Good non mana solo character?

[Clatters]

Hey there!

I was wondering what you would reccomend a new player to play with, whilst keeping the following in mind:

I dont really want to be a mana user, at least not on my offensive part anyways. I did try a battle cleric but the class just didnt wow me.

I dont want to take much damage, as being a player from england much of my time will be spent solo questing, however i do also want to put some good damage out. I just brought 100 pots and it pretty much wiped me out money wise :P sooo i kinda want them to last as long as i can.

I do love the barb class, especially with a 2 hander, but i seem to take a fair bit of damage, does fighter take less damage?

Another class i have tried is the monk, who seems to have a higher AC, yet takes just as much damage (maybe something im doing wrong).

I havnt really tried a melee ranger yet, how are they?

Any ideas and general advice would be fantastic.

Thankyou.

[Noctus]

I do love the barb class, especially with a 2 hander, but i seem to take a fair bit of damage, does fighter take less damage?

Barbarians are all offensive, no defence, need personal healer.
Fighters can have a defence to speak off, but still not suited to soloing very much.


Paladin and Ranger are good soloing classes if you dont like a battlecleric. their spells are buffing, and not essential to the combat capabilities of the class. You will still be deadly without mana.


Paladins have good self-recovery and self healing, while Rangers are more offensive oriented. But most important: Both can use healing wands so you dont need to buy the more expensive Pots.




Another class i have tried is the monk, who seems to have a higher AC, yet takes just as much damage (maybe something im doing wrong).

Monks are hard to play, hard to equip, twinking needy, and need every stat besieds CHA (so only a viable class choice for those with a bunch of +2 tomes and PB32).
I wouldnt really recommend it to somone interested in good solo capabilities and who is new to the game.

[Clatters]

Thankyou for the advice so far, so a paladin sounds like a good character to try next then.

Do you have any advice on a build?

Was just looking through and it seems paladins need a lot of stats to be quite high :(

[Canopenner]

Thankyou for the advice so far, so a paladin sounds like a good character to try next then.

Do you have any advice on a build?

Was just looking through and it seems paladins need a lot of stats to be quite high :(

very very true.. my paladin has pretty much all stats in the 14-28 range at level10.. however paladins are worth it, very high ac very high saves lay on hands smite evil self buffs.. my pally is a soloing machine (except not wf she's drow)

[Noctus]

This is one of the fine templated which Aranticus created for new players.

Its a good build which will work fine without twinking, eaten tomes and does not require previous unlocking of favor rewards. Simply a solid build which will be suited to your preferences.


http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=1718366&postcount=10



Use Sword&Board when soloing, and a big 2hander when in groups or when you need to kill some monsters, like spellcasters, asap.

[Yajerman01]

Thankyou for the advice so far, so a paladin sounds like a good character to try next then.

Do you have any advice on a build?

Was just looking through and it seems paladins need a lot of stats to be quite high :(


are you a 28 pt build or 32? I pressume a 28pt, if so then Pally is the way to go. If 32, then you can try multiclssing. I have a 11/3/2 Fighter/pally/monk halfling with all the dragon marks and he hits good has great saves and ac and with the dragon marks lined out has around 1750hp in heals (no mana bar).

[Anyria]

The Exploiter (you should be able to find many posts about it)

1 level rouge
1 level monk (taken later on)
rest Ranger

You have rouge abilities, High AC, buffing, good damage, two weapon fighting feats for free, etc etc

You rarely get hit and can put out alot of damage.

whatever you decide, have fun!

[Yajerman01]

The Exploiter (you should be able to find many posts about it)

1 level rouge
1 level monk (taken later on)
rest Ranger

You have rouge abilities, High AC, buffing, good damage, two weapon fighting feats for free, etc etc

You rarely get hit and can put out alot of damage.

whatever you decide, have fun!

Thats a great build and I would have suggested that as well but he mentioned he did not want a mana bar using charcter, thats why i tossed out my alternative.

[Anyria]

Hey there!

I dont really want to be a mana user, at least not on my offensive part anyways.

It seemed as though he didn't mind having mana as a buff or small healing. That's why I went the way I did.

[alcmaeon]

I fully understand that you are asking for a solo build and that being from England your play times will not be the same as US/Canada, Aussie/Kiwi or Chinese play times. But I bet you can find some guild who is active when you are. look on the "who" list and sort by guild. That will show you which guilds are often on when you are. Than try them out. Without resources soloing can be very hard to do. WITH resources you can solo any class.

Life will be easier in a guild than out in the cold hard reaches of Eberron, until you have resources that is.

[Thrudh]

Rangers and paladins can use cure wands which are cheaper than potions (and you can use them on team members, which is nice)

All you need is one level of ranger or paladin to be able to use wands (the various wands are character level dependent... i.e. you can't use cure moderate wands until level 3 I think)

Another option is to be a halfling and take the halfling dragonmark feats. Those let you heal yourself and others (limited uses). They can be quite powerful when you get the third rank...

For a new player, I'd probably recommend a ranger... Good fighting power, easy to play, use wands to heal yourself... You do get spells later on, but they are just buffing spells. You cast a couple of spells on yourself when you enter the quest, and then you just use a weapon from then on...

[Clatters]

Thankyou for all the replies.

I decided to make a paladin before i left for work tonight.

So far level 2 and going strong :P

Does that exploiter build take less damage than a pally, as your right, without resources its a bit on the steep side healing myself.

Using a light wound healing wand at the moment that i found, saves on using the pots :)

And yes, i dont mind mana, as long as its only for buffing before a quest.

[Clatters]

Forgot to mention the stats on the pally that i made, was almost similar to the build that was linked.

Dwarf

17 str
10 dex (took 10 as i didnt like the look of the -1 ac penalty, my aim is not to take too much damage :) )
15 con
8 int
11 wis
11 cha

Kinda realised i didnt have enough cha to cast lay on hands when i got it so i took +1 cha with 2 action points and it seemed fine from then on.

Took Two handed fighting as my first feat, dont know whether to go with toughness for the next one or get Improved weapon: slashing.

Going to bump my str up when i finally get some stat level ups.

[The_Phenx]

Anything halfling...the dragonmarks make all things solo capable...

Have a dragonmarked halfy fighter, and can solo anything in game without an air elemental...lol

[Braegan]

Hey there!

I was wondering what you would reccomend a new player to play with, whilst keeping the following in mind:

I dont really want to be a mana user, at least not on my offensive part anyways. I did try a battle cleric but the class just didnt wow me.

I dont want to take much damage, as being a player from england much of my time will be spent solo questing, however i do also want to put some good damage out. I just brought 100 pots and it pretty much wiped me out money wise :P sooo i kinda want them to last as long as i can.

I do love the barb class, especially with a 2 hander, but i seem to take a fair bit of damage, does fighter take less damage?

Another class i have tried is the monk, who seems to have a higher AC, yet takes just as much damage (maybe something im doing wrong).

I havnt really tried a melee ranger yet, how are they?

Any ideas and general advice would be fantastic.

Thankyou.


I read further and saw you settled on the Paladin. I would recommend for a 28pt a str-based pure ranger. The exploiter build, most paladin builds, monk splashes require those extra 4 points or you will be lacking come end game. And really those builds cannot really suffer the lose of -2 to any stat. Not to mention alot of those are ac builds and thus hard to equip/require lots of grinding - also not something I would recommend to a newer player without explaining that you will be gimp unless you get some very specific raid loot.

For a ranger I would go human or dwarf. Stat importance: Str, Con, Dex, Wis. Put all your level ups into str and you have a rock solid build welcome on most any raid that's very easy to equip. Welcome to DDO!

[baddax]

Might i suggest this build?
I am currently leveling a similar more advanced build but am loving it Immensley!


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 Lawful Good Drow Male
(14 Paladin \ 2 Monk)
Hit Points: 224
Spell Points: 191
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 18
Will: 14

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Stats Modified Stats
Abilities (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 12 14
Dexterity 16 23
Constitution 10 10
Intelligence 12 13
Wisdom 14 15
Charisma 16 20

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 1
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 1
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 1
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 1
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 7 11
Bluff 3 5
Concentration 0 0
Diplomacy 3 24
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 3 5
Heal 2 2
Hide 7 13
Intimidate 3 5
Jump 1 2
Listen 2 5
Move Silently 7 12.5
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 1 1
Search 1 3
Spot 2 4
Swim 1 2
Tumble 7 12
Use Magic Device 5 14.5

Notable Equipment
Helm: Charismatic Bandanna of
Ring: Dextrous Ring of
Ring: Ogre Power Ring of
Necklace: Wise Necklace of
Belt: Health Belt of

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Weapon Finesse


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise


Level 4 (Paladin)


Level 5 (Paladin)


Level 6 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 7 (Paladin)


Level 8 (Paladin)


Level 9 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Paladin)


Level 11 (Paladin)


Level 12 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 13 (Paladin)


Level 14 (Paladin)


Level 15 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Divine Might I
Enhancement: Divine Might II
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack II
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good III
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Righteousness I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite I
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite II
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite III
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma II
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma III
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II




Although not technically the same build, similar principals and have had much success soloing up to to level 8 atm

[Clatters]

Do you have a link to this exploiter build i keep reading about :)

Can rangers use wands from level 1?

I know people say that they splash, but what level do they splash at?

Eg ranger 1-4 then <insert class> at level 5.

Getting a bit overwhelmed here, sorry :P

[Braegan]

Might i suggest this build?
I am currently leveling a similar more advanced build but am loving it Immensley!


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 Lawful Good Drow Male
(14 Paladin \ 2 Monk)
Hit Points: 224
Spell Points: 191
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 18
Will: 14

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Stats Modified Stats
Abilities (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 12 14
Dexterity 16 23
Constitution 10 10
Intelligence 12 13
Wisdom 14 15
Charisma 16 20

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 1
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 1
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 1
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 1
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 7 11
Bluff 3 5
Concentration 0 0
Diplomacy 3 24
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 3 5
Heal 2 2
Hide 7 13
Intimidate 3 5
Jump 1 2
Listen 2 5
Move Silently 7 12.5
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 1 1
Search 1 3
Spot 2 4
Swim 1 2
Tumble 7 12
Use Magic Device 5 14.5

Notable Equipment
Helm: Charismatic Bandanna of
Ring: Dextrous Ring of
Ring: Ogre Power Ring of
Necklace: Wise Necklace of
Belt: Health Belt of

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Weapon Finesse


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise


Level 4 (Paladin)


Level 5 (Paladin)


Level 6 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 7 (Paladin)


Level 8 (Paladin)


Level 9 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Paladin)


Level 11 (Paladin)


Level 12 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 13 (Paladin)


Level 14 (Paladin)


Level 15 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Divine Might I
Enhancement: Divine Might II
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack II
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good III
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Righteousness I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite I
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite II
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite III
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma II
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma III
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II




Although not technically the same build, similar principals and have had much success soloing up to to level 8 atm

Too spread out. Just glimpsing at it I can see you won't achieve an "untouchable" ac and with a starting con of 10 it will take one failed save (everyone rolls ones) or one hit to put you under.

[baddax]

Too spread out. Just glimpsing at it I can see you won't achieve an "untouchable" ac and with a starting con of 10 it will take one failed save (everyone rolls ones) or one hit to put you under.


My similar character is level 8 and i have not had any problems soloing content up to this point.

Last night i solo'd Tamming the Flames on normal with no problems. granted this was not elite but with just house p buffs,l level 7 quest and being level 8. I was still very satisfied by its overall performance.

Lastly being a palidin you will have plenty of in battle/ healing on the fly for a paladin build.

[Clatters]

So is staying with the build that i posted above a good idea, or should i go with a ranger?

I do only have 28 pts.

I dont want to level the pally too far just to realise i could be taking less dmg as ranger whilst still being able to wand heal.

Wasnt there a class that couldnt use wands until level 4, remember seeing that on some wand, but couldnt remember which class it applied to.

[Thanimal]

Some things for the OP to keep in mind:

Soloing really requires top-notch equipment. This can make a night-and-day difference. For example, if you are going pure Paladin and not Warforged, then you need some +2 Full Plate ASAP. This is dirt cheap junk to a long-time player, and will HUGELY increase your AC, but may not be easy for you to afford as a newbie soloer, so two good options are:

1) Join a guild.
2) Tell us what server and character name and beg for a donation. Seriously. Most veterans desparately want to get new players involved in the game. 100,000 gold is chump change to some and will completely change what your character can do at low levels.

If you desparately want to do everything on your own, use the Auction House. Shouldn't pay more than 2,000 gp for +2 Full Plate if even a little patient. If you sell all the junk you get, it shouldn't take too long to save that up.

Others things you want for soloing include the +1 Protection Ring offered at the end of The Collaborator, the +5 HP belt offered from one of the Korthos quests, the "Anger" set offered by the combination of the Mayor's quests and Misery's Peak, and the +1 to-hit Googles offered by that Halfling's quest on Korthos -- never remember that dude's name.

At low levels, shields are pretty awesome. +2 Heavy Shield will add a fairly massive 4 more points to your AC. See Auction House for one.

If going Paladin, make sure to immediately take the AC aura enhancements when they unlock at 3. Every point of AC is huge for soloing. You know you're ready for domination if your AC is equal to 16 + 3*(quest level) on Normal. So as a level 2 you'd love to see 22, which should be borderline trivial for a Paladin: 10 base + 1 Protection Ring + 1 aura + 10 armor [+2 Full Plate] + 1 dexterity + 4 sheild [+2 Heavy Shield] = 27. At that AC you can basically cruise the harbor soloing on Normal.

Also, if you have any odd stats, getting a +1 item for that stat is hugely beneficial. (Except maybe INT -- pretty useless stat on a Paladin.)

Good luck and have fun!!

[Club'in]

Use cleric hirelings for the longer quests. Way cheaper than pots.

Paladins, Rangers and Bards can use wands starting at level one. They can use lights at 1, medium at 3, and serious at 5. Bards are also able to use cure critical wands once they get up to level 7.

Many types of characters can use the UMD skill to allow them to use cure/repair wands.

Halfling dragon marks of healing are excellent for many types of characters.

Everything I've listed here is cheaper than buys pots.

[Clatters]

Well if anyone feels generous, my paladins name is Clatters and im on Thelanis (sp?) and would love a donation :P

I am enjoying the paladin, i think at level 2 i was on 19+2, tho cant be sure, at work at the moment.

The enchantments ive taken so far are:

Dwarf axe damage
Extra smite
Dwarf spell resist
10% +heal
+1 char (needed to take this as i only had 11 cha and need 12 to cast the spell)

[Clatters]

...and thanks for the info.

Ill go and check out the hirelings, might try and solo Water works with one.

Ive managed the island quests on hard solo at the moment, might be daring and try elite :P

Will try and save up for some +2 plate as well.

[Oreg]

Agree with post 22.

My 2 cents - Play wahatever class you enjoy. If barb that's fine. Just keep cleric hirelings in your pack always.

[QuantumFX]

Does that exploiter build take less damage than a pally, as your right, without resources its a bit on the steep side healing myself.

Clatters, you probably don’t realize this yet but that question is like pointing a firehose at your face and telling the guy turning the wrench “Let her rip man! I’m thirsty!” :D

The best ways I can think of to help diffuse your costs regardless of build:
- Double click on every collectible you can find and turn them in.
- Examine EVERY wand you find to see if you can use it. Paladin builds have better non-UMD wand usage but, in the long term, the Exploiter is better at the magic item usage game.
- Thinking about “Damage abatement” is much smarter than “Healing” in the long run. Armor Class, Damage Reduction, Energy Resistance, Saving throws, temporary hit points (via Aid, Virtue), killing stuff faster, etc… is much more effective (and fulfilling) than spamming a Cure Serious wand.

Now, back to your question about the Exploiter vs. a Paladin…
IMHO a paladin is a better first character to build. It’s more forgiving and can really teach you about the basics of DDO. At end game, both are very solid characters but have very different strengths.

[baddax]

Too spread out. Just glimpsing at it I can see you won't achieve an "untouchable" ac and with a starting con of 10 it will take one failed save (everyone rolls ones) or one hit to put you under.

My goal when building this character was/is 62AC (58 beholder proof) which IMO is the generally accepted Benchmark for current Self Buffed realistic and relevant end game AC.

Untouchable? No but geared out at level 16 projected Self buffed AC Via umd. projected Ac is 62. Untouchable no? but respectable yes. throw in boosts and such with raid buffs it will be much higher.


Projected en game Hp. will be above 300 with shroud gear. Also IMO the commonly accpted benchmarks for an Evasion/light Tank.

IMO hp Above accpeted benchmarks 450 heavy tank, 350 medium tank, 300 light tank or caster is a crutch for weak players. Dont get me wrong More HP is Always better just not at the trade off other skills and abilities. Too many players trade off skills and abilities for the extra hp which ends up hurting in the end.

[Braegan]

My similar character is level 8 and i have not had any problems soloing content up to this point.

Last night i solo'd Tamming the Flames on normal with no problems. granted this was not elite but with just house p buffs,l level 7 quest and being level 8. I was still very satisfied by its overall performance.

Lastly being a palidin you will have plenty of in battle/ healing on the fly for a paladin build.

Baddax, not knocking or flaming you, but I may have neglected in my above post the point where your posted build will start having real problems is around level 10. Unless your in a raiding guild that will carry you few some titans to get a chattering ring right at level 10 and you have chaos guards lying around and all the other ac gear once you get into gianthold your a liabilty. Your build is a mediocre ac/saves tank with no hp. I'm sorry but my honest opinion is re-roll now.

Clatters, and others, I don't dislike the other ideas given as well as pure paladin, but take into consideration no stockpiles of twink gear, new to game and unguilded the ranger is a better choice for ease. Easier to equip, less stats to worry about, less button mashing, the ranger is a better choice as it will allow for you to get to knowing the game while leveling a easy viable/survivable build. Also I'm on Thelanis as well, look up any of my alts in sig, current lowbie is Braegawumba (lvl 4).

[baddax]

Clatters, you probably don’t realize this yet but that question is like pointing a firehose at your face and telling the guy turning the wrench “Let her rip man! I’m thirsty!” :D

The best ways I can think of to help diffuse your costs regardless of build:
- Double click on every collectible you can find and turn them in.
- Examine EVERY wand you find to see if you can use it. Paladin builds have better non-UMD wand usage but, in the long term, the Exploiter is better at the magic item usage game.
- Thinking about “Damage abatement” is much smarter than “Healing” in the long run. Armor Class, Damage Reduction, Energy Resistance, Saving throws, temporary hit points (via Aid, Virtue), killing stuff faster, etc… is much more effective (and fulfilling) than spamming a Cure Serious wand.

Now, back to your question about the Exploiter vs. a Paladin…
IMHO a paladin is a better first character to build. It’s more forgiving and can really teach you about the basics of DDO. At end game, both are very solid characters but have very different strengths.

qft!:D

[Braegan]

My goal when building this character was/is 62AC (58 beholder proof) which IMO is the generally accepted Benchmark for current Self Buffed realistic and relevant end game AC.

Untouchable? No but geared out at level 16 projected Self buffed AC Via umd. projected Ac is 62. Untouchable no? but respectable yes. throw in boosts and such with raid buffs it will be much higher.


Projected en game Hp. will be above 300 with shroud gear. Also IMO the commonly accpted benchmarks for an Evasion/light Tank.

IMO hp Above accpeted benchmarks 450 heavy tank, 350 medium tank, 300 light tank or caster is a crutch for weak players. Dont get me wrong More HP is Always better just not at the trade off other skills and abilities. Too many players trade off skills and abilities for the extra hp which ends up hurting in the end.

The ac is just not enough for the hp, and I speak from experience. Malvian, TWF, self-buffed gets around a 58 ac. Many times I have rangers for real bark and pally auras and my ac is over 60 but below 65 twf. And I get hit a good deal. The only thing that saves me is having well over 400 hp. Again this isn't meant to flame you bro, but these are my findings and experiences.

[baddax]

Baddax, not knocking or flaming you, but I may have neglected in my above post the point where your posted build will start having real problems is around level 10. Unless your in a raiding guild that will carry you few some titans to get a chattering ring right at level 10 and you have chaos guards lying around and all the other ac gear once you get into gianthold your a liabilty. Your build is a mediocre ac/saves tank with no hp. I'm sorry but my honest opinion is re-roll now.

Clatters, and others, I don't dislike the other ideas given as well as pure paladin, but take into consideration no stockpiles of twink gear, new to game and unguilded the ranger is a better choice for ease. Easier to equip, less stats to worry about, less button mashing, the ranger is a better choice as it will allow for you to get to knowing the game while leveling a easy viable/survivable build. Also I'm on Thelanis as well, look up any of my alts in sig, current lowbie is Braegawumba (lvl 4).

Thanks for your advice it is noted And appreciated. In truth i may find you are right past level 10, but as i have not gotten there yet I will make that determination later on. At level 8.1 i am not in giant hold as of yet but will start giant hold at 9 so that will be a better test.

Secondly i do have some twinked gear, am in a raiding guild however i have never and will never be carried through any quests, at leat not intentioanlly. IF i cannot contribute and carry my own weight I will definitely Reroll.

[baddax]

The ac is just not enough for the hp, and I speak from experience. Malvian, TWF, self-buffed gets around a 58 ac. Many times I have rangers for real bark and pally auras and my ac is over 60 but below 65 twf. And I get hit a good deal. The only thing that saves me is having well over 400 hp. Again this isn't meant to flame you bro, but these are my findings and experiences.

So you are saying 65 Ac and 400 hp is the base line acceptible stats for a twf pally, end game build at level 16?

If so this is much higher than what I thought necessary.

[Braegan]

Thanks for your advice it is noted And appreciated. In truth i may find you are right past level 10, but as i have not gotten there yet I will make that determination later on. At level 8.1 i am not in giant hold as of yet but will start giant hold at 9 so that will be a better test.

Secondly i do have some twinked gear, am in a raiding guild however i have never and will never be carried through any quests, at leat not intentioanlly. IF i cannot contribute and carry my own weight I will definitely Reroll.

Word. You deffinately have an advantage with gear so that will help alot. Just from experience it's frustrating to make a build with ac in mind, and have everything you can have in game for ac and still get smacked around in certain content, and that's frustration I like to see others avoid :). Sadly ac is really all or nothing come the end game.

[Braegan]

So you are saying 65 Ac and 400 hp is the base line acceptible stats for a twf pally, end game build at level 16?

If so this is much higher than what I thought necessary.

That is awesome sauce land! And that's what you shoot for. Always shoot for the highest you can get because you might not have everything going for you. For example you could be on paper 65 ac but are still missing the chattering ring and the components to put dodge on your ac (for example) now you're a 61 ac. Or say for inv space you hot swap in a situational item and it takes away from your ac. It's always going to slide around. So saying your a 65 ac tank could mean your anywhere from 60-70 ac depending on current situation. Not to mention the upcoming Mordenkainen spell which will cause some of your items to stop working for a time. If you are really gear dependant, you're screwed there.

And the same thing for hp. You might need to wait for 20 shrouds to cleanse a hp item so on paper 400, your at 355 until you're done crafting.

[baddax]

That is awesome sauce land! And that's what you shoot for. Always shoot for the highest you can get because you might not have everything going for you. For example you could be on paper 65 ac but are still missing the chattering ring and the components to put dodge on your ac (for example) now you're a 61 ac. Or say for inv space you hot swap in a situational item and it takes away from your ac. It's always going to slide around. So saying your a 65 ac tank could mean your anywhere from 60-70 ac depending on current situation. Not to mention the upcoming Mordenkainen spell which will cause some of your items to stop working for a time. If you are really gear dependant, you're screwed there.

And the same thing for hp. You might need to wait for 20 shrouds to cleanse a hp item so on paper 400, your at 355 until you're done crafting.



qft.

[Clay]

I read further and saw you settled on the Paladin. I would recommend for a 28pt a str-based pure ranger. The exploiter build, most paladin builds, monk splashes require those extra 4 points or you will be lacking come end game. And really those builds cannot really suffer the lose of -2 to any stat. Not to mention alot of those are ac builds and thus hard to equip/require lots of grinding - also not something I would recommend to a newer player without explaining that you will be gimp unless you get some very specific raid loot.

For a ranger I would go human or dwarf. Stat importance: Str, Con, Dex, Wis. Put all your level ups into str and you have a rock solid build welcome on most any raid that's very easy to equip. Welcome to DDO!

disagree with you on these points Brae. People made, played and excelled before we had 32 pt builds. Dump int a little or cha... don't need CE right off the bat... I made an untwinked 28pt dragon marked halfling finesse evasion paladin w/UMD that was very viable, successful and survivable.

To the point of a solo-able no blue bar character? Halfling monk. If 32pt, then 12/18/14/8/16/8, if 28 then 10/17/14/8/16/8, with all level ups to wisdom. Evasion, Fists of light at lvl 3 means you hit stuff and get HP back. Finishing moves to grant 1 min buffs: blur, +2 saves/skills/to hit, mass cure, SP reduction. Halfling guile gives you good dps: you get unbalancing strike at lvl 6 which means you are almost always getting sneak attack dmg. Lvl 7 means you can use wholeness of body for healing every three minutes costing only 40 ki. Improved evasion, Good ac, good saves, good DPS. Monks really are great.

It does, however, require more "buttons" than other melee. You have special attacks and finishing moves that really add to the class and to neglect them would be a significant reduction of contributions.

[Braegan]

disagree with you on these points Brae. People made, played and excelled before we had 32 pt builds. Dump int a little or cha... don't need CE right off the bat... I made an untwinked 28pt dragon marked halfling finesse evasion paladin w/UMD that was very viable, successful and survivable.

To the point of a solo-able no blue bar character? Halfling monk. If 32pt, then 12/18/14/8/16/8, if 28 then 10/17/14/8/16/8, with all level ups to wisdom. Evasion, Fists of light at lvl 3 means you hit stuff and get HP back. Finishing moves to grant 1 min buffs: blur, +2 saves/skills/to hit, mass cure, SP reduction. Halfling guile gives you good dps: you get unbalancing strike at lvl 6 which means you are almost always getting sneak attack dmg. Lvl 7 means you can use wholeness of body for healing every three minutes costing only 40 ki. Improved evasion, Good ac, good saves, good DPS. Monks really are great.

It does, however, require more "buttons" than other melee. You have special attacks and finishing moves that really add to the class and to neglect them would be a significant reduction of contributions.

But Clay you are an experienced vet of the game. What I was trying to get all the other posters to understand is that recommending all these uber builds that require so much loot and grinding to be viable is a mistake to someone new to game. Much better off playing something simple and fun for a first character and get to know the game first.

And secondly all those "great" old 28 pt builds and drow are usually the ones that die from one DBF in part 4 and get laughed at on our vent channel. You know this :D

[Clay]

Meant more that something like this is viable in end game and is easy to make and play for a new character. Hard to come by gear makes it better... but it is still viable without. Made this for non-twink play, and enjoyed it... It was permadeath and the intim greatly helped the party members. This was before Monks were added to the game and in my boredom have been toying with the idea of revisiting this guy and making him again.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.00
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 16 Lawful Good Drow Male
(6 Fighter / 8 Paladin / 2 Rogue)
Hit Points: 252
Spell Points: 55

BAB: 15/15/20/2525
Fortitude: 19
Reflex: 19
Will: 13

Starting
Base Stats
Abilities (Level 1)
Strength 10
Dexterity 16
Constitution 14
Intelligence 14
Wisdom 10
Charisma 14

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 16

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Diplomacy (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Intimidate (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Repair (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 2 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 3 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse

Level 4 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 5 (Fighter)
Skill: Intimidate (+4)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Combat Expertise

Level 6 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality

Level 7 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Intimidate (+3)
Skill: Jump (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)

Level 9 (Fighter)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Use Magic Device

Level 10 (Fighter)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 11 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Dodge
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Intimidate

Level 13 (Paladin)
Skill: Diplomacy (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 14 (Fighter)
Skill: Intimidate (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 15 (Paladin)
Skill: Diplomacy (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery

Level 116 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Intimidate (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Mobility
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Follower of Vulkoor
Enhancement: Fighter Mobility I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Item Defense I
Enhancement: Paladin Item Defense II
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate I
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate II
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness III

[Clatters]

Clatters, and others, I don't dislike the other ideas given as well as pure paladin, but take into consideration no stockpiles of twink gear, new to game and unguilded the ranger is a better choice for ease. Easier to equip, less stats to worry about, less button mashing, the ranger is a better choice as it will allow for you to get to knowing the game while leveling a easy viable/survivable build. Also I'm on Thelanis as well, look up any of my alts in sig, current lowbie is Braegawumba (lvl 4).

I was just wondering if you had a link to this ranger build and ill try it, i figured ill get both the pally and ranger to 4/5 ish and see how they both perform.

If the ranger build takes less damage than the pally then ill give it a serious shot.

Thankyou.

[Braegan]

I was just wondering if you had a link to this ranger build and ill try it, i figured ill get both the pally and ranger to 4/5 ish and see how they both perform.

If the ranger build takes less damage than the pally then ill give it a serious shot.

Thankyou.

The ranger pure will takes alot less damage than a pure pally after level 9 and you get evasion, that's a given. Honestly it's a lot more simple. Go Dwarf or Human. If dwarf use dwarven war axes if human grab khopesh with human bonus feat. I like humans personally but a dwarf will have more hp. Braegan as a 28 pt build would look like:

Level 16, CG, human, Ranger

Str: 16 (+4 levels, +1 tome, +1 dt armor, + 6 item, +2 rams might spell) 30
Dex: 14 (+6 item, +1 tome, +3 enhancement) 24
Con: 16 (+6 item, +1 tome, +1 human enhancement) 24
Int: 8
Wis: 10 (+6 item, +2 tome if you wish) 16-18
Cha: 8

Note the +1 tome useage. Even stats on +1 tome (cheap and easy to get) replaced by raiding and achieving +3 tomes which eventually will become +5 tomes. Don't let anyone fool you into being even with even tomes. You short yourself on having the best numbers possible. Str is the focus and 30 str at level 16 with fav enemy enhancements and you will hit everything. Becomes 32 str at level 20 with last level up point and second human enhancement, 34 with the +3 tome, 36 with the +5.

HP: with a +1 tome and 1 shroud hp item (easy single upgrade) 411 standing hp (I don't show the math but that's what I have trust me :).

AC: lol. Worry about it leveling to 10. Then concern yourself with items that add in blur effect or displacement spells/clickies. At end game drop your ac to it's lowest point and wear guards. Currently I have radiance and earthgrab guard, nothing fancy but works great.

Skills: I put points into UMD, Balance, Tumble, Hide, Move Silently and Spot. Some argue over spot vs. listen the only difference is with spot you spot hidden enemies and traps whereas listen only applies to the former not the latter.

Feats: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Improved Crit: Piercing, Toughness, Power Attack. Human Bonus: Khopesh. Level 18 feat: Oversized TWF to qualify for tempest III.

Enhancements: All the racial toughness for hp, all your fav enemy attack, damage, and saves. Ranger dex III and human con I. Think there was some room for fluff in there.

Favored Enemies: I chose: Giants, Undead, Evil Outsider and Elemental. Some debate the Giant and Elemental but it has worked for me, esp Elemental which cannot be crit'ed so any extra dps on them is good.

But that's about it. Simple, works well and I raid with him all the time to great effect :)

[Clatters]

Thankyou for posting the build, ill give it a shot when i get home.

Whats the ride like to 9 then with ranger? Am i still looking at less incoming damage than a pally?

Kinda weird to think that a ranger with light armor would take less than a plate wearer, but then im used to 'other' MMO's.

DDO is definately different, in a good way.

[Braegan]

Thankyou for posting the build, ill give it a shot when i get home.

Whats the ride like to 9 then with ranger? Am i still looking at less incoming damage than a pally?

Kinda weird to think that a ranger with light armor would take less than a plate wearer, but then im used to 'other' MMO's.

DDO is definately different, in a good way.

Damage will be taken as a melee, thats a given. There are ways to mitigate that damage however. One of the simplest ways as a ranger is to circle your enemy while you swing and fight. Without the feat Spring Attack you would take a penalty to such a tactic (-4 to hit if I remember), something that pretty much only a ranger will have as feats as spread thin in game and rangers need that feat chain for tempest. Other "tactics" you can use on any melee class is using your "trip" skill when you engage, won't always land but a tripped enemy can't hit you :). As far as why a ranger will take less damage with evasion is versus spells and spell effects that have a save.

Example: fireball spell cast at your melee will do (for example) 100 hp, 50 hp if you make your save. Evasion is a very powerful class feat given to Rogues, Monks and Rangers that when they make their save they take no damage instead of half as represented above. Alot of damage from traps, spells, etc can be completely avoided by having evasion and a good reflex score, hence the many folks that "splash" in 2 levels of rog or monk.

[Clatters]

I see.

I noticed there was another ranger build on the newbie template post that had a lot more dex than the one you posted.

Is your way the better way to go?

[Braegan]

I see.

I noticed there was another ranger build on the newbie template post that had a lot more dex than the one you posted.

Is your way the better way to go?

Well you either go str based or dex based. But either way you go you have to make one your focus. Don't fall into that group of the equal dex and str, you have one major and one minor so to speak :). If you go dex based. Make a race that benefits from it (elf, drow or halfling) get the best dex you can and leave str at something like 10. Dex based rangers get hit a lil less but do less damage, it's a trade off I personally didn't wish to make.

[Clatters]

Ok i understand.

Thankyou for all your help.

Kinda hard to pick now whether to do with dex or str.

For soloing i might go with dex just to take a bit less damage, but i was wondering do you need 16 in con? Would 14 be ok?

I only ask so i could either pop str or dex up a bit more.

Sorry last question, i wont bug you anymore :p

[Braegan]

Ok i understand.

Thankyou for all your help.

Kinda hard to pick now whether to do with dex or str.

For soloing i might go with dex just to take a bit less damage, but i was wondering do you need 16 in con? Would 14 be ok?

I only ask so i could either pop str or dex up a bit more.

Sorry last question, i wont bug you anymore :p

Ya sure, gimmie a few mins to run some numbers...

[Braegan]

Halfling Ranger

Str: 12
Dex: 18
Con: 16
Int: 8
Wis: 10
Cha: 8

Follow same formula for str build but sub all level up into dex and take every ranger and racial enhancement you can for dex. Minus the feat "Power Attack" from str build and replace with "Weapon Finesse". However take Weapon Finesse at level 1 or you won't hit anything. Fight with rapiers and have fun!

Feat Order:

1) Weapon Finesse
3) Dodge
6) Mobilty
9) Spring Attack
12) Toughness
15) Imp Crit Pierce
18) Oversized TWF

And yes I think you need to start at 16 con for a ranger because they are the only melee class that is a d8 level up vs d10 and d12.

[Clatters]

OK thankyou for all your help.

Finally home from work now and going to log on and give this char a shot.

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

I solo tons on my monk ( dex/wind based ) and have a blast. Soloing is all about survivability and self sufficiency rather than raw power and dps (at the expense of, for example, AC) - perfect attributes for a monk :) Monks can also self heal with curse of healing and combined with the monk's healing enhancements I find I never have to drink pots.

But if you're not into twitch or pushing buttons to get special attacks, monk might not be for you.

Good luck with your Pally, or Ranger, or whatever you decide to build! :)

Garth

[Drekisen]

Altho monks can be hard to play it is really because u must learn a lot about how they work.

Now I am not a new player, but I did start over on a new server where I did not have a lot of money and therefore was not able to twink. As soon as I unlocked drow with my wiz I rolled a pure drow monk. And I pretty much had to make it with no twinking at all. IMHO, if u learn all that a monk is capable of, go the full THF line and do a fire/STR build, this is a very survivable soloable character. U also should take the Harmonious Balance feat so u can keep urself healed and buffed nicely. I stress these two things as the full THF line does great damage on multiple enemies with a qstaff and Harmonious Balance will keep u continuously healed.

Monks get all around nice saves, if u pay attention a good AC and u can start with a 16 or 17 str and still be able to get up to 30 by end game with just ur 1750 favor tome. Is this a super uber build? NO

I do find monks quite fun to play tho, and especially if u make use of hirelings, they are very well capable of soloing with.

[Clatters]

Well made the def halfling ranger so far and its going pretty well, just about to hit level 3.

Using rapiers at the moment, or should i be using longswords?

Notice that im taking a bit less damage than the pally as well so that will cut down my pot/wand usage :)

[Braegan]

Well made the def halfling ranger so far and its going pretty well, just about to hit level 3.

Using rapiers at the moment, or should i be using longswords?

Notice that im taking a bit less damage than the pally as well so that will cut down my pot/wand usage :)

Use Rapiers you can't use longswords with the feat weapon finesse. Some links you might find useful:

A newbie guide:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=2075707#post2075707

A downloadable character planner.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=87799

The Exploiter Build (since you asked for it)

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=168687

A similiar version to the Expoilter but one I think is superior, esp if soloing is your gig.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=168825

[Clay]

I solo tons on my monk ( dex/wind based ) and have a blast. Soloing is all about survivability and self sufficiency rather than raw power and dps (at the expense of, for example, AC) - perfect attributes for a monk :) Monks can also self heal with curse of healing and combined with the monk's healing enhancements I find I never have to drink pots.

But if you're not into twitch or pushing buttons to get special attacks, monk might not be for you.

Good luck with your Pally, or Ranger, or whatever you decide to build! :)

Garth

Completely agree... especially with the button part. ;)

And I also recommend dex based over str. The monk special attacks, stunning fist/quivering palm/unbalancing strike are all based of your wis modifier (10 + half monk level + wis modifier) which is why I feel if you really want to land those special attacks, you make it the highest attribute. The wind stance also increases your attack speed: more hits=more ki. With healing curse: more hits=more HP recovered.

Why Oversized Braegan? Save the feat and simply use Shortswords. In cerain situations where the penalty will not be so noticed... just suck up the -2 to hit by using an oversized weopon.

Also, the build could benefit from 2 mnk levels for the extra feats... or would that over complicate things? 6Rng Mnk 8Rng Mnk. Would get an additional +4 to ac which is like have a no negative CE on all the time.

[Braegan]

Completely agree... especially with the button part. ;)

And I also recommend dex based over str. The monk special attacks, stunning fist/quivering palm/unbalancing strike are all based of your wis modifier (10 + half monk level + wis modifier) which is why I feel if you really want to land those special attacks, you make it the highest attribute. The wind stance also increases your attack speed: more hits=more ki. With healing curse: more hits=more HP recovered.

Why Oversized Braegan? Save the feat and simply use Shortswords. In cerain situations where the penalty will not be so noticed... just suck up the -2 to hit by using an oversized weopon.

Also, the build could benefit from 2 mnk levels for the extra feats... or would that over complicate things? 6Rng Mnk 8Rng Mnk. Would get an additional +4 to ac which is like have a no negative CE on all the time.



To qualify for Tempest III. Of the feats needed that one seemed to give the best benefit. Of course that's what it's the level 18 seleced feat beacuse it's use is small and not needed until level 18.


Ranger Tempest III
Prerequisites: Ranger level 18, Tempest II, and any one of: Two Weapon Blocking, Two Weapon Defense, Oversized Two Weapon Fighting, or Lightning Reflexes.
Cost: 2 AP
Benefit: Your skill with two weapons is unequaled - your training has turned you into a whirling tempest of steel, granting a 10% competence bonus to dual wield attack speed, a +4 shield bonus to armor class when two weapon fighting, your penalty to hit has been reduced by 2, and you gain additional attacks when two weapon fighting.



And Clay you know I don't have anything bad to say about monks now. Monk + Halfling = fun!