Critique my Hassassin build please

[Cairo]

I know it's nothing special that hasn't been seen before, but I always like to build my own, rather than make a carbon copy of someone else's exactly. Alternately, Take 2 from Cha and Add to Str, drop OTWF and pick up PA.


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Roguey
Level 16 Lawful Good Halfling Male
(16 Rogue)
Hit Points: 170
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 12\12\17\22
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 19
Will: 5

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Strength 12 12 12
Dexterity 18 22 27
Constitution 12 12 12
Intelligence 14 14 14
Wisdom 8 8 8
Charisma 14 14 14

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Balance 4 8 8
Bluff 2 12 18
Concentration 1 1 1
Diplomacy 6 21 21
Disable Device 6 21 21
Haggle 6 21 21
Heal -1 -1 -1
Hide 4 27 37
Intimidate 2 2 2
Jump 5 6 8
Listen 2 2 4
Move Silently 8 27 37
Open Lock 8 27 27
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair 2 2 2
Search 6 21 21
Spot 3 18 18
Swim 1 1 1
Tumble 5 9 9
Use Magic Device 6 21 21

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Halfling Agility
Feat: (Automatic) Halfling Bravery
Feat: (Automatic) Halfling Keen Ears
Feat: (Automatic) Halfling Luck
Feat: (Automatic) Halfling Size Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Heroic Durability
Feat: (Automatic) Light Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Rapier
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortsword
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortbow
Feat: (Automatic) Simple Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Trapfinding
Feat: (Automatic) Trip


Level 2 (Rogue)
Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Evasion


Level 3 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse
Feat: (Automatic) Trap Sense


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Automatic) Uncanny Dodge


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 7 (Rogue)


Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Uncanny Dodge


Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Rogue)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion


Level 11 (Rogue)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 13 (Rogue)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Slippery Mind


Level 14 (Rogue)


Level 15 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 16 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Cripling Strike
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning III
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile III
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabber I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabber II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III
Enhancement: Way of the Assassin I
Enhancement: Way of the Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Hide I
Enhancement: Rogue Hide II
Enhancement: Rogue Move Silently I
Enhancement: Rogue Move Silently II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III

[Absolute-Omniscience]

Way too high charisma and too low str. I would drop cha to 8, and up the strenght and con. Upgrading cha just for UMD is a total waste, especially on a rogue that will be able to scroll heal on a 2 anyways with gear.

Drop OTWF and Toughness and pick up GTWF and PA.

Enhancements are bad, very bad. You're not taking the best enhancement in the game; haste boost. Take it to at least third rank. I would consider dropping last rank 2 ranks of rogue dex as well.

I feel like you're totally ignoring the dps potentail of rogues. You're crippling their best feature and replacing it with nothing worth mentioning.

PS: If you find that you get too few replies, try posting it in a readable format, most forum users and "build-helpers" hate the char-gene layout. Including me.

[Cairo]

Way too high charisma and too low str. I would drop cha to 8, and up the strenght and con. Upgrading cha just for UMD is a total waste, especially on a rogue that will be able to scroll heal on a 2 anyways with gear.

Drop OTWF and Toughness and pick up GTWF and PA.

Enhancements are bad, very bad. You're not taking the best enhancement in the game; haste boost. Take it to at least third rank. I would consider dropping last rank 2 ranks of rogue dex as well.

I feel like you're totally ignoring the dps potentail of rogues. You're crippling their best feature and replacing it with nothing worth mentioning.

PS: If you find that you get too few replies, try posting it in a readable format, most forum users and "build-helpers" hate the char-gene layout. Including me.

Thanks for the reply. Havent made a rogue before, so I appreciate tips. I'd like to hear the reasons behind the tips, so I can understand the build advice better.

I was going for the higher Cha for UMD, thinking ahead to 17-20 and what UMD reqs will be there in those levels, especially since you can't pre-buff UMD in mod9, you need a natural UMD to wear items while switching weapons.

You reco to drop Toughness and pump Con.. why? Wouldnt I get more hp from Toughness & Racial Enhances than I would from 1 more point of Con bonus?

The more i look at the build, the more I agree changing from OTWF to GTWF, and I suppose I could always grab Toughness at 18.

What about start Dex with 17, which would give me a 30+ final dex with a +6 item, not including possible shroud bonuses at all. Then I could drop 2 points from Cha and boost Str to 14.


For enhancements: Drop Halfling Dex 2 & Rogue Dex 3, grab Rogue Haste Boost 3 & Sneak Attack Training 4?

[Absolute-Omniscience]

Thanks for the reply. Havent made a rogue before, so I appreciate tips. I'd like to hear the reasons behind the tips, so I can understand the build advice better.
Alright, I'll explain my advice as best as I can.



I was going for the higher Cha for UMD, thinking ahead to 17-20 and what UMD reqs will be there in those levels, especially since you can't pre-buff UMD in mod9, you need a natural UMD to wear items while switching weapons.

You reco to drop Toughness and pump Con.. why? Wouldnt I get more hp from Toughness & Racial Enhances than I would from 1 more point of Con bonus?

The more i look at the build, the more I agree changing from OTWF to GTWF, and I suppose I could always grab Toughness at 18.

What about start Dex with 17, which would give me a 30+ final dex with a +6 item, not including possible shroud bonuses at all. Then I could drop 2 points from Cha and boost Str to 14.


For enhancements: Drop Halfling Dex 2 & Rogue Dex 3, grab Rogue Haste Boost 3 & Sneak Attack Training 4?

I understand your reasonings behind going high cha, but bumping a stat for a sole skill has never been really good. And wont be really good even with the UMD change. The thing is, you will have very high umd as a rogue, no problems hitting 22 for all the items, I can tell you that. The changes in mod 9 is only that you must be able to maintain the UMD required, eg now you can equip and then drop the UMD and still have it equipped. While in mod 9, you can still run around with GH for +4, and wear em; but if the GH drops they'll unequip. Though that wont really be a problem, I think we can say that GH can be reliably maintainable at the current cap, even easier at mod 9 when the casters get more level 6 spell slots.
And as I said above, even unbuffed you're UMD will be at 23 without any items what so ever, and only 10 cha (8base+2tome). Throw in +6 cha item and buffs and you're sitting at ~30 without any UMD item.

Regarding toughness, I really think that's a feat for mod 9, as you can use minos legend in mod 8. As soon as mod 9 hits, and you hit 18'th level, you can pick it up; or you could go with OTWF at 18.

You could go something like:
13
17
16
14
8
8
Will give you high enough int for Assassinate, I take it that's what you are after. And good enough str on a halfling dex based build. The con will give you 2 more modifiers equalling 40 more hitpoints at level 20, that's equalent to toughness feat and 2 enhancements.

Those enhancements changes looks solid to me, try to obtain suble backstabber IV for mod 9 though, if not sooner. You will easily pull aggro with only 2 enhancements, believe me.