A DDO Review on Tentonhammer

[cyr1ana]

Hello,

I just found a review about DDO:EU at Tentonhammer. It's really worth to read.

http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/78760


greetings

Cyriana

[Gorby]

This is a good review. Ten Ton Hammer gives a lot of good press for DDO.

I just wish they wouldn't share their summoner (http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/78479) build though! :eek:

[Jiipster]

I just wish they wouldn't share their summoner (http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/78479) build though! :eek:

Yaysis christ, did they try to make the worst build possible?

[KoboldTrapper]

I could make worse, but I'd actually have to try to.. >_<

[Kaervas]

I just wish they wouldn't share their summoner (http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/78479) build though! :eek:

Wow, just... wow.

I think they must've tried to make it as gimpy as possible.
I feel sorry for anyone who decides to roll one based on that article.

[TreknaQudane]

This is a good review. Ten Ton Hammer gives a lot of good press for DDO.

I just wish they wouldn't share their summoner (http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/78479) build though! :eek:

Just goes to show the power of Dungeon Scaling :D

[TasteTester]

Would one of you who commented on the Summoner build mind offering some specific comments about the bad and good (if any) points in the build. I'm enough of a novice to builds that the problems aren't apparent to me, but I'm keen to get a better understanding of what makes a build strong or weak, especially caster builds.

So, can we get a teachable moment, please?

Thanks.

[Gol]

Would one of you who commented on the Summoner build mind offering some specific comments about the bad and good (if any) points in the build. I'm enough of a novice to builds that the problems aren't apparent to me, but I'm keen to get a better understanding of what makes a build strong or weak, especially caster builds.

So, can we get a teachable moment, please?

Thanks.
Summoned monsters are incredibly weak due to our lack of control over them, terrible AI, and their lack of gear. Player Characters are (comparably) very over-equipped and 10 times better for the task at hand. For example - a level 4 fighter vs a CR 4 kobold. The question isn't "who would win", but rather "how many dozens of them could the fighter kill without any healing or buffing?".

[hydra_ex]

Would one of you who commented on the Summoner build mind offering some specific comments about the bad and good (if any) points in the build. I'm enough of a novice to builds that the problems aren't apparent to me, but I'm keen to get a better understanding of what makes a build strong or weak, especially caster builds.

So, can we get a teachable moment, please?

Thanks.

DEX - way to high. It claims it needs that to-hit stuff with a bow. There are two things wrong with that. No character in their right mind would use a bow. Second, you won't be able to hit stuff or deal enough damage with a bow, and the utility of it is far worse than spells.

CON - way too low. One hit from anything might kill you. Especially in quests such as sins of attrition, where teleporting devils might not always agro to one thing.

INT - fine

Why elf?
Pro.. ahh... none?
Con: no human for umd, no drow for higher DC, no WF for self-healing

Finally - a summoner? Jeez! Every single summon spell is an absolute joke, and is entirely useless (besides that dog at lvl 1, and that hezrou for doing easier quests).

And that's not all the mistake with their spell choices.

APs are also poorly spent.

Oh God! I didn't even look at the feats and level up points.
It claims to want a high INT? Why are there so few level up points in it?

Light armour proficiency? Even if this build would get AC, since its DEX is much too high, it should stick with robes! Eschew materials? /shudder.

[Yocharles]

I could make a worse build

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

FOri Dor
Level 1 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(1 Wizard)
Hit Points: 27
Spell Points: 120
BAB: 0
Fortitude: 5
Reflex: 3
Will: 1

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 1)
Strength 16 16
Dexterity 16 16
Constitution 17 17
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 6 6

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 1) (Level 1)
Balance 3 3 7
Bluff -2 -2 -2
Concentration 3 3 3
Diplomacy -2 -2 -2
Disable Device n/a n/a n/a
Haggle -2 -2 -2
Heal 1 1 1
Hide 3 3 3
Intimidate -2 -2 -2
Jump 3 3 3
Listen -1 -1 -1
Move Silently 3 3 3
Open Lock n/a n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair -1 -1 -1
Search -1 -1 1
Spot -1 -1 -1
Swim 3 3 3
Tumble n/a n/a n/a
Use Magic Device n/a n/a n/a

Level 1 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Eschew Materials
Feat: (Selected) Great Fortitude
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (1): Nightshield
Spell (1): Summon Monster I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Poison Resistance I
Enhancement: Dwarven Shield Mastery I




and that's just level 1, its worse, but not by much.

[Mockduck]

From the article:


The original DDO also introduced a new game mechanic into the MMOG world that combined the twitch skill abilities of a player with those magical rolls of the dice. The dice rolls are what really matter, but if you're moving while attacking, your die roll will suffer for it. This system works out well.

Except unfortunately some folks at Turbine now see dice as a bad thing, too confusing for new players... :(

[Tendare]

Would one of you who commented on the Summoner build mind offering some specific comments about the bad and good (if any) points in the build. I'm enough of a novice to builds that the problems aren't apparent to me, but I'm keen to get a better understanding of what makes a build strong or weak, especially caster builds.

So, can we get a teachable moment, please?

Thanks.

100 Hit Points at level 20?

Enough said

Ok more

Arcane spell failure for armor, why even wear?

I could go on

[flynnjsw]

I could make a worse build

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

FOri Dor
Level 1 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(1 Wizard)
Hit Points: 27
Spell Points: 120
BAB: 0
Fortitude: 5
Reflex: 3
Will: 1

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 1)
Strength 16 16
Dexterity 16 16
Constitution 17 17
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 6 6

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 1) (Level 1)
Balance 3 3 7
Bluff -2 -2 -2
Concentration 3 3 3
Diplomacy -2 -2 -2
Disable Device n/a n/a n/a
Haggle -2 -2 -2
Heal 1 1 1
Hide 3 3 3
Intimidate -2 -2 -2
Jump 3 3 3
Listen -1 -1 -1
Move Silently 3 3 3
Open Lock n/a n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair -1 -1 -1
Search -1 -1 1
Spot -1 -1 -1
Swim 3 3 3
Tumble n/a n/a n/a
Use Magic Device n/a n/a n/a

Level 1 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Eschew Materials
Feat: (Selected) Great Fortitude
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (1): Nightshield
Spell (1): Summon Monster I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Poison Resistance I
Enhancement: Dwarven Shield Mastery I




and that's just level 1, its worse, but not by much.

To make him more gimp you should have swapped Con and Cha, that way he had neg hp...:D

[Tendare]

From the article:



Except unfortunately some folks at Turbine now see dice as a bad thing, too confusing for new players... :(


/signed

I'm a female player and struggle through some of the mathematical equasions you guys throw around on these forums but for goodness sakes I can read a d20 die.

[Dawnsfire]

The Summoner is a class for extreme min/max players.

Guess only the cool elite players can make the Summoner work ;)

[Dark_Helmet]

Would one of you who commented on the Summoner build mind offering some specific comments about the bad and good (if any) points in the build. I'm enough of a novice to builds that the problems aren't apparent to me, but I'm keen to get a better understanding of what makes a build strong or weak, especially caster builds.

So, can we get a teachable moment, please?

Thanks.
The issue is they are trying to take a build for a different MMO and applying it here. Summoner? Since the nerf of only having a single summoned creature that doesn't apply. They will have one (weaker) creature that will run itself (e.g. attack whatever it wants to) and will die pretty quickly.
Also, the fact that they are wearing armor as an arcane means they are trying to solo instead of working in a party. The AC bonus of wearing armor vs. the possibility of a critical spell failing is not as balanced as they think. Unless they are built to stand in the middle of combat (such as most warforge arcane builds), they should be at a range from the creature casting spells.
Finally, their summoned create will not get agro of all the monsters they will be fighting so monsters will make a beeline right to them and demonstate how a low con is a fatal flaw.

[Dark_Helmet]

From the article:

The original DDO also introduced a new game mechanic into the MMOG world that combined the twitch skill abilities of a player with those magical rolls of the dice. The dice rolls are what really matter, but if you're moving while attacking, your die roll will suffer for it. This system works out well.
Except unfortunately some folks at Turbine now see dice as a bad thing, too confusing for new players... :(

Not to mention that THF twitch is being nerfed. ;) So, Turbine is nerfing those items that the press says "this system works out well".


Seriously, I don't mind some of the non-D&D flavored nerfs, but the getting rid of dice (in a game that shows a picture of a d20 that is rolled) and spells that decay when you get too far away, shows they don't care about the rules.

[Dark_Helmet]

Guess only the cool elite players can make the Summoner work ;)

Actually, the dumbing down of the game system at low level is what makes it work.

This character would get chewed up and spit out in Raids.

[Aristalla]

I got a kick out of this:

"Sure, you could take a point away from Dexterity and spread some of that love around (especially in the Constitution column), but trying to avoid being hit in the first place will work better in the long run.

(Below information based upon 28 point build, level 20)

Hit Points: 100

Armor Class: 17 + Items/spells"


I still don't know all that much about making builds, but I know that 17ac ain't going to help ya "in the long run", or endgame, as many call it. Not that you'd ever even be able to test it because if anything in a raid even looks at you funny, those 100hp will be gone before you even know you were hit.

[Sarria22]

Heck, 17 AC isnt REALLY gonna help you in the short run when you get right down to it, especially given the low CON, and why bother with light armor? just take mage armor, or +4 armor bracers.

[DoctorWhofan]

Nice review. Pretty factual and fair.