Iron Will
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II


Level 7 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II


Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I


Level 10 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II


Level 11 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II


Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Spot II
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 13 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Enhancement: Ranger Hide II
Enhancement: Ranger Move Silently II


Level 14 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Deepwood Sniper I


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Axe Specialization I


Level 17 (Fighter)
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: CON
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II

[coolpenguin410]

Sorry, I hadn't seen your post. Come to think about it 12 ranger would be interesting too, specially if they come out with something new for Darkwood Sniper (which is the PrE I ended up taking not to be screwed with the potential changes to AA). Up to lvl 15 the damage was pretty good, but it started lacking hard with all the DR and stuff. With throwers it's EXTREMELY hard to get DR bypassers. A raw example I could give you is against the Black Dragon in Gianthold Tor. Using a +5 Axiomatic Throwing Axe of Maiming with a Seeker [+10] Backstabbing [+1] weapon on my offhand the criticals were above 200. Normal hits were at around 30~40. As a DwS the critical range increases on sniped shots (as well as the multiplier), so that's a very good boost. Another perk is that these shots can hit multiple enemies (imp. precision), so it's not common to see 6 different mobs taking damage (and usually at least one will be taking 150+ dmg from a crit).
Quick Draw is a must, it increases the attack speed pretty much, but still isn't fast enough. The main issue I have been finding is the low attack speed. The only time the speed is decent is when I use the Fighter's Haste, but that's only 20 seconds.


Rapid shot also increases the fire rate for thrown weapons. You can test and confirm this on your own if you have the space to roll a human fighter and buy him a throwing weapon. It's not a huge boost, but ever little bit helps.

[Kaeldur]

Rapid shot also increases the fire rate for thrown weapons. You can test and confirm this on your own if you have the space to roll a human fighter and buy him a throwing weapon. It's not a huge boost, but ever little bit helps.

Really? Really really really? Even if it's... heck... 2% it's still a gain. I was pretty sure that it only worked for bows...

[Gnorbert]

With the U5 addition of the Brutal throw Feat (use Str for ranged attack bonus instead of dex) Wondering if you'll LR this character or do it differently at all.

I've been trying to think of a build and I keep coming back to Halfling ranger 12/ fighter 6 / rogue 2.

Ranger 12 gives you free TWF, free ranged feats (specifically precise shot and improved precise shot) without needing to pump my dex. In fact I'd only need a 13 dex in order to take rapid shot. Also, since they said their intention is that deepwood sniper is the PrE that should work with all ranged attacks, I'll look forward to any love the DS will get from Turbine soon.

Fighter 6 gives strength enhancements, haste boost and some very helpful feats, plus kensai I.

Rogue 2 gives UMD and maybe open lock - these levels are open for discussion, maybe ditch them for barb levels.

Feats (working list)
Toughness
Brutal Throw
Quick Draw
Rapid Shot
Weapon Focus: ranged (Deepwood sniper if used)
Weapon Focus: thrown (fighter bonus)
Weapon Spec: Thrown (fighter bonus)
Point blank shot
Improved Critical: thrown


Halfling race for thrown weapon enhancements, plus Sneak attack enhancements (not as important)

[Kaeldur]

I know this is old, but I had stopped playing for a while...

I'll give you my experience:

I reached lvl 20 on my character, but nearly abandoned throwing axes, focused on TWF, unfortunately double-gimping my character. There still isn't enough support for throwing-based builds. The Brutal Throw is a great addition and surely would've helped me MUCH more - for starters I would be able to have a lot more STR and a lot less DEX, which is only useful for the stupid ranged to-hit...

I might retry the build once DwS is released. Currently I think the level split is pretty nice (12 fighter/6 ranger/2 barbarian), but if DwS II comes out really good the obvious would be to swap 6 fighter levels into 6 ranger ones.

I still honestly thing Dwarf is a better choice for the throwing build, despite Halfling having the enhancements. Mainly because I think throwing axes are the best thrown weapon, and dwarves' enhancement for axes work on them, so that pretty much eliminates the pro on halflings...



*Edit: And I don't think I tested that Rapid Shot suggestion from a few posts above...