Calling all Rogues!!

[Gladiator_206]

Hey, ive been looking for a new build, but nothing on the forums ever seem to suite what im looking for. I figured id go rogue, just for a change of pace. I chose dwarf for the con, style, and espicially the dragonmark cause id thought it would be awesome to have a rogue that not only disables traps but sets them 2. I went Theif-Acrobat cause i didn't want a rogue like everyone else - dual weilding raipers. (sorry if that affends anyone, not ment to be rude). The enhancements were just a quick choice, more than willing to change any/all. Nothing is set in stone in this build, so feel free to offer up any info you think is usful. Im no expert at rogue, actually this will be my first try so:
1) is the disable device, spot, Open Lock, and search high enough for end game stuff? (if not, how much higher?)
2) a friend said go diplo, cause ill be squishy, is the diplo high enough to be efective?
3) which rogue specific feats should i be taking?
4) I am able to get plus 6 stat items no prob, some plus one tomes, and maybe 1-2 plus 2's, that said, will this build be viable at end game or just a waste of my playing time?
5) was the starting stats good choices or bad? (have 32 point builds)
6) is the umd even high enough to use anything?

Anyways here is what i am currently looking at:



Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.00
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Volug Tantalus
Level 16 Chaotic Good Dwarf Male
(16 Rogue)
Hit Points: 180
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 12\12\17\22
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 14
Will: 4

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Strength 16 20 20
Dexterity 14 15 18
Constitution 16 16 18
Intelligence 15 16 16
Wisdom 8 8 8
Charisma 8 8 8

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 1
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 10

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Balance 2 4 16
Bluff -1 -1 -1
Concentration 3 4 4
Diplomacy 3 18 18
Disable Device 7 22 26
Haggle 3 18 18
Heal -1 -1 -1
Hide 6 23 23
Intimidate -1 -1 -1
Jump 3 20 26
Listen -1 -1 -1
Move Silently 6 23 23
Open Lock 6 23 23
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair 3 3 3
Search 7 22 26
Spot 3 18 20
Swim 3 5 5
Tumble 6 23 31
Use Magic Device 3 18 18

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Warding
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Balance I


Level 2 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Tumble I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I


Level 3 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Spot I


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Balance II


Level 5 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabber I
Enhancement: Rogue Tumble II


Level 6 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Warding
Enhancement: Way of the Thief-Acrobat I


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device II


Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II


Level 9 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Warding


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Cripling Strike
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III


Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II


Level 12 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Way of the Thief-Acrobat II
Enhancement: Rogue Spot II


Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device III


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabber II


Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device IV


Level 16 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Slippery Mind
Enhancement: Rogue Item Defense I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III




Also, any tips on how to play a rogue are appriciated :)

[Aeneas]

The dragonmarks are garbage and do next to nothing.

The only other advice i'll give you is to build your rogue to whatever playstyle you enjoy, they are the most customizable of all the classes. So, pick a couple things you'd really like to excel at, and slightly skew your ability points towards them, but DO NOT min max your ability points at creation.

[Hasteclicky]

I'm always an advocate of the play what you want philosophy. If you are set on the dragonmarks for flavor then you don't have room for the twf chain to dual wield rapiers like you wanted. Your best bet then will be to use Qstaves with acrobat till you level him up and see if your dead set on keeping the marks. You won't want to twf on him anyways till around lvl 9. Just try to grind out a dex tome eventually.
Second dodge isn't gonna benefit you all that much, your ac will be mediocre at best. Try to fit toughness in to benefit from the dwarf racial enhancements.
With some gear grinding your skills, umd included, will be fine.

[kamimitsu]

but DO NOT min max your ability points at creation.

Unless you are VERY sure of what you want to accomplish (and even then, perhaps) this is very good advice.

[Aranticus]

Hey, ive been looking for a new build, but nothing on the forums ever seem to suite what im looking for. I figured id go rogue, just for a change of pace. I chose dwarf for the con, style, and espicially the dragonmark cause id thought it would be awesome to have a rogue that not only disables traps but sets them 2.

ditch the dragonmarks. on paper it sounds cool but in practice, few if not none pulls the mobs back to the traps. it might work if you are soloing thou. also note that in general, you can kill mobs quite fast so actually dragging them to traps may take time. some mobs are also tethered to a spawn point which means they cannot follow you

I went Theif-Acrobat cause i didn't want a rogue like everyone else - dual weilding raipers. (sorry if that affends anyone, not ment to be rude).

no offense taken, acrobat is a good enhancement. the knockdown immunity saved my cleric's ass a few times

The enhancements were just a quick choice, more than willing to change any/all. Nothing is set in stone in this build, so feel free to offer up any info you think is usful. Im no expert at rogue, actually this will be my first try so:
1) is the disable device, spot, Open Lock, and search high enough for end game stuff? (if not, how much higher?)

as long as you max them out, you be fine. only 2 traps in this game have insane DC but they hardly spoil your fun

2) a friend said go diplo, cause ill be squishy, is the diplo high enough to be efective?

diplo is good. the reason you want it is to be able to deflect the attention to someone else and get maximum SA. as for squishiness, dwarves are hardly squishy

3) which rogue specific feats should i be taking?

on my rog, its all offense feats. did not take rogue feats.... the bonus is too small

4) I am able to get plus 6 stat items no prob, some plus one tomes, and maybe 1-2 plus 2's, that said, will this build be viable at end game or just a waste of my playing time?
5) was the starting stats good choices or bad? (have 32 point builds)

not a bad stat distribution, my advice is to drop the DMs, and load up with thf feats for glancing damage. dodge doesnt serve your build alot so maybe ironwill to boost your will saves

6) is the umd even high enough to use anything?

as long as you max it out, it will not be a problem. my L16 pure fight can even heal himself with heal scrolls (abeit at 40% success rate, csw wands are no problem)

see red

[Noctus]

3) which rogue specific feats should i be taking?

None.
If you have a halfway decent INT (12+), you simple dont need them. Dont waste your precious feats on something which you just dont need.



4) I am able to get plus 6 stat items no prob, some plus one tomes, and maybe 1-2 plus 2's, that said, will this build be viable at end game or just a waste of my playing time?

Viable.
TWF is better than Quarterstaff swinging, but not that far behind. On rogues the difference in player skill has a much bigger impact than the choice of dual-rapier versus Quarterstaff.



5) was the starting stats good choices or bad? (have 32 point builds)

They are fine.




on the rogue´s skills in general:
If you put max ranks into them you will be fine. (UMD, spot, search, disable, open lock)

[Psyk0sisS]

If you're goin Acrobat, you'll want a decent STR cause you're gonna be using Qtr Staffs (or should be for the speed atk), and I'd take some of the 2HF feats. Of course you'll need INT and DEX for your rogue skills and AC/Reflex. Good luck, Acrobat is fun...especially when you get Acrobat II + Haste + Haste Boost...OMG its fast!

My math may be wrong, but I count a 22 UMD. You'll be able to do Cure Light wands no fail...+6 CHA will get you to 25 UMD. +4 from Skill boost = 32. Add +3 for the Necklace and you just need to roll >4 to get a Heal off. The boost points kinda suck when you only have 5 boosts. So I'd say your UMD isn't terrible, you can use any gear you want, raise dead, restore, and occasionally pop a heal. You may get frustrated with trying to use Heal, but that's about it. (I think my math is right)

EDIT: Just a side not, I (personally) dont spend too much in SPOT. It's my dump skill after the other rogue skills, UMD, Haggle, and Dip. Unless you're on Elite and have a terrible reflex, you should be fine on "finding" traps without spotting them. I put some in just to see the mobs that are hiding, but I dont max it. NOTE..this is just my opinion, take it for what its worth :)

[CSFurious]

for rogues is halfling

[drachine]

in my opinion there are two or three ways to build your rogue

if you are concerned about AC you can go acrobat and make a dex build. This requires the feat Weapon Finesse and you will not deal as much base damage as a strength build

if you go trapmonkey they are mostly concerned with intelligence and dexterity to traverse traps

and assassins tend to be more DPS driven builds and in my opinion if you want DPS, strength is the way to go, but you AC will not be as high. intelligence is somewhat important as well for assassinate

all my toons are strength based assassins and it is a very strong choice. at higher level once you attain crippling strike, deception and blinding weapons your opponents willl have a harder time hitting you anyway. also there are ways in the game to turn being hit into an advantage

in my opinion too many people who build rogues automatically choose dex as their base high skill without giving it much thought. i think it is a more expensive way to go for the following reasons:

you have to take weapon finesse so you are down a feat already in a class with few feats
also strength based rogues effectively gain a feat because they can more effectively use the given feat Trip
also being strength based means when your Strength increases, this increases your To Hit AND Damage, when your Dex goes up this increases your To Hit AND Armor Class

its a lot to think about and you have to decide what is important to you and build accordingly