An Idea For a real Vip rewards system (Veteran Rewards)

[Jarlaxis]

There is a growing number of disgruntled VIP players playing DDO. Most of the complaints are VIP's are not getting real VIP treatment. There is another thread already discussing this so I will not go into that. I am suggesting an idea that would certainly make being a veteran/vip of the game look sweeter and it would not become a game breaking mechanic if it were introduced. There are a lot of games out there that offer rewards to long time players that frankly, new players don't get, period, until they make it past that "Milestone" as it were, just as this would be.

The Idea:

Every three months (this is adjustable of course) as a VIP/Veteran of DDO you earn a single token that is bound to a VIP account. With this token (which you can swap to the toon you want to have it through the account bank) you approach a member of the twelve and say "Insert text here" and they teleport you to a room (while taking your token) that has one chest from each raid inside it marked for which raid it is based on. Only the raids that you have completed on your character would be accessable. Your character would be allowed to open a single chest in the room, and each chest would have all of the named items that drop from that raids warded chest inside it without the dross one normally gets. Your character would then be allowed to loot One Item from that chest which would then follow normal mechanics and be bound to character.

If you think this idea would be worthwhile respond, if you have a better idea or a modification respond.

Sidenote: This could be implemented retroactively for years of sub paid time, at one token every three months.

[Robi3.0]

/not sign especially the retroactive part.

[cwfergtx]

This sounds interesting but I would make it 1 token every three months then 2 tokens on aniversary of account. So each year you could look forward to getting 5 tokens during the year.

[Jarlaxis]

This sounds interesting but I would make it 1 token every three months then 2 tokens on aniversary of account. So each year you could look forward to getting 5 tokens during the year.


5 tokens per year would be nice, Though it would be up to turbine.

[Kemoc]

An interesting idea, but I think I would find more free turbine points that arrive on time, more useful for every day playing. Perhaps some vanity items to help identify who is vip to make grouping or guild inviting easier.

[Strakeln]

I think moving the monthly points to 1500 or more would be more appropriate.

I agree that VIPs are getting shafted, but I don't think this is a good solution.

[Kemoc]

sorry need to de-bounce the submit key.

[Ereshkigal]

while I don't think the OP has a bad idea, it would require coding changed. Increasing the monthly turbine points would be simpler and thus more likely for the programmers to consider, however the accounting department would probably have issues with it, as it would mean us VIP folks would potentially purchase fewer points.

I'd like a free character respec ( when it's ready to be released ) would be a nice feature. give us vip's one free respec every time they release a patch that changes the way any character build might work.

[WolfSpirit]

I think moving the monthly points to 1500 or more would be more appropriate.

I agree that VIPs are getting shafted, but I don't think this is a good solution.
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This isn't bad.
Though perhaps something more geared for Favor ANd VIP such as Double or Triple Earned Turbine Points per 100 earned Favor.
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Give us vip's one free respec every time they release a patch that changes the way any character build might work.
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Also think this should be a given

[Robi3.0]

I think moving the monthly points to 1500 or more would be more appropriate.

I agree that VIPs are getting shafted, but I don't think this is a good solution.
You do realize that 1500 TP cost 18.99 if purchased straight up right, and the highest a player can pay for a subscription is 14.99. By increasing the VIP gifted points to 1500 turbine would technically be losing money.



I'd like a free character respec ( when it's ready to be released ) would be a nice feature. give us vip's one free respec every time they release a patch that changes the way any character build might work.
I can sign on to this, however it should probably be at the most every update. (probably what you meant) or less often then that.

[Oxvon]

Nah, don't like this idea much.

Not saying that I have a better one, just rubs me the wrong way.

[Shamurai]

Being that I've only been playing as a premium member for a monty, of course I will disagree with the OP.

I think those that have gone before me.. already have waaaay more advantages then me.. in terms of items (stat tomes, good twink gear), knowledge of GUI, gameplay annnd quest/ raid familiarity... to give them more free loot would further widen the disparity between the "haves" and the "have nots"..

Vanity items... I'm fine with that. Let those "tokens" allow them to ... change their name, change their hair color, item colors.. get costumes (with no bonuses) perhaps access guild houses, guild banners... change eye color.. add scars, tattoos... cosmetic things. I'm truly sorry I didn't start 3 years ago.. I like this game better then the one I did play, but alas I didn't know about DDO, so please don't "punish" me for not having come here sooner.

[D'rin]

I think some items in the ddo store only available to VIP's. Things to help level faster or even instant level to cut the grind for rerolling or making new characters. Maybe +2 tomes that are usable early to you can have that +2 int tome for more skill points. It would not be game breaking but would allow the vips to have a better character earlier.

[Dylos_Moon]

I think moving the monthly points to 1500 or more would be more appropriate.

I agree that VIPs are getting shafted, but I don't think this is a good solution.

1500 TP per month would more or less be buying 1500 TP every month and getting full access for doing so.

500 TP is already enough (its almost 7 dollars with normal prices, or $5 for sale prices), and if you're one of those many people who are still on the 9.99/month every 3 months plan from awhile ago, this is a steal, you're getting 500 TP and full access for a little more then the normal price of 500 TP.

I would however support VIPs getting more TP from favor, something like time and a half TP, or double since they are so low as is. Or maybe something like giving VIPs a 10% discount in the store, as well as sale prices on points all of the time (I.e. $1 for 100 points much like the sales in beta.)

Additionally, I would like to add another point to consider, Turbine should add a "1 Month VIP sub" to the ddo store for 1499 TP, this would not include the 500 TP striped that a VIP would normally get, but could be accessed for free if one was willing to grind favor every month.

[Wyrmnax]

I actually like the idea.

Not so sure about all the name loot though. Perhaps make it only most of it, like if you have completed the raid 20 times?

It is one kind of solution that would give the VIPs a benefit to keep being VIPs, while not messing with the fact that they dont buy as many points as a premium.

I really like the idea, with some tweaks.

Retroactivity would be a major issue though. You will have people that suddenly have acess to a lot of raid items.

[WolfSpirit]

By increasing the VIP gifted points to 1500 turbine would technically be losing money. .
Well technically it doesn't cost them anything so they wouldn't really be losing any real money, though we would purchace less TP. But then again, should be be not need to buy much from turbine anyway? Though I do agree 1500 is a bit excessive, perhaps 750 would be more realistic.
I still favor the Double or Triple earned Turbine Points through Favor.
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On subject though, I don't like the loot for VIP idea at all. To me its another easy button for the best loot in the game. These chests can be found in their respected Raid and can be looted already every 3 days.

[Ereshkigal]

I can sign on to this, however it should probably be at the most every update. (probably what you meant) or less often then that.

Yea, in fact if they just did it only on the times when they potentially "break" part of what a character was built for, that'd be lovely. Say put a minimum on it of 1/year or something just in case they ever decide to stop fiddling with stuff, lol.

[Sir_Chonas]

What the reward system should be . . . there are 10000 turbine points worth of things purchaseable to equate premium->VIP. . . Hence, there should be a study done to determine the average length of VIP retention then divide 10000 by that number. It should be a relatively low number I'm guessing around 12/20 months giving an average of 800/500 points a month. It's completely fair since $15 a month would equate to roughly 1302 points. . .however, 1302 points PLUS access to everything is beyond ridiculous compensation.

[Memnir]

I like the idea & the mechanic you suggest - but even at the rate of one every three months, it's overpowered imho. Maybe one every four or six months if it's Raid loot.

I personally would not mind so much if VIP rewards were a bit more exclusive - like VIP only armor/robe/outfit, weapon, and helm graphics. Something that would be graphically attractive enough (hire a new artist, in other words) to be desirable and instantly identified as a VIP piece of gear. Perhaps give exclusive crafting options for the VIP gear in that proposed room instead of chests?

[Robi3.0]

Well technically it doesn't cost them anything so they wouldn't really be losing any real money, though we would purchace less TP. But then again, should be be not need to buy much from turbine anyway? Though I do agree 1500 is a bit excessive, perhaps 750 would be more realistic.
I still favor the Double or Triple earned Turbine Points through Favor.
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On subject though, I don't like the loot for VIP idea at all. To me its another easy button for the best loot in the game. These chests can be found in their respected Raid and can be looted already every 3 days.

You are failing to consider all the options. It will cause turbine to loose money in a very quantifiable way. Since being VIP for 14.99 a month gets you 1500 TP a month with no drawback of being non-vip for cheaper then the 18.99 it would cost to buy 1500 points there would be absolutely no reason not to go VIP for the year it would take to save up enough gifted points to buy the game out right.

So that is 179.88 for a year of VIP sub. (mind you it will be less if you think a head and buy it a year at a time) vs 227.88 of purchasing 1500 @ 18.99 a pop 12 times. That is a lose of 48 dollars per player. That might not seem like a lot, but if you multiply that by even just 1/2 the F2p population it quickly adds up to a big lose

[Shamurai]

Srsly? Raid Loot... Didn't I hear recently: "Watch next they'll put Raid Loot in the DDO store, and when they do I'm quitting, because I worked soooo hard for mine!"

So now you just want to walk into a "safe" room and turn in a "Coin of I've been p(l)aying this long" and just pick the Raid Loot up outta the chest?? Srsly? Srsly? So yeah.. One could just charge a years VIP amount to their CC.. go play something else for a year.. come back and take 4 tokens into a safe place and come out with 4 pieces of Raid Loot? FUN!!!

See my previous post about Vanity Items.. not unbalancing at all but some would find it as an incentive.. or what about a "VIP SELECT" shop where these Coins are the admittance fee and in that shop are Resist 30 pots... or scrolls and potions not available in standard shops (like only in drops - maybe not all but some). ~ slightly unbalancing but not so much and can really only visit that store once every 3 months so better stock up.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

I like the idea & the mechanic you suggest - but even at the rate of one every three months, it's overpowered imho. Maybe one every four or six months if it's Raid loot.

I personally would not mind so much if VIP rewards were a bit more exclusive - like VIP only armor/robe/outfit, weapon, and helm graphics. Something that would be graphically attractive enough (hire a new artist, in other words) to be desirable and instantly identified as a VIP piece of gear. Perhaps give exclusive crafting options for the VIP gear in that proposed room instead of chests?

Raid loot tokens would be nice, of course they would. I'd say one every six months or even a year.

But I like Mems fluff idea better. Just something to stand out from both the VIP crowd and the FTP crowd. It's very depressing to stand in TODs hallway surrounded by....well....mirror images.

[Cyr]

So the idea here is to give out raid loot for money right? Pretty sure there was a big out cry about the store and that possibility a bit back. So I guess the idea is more palatable if VIP's get it and not anyone else then :)

[Shamurai]

Raid loot tokens would be nice, of course they would. I'd say one every six months or even a year.

But I like Mems fluff idea better. Just something to stand out from both the VIP crowd and the FTP crowd. It's very depressing to stand in TODs hallway surrounded by....well....mirror images.


YES, I'm sure it is.. hence a VIP Coin of TENSER's Equipment Dye and Transformation... the coin might let you change any one item to one of a different model (same stats and all) or different color.. For example. I haaaaate the look of my +4 Admantine Plate, prefer the model/ color of my +4 Mith Plate of (something), Looooooooove the Mdoel of my +1 Deathblock Plate of (nothing). I'd be deliciously pink if I could change my Adamantine armor (with its DR) into the model used for the Mith Plate,but in the color schema of the Deathblock! If I'm gonna be gimped might as well look good doing it!

[Elsbet]

I definitely do NOT like the raid loot idea and definitely do like Memnir's vanity items idea. I'd love to be able to paint my DT armor so that I don't look like everybody else.

[IronAngel]

Personally I feel that for VIP's who have unlocked certain things like drow, 32-point builds, and FS that we should get them account wide and not just one server. Then have the store bought ones only good for one server and not account wide. I feel that we earned those items and should have some benefit. I know I have paid a lot of money for playing and attaining these things. But somebody new can come in pay a couple of bucks and them in a better way than me.

I really don't care that these things are in the store as it is a way for Turbine to make some cash, which makes the game better and better (hopefully) :) But, really A VIP or even f2p should get account wide bonuses for unlocking favor instead of server only. Whereas those that do not grind for favor should buy it one server at a time. (Turbine might make even more money that way.

[NXPlasmid]

/not signed

looks like someone needs changing...

[Jarlaxis]

So now you just want to walk into a "safe" room and turn in a "Coin of I've been p(l)aying this long" and just pick the Raid Loot up outta the chest?? Srsly? Srsly? So yeah.. One could just charge a years VIP amount to their CC.. go play something else for a year.. come back and take 4 tokens into a safe place and come out with 4 pieces of Raid Loot? FUN!!!



Notice this part?

Only the raids that you have completed on your character would be accessible.

[Angelus_dead]

I agree that VIPs are getting shafted, but I don't think this is a good solution.
The best way to make VIP worthwhile is to release so many adventure packs that access to all of them is a serious benefit, and buying the individual packs becomes a poor substitute.

In a way they've started to do this, by using Epic mode to give old packs long-term value.

[ahpook]

I really don't like the idea of free loot for being a VIP. There should be a lot more factors that can be played with to make VIP attractive without giving away Raid Loot.

Off the top of my head:

Raid Timers: VIP - 2.8 days (whatever it is now). F2P - 4 days

Character Transfers: VIP $12.99 F2P $24.95

Quest Resets: VIP: 5 minutes F2P: 3 minutes

I am sure that with more than 1 minute of thinking a number of other ideas can be determined that doesn't require raid rewards to characters.

PS: And of course what A_D said above me.

PSS: Ransack Counts: VIP: 8 pulls F2P: 5 pulls

[Memnir]

Notice this part?

Only the raids that you have completed on your character would be accessible.I still find the prospect of raid loot rewarded for time subscribed is not a good road to travel. Even for a raid already completed. To my way of thinking, it cheapens and devalues raids in general. Why continue to run for the Titan belt when I know I'll be able to just pluck it from a chest eventually? No... not a good idea.

Yes, VIPs need some beefier incentives - but raid loot should be won by... I dunno... raiding.

[NXPlasmid]

I honestly find this thread disturbing. If you don't want to be a "VIP" then go F2P. The whole idea of differentiating the VIPs from the F2Pers is lame IMHO. F2Pers are mostly new players and there is already a big divide between us and them. I don't think adding further differentiation is going to help the game or encourge new players. You get all the content and 500 TP a month, plus early access to new content, AND preferential access to the server. What else would you like princess(es), a(an) tiara(s)?

[Robi3.0]

The best way to make VIP worthwhile is to release so many adventure packs that access to all of them is a serious benefit, and buying the individual packs becomes a poor substitute.

In a way they've started to do this, by using Epic mode to give old packs long-term value.
More content for everyone is never a bad thing. /signed

This is probably the best and only solution to the VIP/F2p gap people feel exists

I really don't like the idea of free loot for being a VIP. There should be a lot more factors that can be played with to make VIP attractive without giving away Raid Loot.

Off the top of my head:

Raid Timers: VIP - 2.8 days (whatever it is now).
F2P - 4 days
Bad idea

Character Transfers: VIP $12.99 F2P $24.95
good idea, discounts on any premium service is a great idea
Quest Resets: VIP: 5 minutes F2P: 3 minutes
Not really sure why this would matter to anyone, plus in a group of mixed VIP and F2p at what rate would the instance reset at?

I am sure that with more than 1 minute of thinking a number of other ideas can be determined that doesn't require raid rewards to characters.

[snip]

Edit: Ransack Counts: VIP: 8 pulls F2P: 5 pulls
This may be a good idea I will have to think about it.

[Shamurai]

Notice this part?

Only the raids that you have completed on your character would be accessible.

Okay, I did miss that part... so you hve to run it at least once.. but then what? What would you do for fun? If you're capped.. and now no longer NEED to run a raid (more then once) to get stuff what would you do?

[ddaedelus]

I'm definitely not in favor of the raid loot idea. Raid loot should be available only by doing a raid. And, no, I'm not a raider.

I am, however, a big fan of fluff. Vanity items as rewards for x months of being a subscriber is a fine idea. City of Heroes/Villains does this and it has worked very well.


The best way to make VIP worthwhile is to release so many adventure packs that access to all of them is a serious benefit, and buying the individual packs becomes a poor substitute.

In a way they've started to do this, by using Epic mode to give old packs long-term value.

Absolutely the truth.

[Cyr]

The best way to make VIP worthwhile is to release so many adventure packs that access to all of them is a serious benefit, and buying the individual packs becomes a poor substitute.

In a way they've started to do this, by using Epic mode to give old packs long-term value.

For sure A_D best way to make VIP a more compelling model is for tons of new content to come out. Then either way people choose to buy Turbine makes money. Now your Epic conversion statement is kind of muddled though as those packs actually cost premium players no more money, but still eat up development time actually increasing the benefit of premium to VIP further instead of changing it in the other direction.

[IronAngel]

I honestly find this thread disturbing. If you don't want to be a "VIP" then go F2P. The whole idea of differentiating the VIPs from the F2Pers is lame IMHO. F2Pers are mostly new players and there is already a big divide between us and them. I don't think adding further differentiation is going to help the game or encourge new players. You get all the content and 500 TP a month, plus early access to new content, AND preferential access to the server. What else would you like princess(es), a(an) tiara(s)?

I think that it is more of the fact that VIP's for all their loyalty (even though some are new) feel like they are getting less benefit than new players. And yes I know we could buy the same stuff, but we are already choosing to pay monthly and have been for awhile. Show some love :)

[Jarlaxis]

As a by the way, I never said do this or else, or this should be done no matter what. But the discussion has been opened about it, and so far the feedback positive or negative has gotten people thinking, coming up with ideas etc, that was the point afterall.

This is a DDO modified version of the Vet rewards system from Coh/Cov. My alteration isn't perfect and I never said it was.

I'm open to idea's :D

[Robi3.0]

For sure A_D best way to make VIP a more compelling model is for tons of new content to come out. Then either way people choose to buy Turbine makes money. Now your Epic conversion statement is kind of muddled though as those packs actually cost premium players no more money, but still eat up development time actually increasing the benefit of premium to VIP further instead of changing it in the other direction.
His epic statement is spot on adding epic mode to a lower level adventure pack will add end game value to it it did not previously have. For example 3bc is an adventure pack that could very easily be skipped since it isn't all that important to leveling and has no value at end game. If epic was added to this pack it instantly becomes more valuable since it can now be played for more then just favor at end game.


I think that it is more of the fact that VIP's for all their loyalty (even though some are new) feel like they are getting less benefit than new players. And yes I know we could buy the same stuff, but we are already choosing to pay monthly and have been for awhile. Show some love :)

What makes a VIP more loyal then a Premium player. Is it impossible for a premium player to purchase points every month. I went F2p and turbine still gets a monthly payment from me the same day every month. Choosing to sub for a month or 2 or 3 isn't a guarantee you will continue to do so forever.

Further more once a VIP is unable/unwilling to continue pay for a sub they are left with little incentive to continue playing the game. Therefor the probability that they will spend more money in the future on DDO is drastically less.

[IronAngel]

[COLOR="Pink"]What makes a VIP more loyal then a Premium player. Is it impossible for a premium player to purchase points every month. I went F2p and turbine still gets a monthly payment from me the same day every month. Choosing to sub for a month or 2 or 3 isn't a guarantee you will continue to do so forever.

Further more once a VIP is unable/unwilling to continue pay for a sub they are left with little incentive to continue playing the game. Therefor the probability that they will spend more money in the future on DDO is drastically less.

You really need to see my original post to see what I was actually talking about here. It should be in here somewhere.

What my original point was that premium or VIP's actually get less benefit tan new players. That being the fact that those of us who have been around for some time and actually ground out favor for certain rewards are being restricted to server only rewards, whereas new players (and old) can just pay a couple of bucks to open things account wide. I feel it should be the opposite. Let those longterm loyal VIP's or premium or even non-premium open up things like 32 point, drow or FS on an account wide basis instead of server only and let those choosing the easy button pay to unlock it in each server.

[Jarlaxis]

Okay, I did miss that part... so you hve to run it at least once.. but then what? What would you do for fun? If you're capped.. and now no longer NEED to run a raid (more then once) to get stuff what would you do?

I would say keep running it anyway, but when you've just completed that 80th run of Titan looking to get a Chattering Ring that has eluded you for months, and still don't get it, Say Bah, I'll use my token. Or if you get lucky and actually get one on the first few tries, keep running it for that battle coin, or w/e else you want.

[Kemoc]

I think that despite the success of the free to play move, subscription players are the bread and butter, faithful long term support for the game, steady sure income. And although the VIP deal is not bad, it seems to me there is just a little something missing. There needs to be a little something to sweeten the deal if my take on the forum posts is correct. I think most agree the OP loot idea was over the top and suggested 1500 tp is too much as well, but I think 500 is a little shy. Perhaps 700 or so, extra favor points was not a bad idea, but an over all bump would be easier to do, or a VIP price at the store. I still think a special vanity item would appease most VIP. Something with haggle on it like the bandana, or spurs, ribbons like the knights used to fly for the ladies, tabards, just a few thoughts.

[Robi3.0]

You really need to see my original post to see what I was actually talking about here. It should be in here somewhere.

What my original point was that premium or VIP's actually get less benefit tan new players. That being the fact that those of us who have been around for some time and actually ground out favor for certain rewards are being restricted to server only rewards, whereas new players (and old) can just pay a couple of bucks to open things account wide. I feel it should be the opposite. Let those longterm loyal VIP's or premium or even non-premium open up things like 32 point, drow or FS on an account wide basis instead of server only and let those choosing the easy button pay to unlock it in each server.
I read your post and the spin-off thread. Meh, I have been here just as long as you and have ground out the same favor rewards as you. Personally I couldn't care less that someone can now buy what I worked for and have a better version of it. You know why? because now I am thinking "wow I can buy that to and get unlocks on every server that is so worth it". In the long run keeping it the way it is now will bank Turbine more money and in turn will give the game I love playing longer life and produce more content which is what I want more then anything.

In a way. This course of thought is more loyal to Turbine and the game then Thinking that being longer entitles you to better benefits then someone willing to pay money.

Plus the power gap between Vets and new players is already huge. That in itself is a awesome benefit for your loyalty.

[CDG]

It's a great idea. But instead of raid chests, you should get an "I win the dungeon" button.

That way if you're a talentless gimp that' can't get groups due to the charisma bypass you can just step into any dungeon, hit the "I win" button, and post about your achievements on the forums.

Lay off the bong for a while OP.

[Pyromaniac]

It's a great idea. But instead of raid chests, you should get an "I win the dungeon" button.

Lay off the bong for a while OP.

I've got to agree with CDG on this one. Dramatically punishing premium players after they have given Turbine a lot of money up front is a pretty bad idea. By giving VIPs sudden enormous benefits like free raid loot - you're really sticking it to the premiums.

It wouldn't encourage players of future Turbine MMOs to put cash up front, and DDO is supposed to be a testing ground for that. You don't use your testing ground to hurt your reputation and future products.

Since you're suggesting free raid loot, why not the big red "I win" button that you can hit in any quest or raid?