Vets - When you play with new players what is helpful for them to do?

[Salome]

OK f2p and all the new players it brings has been around for awhile. I'd like to hear from vets who pug a lot and have played with new players, what you like them to do when they are in your group. I'm looking for constructive suggestions on how new players can integrate more easily into pugs. This is for a segment on ddocast so don't waste your time ranting because I'm not looking for rants. There are some obvious ones like let me know you don't know the quest or aren't familiar with it. Don't zerg ahead. etc. What else is helpful for them to do?

Please don't hesitate to post repeat suggestions. I'd like to get a sense of how important each suggestion is.

There is another thread for newbies to tell me what vets can do to be helpful: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=222854

[Visty]

tell that you are new
ask your questions
listen to what is said to you and think about it
dont be annoying (aka dont ask the same question again and again and again and again and again...)
be nice
communicate

[moops]

Just listen to the leader of the quest or raid--which might require turning sound effects and DM voices down:)

I also expect them to join the quest and not go afk or go lolly gagging around while we are inside waiting for them.

[RhapsodieInBlue]

As a new player, but not a free to play player, I feel that my role in a group is that of the class I am playing. I haven't run nearly any of the quests in this game (I think I'm sitting right at 1000 favor at level 15 4/5ths). Every time I join a group where I don't know where I am going or doing, I simply state that and to forgive me if I make a mistake, but I never surge ahead (with the exception of sometimes when I get myself shut in somewhere because I run a little faster and the door triggers on me right as the others would have entered.) New players should not be treated any differently in their roles than a veteran, unless they are severely screwing things up. If someone runs through traps and has no evasion or low reflex saves, perhaps it is time to educate them or if that doesn't work, boot their arse. Case in point would be The Crucible I ran today. Wow, what a crazy quest to go into the first time you do it. Luckily our leadership was top notch both times I did it today and there weren't any failures.

I've really started to love this game, and have noticed some of the "froobs" attitudes and general player ability to be lacking, but I'm not sure if that's just those I have encountered or if it is a general trend.

All I ask is that I be explained what I need to do before I do it in an unfamiliar environment. We don't have a big database of quests to go read to my knowledge (and if there is one, do me a favor and tell me it so I can read!) so those who have knowledge and a general aptitude for leading should share the knowledge and lead us who wish to be better DDOers to success instead of saying something as asinine as "lolnoob" and then getting the boot because we took a step forward or collapsed a floor.

[ShadowHand2]

Take time on your own and explore the game, learn where things are, ask questions, tell us you are new to the game/quest. Say hi when you join or some sort of greeting is always a big plus. The most important ASK QUESTIONS!:p

[Salome]

I made another thread for newbies to let me know what vets do that can be helpful. Please post that there.


As a new player, but not a free to play player, I feel that my role in a group is that of the class I am playing. I haven't run nearly any of the quests in this game (I think I'm sitting right at 1000 favor at level 15 4/5ths). Every time I join a group where I don't know where I am going or doing, I simply state that and to forgive me if I make a mistake, but I never surge ahead (with the exception of sometimes when I get myself shut in somewhere because I run a little faster and the door triggers on me right as the others would have entered.) New players should not be treated any differently in their roles than a veteran, unless they are severely screwing things up. If someone runs through traps and has no evasion or low reflex saves, perhaps it is time to educate them or if that doesn't work, boot their arse. Case in point would be The Crucible I ran today. Wow, what a crazy quest to go into the first time you do it. Luckily our leadership was top notch both times I did it today and there weren't any failures.

I've really started to love this game, and have noticed some of the "froobs" attitudes and general player ability to be lacking, but I'm not sure if that's just those I have encountered or if it is a general trend.

All I ask is that I be explained what I need to do before I do it in an unfamiliar environment. We don't have a big database of quests to go read to my knowledge (and if there is one, do me a favor and tell me it so I can read!) so those who have knowledge and a general aptitude for leading should share the knowledge and lead us who wish to be better DDOers to success instead of saying something as asinine as "lolnoob" and then getting the boot because we took a step forward or collapsed a floor.

[quickgrif]

Well first and foremost let me know you are new so I can help you avoid some of the pitfalls.

Main thing though is to listen and contribute in such a manner that is helpful to the group.

I don't expect the following from any new and learning player:
a) a great build
b) perfect timing during fights (such as for a cleric when to heal or a barb when not to aggro.)

With that said I am more than happy to help those willing to learn with advice to improve a new players play style and build and sometimes with some exceptional new players will help with good equipment.

[cdemeritt]

My wants...

1: if you ask a question, listen to the answer

2: if someone says DON'T or STOP, stop what you are doing... If you want to know why ask. Sometimes what you are doing is harmful to the party (attacking the seers in Madstone, , nearly killing him) most will explain if asked, but often the time is an issue at that second.

3: If you don't know the quest, don't get offended when asked not to do something... Again ask, most will explain why when it is safe to do so.

4: listen and ask questions... just don't get offended if you don't get an answer you want.

5: enjoy the game... it is only a game. try stuff, but do it carefully.

[Ghoste]

tell that you are new
ask your questions
listen to what is said to you and think about it
dont be annoying (aka dont ask the same question again and again and again and again and again...)
be nice
communicate
+1 rep. Not because I agree with what you said (although I do), but because you said it so concisely. We need more of this, less aimless rambling.

[Redlotusninjagrl]

Stay with the group. Bring your own pots/wands for healing (buff pots are helpful too). If you need a heal or an ailment de-buff, ask nicely. And yes, ask questions if you don't understand something.

[whysper]

1. LFM. Use it.
1a. Understand the LFM jargon like "zerg" (to join or avoid, as appropriate.) Ask if unclear.
1b. Read the LFM before joining, it usually tells which quest (and avoids that question.)

2. Mention you are new or new to the quest. No need to apologise for it. Sometimes you will be asked whether you want spoilers etc. or go "blind" (if you mainly want this, look for new player or "crawl" groups or start your own.) My "tour guide" tone is the subject of frequent jokes.

3. Listen, ask questions.

4. Try to stay with the group, usually not the first in line so you see where everyone goes. Learn to observe surroundings, do quick camera sweeps to see what it looks behind you and so on. If lost (in quest or on the way), say so.

5. If on a fast run, if you are unsure about something, do not do it (or ask first.)

6. Do not multiclass unless you have a plan, and understand what you are giving up vs. gaining.

7. Read the manual, read the forums, the compendium, the wiki.

8. Try have fun! Sometimes it takes a few tries to get a character right, it takes a few levels to start getting the hang of things and so on.

[Fenrisulven6]

dont be annoying (aka dont ask the same question again and again and again and again and again...)

Related: Dont be a Chatterer. We don't need to hear about every crit you roll in the quest, your newest cool weapon and how you found it, or the play-by-play of the STK run you did last night. There's a diff between communicating on comms and being a yapper.

[and for some reason, the yappers always have the most annoying voices.]


Added: "Clear Comms" mean shut up and listen. Usually used by the party leader when he's trying to pass out instructions amid all the chatter.

Clear the channel for him so you can hear about the Orcs sneaking up on you.

[Fenrisulven6]

Lemmings. Don't chase the Rusher [wanna-be-zerger]. All it takes is one lemming to rush off after him, and the whole party follows them over the cliff. This is the cause of most party wipes I see in PUGS.

Anchor on the party leader, not the lead.

[Fenrisulven6]

Dont join an Elite run if you've never done that quest.

[Visty]

+1 rep. Not because I agree with what you said (although I do), but because you said it so concisely. We need more of this, less aimless rambling.

rep from ghoste...is that now good or bad? :p

[Fenrisulven6]

If you stumble across a +1 Holy Sickle of Greater Giant Bane, rr 8th lvl, mail it to: Paus.

[Gorstag]

Another thing, it was nice to watch for a few months, but please if you are new do not brag about pulling a +3 battleaxe of deception. 99.99% of chestloot is honestly **** and vendor fodder. It is honestly getting hard to simply say nice pull.....

[Beld]

WE KNOW WHAT GAME THIS IS, really, when I pay my six month subscription, I do not log on and wonder what in the world is going on cause this is not the game I am paying for.

Regardless of whether or not you feel that there are other games that do something better (ie different) telling me constantly what they are, no help.

If you feel you must insert your expert opinion on the subject, start a thread or contact a Dev, at least they could possibly do something about it.

Roles are not as important in DDO:EU as in some other games, get used to this, waiting for the 'perfect' party will often leave you..........waiting, which usually equates to a rant on the forums about not getting groups, there are groups out there, adjust your attitude to accomodate the fact that there is in fact MORE THAN ONE WAY TO SKIN THIS CAT, and you will find much more enjoyment.

In closing, as was stated earlier, remember this is a game and should be fun, if you are not having fun, don't try to change the game, find one that suits you better and have fun, but crying on my fun is no fun for me, which makes me want to go back to my guild only groups, when PUG's are fun too, sometimes.

And I also agree with the listening part even when it's not the answer you wanted. If you want to try something new and ask and find out it won't work, most times (yes, I say most cause there are even NOOB vets) it has already been tried and didn't work, we are not raining on your parade, we are giving you the benefit of having played already.

[krud]

The most important thing a newb can do is speak up. The absolute worst thing is when you join a pug and the leader says nothing the entire time before, or during a quest.

But for the most part I like to shut up and let them play. I just tag along for the ride mostly.

I would like them to have the same newb experience and sense of discovery that I had when I was a newb. If I know a trap is coming up I will just stop, not say anything, and let the rogue (or newb zerger) find out where it is. I always carry extra cure wands (on my paladin) and top of myself and others in between fights, in the hope that other paladins or rangers may catch on. I find many newb rangers and palis still fail to realize they can use cure wands. Sometimes I pass them a slightly used wand and say "here you go, you can use this, ya know".

The only times I speak up is when the quest goes south, and it's obvious that they just want to get the quest over and done with. I also answer game mechanic related questions they ask, or correct something someone says that is wrong. Other than that, not much else.

edit - Oh, and if i group with the newb know-it-all, i still remain quiet. I find that many times other people in the party will gravitate to the one who does the most for the party, not the one who talks the most. Newb know-it-alls naturally get put in their place by their own actions.

[donfilibuster]

The party leader can be calling to stop and gather, as it is common to be eager to walk ahead and fight (specially for traps).
The other thing is to point out the monsters that need to be killed first like the casters, or to get some of them to do flanking instead of spreading out.

[Ghoste]

rep from ghoste...is that now good or bad? :p
Relativity.

[Jacoby]

This is a good thread.

The number 1 thing bad newbs do is fail to communicate. This game is all about communication. Patience and teamwork are paramount. There are bad Vets that have very little patience, ignore them and enjoy the game.

[UnderwearModel]

They NEVER speak up.
They NEVER listen.
They NEVER admit they have not done the quest before.
They NEVER hear the words "TRAP!!"
They NEVER hear the words "Do not go in there!!"
They NEVER hear the words "go to the LEFT" or "Go to the Right"
They NEVER have any healing/repair potions.
They NEVER buff anyone else in the party.

Only after the fact do they admit it is their first time.

Even though, in the beginning I quite clearly and succintly speak and type
"Is anyone new to the quest?"

I came to cannith on Day 1 and have played with many, many, many, many, many, many new players.

My best one today was the two rogues that came into Xorian Cipher, 100% rogue by the way. One said he cannot open traps he only does LOCKS and the other one said he cannot find any traps. But if we could find them he might be able to open them. This was as he died running down the three trap corridor and saying "I made this run earlier today."

Next run I switched to my wizard/rogue and there was another wizard/rogue and we did all traps.

[MsEricka]

It's been said before, but I'll say it again.

When you are a new player (to the game or to a quest!) and you're partying with a veteran (to the game or the quest) you should

1) Be able to hear the party leader talk (headphones, speakers)
2) Listen to the party leader, they usually know what they're doing and what the new person needs to do
3) Do what you're directed to do, there's usually a reason for it
4) Don't run off on your own
5) Tell the party you are new (to the game or quest)
6) Ask what type of weapon/buff will be best used for the quest

[Talon_Moonshadow]

Don't touch ANYTHING! :D

Just follow along, kill things that attack us.

That is the easiest way to get by and not make anyone mad at you.


Now....me personally, I take few quests seriously enough to care what you do.

I usually only mention quest failure items. And things that if you do wrong will prevent us from completing.

Or the converse: things that need to be done for us to complete or proceed...etc.

There a few quests that are very difficult to complete. But those are few and far between.

So go have fun and do what you want. I'll watch and try to pick up the pieces if things go wrong.

[Babumbalaboo]

When I play with new players, the most helpful thing for them to do is keep their ears and mind open, and LEARN.

[justagame]

I would sum it up in one word:

Listen.

I don't care if you don't have the most uber weapons, if you didn't start your cleric with an 18 wisdom, or if you randomly splashed a little barb with your wizard. Just listen well, play well with others, and you can contribute to the party, and everyone will have a good time.

Not too long ago, I was new to the game as well. I had patient vets showing me the ropes, and likewise would willingly show new folks around as well, but for one common factor -- I am coming across more and more who simply don't listen. Tell the sorc to stay back in a key battle, he charges in. Say or type "trap", and he runs through it. Ask at the end of Stormcleave, until you're blue in the face "who has the orbs?" and the guy with them says or types nothing, just chases the giant until the party wipes.

I was convinced for a time that newbs must not have sound turned on, until I saw this happening with text as well. Do newbs simply keep general chat on, and not even bother looking at the party chat window? I swear, that is the only explanation I can think of. Even worse is the occasional person who gets combative in response to simple advice. I write those off as petulant teenagers -- whether it's fair or not, it fits the description of how some are acting.

If I was convinced that true newbs read this, I would implore them to simply listen to fellow party members, especially those that appear to know what they are doing. Will some vets act like know-it-alls? Sure, but the vast majority I've run across are very reasonable -- people only get impatient when you don't listen.

That's how I got into my first pug runs of high level quests: hound, vod, reavers refuge, etc. I sent a tell to the pug leader saying "I haven't done it yet, but I will listen." That's all it ever took.

Most vets I know WANT more good players around. They WANT today's newcomers to become tomorrow's seasoned vets. But when folks show no signs of listening to or cooperating with other party members, it's just a big waste of everybody's time.

[Fenrisulven6]

New players do not matter

They NEVER speak up.
They NEVER listen.
They NEVER admit they have not done the quest before.
They NEVER hear the words "TRAP!!"
They NEVER hear the words "Do not go in there!!"
They NEVER hear the words "go to the LEFT" or "Go to the Right"
They NEVER have any healing/repair potions.
They NEVER buff anyone else in the party.

Only after the fact do they admit it is their first time.

Thats bull. I run with PUGs exclusively, 3-4 hours a day. Alot of them are good players from other games. You just attract bad karma.

[UnderwearModel]

Thats bull. I run with PUGs exclusively, 3-4 hours a day. Alot of them are good players from other games. You just attract bad karma.

Does not look like you read my post.

You play on Thelanis, my experiences were for Cannith. On Ghallanda this is not the situation at all.

On Cannith is where I quite clearly and succintly stated in my post, is where I have ran into these types of new players.

[Aranticus]

LISTEN and LEARN

most impt of all BE HUMBLE

[Arlith]

1. If I am not asking to join your party, or showing as LFG, leave me alone.

2. If I do not accept the first blind invite, I promise you I will not accept the next 8.

3. Read LFM's. (covered enough above).

4. If someone offers a comment on your playstyle, or build, or equipment, look into it. Don't follow it blindly, but every little thing you find out about the game helps you. Even if you you find out what you just found out is BS.

5. Do not spend an enitre STK run bytching about how much a +5 Metalline Khopesh of Pure Good costs until you have played the game long enough to understand why such weapons are so valuable.

6. Make an effort to learn the terminology of the game, both the technical terms and the little social twists unique to DDO.

7. Do not ask me for plat/equip. If you do ask and I say no, that means no. It does not mean ask me 16 more times and maybe I will say yes. I will happily give gear away to people who try to learn the game and appear to have more than three firing brain cells. I would rather destroy a +2 tome than give it to someone spam begging for it.

8. Listen to your other party members. This is not a Newb/vet thing. This is a communication thing. I don't care if the wizzy throwing hypnotism has been playing 4 years or 4 days. If they ask you to attack one mob at a time and leave the rest hypnoed, then do it.

9. If you have never run a quest before, ask those who have what you can do to prepare for it.

10. I don't care if you are not as rich as Drizzzzzzzzzzt Trump. Buy the pots you can and use them as you can. It will be noticed. People tolerate broke much easier than they tolerate stupid.

11. When you join a party, say hello. Ask where the quest is, tell everyone good afternoon. Don't just say, "Share"

12. DO NOT loot chests while others are still fighting.

[Saaluta]

1. When the rogue stops and starts looking around, STOP!!

2. When buffs are being handed out at the start of a quest or after shrining, wait for your buffs or else :) I don't mind using mana to buff you if it will help mitigate any damage you may take.

3. If you reach a shrine and are at half hp and notice the healer is out of mana, don't ask for them to use a wand to fill you up, rest. Even if you are a melee class, you will gain hit points when a healer class is nearby.

4. If you can buff yourself, please do. If you can't buff yourself, ask please. We don't know what you have or don't have for gear or spells unless you say something. Every spell casting class gets buffs for a reason, help your group out. Rangers ask if people want barkskin or resists, bards blur/gh/etc, Sorcs, Clerics, FvS, Wizards...same thing--buff up first, so less damage is taken later.

That's all I got for now :)

Saal :)

[Lleren]

Ok I am still a newbie here, however the post above struck a note. So Newbish here, but veteran elsewhere ;)

Look at the class icons in the group window, figure out what that rogue looks like in game so you can remeber not to pass them when they stop and do the look around for traps bit.

Note also the look of any character with heals and try and stay within line of sight of them at all times. Sticking close to them will also keep yourself in range of groupheals.

This is not any of those other games where mana regenerates, so the folks with healing spells must ration themselves. Carrying your own healing supplies can make the difference between winning the adventure as a live character, being carried in someones backpack to the shrine afterwards, or even failing completely.

[Guildmaster_Kadish]

Communicate.
Ask, tell, listen.


Oh, and try to follow the party--some quests can be very confusing, but most are fairly linear and/or easy to follow. The difference in character speeds usually aren't so great that you get left behind even if you aren't familiar with the quest. It isn't a big deal if you get lost/fall behind, but it certainly seems like it happens more often than it should. Again though, communication is the real key--being lost can be easily prevented/fixed if you tell where you are, ask where to go, and listen to the directions.

[Glenalth]

Communicate. Seriously.

The heart of this game is teamwork between multiple people, if you are not communicating your needs or questions you are hurting the party.

That weird purple icon for "Necrotic Touch" that has a 60 second countdown? That Mummy's Curse thing that doesn't seem to be affecting you? Mention those to someone.

I would rather tell someone "stay out of that hallway so a horde of devils doesn't wipe us" or "skirt the wall to avoid being skewered by spikes" instead of wasting gold raising your corpse. But I need to know that you are new to a quest before that happens.

I have many new people join desert or orchard quests late and ask the dreaded "shar plz" and then "where is quest?"; after given a set of directions they typically end up dead, dropping group, or just disconnecting with no other comment. If you need additional help getting to the quest, just say so. The worst that will happen is someone will laugh and you can drop group knowing they are jerks instead of just doing it out of frustration.


One last thing...
Consumables, potions, scrolls, wands, etc. You may not use them every quest, but when you need them they will be the difference between success & failure. Be sure to stock up on such things when you can afford to.

[karnokvolrath]

mis thread, sorry.

[karnokvolrath]

here are my pet peaves and it only counts in lowbie land. I
usally ask rogues if the have maxed out search/disable, aside from that i really dont care what your build is as long as you can contribute.

I dont mind new players so long as they are willing to learn.

Elitist nubs and shr plz.....get the boot.

That being said im always down to help a newb, so long as you dont join my quests that says (vip, Zerg, know you stuff). If i didnt put that (wich is often) im always down to help a new player but i get mad when the lfm says vip and yet i still get ftpers that say "i cant go there".

[CharlieStubbs]

Communication is the biggest thing I look for.

I never make parties that say "Know the quest" etc, b/c tbh that's bs. you want ppl who know the quest make a better guild ffs.

1) Let ppl know you're new
2) Have a question, ask a question
3) pay attention to party chat and voice chat. You're new, its your responsibility as we can't physically stop you from doing something silly
4) If you start running ahead of ppl and die on trap or mob, or party wipe everyone, don't do it again. If you don't know what you're doing...hint hint...don't be point or primary through doors/rooms/quests
5) If something isn't working (e.g. using your +5 greatsword on ghostly skeletons), don't keep trying...insanity is the defined by repeating the same action with the same results indefinitely....this is true of noobs and vets.

DDO is meant to be fun, but no game is fun before you know how to play. Don't expect hand holding unless you ask for it, and even then understand that spending 1hour more on a quest to explain it, may not be what everyone dreams of doing. If times a factor ppl will say so. If it's not ppl are mostly willing to mentor you.

[BlargneyTheSecond]

If english isn't your first language and you have a hard time understanding, please tell us.
-blarg

[Aranticus]

communication

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuZd19nvmUc

[Enir]

Communicate.
*Listen and Learn.
Follow the Party Leader.
*Listen and Learn.
Learn the Game Mechanics (like how to use a map).
DO NOT MULTI-CLASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!
*Listen and Learn.
Know that it will take many weeks, and probably many characters, before you are proficient with DDO.

Listen and Learn (why do I have to keep repeating this?)

[SquelchHU]

OK f2p and all the new players it brings has been around for awhile. I'd like to hear from vets who pug a lot and have played with new players, what you like them to do when they are in your group. I'm looking for constructive suggestions on how new players can integrate more easily into pugs. This is for a segment on ddocast so don't waste your time ranting because I'm not looking for rants. There are some obvious ones like let me know you don't know the quest or aren't familiar with it. Don't zerg ahead. etc. What else is helpful for them to do?

Please don't hesitate to post repeat suggestions. I'd like to get a sense of how important each suggestion is.

There is another thread for newbies to tell me what vets can do to be helpful: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=222854

The obvious stuff. If you don't know a quest say so. Stay with the group if you don't know what you're doing.

But in addition to that, listen to the responses. If the leader says don't open that chest several times, and you open it anyways you're likely to end up on one or more black lists. Not for being new, but for not listening.

If the leader says we are doing this on normal and you open it on hard, same deal.

Listen to and respect the leader, and listen to anyone else trying to help you and follow through.

[Hadrian]

There are a lot of quests out there that require the collection of some specific item to be turned in or used in some way to complete the quest.

Lately, I have run into a lot of situations where new players just pick up the item as they come across it without knowing what it is or how it's used. Then when the group reaches a point where they need the item, the new player doesn't even realize that he's the one holding it and just keeps silent when people ask who picked up the item.

So, read quest objectives and ask questions. Know what you're trying to accomplish in a quest so that you actually know what it is that you're picking up. If you don't know and do not want to ask, then don't pick things up that you do not recognize as loot that you've seen before.

Also, if you notice your group asking "who picked up item X" and you're not sure if you did - check your inventory. Don't sit there silent for 15 minutes.

[CSFurious]

additionally, self-sufficiency is nice, i.e., bring potions, know where the quest is, try to find out how to play the game better by reading the forums, etc.

learn how to take care of yourself


tell that you are new
ask your questions
listen to what is said to you and think about it
dont be annoying (aka dont ask the same question again and again and again and again and again...)
be nice
communicate

[Kriogen]

Patience.

Not all old vets are smart.

Low man quests. You learn more and faster. Sometimes try to solo, you learn even more. So what if you fail, you are solo, noone can see you :p

Remove auto-attack, auto targeting, etc.

Don't do quest on Hard/Elite until you have done Normal 2-3 times.

Don't expect babysitter. Be prepared.

Use Push to Talk.

[cupajoe]

Yeah communication is key but communication of what? As some have already said, its not about idle chit chat.

Things that you may want to preemptively ask are:
"So what weapons should I have for this quest?"
"So in this next section any traps?"
"So whats the plan for this part?"
"We running past the mobs or killing as we go?"

Usually if I someone asks questions like these the leader or vet will explain the strategies or at least your job.

Just my thoughts.

Oh and here are a couple of free tips....Don't jump while attacking. You don't need to and you suffer a penalty (-4 I think) to hit. Don't jump up and down in shallow lava (like you do in water) cause you need to save EACH time you jump in but once you make your save your good. Any vets feel free to correct me if I am off on these and I will edit.

Oh and one more thing...try to be self sufficient, i.e, bring your own buffs and pots. I know its expensive but it really helps. Also if you are gonna need alot of healing throw the healer a wand.

[Pyromaniac]

Read the forums
Use google

Then ask me questions...Nothing more irritating than being asked questions where the answers would take them 5 seconds to find by looking themselves.

[Draccus]

I haven't read the whole thread so my apologies in advance if this is a repeat.

The number one thing new players can do to improve their gameplay, in my opinion, is to Be Prepared. There are certain inexpensive, easily obtainable items that EACH AND EVERY player should carry before entering a quest and I'm shocked that almost none of the new players I've seen carry them. It can quickly become painfully obvious that a new player isn't properly prepared. From that point, I usually assume the player just doesn't care and my opinion of him plummets. If the player is above level 7, he has to know these things are needed so the only reason not to carry them is because he doesn't care and just wants to be led through the quest by his nose.

Here's a quick list of easy-to-obtain items that I think every player should carry:

1. Lessor Restoration Potions - these are super cheap and available at any potion vendor. They cure a TON of things, from exhaustion to fatigue to stat damage to touch of idiocy (the spell, not the player condition). I carry a stack of 100 on every character.

2. Disease Immunity item - So many mobs have a recurring disease effect that it's just stupid not to have disease immunity. Unlike poison immunity spells or potions, Disease Immunity is not persistant unless you have an item on so, if you don't, you're either going to be chugging potions (if you have them...my bet is you don't) or dealing with the disease effects.

3. Remove Curse potions - Monsters start casting curse in level 2 quests so you KNOW you need these and lots of them. It's just sad how many Remove Curse pots I've used on new players who decided they didn't need their own.

4. Jump clickie - Jump clickies are everywhere yet so many new players don't carry one and instead stand at whatever jump the party needs to navigate and say "I don't have any jump skill." Nor do some veteran players but notice how they all made it over the jump? Get a jump clickie or, at a minimum, a stack of cheap +10 jump pots.

5. Neutralize Poison potions - these things last for 6 minutes so in addition to curing poison, they prevent being re-poisoned and also prevent the effects of trog stench, cloudkill, and a few other nasty things. Instead, players choose to wear the green "please cure me" hat.

Players will spend HOURS scanning the auction house for a new weapon that's a 0.05% improvement over the one they carry and will be obsolete in 2 levels but they can't grab a stack of necessary potions? /boggle

[cpito]

Read the forums
Use google

Then ask me questions...Nothing more irritating than being asked questions where the answers would take them 5 seconds to find by looking themselves.

I second this. I have witnessed too many arguements between newbs and vets like the one over looting myths (in guild chat):

lvl 4 Newb: I heard if you <insert myth here> then you'll get better loot
10 lvl 20's Vet: It's a myth, someone was misinformed or pulling your leg
Newb: Yea but how do you know, have you tested it?
Vet: It's an issue that's been around since day 1 and it's been repeatedly stated by the devs that none of those things effect loot.
Vet2: he's right, it's a myth
Newb: Well, I'm going to test it until I get a definitive answer
Vet: feel free, you can also look it up on the forums, it's been widely addressed
Newb: forums?

If you're going to ask a question or seek advice only to argue with the answer (especially when 8 people all answer the same way), find your answers from other sources.

Stop jumping down the throats of the vets who are honestly (and politely) trying to help. There are good reasons for vets to suggest using the lfm panel (mostly because it advertises to the whole world and you're not going to find many people who want to run Delera's by spamming harbor chat channels). Not too long ago there was a newb spamming trade wondering how much he should sell a +1 longsword for. After about 10 minutes a vet suggested he simply vendor it (no name calling or anything just "vendor it"). He was then chewed out by yet another newb for harrassing newb 1. It wasn't harrassment, it was good advice. In the time he spend standing around trying to sell that dime-a-dozen sword, he could have sold it, run another quest or two, gathered another 3 or 4 +1 longswords and made more cash.

For as much hostility as I've seen from vets toward newbs, I've seen even more from newbs towards vets.

[Vanshilar]

Don't pull levers or open chests or open doors. Sometimes they will spawn monsters, traps, etc. Let other people open the chest, then you go in afterwards and grab the loot.

Don't run ahead of the group. Especially don't run ahead to grab a chest or pull a lever. The game creators are evil. If there's a chest in the middle of the room, and you didn't have to fight to get to it, you can bet that it's trapped. Also, many chests come "pre-equipped" with acid traps, fire traps, etc. Hasn't Durk taught you that already? Also, some "room traps" have their doors close and monsters spawn when someone goes too far in. If you're too far ahead of the group when that happens, the rest of us can only watch you die from behind the gate.

Don't grab unfamiliar objects off the ground (the runes from Tempest Spine come to mind). Sometimes they are pertinent to the quest, so the people that know what to do with them should be the ones getting them.

Don't stand right next to the rogue when he's disabling the trap. Yes, I know everyone's itching for the trap to go away so they can move on. However, the trap box does explode on occasion.

Do go after casters. For the most part, melee monsters won't do much damage if they're not near you, but casters can unload all sorts of nasty stuff from afar.

Do listen to whoever's leading the group through the quest (which usually is the guy with the star but may not be). You might have done the quest one way, but they may prefer doing it another way.

Do follow the leader and stick with the group. Sometimes people run off on their own, and go away from the group. Either they know what they're doing, and don't need healing, which means you shouldn't really follow them unless you know what they're doing, or they don't know what they're doing, and need the healing but is too far away for it, which means you'll die when they die.

Probably most important is to tell people that you are new or that it's your first time doing it. I don't mind giving a play-by-play over chat if I know there's someone that hasn't done the quest before, down to things like what order to talk to people in Delera to activate the last part, or how to get from A to B in The Pit, and I know plenty of other people do so as well. But if you don't speak up, then everyone assumes you've done it before and know what's going on. If you get booted from a group when you said it's your first time, that group probably wouldn't have cared if you fell behind or died anyway, so you saved yourself some time. That having been said, I've never had any adverse comments to me when I said it was my first time doing a quest.

[ddoer]

communication is the most important thing. I expect a new player to:
- tell us if you are new, and if you are, how well you know about the quest. we don't need you to be familiar with the quest at all. if you tell us you are new, we could give appropriate advice and instruction in the quest. We understand everyone has the first time, and if you make it clear, we could help to make it painless. :D if possible, try to tell us before you enter the dungeon so we could ask you to do any preparation work if needed.

- communicate. Make sure you have turned on voice chat and read party chat. if you are uncertain on something, just ask any reasonable questions, just like when you are in RL. if you don't talk or can't type too much, make sure you listen very well. If you can't talk or type and have difficulty in understanding English, just solo or form a group for your own language. On my server, there are a few language specific guild afaik.

- make a reasonable toon. for the 99% of quest, we don't need most party member to have uber gear or be an uber toon, but we do have some expectation from your class. e.g. a cleric is suppose to heal, a barb can do some dps, a L7 wiz/L8 sorc can cast firewall etc. if you do some research on the forum, you won't completely gimp your toon.

- Don't immediately ask for sharing quest after joining a group please. There is nothing wrong in quest sharing and it is a very nice feature, and vets use the feature themselves, but we met a lot of annoying new players who don't seem to put any effort to find the quest giver or learn the basic (such as quest location) of the quest. You could tell us you are new and ask for the location of the quest. It's very likely someone will share the quest to you anyway.

[Vanshilar]

The number one thing new players can do to improve their gameplay, in my opinion, is to Be Prepared. There are certain inexpensive, easily obtainable items that EACH AND EVERY player should carry before entering a quest and I'm shocked that almost none of the new players I've seen carry them.

There's one more that I'd add to the list: Resist potions. Especially acid ones. I don't know how many times I see people get hit by Melf's Acid Arrow and just stand there taking damage when they can just quaff a potion real quick. Clerics aren't going to automatically know that you've been hit with it. You can go one step better and find an item that gives you the resist, so that you don't have to worry about doing those things, at the expense of taking up some equipment slots.

Other helpful items are blindness ward items, underwater action items, and permanent feather fall items, for certain quests.

[Dragonhyde]

If you choose not to use voice for whatever reason please read party chat. Sometimes there is a reason we do not want to kill everything in the room at that moment.

Let the group know that you have not done the quest. This way if there is anything different about the quest it can be explained.

Get comfortable with the ins and outs of your chosen class. Once you have a good idea of how to play the class along the lines of your playstyle then it will be much easier to know about multiclassing or even just regular build types. Once you gain understanding then ,even if it is not conventional or the current flavor build on the forums, build your dream build. If you don't want cookie cutter then don't do it but be prepared to back up an unusual build with good playstyle.

[Draccus]

There's one more that I'd add to the list: Resist potions. Especially acid ones. I don't know how many times I see people get hit by Melf's Acid Arrow and just stand there taking damage when they can just quaff a potion real quick. Clerics aren't going to automatically know that you've been hit with it. You can go one step better and find an item that gives you the resist, so that you don't have to worry about doing those things, at the expense of taking up some equipment slots.

Other helpful items are blindness ward items, underwater action items, and permanent feather fall items, for certain quests.

Thats very true. I carry a stack of 100 of each of the 5 Resist 20 potions. TWF types will kill themselves on a cold shield mob without it and it's far easier to drink one when you need it than to ask for a spell mid-fight.

And blindness pots, since blindness is permanent, are a must!

[biggin]

Play a cleric as your first toon. You get to stand in the back, help the party out with some heals, and get to learn DDO without causing too much trouble. Don't know where traps are? No problem, just stand back and watch the other new people get killed while you look like the hero when they need a raise. It helps you with the sharp learning curve of this game, and when you feel a bit more comfortable with it, either roll a different toon or start making you a decent cleric.

Also, pay attention to the LFM you join. If there is terminology in it you don't understand, ask before you join. If you don't qualify, don't join. For instance, if it says you must be able to hear but you don't have speakers, then just wait for another quest to pop up. Some quests require coordination that is easy when you have voice, a serious burden to the party if you don't.

Also, you may see people doing something you know nothing about, such as people floating around. If you see the party jump from a ledge but you know you can't float, ask someone what's going on BEFORE you jump. Was in a Pit PUG the other day, the party leader and I jump from the ledge, then immediately the other 4 people died from jumping off the ledge. /facepalm

[ReaperAlexEU]

let me know your new. some times i ask, sometimes i forget to ask, and sometimes even when i do ask no-one answers. i don't want to know if your a newbie so i can boot you from group, i want to know if your a newbie so i can adjust my play style from "done this 100 times and just want to lvl" to "help the newbies learn the game and make sure they dont get left for dust".

if i'm trying to help you and all your reading is "blah blah blah" let me know, i have no idea how much you do or dont know and am bound to give the wrong level of advice.

if you die dont release. in many quests its quite possible for a group to recover from a few deaths without players having to take a trip to the tavern. if everyone dies wait a while to see how the group are going to organise a regroup. quite often one person who just needs healing and not a rest will stay in.

most quests do not need a full or perfectly balanced group, or even a dedicated healer. don't be scared of groups like that. they can also offer some of the best gaming experiences as people tend to play at their best when they don't have a nanny at their back. as a newbie try those groups out but let people know your new, chances are you'll get a ton of info and learn a lot out of it.

resist the urge to explore on your own. bit of a conflicting one this, i know how great a quest can be when you explore it for the first time. however many quests are built with dangers in them that are designed to kill, and your fellow party members won't appreciate you dropping the bomb on their head un-invited. so if your new follow the leader, stop when they stop and try to keep up with party chat and voice.

if your given the OK to explore, make sure the group is with you. some times you might get lucky and find a group of vets who are more than happy to take a step back and let you experience the quest properly with your big wide eyes. just be wary of your fellow party members, check the mini map when you move out to make sure everyone else is moving too, don't run too far ahead.

spoilers, some like them some dont. if you dont want spoilers then expect to die, some of the traps are quite inventive and the best way to experience the ingenuity is to walk right into them. if you have the right mentality they should make you go "oooh!", bit like watching fireworks. the vets will get you back on your feet and dust you off and you'll be better off for knowing the dangers and then how to get round them. however some times people just arnt in the mood to get battered black and blue, so when you let the leader know your new try to get a consensus on if your going to run with spoilers or not.

hmm, thats it for now, lunch break is over. hope this helps!

[Visty]

let me know your new. some times i ask, sometimes i forget to ask, and sometimes even when i do ask no-one answers. i don't want to know if your a newbie so i can boot you from group, i want to know if your a newbie so i can adjust my play style from "done this 100 times and just want to lvl" to "help the newbies learn the game and make sure they dont get left for dust".

quoted to....dunno how to say that lol....bold it!?

anyway, its an important thing

[Meleena]

They NEVER speak up.
They NEVER listen.
They NEVER admit they have not done the quest before.
They NEVER hear the words "TRAP!!"
They NEVER hear the words "Do not go in there!!"
They NEVER hear the words "go to the LEFT" or "Go to the Right"
They NEVER have any healing/repair potions.
They NEVER buff anyone else in the party.


.
Sang too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0

[ProdigalGuru]

Share





wait, no




HEAL ME

[buffsrule]

must be able to hear the party.
when asked a question, reply either by typing in party chat or over your mic.
when asked if its your first time be honest. (if no one asks they probably dont care)
carry remove curse pots!!
most of the time if its your first time in a raid your role will be explained in detail. if you dont understand, ask. i'd rather spend an extra 2 minutes explaining again then wipe.
dont be dumb. offensive chat etc.
if you are left dead during a fight, there is a reason for it. live party members are #1.
listen, ask, communicate.
retain what people have told you.
observe what others are doing if you have a chance. if you're a fighter what the fighters, how do they move, where do they attack from. are they standing still or moving around the mobs.

you'll be fine.

[natakeu]

Advice for new players that I have seen/played with.

1. Stop telling me how vorpal/smiting/disruption/paralyzing is something to get excited about. It was something exciting to find when the level cap was 14 and they were actually a rare item. If you play the content from gianthold on up I guarrantee you one of those weapons will drop more often then not. If it's not a tome I don't care.

2. When you can obviously see people in the quest and demand that we share the quest with you just after joining. Case in point I was in the middle of Monestary of the Scorpion and x person who just joins says share. First impression..You dont know where the quest is or where you are going and may not have access to the quest. At this point I have enough to worry about. I will not come out to help you, because I am not going to take an xp/loot hit for you.

3. If you are a new wizard joining the group and tell me you don't have the spell required for the quest and have to go get it from the vendor. Then you are wasting your party's time. Case in point I came across a 14/15 wizard when asked for waves of fatigue said he didnt have it at all. At that level you should have all the spells in all spell levels except for your highest spell level currently available. As a wizard it is part of your class ability to be flexable and have all spells available for the jobs required in quests. You are not a Sorc and do not have a limited spell selection.

[assamite]

What else is helpful for them to do?


1. I like new people to do their job and stick with the group.
2. I don't care if you are new or vet i have same expectations for everyone.
3. If you haven't done a quest/raid before tell me ill give you the 411.
4. I do not care about failing and i will not single someone out for a failure unless he/she went out of their way to make the group fail.
5. 2.5 years i can size a group up and know what it can accomplish by watching play styles and classes. If i tell you "We can't do Tear of Dahkan elite.... we cannot do Tear of Dahkan elite. I will try with you though, just so i can watch the fail and discipline :D it's a game and fail entertains me.
6. If your trying to LvL afap and you tell me your trying to LvL afap don't school me on how doing quests N/H/E is better than doing quests N/N/N/H/E.
7. I don't care about zerging, i am flower sniffer friendly but, if your taking a nap in a bed of roses when you wake up i will not backtrack for you and "Show you where the chests are" sniff them out yourself :D.

[joker922]

When the Caster calls out "Haste", gather on them...They generally are not going to move to you.

[Cyr]

My list for new players grouping is...

A) Say if it is your first time in a particular quest.

B) First thing you do upon first logging in is set up voice chat. Make sure you can hear okay. Almost no one cares if you have a mic though.

C) Loot bragging is for noobs. Same with dps bragging. No one cares that your fireball did 70 damage!

D) Voice chat should not be filled with random chatter about current events, possibly controversial subjects, racist/sexist comments, or other random nonsense...unless you formed the party in the first place and are with a bunch of your friends/guildies where no one minds. In pugs it's never okay. Same goes for music over your chat.

E) Push to talk should be always enabled. No one wants to hear your kids crying, dog barking, or their own voice in an echo chamber.

F) Come prepared. There is no excuse not having basic consumables on all toons. Healer classes should have enough consumables to pull a bad pug through the quest if needed. Yeah it sucks to be a healer sometimes, but in the long run you will make lots of plat on them.

G) Piking is not okay. (Piking is when you go afk for long periods of time in dungeon).

H) Make sure you have time to do the quest before you join.

I) Read the full LFM before clicking to join. Make sure you meet the pre-reqs before joining. If it says "vets only" and you have never run the dungeon and have played for three months find another group.

J) Assume any LFM you join is not going to be run super slow with everyone's hands being held at all times. These are the exception not the norm.

K) Come prepared for higher level content. This goes beyond just consumables. It covers having the right tools for the job. Melee classes in particular fail this test from newbs rather often. Some mobs need certain things to bypass DR for example. A melee without the right weapon sets is almost useless in certain quests (most being higher level). If you don't have the weapons for the quest make sure the leader knows this (or you don't know) before you join.

L) Tank is not a needed role in a party in the traditional MMO sense. Good tanks in DDO often have good dps and huge AC's. The old sword and board all the time guys from WOW are pretty poorly played and built DDO toons.

M) If you are a caster you should make sure the party is hasted at all times.

N) Ranged in DDO is underpowered. Making a ranged toon is a good way to make a bad toon. Top level play has some small give on this, but it requires rather sophisticated builds and some very good gear. Not for the new player in other words.

O) If you don't know ASK!

[QuantumFX]

OK f2p and all the new players it brings has been around for awhile. I'd like to hear from vets who pug a lot and have played with new players, what you like them to do when they are in your group. I'm looking for constructive suggestions on how new players can integrate more easily into pugs. This is for a segment on ddocast so don't waste your time ranting because I'm not looking for rants. There are some obvious ones like let me know you don't know the quest or aren't familiar with it. Don't zerg ahead. etc. What else is helpful for them to do?

Please don't hesitate to post repeat suggestions. I'd like to get a sense of how important each suggestion is.

There is another thread for newbies to tell me what vets can do to be helpful: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=222854

Do not blind invite people to your group. I repeat: Do not blind invite people to your group. And just in case you didn't get it the first two times: Do not blind invite people to your group.

Keep in mind that vets, generally, want you to have a good time and that we don’t think you’re stupid, just new. This is why we tell you what buffs and gear you should carry. This is also why we will give you unsolicited advice on how to play your character.

[Darkrok]

There's one more that I'd add to the list: Resist potions. Especially acid ones. I don't know how many times I see people get hit by Melf's Acid Arrow and just stand there taking damage when they can just quaff a potion real quick. Clerics aren't going to automatically know that you've been hit with it. You can go one step better and find an item that gives you the resist, so that you don't have to worry about doing those things, at the expense of taking up some equipment slots.

Other helpful items are blindness ward items, underwater action items, and permanent feather fall items, for certain quests.

For Melf's I think you can get a 10 acid resist cloak at level 7...might even be earlier. As cloaks tend to be less important gear-wise that's a nice slot for many characters. Usually pretty cheap on the AH, even for a newer player like myself.

[Flintsen]

Nothing, and not because I want to be mean but I want them to experience things for themselves. Whats the fun in me telling a new f2p to the game that's playing Rogue where the traps are. Honestly when I know I'm the only non rookie in the group I don't Zerg, I don't say a word and I don't tell them how to play. I don't even use pots, if I die I die so be it. Why should i ruin it for them. Trust me there is nothing in this game like a new experience. First time I saw the dragon in Von 6 I almost wet myself. Why ruin their fun.

[Salome]

First, I'm still listening.

Second, I've noticed some core recommendations that appear throughout this post and won't necessarily point those out in my following replies.

Third, in an effort to engage in further dialogue I'm asking for clarification or input on some specific post. I'm interested in everyone's opinion and not necessarily just that of the player who originally posted the comment.

[Salome]

Just listen to the leader of the quest or raid--which might require turning sound effects and DM voices down.

First, your recommendation to turn down sound effects and the DM voice (and turn up voice) is an excellent recommendation and not immediate self evident.

Your comment about listen to the leader of the quest or raid is a common one and one that most new players or novice players try to do. So often the problem is that the capable leader is not always self evident. Sometime's its not the person with the star, sometimes its not the person that says they'll lead the way and, more often than not, its not the person that zergs ahead.

Its understandable that it depends and varies from group to group (welcome to adulthood) but following the leader is sometimes easier said than done.

I'm not sure of how to get around that but it seems to be a perennial problem on both sides of the fence.

[Salome]

2. Mention you are new or new to the quest. No need to apologise for it. Sometimes you will be asked whether you want spoilers etc. or go "blind" (if you mainly want this, look for new player or "crawl" groups or start your own.) My "tour guide" tone is the subject of frequent jokes.


The "tour guide" approach is usually appreciated. I know I like it especially if I know absolutely nothing about the quest and I'm feeling the pressure of doing my best. No need to apologize for

I bet new players or "virgins" to a quest would prefer to go blind. But it takes a lot of patience on both sides.

[Salome]

Added: "Clear Comms" mean shut up and listen. Usually used by the party leader when he's trying to pass out instructions amid all the chatter.

Clear the channel for him so you can hear about the Orcs sneaking up on you.

I've never seen this which I'm hoping is a good sign?!? I wish it was used more often.

[Aeneas]

Listen to instructions, don't die, don't be the first one in to a fight, don't run ahead, and don't annoy me with mindless chatter or i will find a way to kill you and not bring you back to life.

Oh and make sure you bring your own Cure/repair pots, poison pots, disease removal pots, remove curse pots, lesser restore pots, remove blindness pots, and farm tangleroot for a deathward clicky. Stop relying on the cleric or FvS for every little thing, they want to play the game too.

Seriously, every class no matter what they are should have at least one whole bar dedicated to being self sufficient and they should be using a good part of their quest made cash to keep the bar stocked. Half of being successful in this game is character maintenance and quest prep.

[Salome]

Lemmings. Don't chase the Rusher [wanna-be-zerger]. All it takes is one lemming to rush off after him, and the whole party follows them over the cliff. This is the cause of most party wipes I see in PUGS.

Anchor on the party leader, not the lead.

Very well said.

[Salome]

mis thread, sorry.

no problem

[Salome]

Dont join an Elite run if you've never done that quest.

Good advice

[Salome]

I usually only mention quest failure items. And things that if you do wrong will prevent us from completing.

Or the converse: things that need to be done for us to complete or proceed...etc.



I would venture a guess that most people, vets and newbs alike, prefer this middle ground.

[Kalari]

Im sure others may have said it but for my own groups this is a must

1. The ability to read, what I put in my lfm really sets the tone to how I want to run the quest. If im setting up a group thats how I see it im running this quest I have a strategy and if your in the group I expect you to be down with the plan. So if I say "Delera's Hard no optionals" it means fast, "Delera's all optionals" means were stopping to get all the extra bosses and chests and working together. If you join any lfm of mine that is "no optionals or quick" expect it to be that way if thats not your style or pace feel free to say so and leave. I hate when people join a group that clearly states these things and then complain. No one from what ive seen ever forces a player to join a group.

2. Communication if you are up front about being new speak about things youd like to see done in a dungeon (without being whinny or demanding) youd be surprised how many long term players will oblige. Depending on the time of day or night and the character im more then willing to take someone threw their first runs no spoilers. But I do have builds that I know can solo quests so when im on them I tend not to want to hand hold and I try to be upfront with that. But if your new join a group and dont say anything end up lost cause you couldnt keep up I cant blame anyone but the person who did not say "hey never done this guys."

3. Accept rejection, this is a game played world wide with many different personalities. Some are really good at what they do in game and have egos for it and they act like dbags its a part of life. You have to learn how to run with thicker skin for every jerk their are nice people and you cannot lump all long timers in with the ones who arent. And if you ever run with the ones who are you have to realize you'll probably be dumped on. Its not fun but you then know who to avoid. I think one of the major problems is people expect everyone to be friendly and overly nice. Its not like that outside the game world so I dont expect it inside either. Maybe my realism is jaded but it helped toughen me up specially when I first started and had really crappy builds.

Thats all I can think of right now but the most important is communication and having a willingness to learn the game. If you show you have those you will go far.

[Salome]

1. If I am not asking to join your party, or showing as LFG, leave me alone.

2. If I do not accept the first blind invite, I promise you I will not accept the next 8.

3. Read LFM's. (covered enough above).

4. If someone offers a comment on your playstyle, or build, or equipment, look into it. Don't follow it blindly, but every little thing you find out about the game helps you. Even if you you find out what you just found out is BS.

5. Do not spend an enitre STK run bytching about how much a +5 Metalline Khopesh of Pure Good costs until you have played the game long enough to understand why such weapons are so valuable.

6. Make an effort to learn the terminology of the game, both the technical terms and the little social twists unique to DDO.

7. Do not ask me for plat/equip. If you do ask and I say no, that means no. It does not mean ask me 16 more times and maybe I will say yes. I will happily give gear away to people who try to learn the game and appear to have more than three firing brain cells. I would rather destroy a +2 tome than give it to someone spam begging for it.

8. Listen to your other party members. This is not a Newb/vet thing. This is a communication thing. I don't care if the wizzy throwing hypnotism has been playing 4 years or 4 days. If they ask you to attack one mob at a time and leave the rest hypnoed, then do it.

9. If you have never run a quest before, ask those who have what you can do to prepare for it.

10. I don't care if you are not as rich as Drizzzzzzzzzzt Trump. Buy the pots you can and use them as you can. It will be noticed. People tolerate broke much easier than they tolerate stupid.

11. When you join a party, say hello. Ask where the quest is, tell everyone good afternoon. Don't just say, "Share"

12. DO NOT loot chests while others are still fighting.

Why you won't serious reconsider my 8th request to join or listen to my exploits when you do is beyond me but... Seriously, these are all excellent and reasonable points. I, for one, wish I heard more of #4.

PS What is bytching?

[Salome]

There are a lot of quests out there that require the collection of some specific item to be turned in or used in some way to complete the quest.

Lately, I have run into a lot of situations where new players just pick up the item as they come across it without knowing what it is or how it's used. Then when the group reaches a point where they need the item, the new player doesn't even realize that he's the one holding it and just keeps silent when people ask who picked up the item.

So, read quest objectives and ask questions. Know what you're trying to accomplish in a quest so that you actually know what it is that you're picking up. If you don't know and do not want to ask, then don't pick things up that you do not recognize as loot that you've seen before.

Also, if you notice your group asking "who picked up item X" and you're not sure if you did - check your inventory. Don't sit there silent for 15 minutes.

A hard but important lesson.

[Salome]

Things that you may want to preemptively ask are:
"So what weapons should I have for this quest?"
"So in this next section any traps?"
"So whats the plan for this part?"
"We running past the mobs or killing as we go?"


Excellent!

[Salome]

Don't pull levers or open chests or open doors. Sometimes they will spawn monsters, traps, etc. Let other people open the chest, then you go in afterwards and grab the loot.

Don't run ahead of the group. Especially don't run ahead to grab a chest or pull a lever.

Don't grab unfamiliar objects off the ground (the runes from Tempest Spine come to mind).

Don't stand right next to the rogue when he's disabling the trap.


/clap

[Salome]

Nothing, and not because I want to be mean but I want them to experience things for themselves. Whats the fun in me telling a new f2p to the game that's playing Rogue where the traps are. Honestly when I know I'm the only non rookie in the group I don't Zerg, I don't say a word and I don't tell them how to play. I don't even use pots, if I die I die so be it. Why should i ruin it for them. Trust me there is nothing in this game like a new experience. First time I saw the dragon in Von 6 I almost wet myself. Why ruin their fun.

Assuming you have the patience that goes along with this, I'd love to quest with you and most newer players or quest "virgins" would like to find more like you. Of course there are times you just want to get the job done and a little direction can go a long way.

[Cyr]

3. Accept rejection, this is a game played world wide with many different personalities. Some are really good at what they do in game and have egos for it and they act like dbags its a part of life. You have to learn how to run with thicker skin for every jerk their are nice people and you cannot lump all long timers in with the ones who arent. And if you ever run with the ones who are you have to realize you'll probably be dumped on. Its not fun but you then know who to avoid. I think one of the major problems is people expect everyone to be friendly and overly nice. Its not like that outside the game world so I dont expect it inside either. Maybe my realism is jaded but it helped toughen me up specially when I first started and had really crappy builds.


QFT. This is an important one. Some players are jerks, most are not though. Also some are not even remotely trying to be mean when they tell you that you trying to range guys with your dex based ranger is probably a bad idea or when they say you need X in here. Kal hit it right on, those undiplomatic people helped her in a way too by improving her builds. I'm sure plenty said some mean things, but more probably said if you did X with the build instead of Y it will do this much more of Z for you. That stuff is really helpful sometimes even though it hurts to hear that you built something badly.

[Salome]

let me know your new. some times i ask, sometimes i forget to ask, and sometimes even when i do ask no-one answers. i don't want to know if your a newbie so i can boot you from group, i want to know if your a newbie so i can adjust my play style from "done this 100 times and just want to lvl" to "help the newbies learn the game and make sure they dont get left for dust".

if i'm trying to help you and all your reading is "blah blah blah" let me know, i have no idea how much you do or dont know and am bound to give the wrong level of advice.

if you die dont release. in many quests its quite possible for a group to recover from a few deaths without players having to take a trip to the tavern. if everyone dies wait a while to see how the group are going to organise a regroup. quite often one person who just needs healing and not a rest will stay in.

resist the urge to explore on your own. bit of a conflicting one this, i know how great a quest can be when you explore it for the first time. however many quests are built with dangers in them that are designed to kill, and your fellow party members won't appreciate you dropping the bomb on their head un-invited. so if your new follow the leader, stop when they stop and try to keep up with party chat and voice.

if your given the OK to explore, make sure the group is with you. some times you might get lucky and find a group of vets who are more than happy to take a step back and let you experience the quest properly with your big wide eyes. just be wary of your fellow party members, check the mini map when you move out to make sure everyone else is moving too, don't run too far ahead.

spoilers, some like them some dont. if you dont want spoilers then expect to die, some of the traps are quite inventive and the best way to experience the ingenuity is to walk right into them. if you have the right mentality they should make you go "oooh!", bit like watching fireworks. the vets will get you back on your feet and dust you off and you'll be better off for knowing the dangers and then how to get round them. however some times people just arnt in the mood to get battered black and blue, so when you let the leader know your new try to get a consensus on if your going to run with spoilers or not.



Excellent food for thought.

[Salome]

C) Loot bragging is for noobs. Same with dps bragging. No one cares that your fireball did 70 damage!

G) Piking is not okay. (Piking is when you go afk for long periods of time in dungeon).

H) Make sure you have time to do the quest before you join.


I liked all your points but these stand out.

[Salome]

communication

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuZd19nvmUc

LOL

Hopefully, you'll see the irony in asking you if this is how you have nearly 10,000 posts.

Sorry for the series of posts, I haven't figured out how to do multiple quotes in one reply or how to use color coding and I'm sure my boss is going to walk by at any moment.

[stainer]

My list for new players grouping is...

C) Loot bragging is for noobs. Same with dps bragging. No one cares that your fireball did 70 damage!



I will make an exception on this if you are on your first toon and pull a nice replacement for that +1 Starter Greataxe. Don't push it though! Once someone says gratz, move along. :)

[Aeneas]

My advice and biggest peeve.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=223180

[Taurnish]

Very well said and as Ghoste asked also very brief. My comments in RED


It's been said before, but I'll say it again.

When you are a new player (to the game or to a quest!) and you're partying with a veteran (to the game or the quest) you should

1) Be able to hear the party leader talk (headphones, speakers) I hate it when there is no communication
2) Listen to the party leader, they usually know what they're doing and what the new person needs to do
3) Do what you're directed to do, there's usually a reason for it Don't aggro a whole room if the plan is to pick off groups at a time
4) Don't run off on your own
5) Tell the party you are new (to the game or quest)
6) Ask what type of weapon/buff will be best used for the quest Very good

I add
1. Also, don't start discussing builds in a quest or ask where Fred the feat trainer is or other such info. Do this at the end of the quest please.
2. Call out if you get lost and stop running around
3. By lvl 4 or 6 you should be somewhat self sufficient (have a wands, a few pots, etc).....use them.
4. Look out for vets that are willing to teach :), many won't mind taking time with you if you listen.....however, if you are the guy who runs ahead into a mob and dies after you were told "don't go that way" the vet may not be willing to spend any extra time with you. Some vets don't teach much except maybe to their friends or guildies.
5. If you are lvl 8 and still running basically with Korthos gear let us know.....some vets have so much cash they will go buy something for you.
6. And lastly, some classes are built to do certain things.....I don't suggest newb players multiclass but its their F2P or P2P so who am I to tell them how to play; however, if you are a rogue and cannot disable or find traps or open locks you should let the leader know when you join. This can make life for everyone in the party easier. Also, if you are a cleric who essentially does not heal or a wizard who is a hand to hand battle mage let the party know BEFORE the quest starts.
7. Have fun and learn...use the forums (with a grain or pound of salt I might add), use the compendium, pay attention to maps, trap locations, ambushes, etc. Know where to buy stuff.
8. Don't talk to the party with general chat and don't ask for stuff in party....like plat. :confused::confused:

I run with fewer PUGS now but occasionally I find a new player willing to listen ....if so I don't mind spending extra time helping them learn the game since I learned it by people spending time teaching me.:cool:

[Montrose]

Don't clog voice chat with inane chatter, especially if the quest is even remotely tricky. Join a guild and chat on vent if you want social hour, otherwise stay on topic.
Keep up. Don't lollygag trying to break every barrel or pick up out-of-the-way collectibles. If you do wander off and die, do not expect me to come get you.
Be efficient / Don't undo the actions of others. If someone cases hypno, don't smack every mob. If someone casts web, don't fireball it. If the tank has a mob 99% dead through DPS, don't charm or FoD that mob.
Let the group know if you don't know what you should be doing. We're happy to tell you.
Don't answer questions or give advice on things you are not 100% sure about. It's incredibly annoying to have to correct ****-poor advice.
Don't join an "in progress" or "know your way" or "experienced only" group unless you are very familiar with the quest. You'll just annoy everyone.
Don't die. You cost me exp when you die.
Don't summon a hireling. They will cost the group exp
Don't re-enter the quest. If you release, I *will* boot your ass to save my exp.

[Salome]

My advice and biggest peeve.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=223180

I can do a whole segment on being self sufficient. If you or anyone else would like to join me for an interview I'd be happy for you to be able to explain to new players how they can be self sufficient. Just send me a pm or post a reply.

[Frodo_Lives]

1) I don't believe that this has been mentioned but please Communicate! ;) Most important is to let the leader/party know you are new. Ask if there is anything you should know, any specific spells, any specific no no's about this quest.

I remember talking to the drow in VoN 1 without thinking about it way back when almost causing a wipe in a PuG. No one said not to and I didn't think to ask if I should or shouldn't.

2) Don't touch anything! Do not open a door, pull a lever, active a rune unless directed to. If you don't know what will happen leave it alone. By all means ask questions about the whats and whys of the quest but don't interact with things unless others have first.

3) Keep up with the group, if you are falling behind let everyone know. Most people are fine with slowing down to a pace that you will be able to keep up with. It isn't a NASCAR race, there are no medals for finishing the quest in record time. Most players are more than willing to take a few extra minutes and make sure that the quest is finished as a team. That being said, don't stop and smell the roses at every corner it is also your responsibility to try to keep up with the vets as much as it is there responsibility to slow down for someone new.

4) Don't brag. No one cares about what you looted or how much damage you crit'd for. We don't need to know how awesome and uber you are. Anyone worth impressing will notice if you are good or not without any self promotion on your part.

5) Ask questions, and listen to the answers. That is the best way to learn and most vets will respect the fact that you are asking questions and will be happy to help you.

6) Explorer areas are great places to test out new spells or abilities at low/mid levels. Korthos Island, Creulean Hills, Tangleroot Gorge and Sorrowdusk Island are all great places for level appropriate characters to try new things and experiment.

7) Use the forums to find information and learn. If you are reading this then you probably already know that but hey it's worth mentioning.

8) Follow instructions, if you do not understand what is being asked of you say so. There are only a few quests in this game outside of raids that require specific tactics but if the leader wants to do something a certain way then there is probably a reason for it.

9) Spend time running around Stormreach, get quests from the quest givers (you don't have to enter the quest most times) so that you can read the dialog. Learn who sells what and where. Familiarize yourself with the layout of each of the houses and the marketplace so that when you are joining a group doing a house quest you know where each house is and can find the tavern or questgiver with minimal direction.

10) Don't get upset if you die. Unless you are playing Perma death it's not a big deal. I've seen people (new and vets alike) get all bent out of shape because of it. Sometimes you will fail a save or take a crit and it happens. Try not to die cause you are doing something stupid, or at least try not to die doing the same stupid thing more than once! :)

11) Wait for the rogue to disable traps, or the caster to finish buffing, or the bard to finish their songs. Do not run off and try to be the hero clearing the room. Most of the time it's a bad idea. Stick with the group and things will go a lot smoother. Try not to be in the lead or at the back. The middle of the group is almost always the safest place to be.

Some of these things are redundant and have been mentioned before, but all are important and I know I still find far more vets that are helpful and patient than are rude and elitist.


*** Your attitude has a lot more to do with the way you are treated by others than anything else ***