All Melee/Caster Shroud Run - Build 'em!

[Draiden]

I've posted a couple of times about the melee caster builds and how they really work in today's DDO. Sadly, I just haven't seen many running around Sarlona.

I have had SO MUCH FUN with this character that it disappoints me to see that people have given up on the concept. Granted, there was a time in the game where there just wasn't enough gear/classes (ie. monk splashes are now available) to make it work. Well... I'm throwing down the gloves. Make the character, level the **** out of it, and let's get in the Shroud. I CHALLENGE YOU TO GIVE IT ANOTHER GO! I can't express enough how much fun this build is to play, or how satisfying it is to finally get the balance correct and get it all to jive.

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask me or post on this thread to get advice from others. The build I have now was certainly pushed in a couple of right directions from the DDO community, so give it a shot!

[cluedout]

Spent a few hours tweaking this out

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.00
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Sahbam
Level 20 Chaotic Good Warforged Male
(2 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 16 Wizard)
Hit Points: with all shroud/best items, looking at 450ish
Spell Points: 1300ish with shroud
BAB: 11 (to hit bonus with DP clicks/full self buffs is around 35 on first swing)

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 16 20
Dexterity 15 18
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 16 20
Wisdom 6 6
Charisma 6 6

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7 (mod 9 friendly build)
+2 Tome of Dexterity used on or before level 11

Ending
Base Skills
Skills (Level 16)


Disable Device 23 MAX
Search 23 MAX
Use Magic Device 23 MAX
Balance 10 remaining here

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Jump (+3)
Skill: Listen (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Repair (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Swim (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell


Level 3 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Khopesh
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 4 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting


Level 7 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Quicken Spell
+2 int tome


Level 8 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+6)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 11 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
+2 dex tome for ITWF


Level 12 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 13 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell


Level 14 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 16 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness IV
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Force I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Force II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Force III
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Force I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Force II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Force III
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation III
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar I
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar II
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar III
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar IV
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution I
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution II
Enhancement: Warforged Inscribed Armor

Level 17 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 18 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Spell


Level 19 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 20 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


max umd, DD, search, if any left over into balance.

just remember, you nuke/buff dont even bother with PK/FOD

keep yourself hasted, displaced, stoneskined, jumped, nightshilded, raged, GH'd, fireshilded, and mass prot from energy at all times, then throw a firewall and smack them with your 2 min2 khopesh's.

make a few guard GS items just for kick's and develop your twitch skills.

pick up some of those nice tower shilds from vod/hound when you need DR, S&B is the way to go, if you have torc/concordant oppositon turtle to get mana/hp back while quicken reconstruct to stay healed

magic missle, force missle, and the upcoming chain missils will be devastating as completely specced out in them, pick up repair lore and force lore (if they have them) on an item if possible and you can be the party boss blaster

do anything possible to increace con, that is the one thing i might change if i can find a spot, 16 base con for more hp but that would gimp something else.

see if you can fit the following eqipment...

from the top,
head: minos legens
neacklace: GS/torc (torc if your playstyle allows)
trinket: bloodstone/hogf/mummified bat
cloak: stormreavers napkin (+6 intel)
belt: titan belt (GFL/+6 str)
ring1: tumbleweed
gloves: spectral/7 finger/switch spot for DP clicky's/open lock/disable device
boots: striders (if you are good with exp retreat more greensteel goes here)
ring2: +6 con
bracers: greensteel
docent: DOD (again for torc/conc opp)/the best dragontouched you can make
goggles: tharns (TS +5 sneak attk +15 search/spot)

so, room for about 3 GS items. make one sp/cha skills item (nacklace), one +45 hp item (bracers) and a concordant opp item (boots) if you dont like torc/conc opp make whatever you please instead of conc opp (i recomend loads of guards) (one possible fun combo i thoght of is a +6 % fire lore , greater fire lore, DBF 3/day, sup fire lore, insineration guard (5% to do 300 odd damage on being hit)

question, do the +2 to hit on the tumbleweed and the spectral gloves stack?
if i have knock on this character, is open lock skill still needed?
is this build going to be too gimped to even be usable current end game?
what am i looking at with attack bonus, divine power clickys and full self buffs/ beholder attk bonus include plz
should i alter the starting stats any?
any feats i'm leaving out that are needed?

comments?
similar build you can link me to? (no THF builds, just TWF builds plz, i know all about the tukah build)
gear i should be on the lookout for?

[Draiden]

question, do the +2 to hit on the tumbleweed and the spectral gloves stack?
Hoping somebody else can answer that. I use the spectral gloves, and the +2 is a competence bonus. If tumbleweed is too, then no. Is it maybe a luck bonus? Then it would stack.


if i have knock on this character, is open lock skill still needed?
Yes. Even with heighten and the Napkin, knock is still pretty weak.


is this build going to be too gimped to even be usable current end game?
Actually, I made 3 attempts at a melee caster and you seem to have avoided most of the pitfalls I hit during those attempts. If you want to focus more on being a rogue/caster type of melee caster (if you follow that), then you're good. If you want to be a pure dps machine, then I would recommend reevaluating taking so many levels of caster. 12 levels as a wizard will really get you everything you want for the build- including all 3 INT enhancement lines, Elemental Damage Enhancements for whatever you want to spec for (force, as you said) and 3 bonus MM feats. If you could consider this build being the "rogue" or of a melee/caster kind of party, then it's perfect. Or even if you want to consider it the "caster" of the melee/caster party. I know that's confusing, but even if the entire server was built as melee/casters, some of those characters would have to be better at casting to play the caster role when required, and some would need rogue abilities to fill in that role, and some would need to play a little more of the healer role (for the Monk2/Cleric14 builds out there). Your build should be slightly tweaked more towards what you want his strengths as a group member to be. If it's tanking... then no. Reevaluate.


what am i looking at with attack bonus, divine power clickys and full self buffs/ beholder attk bonus include plz
Divine Power clickies will get you all the way up there with any pure melee. That's why they rock. The issue is how many times do you want to constantly swap gear around to activate it? And are you okay with throwing Tenser's to get a longer duration of the same effect, but not be able to cast in the meantime? You're BAB is really low, no doubt, and you will feel that when you're up against beholders. Spectral Gloves certainly help, and you end with a 30 STR (with today's DDO), so you're good there. Again, if you want to focus on being the "melee" of a group, consider taking more melee class... but not too much. However, 16 wizard is still a very formidable foe!


should i alter the starting stats any?
These actually look really solid. Similar to what I did with my Human, in fact, except that I calculated +1 Human Adaptability into STR and CON. And the Ram's Might for STR.


any feats i'm leaving out that are needed?
Weapon Focus certainly helps the low BAB issue! Also, I would reconsider PA. I know it's a melee's staple feat, but consider the implications on a low BAB.


similar build you can link me to? (no THF builds, just TWF builds plz, i know all about the tukah build)
My build is a TWF with Khopeshes- focused more towards a melee job. He's a Human Wiz8/Ranger6/Monk2, and will be a Wiz12/Ranger6/Monk2 soon enough. The Ranger6 is for Tempest, free TWF feats and Manyshot. The Monk2 is for WIS bonus to AC. My attempt at the Pally/Sorc was detrimental at endgame because AC was too low and you can't rely on Displacement too much these days. Wiz12 will give me everything I want for buffs and nukeage, as explained above. While leveling I was amazed at the synergy I discovered between the 3 classes, too. Eveything complements eachother wonderfully. It seemed that as I leveled in one class, it made the other abilities better, too. To reitterate, do everything you can for AC, though. DEX builds are a great help in this department, and since you're already going for TWF you're already sniffing down that dog. Start thinking Icy Rainments and Armor+8 Bracers.



gear i should be on the lookout for?
You're already on it.

I'll leave you with this. Take my advice with a grain of salt. Obviously, play what you like. That being said, as you play the toon you will become aware of it's faults more than anybody else, and you'll know how to adjust fire to make it work, so the best thing I can advise is... GET CRACKIN'! ;)

[cluedout]

that, my kind sir is exactly the kind of input i was looking for! thanks so much for not criticizing it beyond belief

as for the AC thing, not to worried, its a warforged and i get quickened reconstructs that are hitting for over 500 hp because of all the force/repair enhancements i have

going all str base so i can do a bit more damage than other toons i have

hmmm, might have to abandon the open lock thing though, hard to fit the heighten feat in, however, might take it at lvl 18 as it is a useful one and add a bit to casting ability and at least be able to finger my way threw some of the lower lvl quests

i seriously thought about some different ideas for classes, for example 2 rog 15 wiz 3 ftr but decided that overall, i will benefit more with some sp and extra spells over nothing a lvl 3 fighter could offer me

seriously still thinking about a third lvl of rog making it all 15 wiz 3 rog 2 ftr that would still allow all the feats and also allow a few more skill points to dump into balance or open lock. that along with an extra 1d6 of sneak attk damage

as for DP clicks, i have like 50 altogether and they all go in the gloves slot, which is the switchable slot on this build. DP also allows for the most important part of being a wizard, being able to cast spells which tensers cannot do

as for my role in the party, i can fill any slot you want except intimitank :P dps, buffs, rog skills, caster... (FW, MM, FM, chain missile, disintegrate being the main dps spells) as well as having umd enough to raise ded, heal scrolls and some of the most powerful reconstructs in the game

[Quikster]

gloves and ring do not stack.

with PA on you will definately need to use DP clickies. My suggestion is to get as many as you can in the same slot. Then hotkey em, bang it twice then back to normal item. Just like playing a paly :D

If going wf'd I prolly wouldn't focus on ac but sp regen, torc and a couple CO items along with SS and discplacement. Figure the times when discplacement is negated you're prolly getting mass healed 85 percent of the time, and the other 15 you can heal yourself. Carry lots of mana pots and scrolls just in case :D

Dray I have a melee cleric at 6 so if any of these other jokers get serious I can run her to cap if needed :D

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

gloves and ring do not stack.

with PA on you will definately need to use DP clickies. My suggestion is to get as many as you can in the same slot. Then hotkey em, bang it twice then back to normal item. Just like playing a paly :D


if you're short on inventory slots and high on UMD you can also use divine power scrolls. I use these on my bard who never seems to have enough inventory space.

Garth

[Quikster]

if you're short on inventory slots and high on UMD you can also use divine power scrolls. I use these on my bard who never seems to have enough inventory space.

Garth

Good call yo! Listen to this guy he is the founder and leader of the guild 15 Minute Speed Shroud!

[Draiden]

Dray I have a melee cleric at 6 so if any of these other jokers get serious I can run her to cap if needed :D

Cool, man. Thanks. I've heard good things about that build of yours. I think Taog was impressed with it. A couple of melee clerics, and the rest melee casters... would be a fun shroud run.

[Quikster]

Cool, man. Thanks. I've heard good things about that build of yours. I think Taog was impressed with it. A couple of melee clerics, and the rest melee casters... would be a fun shroud run.

There you go with your cleric hate. The thread title says melee/caster not arcane caster. Clerics are casters too ya know. You don't have to seperate them out :D What about battlebards? you aren't going to exclude them too just cuz you don't have a bard are ya?

[Varr]

I'd love to join if around when you form up. Varrr is my 16 pure str built wf sorc. Khopesh improved two weapon melée sorc. Even stumbled into a bloodstone for him, can't wait for ic slash at 18.

[Thrudh]

I actually have a copy of Hasenpfeffer (my 11/5 ranger/wizard on Thelanis) on Sarlona... but he's only level 6 (4/2 ranger/wizard) on Sarlona.

Maybe I should level him up? (Doing the exact same character on a different server isn't much fun though... I'm not sure why I thought it would be)

[Varr]

yea repeat builds on another server is a grind. For the 12/6/2 wiz/ranger/monk might I suggest 11/6/3 path of light instead. Can hand to hand and do some tasty shields of healing when foe become thin or your soloing and you don't need the insta beatdown of the khopeshes. Also can replace vorping khopeshes with kamas.

[Draiden]

There you go with your cleric hate. The thread title says melee/caster not arcane caster. Clerics are casters too ya know. You don't have to seperate them out :D What about battlebards? you aren't going to exclude them too just cuz you don't have a bard are ya?

Clerics... casters?! Pfft! And BARDS?!?!? HA! Bards are flaming church-boy wanna-be's and tavern drunks that boast and fiddle on about other peoples heroics because they don't have any of their own.

;)

[Quikster]

Clerics... casters?! Pfft! And BARDS?!?!? HA! Bards are flaming church-boy wanna-be's and tavern drunks that boast and fiddle on about other peoples heroics because they don't have any of their own.

;)

Whatever I have a couple bards I want you to meet.