What do you think $15/mo should get you?

[Draccus]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)

[Impaqt]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)

I think your just Fishin for Rep...... :) It worked.. Well said. Spot on.

[Draccus]

I think your just Fishin for Rep...... :) It worked.. Well said. Spot on.

Nah, I use comedy, sarcasm, and "Cheat Death Sucks!" posts to fish for rep. This is a full-on rant ;)

[wamjratl1]

I am not getting my $15 a month's worth of DDO. I do not have to time to play as much as I like, and therefore I only get $6-$8 worth of playing time a month. I cannot believe that for 2.5 years, Turbine has NEVER ONCE offered to babysit my kids or rub my wife's feet while I play DDO so I can get my money's worth. Outrageous! Customer Service... HMPH!

[Grosbeak07]

I am not getting my $15 a month's worth of DDO. I do not have to time to play as much as I like, and therefore I only get $6-$8 worth of playing time a month. I cannot believe that for 2.5 years, Turbine has NEVER ONCE offered to babysit my kids or rub my wife's feet while I play DDO so I can get my money's worth. Outrageous! Customer Service... HMPH!


Dude, get your kids to rub your wife's feet. Problem solved and you should have more game time then. :D

[Ranmaru2]

$15 a month to a college student is a bit of cash :D

[Missing_Minds]

$15 a month to a college student is a bit of cash :D

Looks like it is Ramen again for dinner. Good thing I like Ramen.

[IrishHalfling]

$15 a month to a college student is a bit of cash :D


Right, that's a case of Natty Light and a cover charge!

[Furbitor]

nooo

It costs more to play DDO than $15 bucks...

In order to play ddo I must:

1. Pay my rent $500 per month
2. Pay my $150 elect bill/month
3. pay my $50 dollar internet connection bills /month
4. Buy a $3000. dollar gaming rig...
5. Pay $15 bucks/day for fast food so I can game and not cook
6. Spend huge amounts of time locked in a dark, cool room. time =money
7. Buy the $40.00 copy of DDO off the shelf
8. Now I get to pay $15 bucks a month.

so. DDO isnt free.

I dont play in anyone elses house.. I use my own comp..

Gaming costs money.. big money.

I take it seriously, don't you?

[Jay203]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)

i think there's at least one other thing we're entitled to
customer service :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Gnorbert]

nooo

It costs more to play DDO than $15 bucks...

In order to play ddo I must:

1. Pay my rent $500 per month
2. Pay my $150 elect bill/month
3. pay my $50 dollar internet connection bills /month
4. Buy a $3000. dollar gaming rig...
5. Pay $15 bucks/day for fast food so I can game and not cook
6. Spend huge amounts of time locked in a dark, cool room. time =money
7. Buy the $40.00 copy of DDO off the shelf
8. Now I get to pay $15 bucks a month.

so. DDO isnt free.

I dont play in anyone elses house.. I use my own comp..

Gaming costs money.. big money.

I take it seriously, don't you?

Oh please... without DDO you would still be paying all those costs to support your porn habits.

[Big-Dex]

I don't entirely disagree with you Drach. It is a fair enough perspective for some, but for those of us who really don't care about the $15/month, it misses the mark ... or doesn't even address it.

You make a committment, meet it. You fail to meet it, make good on it.
Communicate with your customers, don't insult them by trying to placate them.
Treat your customers as you would want to be treated if you were the customer.

Etc. etc.

I won't preach any further. Just realize that for many here, it is not the money, it is the principle behind it.

Don't get me wrong. While I strongly disagree with their approach to customer satisfaction and question their committment to some of the fundamental principles I value in companies, I am still willing to pay my $15 to play their game. It is still a fun form of entertainment for 50 cents each day. I, like many I think, would just rather give the money to a company that values their loyal customers as much as they do their bottom line. Since there aren't many of them around, we will just have to settle for the cheap entertainment.

Just sayin'
Dex was here. :cool:

[Impaqt]

nooo

It costs more to play DDO than $15 bucks...

In order to play ddo I must:

1. Pay my rent $500 per month

Dnt we all? What does having a roof over your head have to do with DDO?


2. Pay my $150 elect bill/month

of which about $5-$8 is your PC. Even if you leave it on 24/7


3. pay my $50 dollar internet connection bills /month

ANd you dont do anything with that internet connection besides DDO?


4. Buy a $3000. dollar gaming rig...

Unnecessary. I have guildies playing this game on $500 machines from 3+ Years ago.


5. Pay $15 bucks/day for fast food so I can game and not cook

Personal Choice, Not DDO Related.


6. Spend huge amounts of time locked in a dark, cool room. time =money

Again, Personal Choice. But if you can afford all those other expenses, ya gotta be soing something productive right?


7. Buy the $40.00 copy of DDO off the shelf

3+ Years ago... Not relavent. its $15 at most today. and includes a Free month


8. Now I get to pay $15 bucks a month.

You'd think someone as obsessed as you would of taken advantage of the $10mo Promo.... Bummer.



so. DDO isnt free.

I dont play in anyone elses house.. I use my own comp..

Gaming costs money.. big money.

I take it seriously, don't you?

It can cost big money, but certainly doesnt Require it.

[Lorichie]

For 15 a month i expect to get:

access to the servers.

everything else is just fluff.

Now, at some point in time i'll have to decide if that 15 a month is worth it to me, but that's a different conversation. i'm a simple guy.

Access to the servers is 15 a month, and my experience might change. simple. there's no gray area for me, it is as simple as it says it is.

Again, if i'm bored with what i'm doing while logged onto those servers thats a different discussion, that's not a money per month issue. that's a question about is the money well spent to me or not issue.

R

[Donnie]

I won't preach any further. Just realize that for many here, it is not the money, it is the principle behind it.

Yep. I personally could wipe my ass with $15 right now. However, for $15 I expect a little courtesy...and changing a release date 3-4 days before it drops is not courtesy imo.

Im over it at this point, but I cant help but feel like after all these years Turbine still hasnt learned a **** thing about proper communication :(

[Furbitor]

duplicate post deleted

[Deep_Sashelas]

I think the notion of 'value' is relative to other offerings of a similar type.

While no new content is necessarily guaranteed it is somewhat expected given the general state of most MMOs. DDO's sister game LotRO has pretty consistent content updates for $9.99 (a fee which is offered again and again). However I realize they are two very different games and any client has the choice to leave or not leave based on their concept of 'value' or simply on principle.

I think many here who complain about the expectations simply want DDO to be all that it can be. Honestly if they made an expansion pack (or a Guild Wars product line) with loads of new content I believe most veterans would gladly buy it. Of course that option doesn't exist in the new DDO but it brings us back to the 'value' of a gaming experience.

On a personal level for 15 a month I do expect content updates, a moderated forum, developer interaction, special events, game evolution (in terms of exploits/ruleset changes/server pop/etc) and some small input/feedback (whether directly listened or not :) ) in the direction of the game. Whether that belief is justified by the money or not I don't really know or care. It is simply what I ask for in a game. *shrug*

So....I pay for a while and play the content I wish and then leave. I have returned fairly recently for new content and to see what the EU might have to offer.

[Furbitor]

Dnt we all? What does having a roof over your head have to do with DDO?

Where do you play the game? in a Wendy's parking lot? it requires you to be somewhere to play.

of which about $5-$8 is your PC. Even if you leave it on 24/7

Computers don't run on wishes... Cannot play DDO without electric.

ANd you dont do anything with that internet connection besides DDO?

Irrevelant.

Unnecessary. I have guildies playing this game on $500 machines from 3+ Years ago.

Sure. I could have a cheaper machine and setup.. but 500 or 5000.. it still is something... and last I looked I wasnt given a free computer.

Personal Choice, Not DDO Related.

probably. but also spending time is revelant.. therefore time spent is worthy.

Again, Personal Choice. But if you can afford all those other expenses, ya gotta be soing something productive right?

Time spent not gaming is used to earn money to game further.. if those bills above don't get paid.. then that $15/month bill is worthless.
[QUOTE]
7. Buy the $40.00 copy of DDO off the shelf
[/QUOTE
3+ Years ago... Not relavent. its $15 at most today. and includes a Free month

I dont care. its what I spent 30 days after release in a Gamestop store. Price drops now doesnt care what I had to pay.

You'd think someone as obsessed as you would of taken advantage of the $10mo Promo.... Bummer.

If I wanted to take advantage of chaining my account to a 6 month renewal cycle, I would have. But I make money the $5.00 bucks extra I pay to hope turbine keeps hiring good devs to help write content. but thats me.


It can cost big money, but certainly doesnt Require it.

I object.

Dont pay your rent? where you gonna play?
dont pay your bills? where you plug your comp into?
dont eat? How can you play if your dead?
dont pay for a computer? maybe the DDO can port the game to Pencil and Paper.
Dont get a subscription? cant play in the game longer than a month (free)




furbed in yellow

[Elaril]

i think there's at least one other thing we're entitled to
customer service :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

What is this customer servicing you are speaking of? I'd say we got "served" big time with this mod.

[Impaqt]

[QUOTE=Impaqt;2340880]Dnt we all? What does having a roof over your head have to do with DDO?

Where do you play the game? in a Wendy's parking lot? it requires you to be somewhere to play.

Irrelevant. you dont own a home, or Rent an aprtment in order to play DDO. SHelter is a basic human need completely unrelated to DDO. I fyou didnt play DDO, You would still want a roof over your head.

of which about $5-$8 is your PC. Even if you leave it on 24/7

Computers don't run on wishes... Cannot play DDO without electric.

Irrelevant to my point. You dont pay the Electric company $150 mo/ for DDO. You pay then $5-$8 for DDO. and thats being generous.

ANd you dont do anything with that internet connection besides DDO?

Irrevelant.
not really.

Unnecessary. I have guildies playing this game on $500 machines from 3+ Years ago.

Sure. I could have a cheaper machine and setup.. but 500 or 5000.. it still is something... and last I looked I wasnt given a free computer.
that was my point, Thanks for conceeding that. you dotn NEED a $3-$5k computer to run DDO. a $500 one can suffice.

Personal Choice, Not DDO Related.

probably. but also spending time is revelant.. therefore time spent is worthy.

Worthy? lol
Again, Personal Choice. But if you can afford all those other expenses, ya gotta be soing something productive right?

Time spent not gaming is used to earn money to game further.. if those bills above don't get paid.. then that $15/month bill is worthless.


[COLOR=CYAN]Thats borderline sickness there. Are we going to see you on the next episode of Intervention or Obsessed? Seriously.. Reread that stuff.. ITs kinda scary. This is a Game.

furbed in yellow

I'm now officially bored with this thread.

[ariel7]

$15 a month to a college student is a bit of cash :D

One of the biggest cons in history. When I was in college I always had time and cash for beer, parties, and whatever else.

College students = disposable income.

Married people are broke. :)

[wamjratl1]

[

Where do you play the game? in a Wendy's parking lot?



Yes. (at least that's what I told the cops I was doing...)
oh and +1 cuz that quip made me laugh. Now you two stop arguing!

[Ciphertazi]

The Truth.

[stromburg]

$15.00 gets me a pack of smokes so by quitting I can play DDO for free and even be a VIP!

[Deep_Sashelas]

One of the biggest cons in history. When I was in college I always had time and cash for beer, parties, and whatever else.

College students = disposable income.

Married people are broke. :)

No kidding. No real bills, always somewhere to mooch free food, I could get around nearly everywhere I wanted to go by walking or hitching a ride and the best thing was that there was always another student that was selling something pretty nice for pocket change.

Bikes, computer parts, clothes, motorcycle parts, audio equipment, etc. Someone was always scrounging for Spring Break :)

Now I have mortgage/car/business expenses/child/spouse/etc. DDO is last on the list :P

[Uska]

If I said something like this I would get attacked as usual from a certain crowd. but glad you said it.


+1

[Twerpp]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)


It doesnt matter what every different players perception of "15 bucks worth" is.

If the company says you are gonna get "X" for 15 bucks a month, you should get it.

Course none of it matters now that its "free".

[transtemporal]

This newfangled rational approach will never catch on drac. What's the use of a subscription if not to hone our e-peen? Where's the entitlement? These are the foundations upon which the interwebz was founded! :)

[Furbitor]

If I said something like this I would get attacked as usual from a certain crowd. but glad you said it.


+1

No fears Uska!! Every do-gooder needs to have a say.. I'll support ya!

"....for if there was no GOOD in the LAND, then there cannot be EVIL....."

[Uska]

No fears Uska!! Every do-gooder needs to have a say.. I'll support ya!

"....for if there was no GOOD in the LAND, then there cannot be EVIL....."

sometimes even in your sarcasm your funny:) +1 for making me laugh even if you didnt intend to.

[Kalari]

I get that 15 bucks is not a lot of money and that for it turbine provided a good time sink when some of us needed it. I am not making demands honestly dont care to. I just think I can take the 15 bucks now and find another time sink that I dont feel ive run into the ground.

I have said many times if they offered a real expansion I would have gladly shelled out more money for it. Now I doubt I will this last incident really broke things for me and it wasnt just the having another month with nothing to do. Its that they dont want to let people know why they are doing it. If its an exploit they found or a bug why not say it without giving specifics? No instead they leave another month of people speculating in the forums cause lets face it for many of us trolling the forums has been more fun then playing the content provided.

All they have to do is add a little more communication it doesnt even have to be 100 percent honest just more then "hey it was the stress test.." okay but many said they were on during said test and didnt see the issue. So who are we to believe? thats why many of us are just done and tired. Its one thing to be disappointed with the push back its another to think "Turbines keeping secrets again." which is exactly what this latest incident feels like.

[ThrasherGT]

Just wanted to ask a question to all who say "We pay for server access, that's all. Anything else is a "Bonus"."

If DDO was "as released" With a level 10 cap and nothing else added that We have gotten in the last 3.5 yrs, would You still be playing?

Mods drive the game forward. Yes, they are REQUIRED to keep a player base happy and paying their monthly fees. Suggesting otherwise is ridiculous.

My beef with the entire fiasco is the way it's been handled since the beginning:

Sept '08: "We hope to have the new Mod out by the end of the year" = $30 from me.

Dec '08 "We hope to have the new Mod out "Around the Anniversary"" = another $30

March '09 "Sorry, no new Mod, But We have a "Super Secret" Project We're working on, and it going to make DDO AWESOME. Stay tuned." = another $50

Now, I'm not saying that I would have cancelled My sub, (I haven't even through My "breaks" from the game) But the whole thing reeks of a shameless money grab and "Being pulled around by the nose".

If They were Honest with us back in Sept '08, there's a chance that this game wouldn't even be here right now. I mean, I get it, They did what they had to do to stay in business, but it leaves a bitter taste in My mouth.

I hope they have MOD 10 ready to go, because if they don't release it before My sub runs out in early Nov., I'm outta here............

[TommyBoy]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

OK $45 is roughly the cost of a new game. So for the $180 a year I can buy 4 new games. I understand that there are cost that are associated with running an mmo. To answer your question I expect atleast two new games worth of content. I think thats only fair since I'm paying the orginal cost four times a year. That perspective enough?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

Where as this is somewhat technicly true it is also poor business practice. And I for one invest more into DDO then my 401k. I do pay to play a game that does somewhat intitle me to more then one who doesn't and the fact that I have been here 5+ yrs means that I should be valued.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

Its not just 15 dollors I have 3+ years of time invested. Time is money. Not only that $15 is sizable over time ($15/m x 12m = $180 x 3yrs = $540 +$45 = $595)

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

5? 8oclock columbian is only $5 a bag and makes roughly 30 cups

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)

see lime

[Demonfire]

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." .....

Man you're **** right because no new content is pretty close to what we had since almost a year now! I would be the first to pay 30$/month or even paying more money for expansions... but unfortunately Turbine decided that ddo was the least of their priority and it will last so long as we milking cows will stay around.

[gaki]

Here's what I expect:

a) the product
b) customer service to support the product.

And that goes for every product, right on down to those that only cost a buck or two.

Before we jump on the "it's only a few cups of coffee" BS ...

Starbucks has to invest a few billion dollars in infrastructure costs to make its 500 million dollars in profit every year. You can't re-sell a cup of coffee to a million people worldwide, you have to re-make it each and every time. Compare that to Blizzard, who made 900 million last year and who had to invest less than half that in data centers and development costs. The potential profit levels for the two products are at the opposite ends of the scale!

A coffee giant pays five bucks to make 1. An MMO developer pays one buck to make 2. I think that means they come with different service level expectations, don't you think?

So, is it really competing with that coffee, or is it competing with that $15 CD/DVD/book I could buy that will last me the rest of my life?

[Ranmaru2]

One of the biggest cons in history. When I was in college I always had time and cash for beer, parties, and whatever else.

College students = disposable income.

Married people are broke. :)

Only those who don't think about the long run (aka after they get out and the loans they have) will dispose of a metric butt ton of cash during their college years, so my point still stands...$15 a month (realistically speaking, $30 a month since I pay for my gf's account too) is a lot of dough

[Grosbeak07]

Since I still do the 6 months at $9.99, I guess this bothers me a lot less than others. It cost me $10.50 a ticket to go to the Movies. So for $.51 less than a movie ticket I get to play DDO for a month. If I play 3 hours of DDO (And I play more than that), it's already a better deal. I do the same thing on LOTRO as well, and I play that even less.

To me its still the best entertaintment value out there, something both me and Mrs. like to do, so its good value. For $10 bucks, I don't expect over achieving customer service, I don't expect to be wowed every time new content comes out, I guess I don't pay them enough to care.

Now if I paid 30, 40, 50 or more dollars per month, then you bet I would expect more, but I don't... So I keep my expectations real.

[cbj192]

...Server access for my money. Which right now tends to be moody. I seem to lose the server connection very frequently nowadays. It really needs to be consistent. However when I thought Mod 9 was coming I didnt mind as much - I just figured it was part of the process.


To me I don't care if Mod 9 takes anther six months to come out but if I am paying for old content then please at least allow me the ability to play w/o crashing.

[KoboldKiller]

I expect reasonable time between updates. I expect a playable game with an acceptable amount of glitches and lag (not saying it's not acceptable). I expect customer service to the extent that I get a reasonable answer for reasonable questions. I expect a game based on D&D to follow the rules and not be perverted to the point it's beyond recognition.

These are MY expectations.

[KoboldKiller]

I remember the days when I used to defend Turbine and was labeled a fanboi, but then I grew wise and realized I was defending something that could care less about me or my defense of it. Now I am a happy voice of dissent and realism. If Turbine really cared about it's current player base and not it's incoming gold card crowd we would get better information than we do and wouldn't be tossed "cookies" every time the blow something. Instead they would give us compensation that matters, such as a free month of play not Turbine points we can't use until they get the delayed MOD released anyway.

[Stonebread]

Dude, get your kids to rub your wife's feet. Problem solved and you should have more game time then. :D

+1 rep to you!

[Philam]

$15 A Month Apparently Gets You ****ed By Turbine!

[Stonebread]

The money cost to play DDO is insignificant. It's not the money, it's the time that is the real investment.

[KoboldKiller]

$15 A Month Apparently Gets You ****ed By Turbine!


That's not a bad price considering what you would pay for that elsewhere. :D

[Grosbeak07]

These are MY expectations.


And what if my expectations are different than yours? Who should Turbine design their game for?

[KoboldKiller]

And what if my expectations are different than yours? Who should Turbine design their game for?


The fact is Turbine designs the game for their own expectations with few exceptions. I have seen to many stealth changes and things down for the vocal minority. I am not saying the game should be designed to my expectations (though I expect many people have the same expectations as I do) but now it appears they are going to cater to the WoW crowd and the gold card carriers. Easy buttons are not always good.

[DoctorWhofan]

bah.

Three subs for DDO = $35/mo two $10 and a $15

Cable/Internet = $92/mo darn you, Hawai'i!

Father-in-law's new DDO sub = $15/mo Dad lost his job of 26 years with no pension. Now works in Wal-mart just to pay taxes on his house and make ends meet.

Father-in-law's internet = $ 49/mo see above

Revamping my old computer cuz Dad had to sell his and mailing to him = $150


A family of gamers able to play together even though Dad is in Michigan = priceless.




--and worth every penny we spend.

THe only money I have wasted on Turbine is to pay for the higher up's salary.

[JakLee7]

This thread really brings the contrast out between the two sides of the coin
1. I enjoy the game & the money I spend, reguardless of new content, is well spent
&
2. I need more from this game to continue enjoying it.

There are some who truely are disgusted/hurt/ect by the delay tactics Turbine used, and feel wronged in some way. I do not think it is wrong to feel this way any more than I feel it is wrong for someone to say they don't like it but still have so much of the game they still do enjoy.


I don't mind paying the $15 a month for a game I enjoy. I will continue to pay the money as long as I still feel the game is "worth it". But that is the real kicker there - it may be "worth it" to me long after it is "worth it" for you, or vice versa. And the more things that irritate me, or you, or any player; the more delays, the smaller releases, the changes to the game disrupting the "fun" aspect for customers, the more customers leave. Once enough people leave the game, it is no longer profitable. When it is no longer profitable it shuts down, reguardless of who still enjoys it and is willing to pay for it.

I know this game today is different than the one initally released. I know some of the changes were good, some bad, some just DIFFERENT. I could see myself playing this game 5 years from now still, if I still enjoyed it. I have games that are 10 years old that were fun enough that I still play, in fact if you go back farther even, I play Final Fantasy 1 on occation because it was such a FUN game. I don't want to see DDO fail, but I also don't want to feel like I am paying Turbine $15 a month today for a game I MAY like in one, two, or six months from now.

[Lorichie]

The fact is Turbine designs the game for their own expectations with few exceptions. I have seen to many stealth changes and things down for the vocal minority. I am not saying the game should be designed to my expectations (though I expect many people have the same expectations as I do) but now it appears they are going to cater to the WoW crowd and the gold card carriers. Easy buttons are not always good.

This is pretty much it in a nutshell. They, for better or worse, have a vision of where they want to take this game. Along the way, if something they envisioned, either by us or by those above them, needs to be changed they do. Sometimes it works in our favor, sometimes it doesn't, but the vision still needs to be there, and still is there.

Each of us as individuals needs to decide for ourselves if we want to follow along with that vision. There are some things that cannot be undone, for better or worse. There are some things that can be met halfway. However, at the very core of it, none of it was done intentionally to lose money or to waste time, theirs or ours. (i understand that those that are the angriest will disagree, thats ok, that's why opinions are as they are.)

Video games, Mmo's in specific, are fluid. Sometimes it runs thicker than others, but it's still fluid.

R

[smatt]

Reading these boards, I am really surprised at what some players expect to get for $15/mo. Some of the comments range from laughable to pathetic. Some of you are treating your $15/mo as if you're investing your life savings into a retirement account. How about a little perspective?

Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period. It doesn't guarantee you new content and you aren't OWED anything for being a "loyal customer for 3+ years." This isn't Turbine Airlines and you're not racking up frequent flier miles. This isn't your 401k, your life insurance policy, or your escrow account. You pay to play the game and you get to play the game.

"I've been paying $15/mo for three years and this is all I get?"
No, you GOT 3 years of playing the game, which is exactly what you paid for.

Finally, we're talking $15/mo. That is a trivial amount of money to the vast majority of people in the countries where this game is played. Most of us spend more than $15 a WEEK on coffee yet we think we should be treated like shareholders in Turbine common stock.

If you think Turbine owes you more than you're getting for your five-cups-of-coffee a month and you're not getting it, then maybe MMOs aren't a good place for you to spend your life's savings.

(whew...not sure where this uncharacteristic fanboi rant came from. Too much time reading the forums I guess! Oh yeah, one more thing: Give us a better rogue capstone, Turbine!)


I would agree to some extent.... BUT... When they start telling us this and that is coming out.... Making vague promises, and statemnts hinting at certain things, let all the forumites get going and never dispell the commonly held rumours.... Well then I feel the OWE me more...

Therre'sa big difference Dresek, and you know what I'm talkign about.. That's why any court case would be laughed at... Taht's why theyr'e so vague giving hints, wink wink nod nod type stuff... That's why they IMPLIED Mod 9 around the first of the year, then around the anniversary..... Ect.. Nothing in writing, no promises.... Makes it real easy for them to say sorry thanks for playing, if you don't like it **** off......

You can make these statements about them not owing us anything all day long.... At some point that doesn't hold a drop of water.... Not after we sat through over 3 weeks of almost totally unplayable lag last Nov. when they were CHARGING us to Beta their new network configuration for this DDO-EU, the constant extended downtimes day after day after that... Then another move, then a vieled implied releases around the anniversary, whre they LET everybody think it was coming out, tons of people came back to the game wasted their money and time... They let everybody BELIEVE it was coming out soon, and they knew it wasn't....
Legally no they don't us jack.... Ya most of us love this game, that's why we put up with Turbines BS.. No I'm not leaving.. When I do I'll just leave....... But I'll tell you what, there is no way in heck I would ever encourage anybody else to play this game at this time. Not unless things change as far as the way the customers are treated.... Great game, but man there's far too many head scratchign moments.....

We all love this game otherwise we wouldn't be here.... But as far as the fanoi stuff.. Nope that's long past....... But maybe they should jsut shut about any dates, or anything and put it out the day it comes out.... That would at least be an HONEST way to do it... For the last 2 years they as a corporation have been completely dishonest with their customers..... :(

[Draccus]

I would agree to some extent.... BUT... When they start telling us this and that is coming out.... Making vague promises, and statemnts hinting at certain things, let all the forumites get going and never dispell the commonly held rumours.... Well then I feel the OWE me more...

Therre'sa big difference Dresek, and you know what I'm talkign about.. That's why any court case would be laughed at... Taht's why theyr'e so vague giving hints, wink wink nod nod type stuff... That's why they IMPLIED Mod 9 around the first of the year, then around the anniversary..... Ect.. Nothing in writing, no promises.... Makes it real easy for them to say sorry thanks for playing, if you don't like it **** off......

You can make these statements about them not owing us anything all day long.... At some point that doesn't hold a drop of water.... Not after we sat through over 3 weeks of almost totally unplayable lag last Nov. when they were CHARGING us to Beta their new network configuration for this DDO-EU, the constant extended downtimes day after day after that... Then another move, then a vieled implied releases around the anniversary, whre they LET everybody think it was coming out, tons of people came back to the game wasted their money and time... They let everybody BELIEVE it was coming out soon, and they knew it wasn't....
Legally no they don't us jack.... Ya most of us love this game, that's why we put up with Turbines BS.. No I'm not leaving.. When I do I'll just leave....... But I'll tell you what, there is no way in heck I would ever encourage anybody else to play this game at this time. Not unless things change as far as the way the customers are treated.... Great game, but man there's far too many head scratchign moments.....

We all love this game otherwise we wouldn't be here.... But as far as the fanoi stuff.. Nope that's long past....... But maybe they should jsut shut about any dates, or anything and put it out the day it comes out.... That would at least be an HONEST way to do it... For the last 2 years they as a corporation have been completely dishonest with their customers..... :(


I don't disagree with anything you said. I agree that Turbine's marketing tactics are shady and underhanded. I am convinced that some (maybe not all, but some) of the delays and promises and vague statements were made solely to squeeze another few subscription weeks out of any players that were waivering.

But I don't think there was any malicious intent. I don't think they've been trying cheat anyone out of their subscrption fees and give them a lousy product. Instead, I think they honestly believe that DDO:EU is going to make DDO great and that all they need to do is keep their subscribers around until launch and we'll all agree.

That all being said, I still don't understand the posts from people thinking Turbine owes them something other than a game to play. An apology for the delays and bad info? Sure. But the fact remains that paying $15/mo for a 16 months has given me 16 months of DDO. Just like I expected.

I think one reason that I'm not as upset about the delays as most other players is that I was expecting less. I was honestly expecting the game to die and that Turbine would make an announcement like UO made when that game died. I was so sure Turbine was going to announce an end to supporting the game ("but we'll keep the servers running as long as we have players!") that when I found out it was quite the opposite, I was relieved and happy. Yeah, I want to play the new stuff as badly as you do but I'm just so glad it's coming that I'm not upset about the wait.

Finally, I'm not even close to bored with the current content like most of you vets. I've got two capped characters and haven't even run every quest yet. I've only got 6 Dragon raid completions, 3 DQ's, 26 Titans, and 90 Shrouds across all characters. I know most of you can't bear to run another freakin' Shroud or Hound but I still have fun in there. It's a lot easier to not be jaded when you're not dying for new content.

[Timjc86]

I form my expectations based on two things:

1) Industry standards: $15 a month in any other MMO gets you regular content updates. This includes previous and current games (other than DDO) run by Turbine. To be paying the same price for significantly less content begs certain questions.

2) Hype built up directly by Turbine: this would be a totally different issue if they just told us not to expect any content updates for a year. But when they vocally advertise content updates with a specific time frame and then delay in days prior to release... that's just bad form.


Your $15/mo gets you a month's worth of playing DDO. Period.

Unfortunately, I'm sure this is exactly how the license agreements define Turbine's obligations, which is why nobody's going to talk with their lawyer.


I agree that Turbine's marketing tactics are shady and underhanded. I am convinced that some (maybe not all, but some) of the delays and promises and vague statements were made solely to squeeze another few subscription weeks out of any players that were waivering.

This is what it boils down to for me. Turbine hasn't done anything illegal, but they've certain done things that are unethical. I have no legal claim to however many $15 monthly subscriptions I feel Turbine has wasted, but I definitely feel like I have been mislead, devalued, and mistreated as a customer. That's also part of what makes this so frustrating: I have no recourse. Except to leave. (And to b**** and moan here until my sub's up.)

I enjoy DDO, but I don't enjoy dealing with Turbine. The former has been enjoyable enough to put up with the latter for a long time, but that is quickly changing.

[wolfy42]

It should be mentioned that not everyone actually plays DDO even when they do have a subscription. I have probably paid for 4+ months at least by now where I didn't even log into DDO once the entire month....while I waited for new content to be added.

I know I'm not the only one who has done that either....especially in the recent past.....so then it's not 15$ a month to pay for a game you are currently using...but it's $15 a month to wait for a release you have been promised soon (so you keep your account active) but that never arrives. Perhaps what should happen is VIP's should get 30 days of play per $15.....and if you don't play for a full 24 hour period it doesn't count as a day.

If you log on at any time during a day....then you lose 1 day from your 30.

That would have saved me over $100 a least over the years.

I think $15 a month is a GREAT deal for DDO when you are actually playing it though. I do think that we are entitled to new content though....otherwise there is nothing left to do and we would just stop playing. If we are promised new content (which we are) then we are entitled to it for the money we play.

How many of you would still be playing DDO if all that was available was what was released 3 1/2 year ago?