Where to put the skill points?

[Blind_Skwerl]

I am building a 14/2 rogue/monk starting with 14 int and then reading a +2 int tome at level 1. Will be an acrobat 1/4staff speed junkie, ala Big F'n Stick/Preying Mantis build. Where would you folks put the skill points? Balance at all? Spot at all? How much tumble is too much? Not bothering with haggle, I got a character for that.

[MysticRhythms]

Splashing skills seems inefficient. I would think you would do your best to maximize whatever you are trying to do.

Balance
Concentration
Disable Device
Jump
Open Lock
Search
Tumble
Use Magic Device

Next tier:

Diplomacy
Spot

And then if anything left ...
Hide
Move Silently

[Blind_Skwerl]

concentration? Why?

Max balance on an Acrobat build?

[MysticRhythms]

concentration? Why?

Max balance on an Acrobat build?

Concentration for your Monk ki if that matters to you.

Maximum balance isn't needed if you're going for Tier II, so move it down to the bototm of the list.

[KingOfCheese]

Assuming you don't have enough points to go around--it is often times best to max certain skills and do incomplete ranks in others.

I think the following benefit from being maxed: search, disable, balance, UMD, diplo

The following can be partial ranks (for the following listed reasons):

Jump-might want to max-but if you are looking to hit 40 jump with the spell cast on you, you only need partial ranks (and not that many depending on your STR bonus)

Open Lock--most relevant locks in the game aren't challenging. You can get by with proper gear and only a few ranks and hit every major lock. If you have points to spare--max this--just in case new, more challenging lock come in the future (rogues will be expected to hit these). But, this one can be sacrificed.

Tumble--if you are dex-based, you will obtain a great tumble ability without going max ranks

Hide/Move Silently--both can get up in the very effective range without taking full ranks. If you have ranks to spare--max these--but partial ranks will give you enough to sneak by nearly everything.

Keep in mind that you are going to have boosts to all of these while you level up and certainly at end game: GH +4, head of good fortune +2, stat modifiers (int/dex/str--may be substantial), shroud crafted items (up to +6), gear (+15; except for UMD--+5 or +3), boosts, etc. For some skills you will be adding 30-40+ bonuses on top of your ranks by level 16. Considering that a 40+ skill is sufficient for most tasks at end game--it is easy to be effective with partial ranks.

[MysticRhythms]

With a 16 Intelligence and so many rogue levels, there will be so many skill points to spread that you may as well max out the ones mentioned by KingOfCheese. What else will you spend it on anyway? Swim, maybe?

[KingOfCheese]

I forgot spot.

This is a controversial one. If you have ranks available--max it out. But this is one that you can entirely live without if you are willing to learn where traps are the hard way--and then you know where they are every time in the future. In the future, we may get quests with random traps--making this skill more important. I know a lot of people don't invest ranks here. One of the side reasons for this, is that many people have WIS as a dump stat. Because of this, even with full ranks, the spot is marginal during early levels--and people get used to living without it. Thus, when they are higher levels, they don't care to have it because they rarely or never used it earlier. With monk levels, this probably isn't the case for you since you will probably have some starting WIS and will build up your WIS. I have ranks on my rogue and like having it (with Tharnes goggles +15 it is very effective), but ran for a long time without it and didn't really miss it.

[Leyoni]

I am building a 14/2 rogue/monk starting with 14 int and then reading a +2 int tome at level 1.

14 INT is 40 skill points at L1. Eating a +2 tome gives you 11 skill points at L2+.

You can effectively keep 10 skills maxed out and then play catch-up on the 11th. Or, you can pick 11 skills that matter to you and start 2 of them at 2 points (always staying 2 skill points behind the rest of your skills from L2 on).

Disable Device -- Obvious
Search -- Can't find it, can't disable it
UMD -- I use to not favor this skill but have come around to the light
Diplomacy -- Hit hard enough and you will draw aggro, aggro is not your friend, diplo is
Hide -- One half of the sneak combo
Move Silently -- The other half of the sneak combo, you can do amazing things rescuing folks from near party wipes just by being able to recover soul stones, worth it for that reason alone
Spot -- Not in top few skills but if you have points it is handy nonetheless
Open Locks -- Like spot but with 14 or 16 INT should always be kept up
Tumble -- If you are twitchy it is a good skill
Bluff -- Probably towards the top in some lists, not as useful as diplo IMO
Listen -- Not usually recommended but useful combined with Spot

If I had 11 skill points per level these would be the ones I focused on. This assumes you are going Acrobat so balance isn't required. If you do not go Acrobat then balance moves ahead of bluff, IMO, and listen drops off the list.

Last thing, you will only have 7 skill points (not 11) when you take your monk levels. If in doubt about where to use the skill points, start with the ones that are not cross-class and then fill up the other ranks starting from the top of the list when you take your next rogue levels.

[Emili]

If you slide a point anywhere for full ranks I'd say OL because 1 or 2 points down and it being a D20 roll you'd never know the difference... always max concentrate on a monk... UMD, DD, Search and Spot on a rogue, OL and Diplo the next tier imo... then the other skills for flavor.

[Blind_Skwerl]

this guy is only 2 monk levels, for the attack speed boost with staffs. Still need concentrate for that?

[MysticRhythms]

"need?" No.

But it still generates ki and what else are you really going to spend so many skill points on? You will seriously have a ton of them.

What race? I'm assuming Halfling.

[Blind_Skwerl]

yeah he's halfling. Funny thing about skill points: they are like cash. No matter how much you have, you wish you had more.

[Leyoni]

this guy is only 2 monk levels, for the attack speed boost with staffs. Still need concentrate for that?

For building Ki. OTOH, what will he do with the Ki once he has it? It certainly could go in my list of skills replacing listen. But, it would be one of the skills that drops behind the others in total levels, IMO.

[Inspire]

Leyoni's list is sound.

Dont invest in Concentration, you will have plenty of Ki for your 1d6 elemental attacks anyways.

I personally swear by Hide and Move Silently, the only thing I wouldnt invest my skill points into is Listen... you dont need Listen and Spot, and spot gives you the heads up about traps. You will still overcome most mobs Hide check and spot them anyways, dont worry about their Move Silently(your Listen check).

Intimidate is also highly useful.

[Blind_Skwerl]

The creator, Phenx, did say he kind of wanted intimidate for trash mobs. Going 0 on the concentrate. The balance is my biggest question. Obviously it would be helpful early, but what about after acrobat 2?

[Draccus]

My thoughs:

Maximize:
Spot - Random traps exist and I expect them to be used more often.
Search - You can't disable it if you can't find it and elite traps have high DCs.
DD - Obvious
Jump - Too useful to not max
Hide - If you are an assassin OR like to stealth solo quests, max it out. FWIW, elite drow in Monastery will spot you with a 40ish Hide/MS
Move Silently - see above
UMD - Obvious

High
Tumble - Fastest way to get out of trouble
Diplomacy - lifesaver skill and exponentially better than bluff
Balance - Not sure how helpful it is since I bounce back up after being knocked down and have zero ranks (but can hit 39 balance easily with items and dex). I will start adding it at level 17.
OL - Not a big deal but I don't like to carry an OL item so I just max the skill

Ignore all others.

But here's the easy part. The "max" list only contains 7 skills. The High list contains 4 skills. So a rogue with 16 int (14 + tome) can max ALL the useful skills in the game. There's no decision to make, really. Bluff is a joke and swim can be ignored (except MAYBE in the Abbot...wear an item). I wouldn't even consider conc, haggle, listen or intimidate unless you've got some strange splash build.