Wizards as Buffer/CC

[Canon]

So I was in a PUG tonight on my wizard/rogue and got berated for not "killing stuff".

This was after I had cast blur, heroism, bulls strength and hasted everyone numerous times throughout a number of quests. Not to mention the webs and hypno being thrown out, as well as offensive wands I had on me.

My question is this...Is it that uncommon for a wizard to primarily cast buffing and crowd control spells as opposed to spending spell points on damage spells? Or was this guy just a DB for asking me telling me "I don't know what you've been doing so far" and basically telling me I was deadweight.

I value any constructive opinions.

[techwench]

Or was this guy just a DB (...)
Yes. ;)

Crowd control is awesome and (if you don't screw it up like I do...still working on that hand/eye/keyboard coordination) it's extremely helpful to the guys doing the actual killing. The ones who know, appreciate it. The ones who don't, call you dead weight. :rolleyes:

[7-day_Trial_Monkey]

I'll take your kind of wiz over someone who tries to spam damage spells any day.

[Canon]

Thank you both for your input.

I always considered sorcerers to be more the arcane damage dealers and wizards to be more utilitarian, based primarily on the number of spell points available to them.

I plan on using damage spells at higher levels (firewall springs to mind) when I have items, etc. to help with the spell point issue, but at this point the character has 5 levels of wizard and is sitting on less than 500 SP.

I honestly thought I was making a worthwhile contribution to the group and the comments made by the group leader were a real downer.

So now I guess I will make an announcement when I join groups..."I am a buffer. If you want kill count from the arcane caster, hire a sorcerer."

[xtchizobr]

Thank you both for your input.

I always considered sorcerers to be more the arcane damage dealers and wizards to be more utilitarian, based primarily on the number of spell points available to them.

I plan on using damage spells at higher levels (firewall springs to mind) when I have items, etc. to help with the spell point issue, but at this point the character has 5 levels of wizard and is sitting on less than 500 SP.

I honestly thought I was making a worthwhile contribution to the group and the comments made by the group leader were a real downer.

So now I guess I will make an announcement when I join groups..."I am a buffer. If you want kill count from the arcane caster, hire a sorcerer."

if they want a kill count from an arcane caster, they should go back to WoW! =P

even sorcs can't afford to just spray SP at the mobs in most dungeons (depends on how frequent the shrines are). i guarantee you that, as superior as swords are in hurting enemies, the sword-arms can't do it all by themselves.

blur and heroism make the world go 'round.

[smatt]

Depends on the group as well as the quest..... Wizzy's are best at buffing and CC as oppossed to being easy button kill bots.... It simply depends on party, quest, wiz build playstyle.... It's much harder to gauge in a PUG consistaning of players you dont' knwo. But with experience you'll learn to look at the group make-up, know the quest, as well as having full knowledge of your entire spell list, and then from there ahve a pretty good idea of how best to use your toon to full advantage.

[Halock]

You get my vote of confidence, ignore that other foo...

[Merkinsal]

Thank you both for your input.

I always considered sorcerers to be more the arcane damage dealers and wizards to be more utilitarian, based primarily on the number of spell points available to them.

I plan on using damage spells at higher levels (firewall springs to mind) when I have items, etc. to help with the spell point issue, but at this point the character has 5 levels of wizard and is sitting on less than 500 SP.

I honestly thought I was making a worthwhile contribution to the group and the comments made by the group leader were a real downer.

So now I guess I will make an announcement when I join groups..."I am a buffer. If you want kill count from the arcane caster, hire a sorcerer."

I like your first few paragraphs. :) Last one not so much. A great strength of wizards is the ability to bring the best spells and a variety of spells to a particular quest.

I am more curious about your other levels and build. What is your particular reason for being a buffer and cc focused caster who does't melee or use damaging spells and is multiclassed?

[sephiroth1084]

Or was this guy just a DB[...?].
Yes.

Kill count doesn't really mean much (I remind players of this frequently) as it only tracks who got the last hit, not who did the most damage or who prevented the most damage, or who made the quest run smoother, or...you get the point.

There will be some instances where nuking will be the way to go, but for most of your questing, just stick with the good job it sounds like you've been doing!

Oh, and save some of your mana by using wands for buffs! Check the AH for higher level Blur, Resist Energy and Bull's Strength wands.

[smatt]

Yes.

Kill count doesn't really mean much (I remind players of this frequently) as it only tracks who got the last hit, not who did the most damage or who prevented the most damage, or who made the quest run smoother, or...you get the point.



There are many small **** arrogant, uber, egomaniac punks who who would disagree ;)

[Babale]

Hey, don't worry about it. I used to worry about how my wizard had so few kills. Then one day, I died. From ghost mode, I was amazed to see how much harder the quest became, even though I wouldn't have made any kills. Of course, it was too late to make me feel better, since I lost my wizard. (PD). But it made me enjoy the one I rolled up next much more.

[Soulken]

In many quests your better off buffing and hasting the party rather then trying to kill stuff, the guy was just a jerk.

[sephiroth1084]

There are many small **** arrogant, uber, egomaniac punks who who would disagree ;)

When they do, change tactics, lead the kill count, then stop grouping with them! :D

[EddieB_TBC]

Wizards excel at party buffs, crowd control, selective holds / insta-kills like PK and FoD of casters or high DPS output / high HP mobs, firewall as appropriate. Sorcs are a little harder strapped for lots of buff and CC spells but they have the SP reserves to do more DD and AoE attacks. Put whoever the idiot was that bad mouthed you in your "friends" list and move on doing the job you are best at doing (and enjoying it FTW). ;)

[Eradacator]

Wizards excel at party buffs, crowd control, selective holds / insta-kills like PK and FoD of casters or high DPS output / high HP mobs, firewall as appropriate. Sorcs are a little harder strapped for lots of buff and CC spells but they have the SP reserves to do more DD and AoE attacks. Put whoever the idiot was that bad mouthed you in your "friends" list and move on doing the job you are best at doing (and enjoying it FTW). ;)



Going to have to agree with you here, I have a 19 wiz and my friend has a 19 sorc..(we have other toons but these are our first toons from launch thats why I felt compelled to post here) We've had this discussion once over a few beers (Yeah I know sad huh). Now keep in mind everyone plays their character differently, but with respect to the fact that I cannot cast as fast as my friend nor have the insane amount of spell points. I make it a point to first, if there is no bard in group pass out the buffage

- blur/disp/GH/jump/resist/prot/stoneskin

Then crank out a haste... Obviously depending on your experience with the the game you start to know what to expect in every dungeon.. So for the most part I bring whatever particulars needed for the fight... In general I try to do efficent killing much like the quoted post said..

Lots of:
Fire Walls, Finger, Wail of Banshee, PK, F2S, disco balls, and acid fog (mix in whatever else you want to that mix that I failed to mention)


IF you are the only caster in the group... politely tell the dbag who gave you a problem to eat a you know what.. And feel free to toss in the occasional rays, lazers, whatever else you want..

If you got a sorc in group with you...let them goto town and hook the team up, then rock out to the remainder of your SP's Another point I'd like to exemplify... cool thing about sticking back sometimes and playing buffbot/CC you save the groups arse on many of occasions!

[Canon]

I am more curious about your other levels and build. What is your particular reason for being a buffer and cc focused caster who does't melee or use damaging spells and is multiclassed?

This particular character is a drow and now has 7 levels of wizard and 2 levels of rogue. I am not a minmaxxer to the extreme that I have seen, but I did want this character to wear more than one hat. I also heard that taking one level of rogue for every 4 levels of wizard would allow the toon to keep all the important rogue skills maxed out. So far, this is definitely the case. I am very pleased that she can spot, find and disable traps/locks in quests at least 2 levels above her (did Gwylans on elite at level 6 and found/disabled them all).

I figured that being able to do all the roguey stuff AND buff the team would make her a boon to any group she was in, so as I said I was more than a little miffed when I got insulted for not killing more. Hence the original post. I wanted to gauge whether I was the DB or this other guy was.

[sephiroth1084]

- blur/disp/GH/jump/resist/prot/stoneskin


Buffing one person with all of that costs 110-335 SP (depending on how many resists/protects you're handing out). That's a pretty huge chunk of your SP to pass around (660-2010 for all 6 people), so:

Remember that paladins, rangers, clerics and favored souls may be able to handle resists and protects, and also that resist, resist (7) and resist (11) wands are essentially just as good as your casting, but save you SP for more important stuff (like CC and FUN). Ditto for Blur wands (particularly lvl 5 and 10 versions), as well as Stoneskin wands (actually, better to use a wand of SS for a few levels after gaining the spell).

Personally, I can't be bothered keeping Displacement up on a whole party, so I don't give it out unless we're heading into a really tough fight, and even then, I tend to just give it to the person most likely to have aggro or the squishiest, and the healer. It's just too expensive passing it out to everyone repeatedly.

One last thing to remember: while the healer's SP is keeping the party going, your SP is usually saving them SP, and most of their buffs are cheaper, as they have more and better mass buffs, so don't feel too bad having them handle some of the buffs that you may have otherwise. And pestering rangers for resists is better than pestering paladins, as pallies have short-duration buffs that they tend to renew often and, therefore, require more of their mana over the course of a quest, while rangers' buffs are all of longer duration.

[hermespan]

So I was in a PUG tonight on my wizard/rogue and got berated for not "killing stuff".

This was after I had cast blur, heroism, bulls strength and hasted everyone numerous times throughout a number of quests. Not to mention the webs and hypno being thrown out, as well as offensive wands I had on me.

My question is this...Is it that uncommon for a wizard to primarily cast buffing and crowd control spells as opposed to spending spell points on damage spells? Or was this guy just a DB for asking me telling me "I don't know what you've been doing so far" and basically telling me I was deadweight.

I value any constructive opinions.

hmmm... I'd have said "What are you doing, as party leader, one of your jobs is to tell me what you want, buffs, dps and/or crowd control, so I don't know what you've been doing so far, but you aren't leading. Do your job or keep your pie hole shut about the way I do mine."

Party leader needs to tell you what he wants up front if he has expectations about how you should do your job. That's *his* job, so before he can say squat about how you are doing yours, he's got to step up and do his own.

Yea he's a DB.

/shrug

[Phidius]

So I was in a PUG tonight on my wizard/rogue and got berated for not "killing stuff".

This was after I had cast blur, heroism, bulls strength and hasted everyone numerous times throughout a number of quests. Not to mention the webs and hypno being thrown out, as well as offensive wands I had on me.

My question is this...Is it that uncommon for a wizard to primarily cast buffing and crowd control spells as opposed to spending spell points on damage spells? Or was this guy just a DB for asking me telling me "I don't know what you've been doing so far" and basically telling me I was deadweight.

I value any constructive opinions.

It would really depend on the quest and the party mentality. If you were running Delera's with a party who just wanted to gitterdone, I'd say buffing the party and throwing CC would be the wrong tactic.

I'm betting this is not the case.

[Linenoise2]

In many quests your better off buffing and hasting the party rather then trying to kill stuff, the guy was just a jerk.

Not to mention that Haste is by far the single most potent DPS in the game. Combine Blur, Haste, and GH and a Wiz/Sorc has contributed more effectively to a party than most ignorant players could ever imagine. :D

[Kalari]

As someone with 8 arcanes now under my belt (maybe more on other servers :p) it always amazes me what people will expect out of a caster. They want us to buff them, keep them running fast, keep the mobs immoblized then insta kill the ones they cannot. Its not easy at times and even after a few wizards and now sorcs under my belt it can be frustrating.

I learned one thing one person in my party gets the most buffs and thats me, keeping myself alive and not being hit will help out in the long run. If there is a main tank they will get buffed to. If the quest is shrine heavy I will make sure the full party is buffed then do what I have to do. But to answer your question op yes the guy was a complete DB. I find anyone who tries to tell someone how to play their character when they are doing their best and the quest is going smoothly to be so as well. Helpful advice is one thing, expecting one person to handle several roles so that you can succeed is jerky no matter how you slice it.