Virtuoso's need Curse Song!!

[Henrieta]

It would be great to see a variety of songs for virtuoso's to play. Maybe one that can slow enemies, one to disrupt their spells, and of course curse song (from NWN 2). Please add these as soon as possible to make virtuoso's have some use. Maybe where a warchanter can give ironskin chant, a virtuoso could strip an enemy of it's buffs and AC. Please look into this idea.

Curse Song
Type of Feat: Class
Prerequisite: -
Specifics: Bards are able to sing a song that can curse their enemies. Deafened creatures are not affected by the bard's singing. The song affects all enemies within 30 feet and lasts for 10 rounds. The higher the bard's final Perform skill and class level, the better the Curse song. All of the penalties listed are additive.
- 3 Perform and Bard Level 1: -1 to Attack and Damage rolls.
- 6 Perform and Bard Level 2: -1 to Will Saves.
- 9 Perform and Bard Level 3: -1 to Damage rolls and -1 to Fortitude Saves.
- 12 Perform and Bard Level 6: -1 to Reflex saves, -1 to Skill rolls.
- 15 Perform and Bard Level 8: -1 to Attack rolls, 8 damage.
- 18 Perform and Bard Level 11: -2 to Dodge Armor Class, -1 to Skill rolls.
- 21 Perform and Bard Level 14: -1 to Damage rolls, 8 damage and -1 Dodge Armor Class.
- 24 Perform and Bard Level 15: -1 Will Saves, -1 Reflex Saves, -1 Fortitude Saves, -1 Dodge Armor Class.
- 25 Perform and Bard Level 16: -1 Will Saves, 4 damage, -1 Dodge Armor Class.
For each additional 5 Perform and 1 Class level in Bard, an additional 2 damage is granted.
Use: Selected.

[Thrudh]

Not a bad idea... less powerful than a party buff song since a party buff lasts for several encounters, while you'd have to resing a debuff song at every encounter for the same effect...

I'm not sure of the details, but a set of debuff songs would be cool...

[Aerendil]

There are a LOT of things DDO could implement from either NWN2 or the Complete Adventurer sourcebook which would really flush out Bards of all sorts.

CA sourcebook offered a variety of new spells that I've discussed in other threads, but which includes more sonic-based DD spells, more buffs (including a "sonic weapon" buff that adds +d6 sonic damage to a Bardic weapon), and some enemy debuff songs.

CA sourcebook is also the PnP book with the Virtuoso PrC in it, so there are some things in there that may still make it in game. Who knows.

NWN2 offers additional bonuses such as the Curse Song mentioned above, a Haven song (think of it as a diplomacy effect for the Bard - so enemies will be more likely to attack others), and various other songs that can improve regeneration rates, slow enemies, and even disrupt enemy spellcasting (this one is taken right from the Virtuoso PrC). It also introduces new spells including a nice new sonic DD upgrade to Soundburst (think Soundburst but is 1d6 dmg per level, max 15d6), and Hold Person, Mass.

So yeah, there's a lot that DDO could implement.
They just haven't done it, and no dev feedback discussion has been in place even suggesting it.

/shrug

[rimble]

Not a bad idea... less powerful than a party buff song since a party buff lasts for several encounters, while you'd have to resing a debuff song at every encounter for the same effect...

I'm not sure of the details, but a set of debuff songs would be cool...

Could sort of make it an 'aura'...basically, the Bard is walking around singing/playing/whatevering...but we don't necessarily need to hear the music, it might get pretty monotonous, hehe.

Anyways, it could probably be coded like the Paladin aura (or Implosion), but which causes penalties to your enemies rather than bonuses to your party...the Bard sings, he gets this aura for the normal duration of however songs usually last, and things that enter within the radius of that aura take various penalties (Will save vs. Perform skill, good luck making that roll...). BTW, Will save should be vs CURRENT Perform skill...no fair singing then taking your Perform item off. =P

It should probably be a general Bard ability, but that Virtuosos can do better (like the Inspire songs and Warchanters).

[Aerendil]

Yep, I'd love to see some of this added - and they needn't even make it song-based (although that works very well for Virtuosos).

NWN2 has several really nice options for songs:

Inspire Jarring - song-based AoE which forces enemies to make Concentration checks (at -4) to get their spells off. This was taken from both NWN2 and right from the Virtuoso PrC. I'd say this could be a decent tier II ability or a trainable enhancement.

Inspire Slowing - all enemies that come within 20' of the Bard must make a Will save (DC in NWN2 was 13 + 1/2 bard level + CHA mod, although I'd imagine in DDO this will be 10 + 1/2 + CHA mod) or be slowed down.
Additionally, in NWN2 this started off as a 15% slow and later improved to 30%.

Curse song - this is another one that improved with levels, but was much more noticeable. When you first got the song it would do a mere -1 to attack/damage on enemies. At level 16 with perform 30, you'd be doing 20 damage to your target, as well as -2 to attack, -2 to damage, -3 to will saves, -2 to fort and reflex saves, -4 to AC, and -3 to skill checks, with a further 2dmg/-1 to skills for every Bard level and +5 Perform past level 16.

Legionnaire's song - the song determines the highest character's BAB in range, and everyone affected by the spell now use that BAB as theirs until the song wears off. They are also given a +4 competence boost to damage while the song is in effect.
IMO, this is the ideal Warchanter III benefit.

As I've said before, plenty of ideas and options out there. Just wish they'd implement some of them...

[Valindria]

I saw this and laughed:


Well balanced so that even the weaker player classes, like bards, will have a fun time.

In the NWN 2 expansion features:

http://www.atari.com/us/games/neverwinter_nights2_mysteries_of_westgate/dvd_rom?dd=1

I guess the bards need love in most games. :)

[Henrieta]

It takes alot of skill to play the adventuring-life challenged bard class...well. But I love it.

[Maegin]

It takes alot of skill to play the adventuring-life challenged bard class...well. But I love it.

lol tell me about it. ive been a virt since launch, and man its so hard to remain, but i know it will get its day soon.

[Aerendil]

lol tell me about it. ive been a virt since launch, and man its so hard to remain, but i know it will get its day soon.

You mean Soon[TM] ;)

I'm also wondering what any future Virtuoso changes will do to Virts.
Looking at their abilities both in PnP (Complete Adventurer) and NWN2, most song-based abilities are either a DC of the perform check (which any Bard can have a decent score in) or a DC of 10 + 1/2 bard level + CHA mod, which forces Virtuosos to go a path similar to the Spellsinger (i.e. stay pure and put level ups into CHA).
Except it doesn't look as though the capstone will affect song DCs (only spell enchantments)...

But I wonder how many Virtuosos out there don't have decent CHA scores, which could put them in trouble one day (or force a switch to Warchanter).

/sigh.

But yeah, still holding out for Virtuoso love too. I changed mine over to Spellsinger for the time being, but wouldn't hesitate to switch him back if they actually gave some Bard love.