PvP: Challenge Other Players! [Archive] - Dungeons & Dragons Online Forums

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:08 PM

PvP can be a lot of fun with friends and guildies, but sometimes you just want to pick a fight with a complete stranger one-on-one, without interference. We're pleased to introduce in Mod 9: the challenge system!

Rather than convincing your foe to run all the way to a PvP tavern to duke it out, you can now just select the player directly, and on your inspect orb, click the "challenge" symbol. This will allow you and your enemy to be transported to a PvP arena of your choice from anywhere in the game!

To begin your duel, you must specify the terms of your battle. Select from:

Game type (death match, capture the flag)
The Arena (select an arena or chose random)
Time limit (a range of minutes up to a full hour, or random)

Similar to a trade window, both parties must agree for the match to begin, and you can see the status of whether or not the other person has accepted yet or not. Your opponent is presented your terms, and given the chance to negotiate any changes they'd want to make to the duel. A text field is also available for you to privately chat/negotiate in the Challenge window with your opponent prior to the start of the match. Once you and your opponent agree to the terms, you will be transported automatically into the arena after a 5 second count down.

Remember that in Mod 9, general chat spans across any instance, so if you were standing in the Marketplace when you entered the arena, your general chat will still be seen in the Market. If you have something to say to your PvP opponents that you don't want everyone to hear, you're best to use /say or /tell.

You don’t have to just duel though, you can challenge in groups as well! You can fight in combinations of 1 vs 6, 3 vs 3, or any other group configuration you want. Gather your forces together into a group, and your opponents must do likewise. So if your group of 3 would like to fight those two guys in a group by the mailbox, set up your challenge and it will present it to them! You can see the status of who all of the two teams has accepted the challenge, and who's acceptance is still pending. Remember that you need to be in separate parties to use the challenge system. If you need to communicate between the two rival teams prior to the match, you can use the text field in the challenge window before everyone is transported into the match.

If you'd like to have a match up with other random players, Jackson Laws is still available in the PvP taverns, and the open-brawl Tavern pits are still available at the Phoenix, Hammersmith, Wayward Lobster, and Open Palm.

In addition to the normal death-match arena, a new Shavarath themed death-match arena has been added! Filled with traps and things to avoid bumping into, it can really add a whole new level of difficulty for your duel as you try not to be done in by your enemy AND your environment!

If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time! Otherwise, you can leave it on and see who picks a fight as you're making your way around the various public spaces!

So the next time you're milling around the Harbor or Meridia, and you have a hankering for some PvP, challenge a friend or a stranger to PvP on the spot using the Challenge system!

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:09 PM

ho ho ho, i can't wait, DIE BLAH DIE!!!

Venar

03-25-2009, 04:11 PM

i am sure 2 or 3 players will be happy.

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:13 PM

i am sure 2 or 3 players will be happy.

welcome to fight club

if it's your first night, you have to fight

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:14 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

Abysom

03-25-2009, 04:14 PM

More meh...

moorewr

03-25-2009, 04:15 PM

I can't wait for people run though the harbor with n00bs spamming challenges... or conversely, to spam plat spammers with challenges in hopes of their scripts clicking yes for them... :cool:

Milamber69

03-25-2009, 04:15 PM

Im happy, I plan on standing in Korthos Island and spamming it to new people as they create a character for the first time :)

Sabotage

03-25-2009, 04:16 PM

ho ho ho, i can't wait, DIE BLAH DIE!!!

blah will die

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:16 PM

I bid 50 quatloos on the newcomer

that woudl be the next step for this to allow spectators and betting

Gol

03-25-2009, 04:16 PM

Slink

03-25-2009, 04:16 PM

Hmmm, 10 paragraphs for 1% of the community, that's nice.

Sorry, just not my thing. Actually this is kind of depressing to be honest.

The addition of general tab spam...err....spanning across all instances is not the greatest idea either.

faldordadink

03-25-2009, 04:17 PM

not a pvper myself, but htis is kinda cool, the only way it would be better is if the match took place where the challenge occurs, marketplace brawls would be fun.

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:17 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

it adds flavor to the game

it's like housing, crafting, etc., it fleshes out the game world. not everyone does it but different strokes

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:18 PM

I bid 50 quatloos on the newcomer

that woudl be the next step for this to allow spectators and betting

oooo now there's a good idea

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:18 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

bump

DasLurch

03-25-2009, 04:19 PM

If this is what is holding up Mod 9, i will be really dissappointed. DDO is pretty much a team oriented game. :(

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:20 PM

Awesome, thanks turbine.

Abysom

03-25-2009, 04:20 PM

At least there's one good thing from this:

"If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time!"

EazyWeazy

03-25-2009, 04:21 PM

or Maybe We Should Make About 20-25 New Quests...pvp And Everything Associated Is A Failure And Waist Of Developer Time

Jrp

Qft :(

DagazUlf

03-25-2009, 04:21 PM

Stupid. :mad:

Impaqt

03-25-2009, 04:22 PM

Gorby

03-25-2009, 04:23 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waste of developer time

jrp

qft

RavenBrother

03-25-2009, 04:23 PM

Talish

03-25-2009, 04:24 PM

Please make sure auto-decline is enabled for new characters.

Agreed.

EDIT: I am not however against this change. I will probably use it from time to time myself. I am just worried about a few existing players who may spam new players with challenges before they have even mastered the controls for the game.

Korvek

03-25-2009, 04:25 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

Unless of course new players coming in like that sort of option.

It's rather difficult to know what new players are looking for I imagine, so my guess is Turbine is just deciding to add some features that exist in some other (more popular) MMOs.

maddmatt70

03-25-2009, 04:25 PM

Kadran

03-25-2009, 04:26 PM

Strakeln

03-25-2009, 04:26 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrpWhile I agree with the sentiment, if you're going to copy/paste yourself over and over, please use the word "waste". You don't want to see the imagery that line is causing me to see.

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:27 PM

LoL Someone is getting nailed by the forum police, but still ^^^^ is funny. Spamming unfortunately, is not.

RavenBrother

03-25-2009, 04:27 PM

If this keeps new players in the game I am all for it. Some people out there like pvp. You forum vets don't, but I see this as a substantial improvement to the system and will be yet another thing that keeps new players around. Thumbs Up Developers and Turbine..

Without the core "VET" players this game would be no more... new blood tends to come and go quickly... I would more over want to build a core of committed players than please the frindge that doesn't hange around.

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:28 PM

qft

Qft
Qft
Qft

i did post it 3 times, I actually cant believe, they just dont seem to get it, its like a bird who just keeps flying into the window at full speed. they never will seem to understand and duplicate the few sucessful modules and build on them, they continually keep adding to failure

jrp

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:29 PM

it adds flavor to the game

it's like housing, crafting, etc., it fleshes out the game world. not everyone does it but different strokes

agreed not everyone will do it, but it opens up the game a bit to those that do, and anything that opens up the game to a wider audience is a good thing. Like I said in my previous post the next step for this would be to open it up for spectators, and allow betting

EazyWeazy

03-25-2009, 04:29 PM

I actually feel deflated with this info. Last week I was so excited about the Flagging post that I screwed up 3 times trying to post it over on our Guild site. I was ecstatic.

I feel the complete opposite of that way right now. :mad:

maddmatt70

03-25-2009, 04:30 PM

Without the core "VET" players this game would be no more... new blood tends to come and go quickly... I would more over want to build a core of committed players than please the frindge that doesn't hange around.

This actually gives me some hope. The game seems to be dying, but this sort of ambitious improvement is alot like the hireling improvement - they both give me alot of hope that Turbine is working on the longtime future of DDO instead of just letting it die the death it is..

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:31 PM

Are these going to be new arenas, or will these challenges take you to the usual places? IE Wayward Lobster, Phoenix Tavern, etc.

If it takes you around Stormreach, I am ALL for this (and I hate PvP.) I will use this feature with a friend to "teleport" around places I want to go. :-D

It takes you to the arenas you can access through Jackson Laws (plus the new Shavarath one). If you challenge someone in the Marketplace, you enter the arena, and when your match is over, you're back in the Market. If you were in Gianthold, you'd enter the arena, then when the match is over, you're back in Gianthold.

nytewolf

03-25-2009, 04:31 PM

So if someone sends me a challenge to do Pvp more than once and I decline them can I report them for harrasment??

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:31 PM

While I agree with the sentiment, if you're going to copy/paste yourself over and over, please use the word "waste". You don't want to see the imagery that line is causing me to see.

I consider this a free bump

jrp

RavenBrother

03-25-2009, 04:31 PM

I love it when nerds get furious about stupid things. Cry! Cry! It feels so good!

You meen people that are smarter then you :)

noilli

03-25-2009, 04:31 PM

At least it'll hopefully be an easy way to warp back to the market place, harbor or house J. Are there any other arenas anywhere else? They should put one in Meridia.

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:32 PM

i say we kill the messenger!! let's all challenge tolero in front of the subtarranean!!

/sarcasm off

seriously i like this though, adds to the game overall

noilli

03-25-2009, 04:32 PM

You meen people that are smarter then you :)

Yes, people who are smarter than me care so much about trivialities like this.

Vordax

03-25-2009, 04:32 PM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

More than likely this was done by the UI team (person?), and most of the pieces were there in the backend already, just skipping the need to talk to Jackson Laws.
So if they had redirected this developer off of the UI team for the duration of this task and onto the content team, I would imagine it would have amounted to about 5-10% of 1 quest.

Vordax

noilli

03-25-2009, 04:33 PM

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:33 PM

Without the core "VET" players this game would be no more... new blood tends to come and go quickly... I would more over want to build a core of committed players than please the frindge that doesn't hange around.

That's what most vets believe in any mmo, but sadly it's just plain untrue.

What you see on forums in any game is the vocal minority, we have what, maybe 100 repeat posters who think they are the voice of the mmo? It's just plainly untrue.

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:34 PM

More than likely this was done by the UI team (person?), and most of the pieces were there in the backend already, just skipping the need to talk to Jackson Laws.
So if they had redirected this developer off of the UI team for the duration of this task and onto the content team, I would imagine it would have amounted to about 5-10% of 1 quest.

Vordax

I would take it

jrp

Angelus_dead

03-25-2009, 04:34 PM

We're pleased to introduce in Mod 9: the challenge system!
As others have mentioned, it provides minimal value to the game. However, hopefully it didn't take much programmer effort to accomplish. (Stuff like this shouldn't be hard)

Rather than convincing your foe to run all the way to a PvP tavern to duke it out, you can now just select the player directly, and on your inspect orb, click the "challenge" symbol. This will allow you and your enemy to be transported to a PvP arena of your choice from anywhere in the game!
It would be pretty cool if players could choose to become hostile to each other in areas of their choosing, including quests. It would be amusing to see some parties attempting to win a dungeon with Friendly Fire activated.

If you'd like to have a match up with other random players, Jackson Laws is still available in the PvP taverns, and the open-brawl Tavern pits are still available at the Phoenix, Hammersmith, Wayward Lobster, and Open Palm.
The house P tavern was never activated for PvP, even though a bouncer NPC (ogre) was added in module 3.

In addition to the normal death-match arena, a new Shavarath themed death-match arena has been added!
Each new module should have included a pvp room in one of the new taverns.

Filled with traps and things to avoid bumping into, it can really add a whole new level of difficulty for your duel as you try not to be done in by your enemy AND your environment!
Be warned that the experience of the WOW devs shows that players tend to hate trap-filled pvp zones.

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:34 PM

You meen people that are smarter then you :)

isn't it mean?

RavenBrother

03-25-2009, 04:34 PM

Yes, people who are smarter than me care so much about trivialities like this.

This is a forum... if we can't make our feeling known about a subject then why bother having user input. I hate this concept and I make my feelings known. If you like it you should stop wasting time and post that you like it and why. If there is an overwhelming positive feedback then this would not be wasted dev time...but...why don't you take some time and see how people feel before you try to troll. People who post for the sake of berating or putting down others or just to insite a reaction are very pathetic indeed.

Kadran

03-25-2009, 04:35 PM

It takes you to the arenas you can access through Jackson Laws (plus the new Shavarath one). If you challenge someone in the Marketplace, you enter the arena, and when your match is over, you're back in the Market. If you were in Gianthold, you'd enter the arena, then when the match is over, you're back in Gianthold.

Lame. Burst my dreams of easy travel. :-P

It's cool for people that like PvP. I just don't see the point. I'd rather run a quest, or a loot run, or... organize my inventory. :-)

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:35 PM

So if they had redirected this developer off of the UI team for the duration of this task and onto the content team, I would imagine it would have amounted to about 5-10% of 1 quest.

Vordax

Something tells me you don't want Phax designing your quests :eek:

"Ok so there's this pie right...and you have to defend it from these kobolds...and then it turns blue...and...."

(I kid...love to Phax :D)

Slink

03-25-2009, 04:35 PM

Qft
Qft
Qft

i did post it 3 times, I actually cant believe, they just dont seem to get it, its like a bird who just keeps flying into the window at full speed. they never will seem to understand and duplicate the few sucessful modules and build on them, they continually keep adding to failure

jrp

Not to mention this spam is eerily similar to what the general tab is going to look like after this change.

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:36 PM

Without the core "VET" players this game would be no more... new blood tends to come and go quickly... I would more over want to build a core of committed players than please the frindge that doesn't hange around.

that is an assupmtion that has no actual proof to support it, while the "CORE" vet players may make up a large portion of the forums, the percentage of hardcore vets could be actually a small percentage of the actuall paying playerbase. Only Turbine has those numbers, and I am sure they use them to make the decisions on what gets put in the game and what people want

Coldin

03-25-2009, 04:36 PM

All in all, a decent improvement. I look forward to using this in the downtime between quests.

totmacher

03-25-2009, 04:36 PM

Something tells me you don't want Phax designing your quests :eek:

"Ok so there's this pie right...and you have to defend it from these kobolds...and then it turns blue...and...."

(I kid...love to Phax :D)

i would love to playtest this pie-defending quest. how could you be so cruel to pie, tolero? pie loves you. pie loves everyone!

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:37 PM

It would be pretty cool if players could choose to become hostile to each other in areas of their choosing, including quests. It would be amusing to see some parties attempting to win a dungeon with Friendly Fire activated.

Friendly fire in the open spaces is more complex than this. Just getting spell casting in the Market for the devils was an extra level of *ahem* "fun"

The house P tavern was never activated for PvP, even though a bouncer NPC (ogre) was added in module 3.

I think you're thinking of the Bogwater, not the Open Palm. Open Palm is located in House J.

Andora

03-25-2009, 04:38 PM

Is this going to become the new harassment " Join my Guild "? I would rather have had quests of any level then this.

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:38 PM

i would love to playtest this pie-defending quest. how could you be so cruel to pie, tolero? pie loves you. pie loves everyone!

Q: What does Tolero and Richard simmons have in common?
?

noilli

03-25-2009, 04:39 PM

This is a forum... if we can't make our feeling known about a subject then why bother having user input. I hate this concept and I make my feelings known. If you like it you should stop wasting time and post that you like it and why. If there is an overwhelming positive feedback then this would not be wasted dev time...but...why don't you take some time and see how people feel before you try to troll. People who post for the sake of berating or putting down others or just to insite a reaction are very pathetic indeed.

There's a difference between letting your feelings be known and seeming like a petulant child. Your comments about only hardcore players mattering and only features you deign to appreciate mattering makes you appear childish and it amuses me, that's all.

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:41 PM

There's a difference between letting your feelings be known and seeming like a petulant child. Your comments about only hardcore players mattering and only features you deign to appreciate mattering makes you appear childish and it amuses me, that's all.

/QFT
*holds up two hands w/ pens in each one*
Can I sign twice?

Yeric

03-25-2009, 04:42 PM

What a waste of time. Yours and mine. There are a bunch of things dev time could be more useful doing. If it wasn't for the opt out button, there could have been a problem.

Gratch

03-25-2009, 04:43 PM

Coldin

03-25-2009, 04:43 PM

Something tells me you don't want Phax designing your quests :eek:

"Ok so there's this pie right...and you have to defend it from these kobolds...and then it turns blue...and...."

(I kid...love to Phax :D)

Reminds me of the quest...

*You're in a 10x10 room. There's a delicious looking pie on the table, and an orc standing in front of it.* What do you do?

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:43 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:44 PM

What a waste of time. Yours and mine. There are a bunch of things dev time could be more useful doing. If it wasn't for the opt out button, there could have been a problem.if you change problem to shooting, you could have a rap song!

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:45 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

Hey!!!! can you get the rights to add a PVP area called "THE THUNDERDOME" then everyone would be in favor of it or risk being lame!

Tolero, add the thunderdome ... best idea EVER!

Anastasios

03-25-2009, 04:45 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

Get the Cube in here and I will make it a Thunderdome everyone will never forget!!! Mad Max ain't got PvP on me....

Slink

03-25-2009, 04:46 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

But isnt that exactly what it is about? Fighting with each other? :confused:

Sorry, lol, I just found that comment + the "tid-bit" kinda funny

RavenBrother

03-25-2009, 04:46 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

Well I would suggest you give us something better to talk about. This is a very touchy subject in the community and has a great division there in. A lot of hard core vets and Classic DnD players either are for or very against PvP as the absence there of was an attraction at launch. So... to solve your problem Close this thread and give us something we would be amazed at like last weeks sneak peek :)

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:46 PM

What a waste of time. Yours and mine. There are a bunch of things dev time could be more useful doing. If it wasn't for the opt out button, there could have been a problem.

and that is precisely why they put it in, not everyone wants it, they get that ,so you turn it off and the game goes along just the same way it did before.

It is fine not to like the addition and say you could care less, that is your opinion, but those who say its a waste of dev really mean, since I want them to doX anything they do that is not X is a waste of time, and I am sorry but you are not the only player here.

Venar

03-25-2009, 04:46 PM

Is this realy easier to code then a compenent pouch?

moorewr

03-25-2009, 04:46 PM

While you are adding fighting pits, throw a tavern brawl into Meridia and the Portable Hole. If there had been a pit in Meridia I might actually have done some PVP over the last year.. since that's where I tend to putter with inventory between quests.

Question on the challenge - can it only be done by getting the character in your focus orb? No long-distance challenges?

Montrose

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

Hmmmm... I'm really hoping this was a 1 or 2 day work item that just happened to fit into the schedule and not something that got prioritized high based on its own merits.

Or maybe I'm misaken and the telemetry data shows that people are crazy nuts for PvP and this is a big-ticket win.

Still, overall, this news is far less exciting to me than things like bug fixes.

juniorpfactors

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

I am moving on to the new content discussion.... I mean I am still looking for the new content information so I can go discuss it

jrp

Kylstrem

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

Will there be a way for Turbine to keep track of statistics for how often this used (actually accepted challenges)).

This way for future mods when a developer or marketer brings up enhancements for PvP, someone can bring up those stats and say: "Well, we could do more PvP, but 'bang for buck' factor isn't high enough".

What a bunch of **** this new feature is for the large majority of players.

And what a letdown for the people waiting for some new tidbit about Mod 9.

Sheesh!

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

Get the Cube in here and I will make it a Thunderdome everyone will never forget!!! Mad Max ain't got PvP on me....

I just picture an old dude with his belly hanging out w/ Jello all over him.

Eelpout

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

2 man enter, 1 man leave.

Masterblaster!! Masterblaster!!

Angelus_dead

03-25-2009, 04:47 PM

I think you're thinking of the Bogwater, not the Open Palm. Open Palm is located in House J.
In module 3, an ogre NPC was added to the Bogwater tavern with dialog that indicates PVP is allowed there. But it is not.

Apparently some dev wanted the lower level of that room to be PVP enabled.

cdbd3rd

03-25-2009, 04:48 PM

I can't wait for people run though the harbor with n00bs spamming challenges... or conversely, to spam plat spammers with challenges in hopes of their scripts clicking yes for them... :cool:

I was sitting here quietly grumbling about PvP junk - but this one thought has turned it all around. It'll never work that way, but the thought is truly amusing. :D

Impaqt

03-25-2009, 04:49 PM

Perhaps we need a Challenge button added to the forums?

Aesop

03-25-2009, 04:49 PM

Well its not something I would use per se... but hey if somoene gets some fun out of it then that's good... so where is that decline Challenges Button anyway?

Aesop

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:50 PM

Is this realy easier to code then a compenent pouch?

Yes actually.

Anthios888

03-25-2009, 04:50 PM

The game isn't very well-balanced for serious PvP, but it doesn't mean that it's not fun to jump around and kill your friends once in a while. This sounds like it will make PvP easier to start up casually, so maybe it will be more accessible for those down times in between questing. I see no downside to that. Even if this is a feature I use only once a month, it will help PvP nuts get their fix and is an upgrade no matter how you look at it. Thanks for the preview.

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:50 PM

Perhaps we need a Challenge button added to the forums?

Except the Cube doesn't play fair oO

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:51 PM

Perhaps we need a Challenge button added to the forums?

LOL seems that way sometimes. 1/2 the people aren't happy unless they are mad at someone here..

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:52 PM

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:52 PM

So tolero, since your reading this...

Would Turbine Get sued if they named a new PvP area "the thunderdome"?

Put in some areas for people to watch, i bet it would be used and always funny. To me at least.

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:53 PM

Question on the challenge - can it only be done by getting the character in your focus orb? No long-distance challenges?

Correct. If you want to PvP "long distance" like that you're better off visiting the nearest Jackson Laws for a match up. That matching system is still in play.

Guaire

03-25-2009, 04:53 PM

Except the Cube doesn't play fair oO

Two men enter. One cube leaves. :eek:

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:53 PM

So tolero, since your reading this...

Would Turbine Get sued if they named a new PvP area "the thunderdome"

P....robably. Though there might be a way to give it a shout out indirectly :D

Deadz

03-25-2009, 04:54 PM

P....robably. Though there might be a way to give it a shout out indirectly :D

95% percent of the people here would think that was a blast, the other 5% would complain cause that's what they do!

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 04:54 PM

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 04:55 PM

The purpose of this thread is to talk about the new fighting system, not to fight each other :eek: this is not the thunderdome folks.

Correct me if I am wrong Mertolaskero, but from your OP, it reads that the only thing you have changed/added with this is a new Arena of some sort and a new UI?

IF that is the case, and even though I stopped PvP here, I like it!

Far to many times I have wanted to duel a friend or test out something, only to have some smacktard jump in and be an ass - even after a polite notification of what we were up to.

If that is the limit of what has been done for PvP in M9, I will thank you.

slumbering_dragon

03-25-2009, 04:56 PM

with our challanges could we put in plat or equipment as a bet to the fight and the systen will take them from our invintory and the winner gets every thing in the pot.

DoctorWhofan

03-25-2009, 04:56 PM

Thank you for the news, but PvP? Great. Joy. Now I am going to be annoyed by people with the stupid challenge system.

As Jrp said- I'd rather have more quests.

Slink

03-25-2009, 04:56 PM

Anastasios

03-25-2009, 04:58 PM

Except the Cube doesn't play fair oO

Cube's dirty...truth is out people...IT IS TAINTED.

Could it be the reason my favorite word is now censored...Thunderdome awaits and I got just the right weapon to take it out...

Seriously though, never been a fan of PvP, but I know people who enjoy it, if it's an easy thing to do to incorporate in mod 9, then by all means do it. Big deal, life goes on, at least they're trying to make it better for others who may enjoy this aspect of the game...that says a lot imho.

Tolero

03-25-2009, 04:58 PM

In module 3, an ogre NPC was added to the Bogwater tavern with dialog that indicates PVP is allowed there. But it is not.

Apparently some dev wanted the lower level of that room to be PVP enabled.

Hmm I'm aware of the Ogre but I don't recall that he actually says there is PvP in Bogwater. I remember he said something flavorful hired roughian like thing like "RAWR I get paid to smash heads"... or something like that. Will have to check on that, he shouldn't be talking about PvP, the only PvP brawl pits/Jackson Laws areas are Phoenix (Marketplace), Wayward Lobster (Harbor), Open Palm (House J), and Hammersmith (House D)

Deuce

03-25-2009, 04:58 PM

So, I’m just thinking out loud here – suppose you form a party for a quest, leave one guy outside, then middle of quest you have your “Outside Guy” pick a fight with a friend/guildie/someone guaranteed to accept. Everyone goes to arena – heal, buff etc. – then leave the fight. Bam! Maybe not as good as a rest shrine (unless there are Shrines in the arenas? Don’t know, because I haven’t really done PVP). If there are shrines in the arenas, then that’s even sweeter – free shrine anytime you need it without having to leave the quest. Could you initiate a raid PVP fight? If so, then you could do this in the middle of a raid… Thoughts to ponder.

Personally, I don’t PVP, have no interest in it at all, and intend to turn off the option as soon as I log in after Mod 9 goes live…its not game breaking ‘fail’ for me, but I do wish dev resources hadn’t been spent on this until after other issues are resolved.

Thelmallen

03-25-2009, 04:59 PM

Can we have a setting like "anonymous" that allows us to not have to even SEE challenge requests? I don't want to get hit by fifty challenges walking to the bank in the marketplace but I dont' want to have to be anonymous for this to happen.

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 05:00 PM

Thank you for the news, but PvP? Great. Joy. Now I am going to be annoyed by people with the stupid challenge system.

As Jrp said- I'd rather have more quests.

Read what Tolero has posted.

You can turn off the Challenge System.

Only thing annoying here is people's inability to read.

slumbering_dragon

03-25-2009, 05:01 PM

So, Tolero, you mention that two persons can enter a pvp match from "anywhere in the game". Does this also incude from in-quest?

For instance, George and Bill are having a disagreement over which Gelatinous Cube to kill first, after 2 minutes of bickering back and forth, Bill sends George an invite to the pvp pit to settle it once and for all. 1 1/2 minutes later, Bill and George arrive back in the quest, Bill being a little more agreeable on things.

:D

u know that bings another questoin, if loose hp and spen sp in pvp, and tele back to quest are they lost? is pvp tavern regen, and what about death in pvp, if u die there do u have to res out there or are put bakc where u were with 1hp?

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 05:01 PM

can We Have A Setting Like "anonymous" That Allows Us To Not Have To Even See Challenge Requests? I Don't Want To Get Hit By Fifty Challenges Walking To The Bank In The Marketplace But I Dont' Want To Have To Be Anonymous For This To Happen.

if You're Not In The Mood To Accept Challenges, You Can Turn On/off Challenge Acceptances In Your Options Panel At Any Time! otherwise, You Can Leave It On And See Who Picks A Fight As You're Making Your Way Around The Various Public Spaces!

:d

Tolero

03-25-2009, 05:01 PM

So, Tolero, you mention that two persons can enter a pvp match from "anywhere in the game". Does this also incude from in-quest?

You can't be in the same group to challenge the other person

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 05:02 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

totmacher

03-25-2009, 05:02 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

ogog mod 9 ogog

Slink

03-25-2009, 05:03 PM

u know that bings another questoin, if loose hp and spen sp in pvp, and tele back to quest are they lost? is pvp tavern regen, and what about death in pvp, if u die there do u have to res out there or are put bakc where u were with 1hp?

yes that was my question, in a round-about way.

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 05:03 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

To busy *****ing about something they will not use Arko....

;)

Talish

03-25-2009, 05:03 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

Nice catch :D

Slink

03-25-2009, 05:04 PM

You can't be in the same group to challenge the other person

Ok, thank you for the quick answer. :)

maddmatt70

03-25-2009, 05:05 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

Could it be coming in April? Was having trouble believing that it was coming anytime soon because of the lack of any news on that front.

Oxvon

03-25-2009, 05:06 PM

Darn, wish you could fight while in a group. Would have been a new way to win raid loot!

Renegade66

03-25-2009, 05:06 PM

Slink

03-25-2009, 05:07 PM

So in all the bickering everyone failed to notice Tolero's new sig

woot!

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 05:09 PM

DDO has PvP? That's too bad, but does explain a lot. Whatever makes DDO profitable is fine with me though. I can put aside my personal desire for more content rather than PvP that I will never use as long as it helps keep DDO viable.

that is the logical way to look at it, I mean personally I hardly ever pvp, but it is always good fun to hop into a pvp pit especially when the devs spawn stuff

Sequell

03-25-2009, 05:13 PM

I've always felt anything related to PvP was a waste of Dev time and should never have been included in the game. My opinion hasn't changed, but I guess some people will welcome and like this. Would have rather seen a hundred other things done before something like this was ever considered, but whatever...

/shrug

/signed

I could not agree more with you. Maybe do something about the lag instead of introduce something that will just start porting people all over...bad idea and a waste of time IMO.

cdbd3rd

03-25-2009, 05:16 PM

1) Hoping the option is defaulted to 'OFF' - have enough stuff to arrange/toggle/adjust with each new char.

2) PvP tends to lead to smack talk, and for a lot of folks just being around it is not pleasant. If General is going to reach more screens, that's going to be compounded.

But that said, my boy likes to PvP with his friends. He'll like/use this feature.

So basically the opinions of my 2 accounts cancel each other out. :rolleyes:

Slink

03-25-2009, 05:17 PM

Could it be coming in April? Was having trouble believing that it was coming anytime soon because of the lack of any news on that front.

People seem to forget there are alot of reasons why Turbine would keep things quiet. They do care for this community more than most people are willing to admit. There are times when business is business.

I am hopeful for the new module not for my sake but the community as a whole. Everyone that posts here, no matter how they might disagree, are here because they love the game. Otherwise, they just would not bother.

Am I enthralled with this new info, no, I won't lie. But, every new module they have released has been fun. Even if not succesful for the masses, it was still a blast at the time, at least for me it was.

The_Phenx

03-25-2009, 05:18 PM

/shrug

I might use it from time to time... I wish we could use landscape outdoor explorer areas for pvp tho... that might make things more amusing.

Imagine a 12 vs 12 guild brawl in the cerulean hills

Mockduck

03-25-2009, 05:20 PM

Sure, PvP isn't for a majority of the average DDO folks, but it's got a following. I don't PvP, largely because my experiences have been lots of short, quick deaths at the hands of the uber-equipped (or much higher levelled). I think killing some time with guildies in PvP or friends will be cool though, especially with the nice interface this seems to be getting. I don't know, it may actually motivate me to PvP!

I think DDO should offer all sorts of things, including stuff I'm not into.

Personally, one of the best benefits of PvP has been it's impact on testing things out, making videos and other stuff. So there are ancillary benefits to this change as well. Having a private arena-like instance to "film" stuff will be cool as well. Or hold contests/giveaways/rp nights/etc.

What is the current limit for PvP? Is is six, 12, unlimited?

Wrustle

03-25-2009, 05:20 PM

I am not too excited about anything PVP but hey, it's something. I am sure more than a few will find enjoyment from this feature. I am thankful that they at least will give us an ''off'' switch. Could you imagine how many unwanted challenges you will get EVERY SINGLE TIME you log in if you have that turned on? Oh well, to each his own.

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 05:22 PM

One request Tolero, is to give us screenshots, they go a long way to showing us how it will work, and adds to the discussion

thatguy

03-25-2009, 05:23 PM

slumbering_dragon

03-25-2009, 05:24 PM

hey tolero, what is the max peeps in the new pvp challenge area? could we do a 12v12 group?

Roman

03-25-2009, 05:26 PM

PvP is a fun distraction every now and then but why in the world were valuable development hours put into this feature? :confused::confused::confused:

Wizzly_Bear

03-25-2009, 05:26 PM

i don't care about pvp personally and would rather see new content, but if it helps DDO then i'm for it.

/hoping it does

Wizzly_Bear

03-25-2009, 05:27 PM

PvP is a fun distraction every now and then but why in the world were valuable development hours put into this feature? :confused::confused::confused:
i'm sure this did not take hours. maybe minutes.

Flex

03-25-2009, 05:28 PM

All I can say is thank you. Yes, I am a very casual player. I rarely post. Obviously PVP is not the focus of this game, but I do appreciate any enhancement that makes it a little easier to get something going.

DDO is a great game, but sometimes a break from the grind is nice. The current system made it very difficult to get any decent PVP going. I left DDO for six months to play AoC just for a better PVP experience. Yes, that game is lacking in many ways. Not that it is any consolation to the hardcore veterans, but these little changes are likely to keep me and my friend around when we get the PVP itch.

Thrudh

03-25-2009, 05:36 PM

Hmmm... at first I was kind of "you're stealing my content for this *blah*"... but now that I think about it... they're just adding an extra entry point into the already existing PVP code, probably not using any content builder time, and this will be a great way for even nonPvP'ers to grab a guildy and test out some new effect or stacking'ness or enh respec or ....

Good but not great. Can we have Mod 9 now?

Yeah I was the same way... mad at first, but really, it's just a new way to get to existing PvP areas... that are already coded... This is actually pretty decent for the small amount of work it probably took...

Lorien_the_First_One

03-25-2009, 05:37 PM

If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time!

Ah well I guess I know the first click after "turn off help prompts" for me from now on.

Gum

03-25-2009, 05:40 PM

Imagine a 12 vs 12 guild brawl in the cerulean hills

Oh man, that would be awesome.

Personally, one of the best benefits of PvP has been it's impact on testing things out, making videos and other stuff. So there are ancillary benefits to this change as well. Having a private arena-like instance to "film" stuff will be cool as well. Or hold contests/giveaways/rp nights/etc.

Man, your right, this should really help with contest rp nights etc. Nice

I like it. I recall many people in game wanting an improvement to PvP. This should be interesting, and I look forward to it. Also, teleporting in any shape, form, or fashion is much appreciated lol. Very nice flavor to the game, :) ty.

Deuce

03-25-2009, 05:45 PM

You can't be in the same group to challenge the other person

But if you leave a guy outside an instance, and he challenges someone, can the people INSIDE the instance accept? And would it reset the instance?

I ask, because this section of the announcement - "You can fight in combinations of 1 vs 6, 3 vs 3, or any other group configuration you want." - would seem to indicate that you can do a challenge as a raid party.

If so, I can already think of ways this could be...used...especially if there are shrines in the arena areas...

Montrose

03-25-2009, 05:47 PM

Ah well I guess I know the first click after "turn off help prompts" for me from now on.

Before or after enabling voice chat?

HeavenlyCloud

03-25-2009, 05:47 PM

Thank you Turbine :D you made me happy.

Dizrol

03-25-2009, 05:48 PM

So it looks again like we've revamped that and changed this and....what?!?! lack of new content..............again??

Dark-Star

03-25-2009, 05:54 PM

it adds flavor to the game

So does a timely release of Mod 9...

I am a vet, I like to pvp once in a while, but I don't see how this will substantially enhance my pvp experience.

Granted we are looking at it from the outside, but it seems to many of us that these resources could have be used elsewhere... 3BC anyone?

It just doesn't seem like the person setting design/content strategy for the last year is listening to the people that play this game.

Drider

03-25-2009, 05:55 PM

So how long before the nerf so and so class. :p

Deuce

03-25-2009, 05:56 PM

So how long before the nerf so and so class. :p

What, you mean to balance out PVP? Oh, I figure mod 10 or so...but maybe a patch, just depends....

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 05:56 PM

So does a timely release of Mod 9...

I am a vet, I like to pvp once in a while, but I don't see how this will substantially enhance my pvp experience.

Granted we are looking at it from the outside, but it seems to many of us that these resources could have be used elsewhere... 3BC anyone?

It just doesn't seem like the person setting design/content strategy for the last year is listening to the people that play this game.

you assume that everyone plays the game the way you do, that is a false assumption with no data to back it up.

Krell

03-25-2009, 05:58 PM

Interesting, but if you really wanted to make it interesting let players also put items or plat in a trade window and have the game deliver them to the match winner.

One fun thing about going red (PvP) in Asherons Call is that the dead body would drop a few possesions that the victor would loot. There was a certain satisfaction in looting your victim. Also you could inscribe items with a limited amount of text and the inscription could only be removed by the player that inscribed it. I remember seeing a number of items in the shop inscribed with "looted from the corpse of playername".

I think it would add flavor if you had an opportunity to "get their stuff" if you are victorious. Of course whatever items or plat entered in the window before the match would be mutually agreed upon and voluntary.

Maybe instead of the previous ****orGoRed t-shirts from Turbine (South Tenkarradun Foundry University on the front, Go Reds! on the back), we'll see ****orGoArena (Silver Teachings of the Flame University).

Raithe

03-25-2009, 06:07 PM

So how long before the nerf so and so class. :p

I think it started to get bad around Mod 5. Lots of people were annoyed casters didn't need them.

EDIT:

I think this change could most definitely inspire some roleplaying, as the challenges are not dependent on being in a particular location. So I like it, but I don't think it's enough to actually draw a larger market to the game.

Dark-Star

03-25-2009, 06:10 PM

you assume that everyone plays the game the way you do, that is a false assumption with no data to back it up.

Wrong.

I assume correctly that most people are the way I am: they quest, they raid, they occasionally (or never) PVP, and they are new content starved. And I can back that up with every gaming session I play.

maddmatt70

03-25-2009, 06:16 PM

Wrong.

I assume correctly that most people are the way I am: they quest, they raid, they occasionally (or never) PVP, and they are new content starved. And I can back that up with every gaming session I play.

Hmm, well Dark-Star the way I read this is another means to attract new players to the game or keep new players in the game that care about PVP. It is undeniable that people like PVP in other mmos so there is a market for it for sure. Some people have argued in the past that DDO should have put a much larger investment in PVP as a means to be more sustainable. It is not really debateable that DDO could use a bump in subscriptions. More subscriptions will equal more quests and raids which is something me and you want. If a better PVP environment leads to more subscriptions I am all for it..

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 06:18 PM

Wrong.

I assume correctly that most people are the way I am: they quest, they raid, they occasionally (or never) PVP, and they are new content starved. And I can back that up with every gaming session I play.

so you play with maybe 40 different people and you think that is an accurate picture, of course they have the same opinion, they are in the same guild and you play with like minded players, but to think that you make up the majority of all player types in DDO, is not supported by any actual statistics.
I know people who have been playing this game since the beginning and they are just bringing their first player to cap, why because they have been playing once or twice a week, and they do every quest not just power level to 16 in a week like some of us do, do they make up the majority of the player base nobody knows except turbine, and after looking at all the changes I see coming out with mod 9 and the last year, something tells me the numbers are much different than your average forum goer thinks they are. Because if the majority of players wer "Vets" and hardcore and only cared about content, that is what they would have focused on.

ArkoHighStar

03-25-2009, 06:19 PM

Hmm, well Dark-Star the way I read this is another means to attract new players to the game or keep new players to the game that care about PVP. It is undeniable that people like PVP in other mmos so there is a market for it for sure. Some people have argued in the past that DDO should have put a much larger investment in PVP as a means to be more sustainable. It is not really debateable that DDO could use a bump in subscriptions. More subscriptions will equal more quests and raids which is something me and you want. If a better PVP environment leads to more subscriptions I am all for it..

well said

Tolero

03-25-2009, 06:21 PM

What is the current limit for PvP? Is is six, 12, unlimited?

The max for the challenge system is currently 6 v 6

Alavatar

03-25-2009, 06:25 PM

i'm sure this did not take hours. maybe minutes.

I bet it did take hours. But, I also bet that this is more GUI work and less code/art work.

Roberto

03-25-2009, 06:27 PM

PvP is a fun distraction every now and then but why in the world were valuable development hours put into this feature?

Probably not as much as it might seem, since from the description, it sounds a HECK of a lot like the /spar feature in LOTRO.

Gorstag

03-25-2009, 06:37 PM

Kinda a meh thing for me personally. I mostly play rogues, and most rogues would be a fool to activly seek pvp. Between blindness ward, heavy fort, and actually being targeted by your opponent there simply is no point to trying it.

Gratch

03-25-2009, 06:42 PM

Any chance that a given challenge includes the new also /emote'able animation /faceslap or /gloveslap or /*****slap.

Are we ever getting new emotes or are all the animation resources monster/new races engaged?

/cheer2 for Tolero's sig.

ChaelaAnne

03-25-2009, 06:44 PM

T, thanks for delivering on the promise made about the Escapist voting. It's nice to know you are in the players corner.

That said, my birthday is April 15th, and it would be SO awesome to be playing new content. So like, if you could release the mod the Wed. before, that would be PERFECT for me. Pretty please? :D

Lorichie

03-25-2009, 06:51 PM

I dont care about pvp.
I dont like pvp.
I've pvp'd mebbe half a dozen times since it came to the game.
I will be turning off the accept challenges clickie.
I would rather have any number of other things in the game before this...

That said, there are those that like this, so i'm happy for them that they got a shiny. Who am i exactly to moan and complain because something was added to the game that i dont like? Who am i exactly to think that i know better than anyone else what needs to be added to the game and when?

I have my thoughts and ideas, but they in no way come before or in replacement of anyone else's thoughts and ideas. To think so is just a little bit regressive.

R

Timjc86

03-25-2009, 06:51 PM

Yet another reason for something like this (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=172493). C'mon, give rogues a chance. :D

akla_thornfist

03-25-2009, 06:52 PM

not a pvper at all but i know some folks like it so whatever, i will try it a few times then go back to my quest for the most uber of loot:D

Andora

03-25-2009, 07:01 PM

Read what Tolero has posted.

You can turn off the Challenge System.

Only thing annoying here is people's inability to read.

DrWhoFan and I are some of the few who monitor general chat to help new players. This is going to be in general as well as the childish taunts about why we have challenges turned off.

For me this is not about growing PVP, as much as it is about annoying me. When I started many young ones still played DDO and even with decline guild invites turned on I was blasted with tells asking me to join a "new" guild. Or, "why would I not join" said guild. Reporting someone falls into the wasting my time area.

They want to grow PVP, fine. It is not something I want to do but I have no problems with others wanting it. I do have a problem when it starts to hamper my having fun, and helping new players is fun for me. That was hampered all ready by removing tells from trial accounts. No matter what you might think not all trial players are plat farmers.

On a side note, I am not a power gamer. I do know we need more quests. That is a fact. Level cap is going to 20. Players are going to need more things to do. Deal with the fact that many are unhappy with the lack of any information about this. Questing is the number one thing to do with DDO. It is why many of us are here. Getting nasty with anyone who is unhappy this will not make you right, or a better smarter person.

WolfSpirit

03-25-2009, 07:01 PM

Are we all going to have to cancel our subscriptions to get the message accross that most of us don't give a flying #$#$ about PVP! Can't you stop wasting time developing this #$#$ and do some real work....you definatly no longer have my vote! and now I might have to activily Campain against turbine so they loose! What utter CR*P!:mad:

Just so you know, there is a huge following for PvP though most are not nearly as vocal as the nay sayers of the Forums.
And let me draw your thoughts to another point.
One of the things MANY subscribers to WoW have to say is that they really enjoy the Evil vs Good with the PvP aspect of stalking and killing other PCs. Now this isn't feasable in our Good/Neutral world that we currently play in but it sure goes a long way.
If we keep appealing to MANY people and not just the Nay sayers, this game may just grab popularity with Thousands more people who DO enjoy this sort of thing.

Another point:
The in-game PvP game Capture the Flag is really alot of fun! This from someone who doesn't actually PvP but I do enjoy this part.
I had the time of my gaming life doing Capture the flag but VERY few in our guild wanted to try it because its PvP. Last night I was able to "Slip" a Raid amount of us into a game and we ended up playing for 3 Hours straight. EVERYONE had an blast and each and everyone one wanted us to set aside time weekly for it.
So even if your not a PvPer, do try to be tolerant of those who do enjoy it. And maybe you should try it out before you condemn it people. You might be missing something thats loads of fun.
-
One last point about Mod 9 being so far away and I think its our own fault.

It is my belief that we all would be playing in Mod 9 with lv 20s or close if we, as a community, wasn't so Negitave about EVERYTHING DDO Staff puts out. Very rarely is there a thread without it being set afire by loads of Negatave people who all cry their love for this game by showing anger. I believe that DDO would let us play if we were more patient with them. But I'm sure they have learned a fair amount of "Fear" from us when we rip every upgrade and possible change apart in furious comments like the one above. So instead of giving us the more raw version, they are probably trying to iron out EVERY little bug because the vast majority of the Forum Goers are out here waiting to jump on the smallest bug with rage and an outcry with Silly Signatures.
I am left to ask, why do so many Love to Hate this game SO much?
Where is our patience?

Then again...

I'm sure there will be 10 Negative people ready to List a pile of Petty reasons below in an attempt to be clever and show how my patience is wrong and I too should change my Signature to reflect my Hatred for this Loved Game...

Dark_Helmet

03-25-2009, 07:03 PM

so you play with maybe 40 different people and you think that is an accurate picture, of course they have the same opinion, they are in the same guild and you play with like minded players, but to think that you make up the majority of all player types in DDO, is not supported by any actual statistics.
...blah blah blah... I am so smart and you are a loser comments removed...

I think it came out during the last survey how much PVP was not supported by the community. That is why an intern probably did this work (j/k Phax! :p)

Speaking of which, I think Tolero needs to do another poll ranking the activities not just in order related to each other, but rank each individually on its own merits (so you can give a 10/10 for chain quests and explorer areas while giving a 1/10 for PvP - just an example... not that I hate PvP, oh wait I do! :D)

I would also create a ranking system showing concept (what you think of the idea) and execution (how playable it is) to see where people consider the weakenesses are located.

This should be a private survey that they can just publish results. Too many times people place in comments that just start a flame war (just like the pointed attacks against each other above).

The one thing you could collect in a thread was the original "If you could change 3 things in DDO, what would you change", collate the data, then create a survey based on the top 10 answers from people. After people vote on them, it can give you an idea of what the people who read the forums are thinking. If you were really inspired, you would make an in-game survey that can be filled out by a player (maybe during the login? and not changing of characters) so you could get the people who stay away from the forums due to all the flaming. Oh yeah, don't let trial accounts fill it out (we know what all those farmers really want ;)).

WeaselKing

03-25-2009, 07:05 PM

PVP challenges:the new trade window.

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 07:08 PM

DrWhoFan and I are some of the few who monitor general chat to help new players. This is going to be in general as well as the childish taunts about why we have challenges turned off.

For me this is not about growing PVP, as much as it is about annoying me. When I started many young ones still played DDO and even with decline guild invites turned on I was blasted with tells asking me to join a "new" guild. Or, "why would I not join" said guild. Reporting someone falls into the wasting my time area.

They want to grow PVP, fine. It is not something I want to do but I have no problems with others wanting it. I do have a problem when it starts to hamper my having fun, and helping new players is fun for me. That was hampered all ready by removing tells from trial accounts. No matter what you might think not all trial players are plat farmers.

On a side note, I am not a power gamer. I do know we need more quests. That is a fact. Level cap is going to 20. Players are going to need more things to do. Deal with the fact that many are unhappy with the lack of any information about this. Questing is the number one thing to do with DDO. It is why many of us are here. Getting nasty with anyone who is unhappy this will not make you right, or a better smarter person.

And this has to do with said poster being "annoyed by people with the stupid challenge system" how?

:confused:

ChildrenofBodom

03-25-2009, 07:11 PM

Don't worry about the haters Tolero. You guys didn't waste your Dev time. It will be fun and help bring in new people. I have said to some of my friends that they should play DDO, and on their top 10 list of questions is "Is there good PvP?"

Also, saying that they satisfied 1% of the DDO population is a very ignorant statement. Your calculations are off. I don't know any people that don't enjoy PvPing with friends and guildies. It's not about who is better, it's about having fun. Which is kinda the whole point of the game.

Thanks Tolero for the update!!

Borror0

03-25-2009, 07:14 PM

I bet it did take hours. But, I also bet that this is more GUI work and less code/art work.
"Hours" when talking about something Turbine has been working for months is pretty insignificant.

Hurunewyz

03-25-2009, 07:18 PM

First off,Thank You, Tolero. Great Job as usual!

Next, I'd just like to give my two cents to Turbine's ear: This addition sounds fun to me and is just another reason to keep playing...I've been playing DDO "casually" for a few years. I've heard the arguments for and against PvP. Having come back to the game several times and by no means a regular PvP'er, I think this adds to the game's depth, variety and appeal. Especially for RP or downtime between quests. I used to hear people complain that PvP would be the "death" of DDO and have found that, so far, that's not the case here. So far, I think the PvP aspect of DDO has room to grow and has been implemented in such a way that it can help attract new players, keep the game fresh, and not alienate those who don't choose to PvP. Anyways, again, just my two cents. Thanks, Turbine!

BigBadBarry

03-25-2009, 07:42 PM

"Hours" when talking about something Turbine has been working for months is pretty insignificant.

And who's to know how and who they got to do the development.
Not every developer can build new quests. (Like when henchmen were done people said "Id prefer more content/quests" - but Codog, who developed henchmen, doesn't do quests)

Who's to say they didn't use the development for training purposes - or have it developed as a side project during lulls ("I got an hour whilst I wait for this to come back from QA - i'll jump onto that pvp code I been working on")

Pyromaniac

03-25-2009, 07:47 PM

GhostNull

03-25-2009, 07:49 PM

Definitely going to need some sort of “Auto Decline” for one-on-one PvP invites. You do know there will be "those" people that’ll just run around spamming them.

Vordax

03-25-2009, 07:58 PM

And who's to know how and who they got to do the development.
Not every developer can build new quests. (Like when henchmen were done people said "Id prefer more content/quests" - but Codog, who developed henchmen, doesn't do quests)

Who's to say they didn't use the development for training purposes - or have it developed as a side project during lulls ("I got an hour whilst I wait for this to come back from QA - i'll jump onto that pvp code I been working on")

Where I work we use the agile process and decide what will get done for each months "sprint". A lot of the projects we develop are large and take 2-3 weeks. So that leaves us with a 1-2 weeks left, not enough for a big project, but it is enough to get in some of the smaller features that only a smaller user base would use. I would imagine something like that could easily have happened here.

Vordax

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 08:16 PM

Poor choice to put effort against this when the game is dying from lack of content and horrific lag.

Can we challenge the person in PVP who decided that this is more important than new content or fixing the lag?

Do you know for sure that this was not done in ADDITION to new content?

Do you know if content and the devs that did this are on the same 'team' or are they separate?

No, you don't. There are separate 'teams' all working on separate projects at the same time.

BigBadBarry

03-25-2009, 08:23 PM

Where I work we use the agile process and decide what will get done for each months "sprint". A lot of the projects we develop are large and take 2-3 weeks. So that leaves us with a 1-2 weeks left, not enough for a big project, but it is enough to get in some of the smaller features that only a smaller user base would use. I would imagine something like that could easily have happened here.

Vordax

Agree Vordax. You might not get the 1-2 weeks sometimes if there's overrun or a bug comes from nowhere, but I'm sure sometimes you do.

Who's to say they didn't also want to cross-skill someone in the PvP code and use this small project as the vehicle to pick up how it works.

muffinlad

03-25-2009, 08:26 PM

Several thoughts from muffinland, home of the muffinpeople.

A) I spend all day telling developers what to develop, working with clients to get more things for developers to develop, talking to people what we are developing.

I am not going to do that here.

B) I don't care for PvP. Partially because I suck at it, partially because I don't enjoy smacking my friends around, partially because I am a very rewards driven person, and dont see any real reward from it. What ever the reason, not a big fan.

I think this is fine. I think long term, PvP gets us to Player Driven Content, and that saves the game and the industry. It is a long road, but they have to take steps with it, more power to them.

Even though I have no interest in using it.

Further, I am guessing they are going to make the challenge button default to on as a way to encourage people to know about the feature. This is a mistake.

Good UI here says it should be rolled out as TURNED OFF, and give people the option to turn it on, OR, have a "turn this off" button when it is offered to them the first few times.

Regs,

muffincode

Big_Russ

03-25-2009, 08:28 PM

Yes, this is horrible, this idea. -- Samir Nagheenanajar

:(

Big_Russ

03-25-2009, 08:32 PM

Do you know for sure that this was not done in ADDITION to new content?

If this was done in ADDITION, then ADDITIONAL content should have been made instead.

Do you know if content and the devs that did this are on the same 'team' or are they separate?

If this was done by a separate team, then I would suggest merging teams and creating more content.

Jesen

03-25-2009, 08:33 PM

People still PVP in DDO?

Tell another joke! That was a good one.

Memnir

03-25-2009, 08:35 PM

.
.
.
.
.
.......http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn12/EnPsyane/Disapproval.jpg
.
.

Vordax

03-25-2009, 08:38 PM

If this was done in ADDITION, then ADDITIONAL content should have been made instead.

If this was done by a separate team, then I would suggest merging teams and creating more content.

Different skill sets here bud, can't always do that. And to answer your next question: NO they can't fire the UI person to hire a creative person.. still need UI work done.

Vordax

Big_Russ

03-25-2009, 08:40 PM

Different skill sets here bud, can't always do that. And to answer your next question: NO they can't fire the UI person to hire a creative person.. still need UI work done.

Vordax

In a budget, manhours are manhours. You can certainly take money away from the "UI guy budget" and give it to the "content developer guy budget." That is MOST DEFINITELY in Turbine's control.

Stamp3de

03-25-2009, 08:41 PM

Thank u devs!!
I think the fun of pvp is underestimated in this game. People think that everyone spams pws and other "cheezy" spells all day long so they frown upon spending time pvping. But when u agree to a set of rules between u and the person ur fighting, it makes pvp much more enjoyable. Yes in tavern brawls there is that one idiot who will spam spells on lowbies, well now u can just open up ur own instance.

In my experience most idiots who want to annoy people do it in the lobster. Most of the time, if u want some peace just to fight ur friend, u can goto another tavern. And just because someone doesn't appreciate one thing it doesn't mean it should be overlooked, even if most people don't want it.

The more alleys that the devs explore will eventually result in more subscribers. And to those who say the devs should have spent their time on something people think are more beneficial, how can u prove they chose to work on pvp instead of other things? besides the obvious. -_-

WorldTraveler

03-25-2009, 08:49 PM

I never pvp and didn't sign up to pay each month to play against other people, but rather with other people. It is a fact
that it is some peoples' thing and so I disagree with all the whining that it is a waste of time. Not just from the point
of view that somehow it must have taken time away from something else (as has been pointed out, it probably took little if
any to adjust existing code). I disagree that it's a waste of time on the simple basis that if it is an improvement that
makes the game better or more fun for any new or existing players, then by definition, it IS the developers successfully
doing their job.

That said, I found one of the most annoying things about my fairly brief stint in WOW (six weeks of unplayability in DDO
stemming from a change of our apartment server they had to fix) the fact that even though I had chosen to play on a server
that was not pvp, I couldn't go anywhere more than a little ways down the road without having a flag thrown down and a
challenge to decline. Not sure if there was a similar option in their game to simply turn the challenges off or to some
kind of auto-decline, but I am spared having to give this a big thumbs down to read that you can in fact turn it off here.
I agree with those who have said already that it would be very counterproductive to the efforts to give new players good
experiences while they are still making up their minds to not expose them to automaticly having spammed challenges by
setting the default to off. You can even have the first prominent tooltip that pops up when you either skip tutorial or
get through the first dungeon and appear there for the first time in Korthos explain to new players that if they want to,
there is this option that is off now, but can be turned on. Also, not sure I'd clog the general chat channel with the
kind of trash talking that is to some people kinda funny, to some indifferent, but to others (and perhaps the parents of
kids when on too) offensive. It is really something that only matters to those pvping anyhow, and maybe any people who
are watching. Since it will just teleport you to one of these existing arenas in their particular bars, leave their chat
there where it belongs.

cardmj1

03-25-2009, 08:57 PM

Are these going to be new arenas, or will these challenges take you to the usual places? IE Wayward Lobster, Phoenix Tavern, etc.

If it takes you around Stormreach, I am ALL for this (and I hate PvP.) I will use this feature with a friend to "teleport" around places I want to go. :-D

Teleport? hmmm. In Reaver's Refuge, bound in Meridia, need to go to House J. I challlenge you sir to a duel and a teleport!

Yep, I can see me using this.

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 09:04 PM

If this was done in ADDITION, then ADDITIONAL content should have been made instead.

If this was done by a separate team, then I would suggest merging teams and creating more content.

Sorry, but Kate has the job of Management and this IS content. Sorry that you won't enjoy it, but like all content it is not for everyone.

Big_Russ

03-25-2009, 09:11 PM

Sorry, but Kate has the job of Management and this IS content. Sorry that you won't enjoy it, but like all content it is not for everyone.

OK. Let me clarify. Money should be spent on NEW QUESTS.

:rolleyes:

Oreg

03-25-2009, 09:16 PM

If this keeps new players in the game I am all for it. Some people out there like pvp. You forum vets don't, but I see this as a substantial improvement to the system and will be yet another thing that keeps new players around. Thumbs Up Developers and Turbine..

Ths implies that people left in the past because there was no pvp. People leave this game for a myriad of reasons, not one of which is lack of pvp. Solve the problems and keep the people you do have before you worry about attracting new players, for they too will leave if the problems aren't solved.

Any real businessman knows this...

Borror0

03-25-2009, 09:17 PM

OK. Let me clarify. Money should be spent on NEW QUESTS.
New quests is old player player retention. Improvements like PvP is mostly new player retention and also (to a lesser extent) old player retention.

It would be unwise to only aim at keeping old players around and hope the current game is enough to attract new players. What you're asking Turbine to do is to stop making their game more competitive and only keep you interested. If a factory would do that, they would eventually go bankrupt because they would not be as productive as other factories.

miceelf88

03-25-2009, 09:29 PM

If they don't fix the lag, they won't retain anyone, eventually. I also don't at all see how trying to be a second-rate WOW, instead of building on DDO's strengths is a good thing, but perhaps there's something about PvP that I'm missing.

Oreg

03-25-2009, 09:29 PM

New quests is old player player retention. Improvements like PvP is mostly new player retention and also (to a lesser extent) old player retention.

It would be unwise to only aim at keeping old players around and hope the current game is enough to attract new players. What you're asking Turbine to do is to stop making their game more competitive and only keep you interested. If a factory would do that, they would eventually go bankrupt because they would not be as productive as other factories.

Sorry but I disagree. Limited PVP in the manner that it will be upgraded to will not be enough to attract new players nor keep them. Any pvp centirc player who would try DDO solely because of PVP will soon be dissatisfied with its limitations and leave. They are not changing the pvp mechanic just adding the challenge feature. So if DDO PVP ver. 1 didn't work, what makes you think adding a "challenge" feature will work? At best it will be a diversion to existing players and in a few months about as utilized as the current pvp system. (after all it is the same mechanic just with a different invitation system)

SteeleTrueheart

03-25-2009, 09:33 PM

I PvP rarely and only as a time filler / guild fun thing. This impacts me not at all. But a new feature is a new feature and if someone interested in the game is also interested in PvP and this feature makes DDO just that little bit more appealing, then sure it was worth the effort.

I think the forumites would be more interested in other details like No. of Quests. New opponent races. Any crafting/named items. AKA what will we be grinding for and in over the next 6 months.

The little bits you are giving out / new features / concept art would really go well in say THIRD PARTY info release. Where is the online media for this game? An article would be happy to give specific info like this instead of giving quest details away which we know they wouldn't be able to give too much on a quest. But they could give out all the details to a new feature.

Nice addition, but will affect few.

Borror0

03-25-2009, 09:43 PM

At best it will be a diversion to existing players
What's wrong with that if it required very little time?

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 09:45 PM

OK. Let me clarify. Money should be spent on NEW QUESTS.

:rolleyes:

And it has. In addition to this and other features.

:rolleyes:

Oreg

03-25-2009, 09:49 PM

What's wrong with that if it required very little time?

Absolutely nothing. Nor did I say there was anything wrong with it. I was stating that I did not agree that this improvement would lead to new player retention.

Hendrik

03-25-2009, 09:53 PM

What's wrong with that if it required very little time?

Because Borror, many people here just think of themselves.

:mad:

gemini26

03-25-2009, 09:59 PM

I have yet to pvp in this game. D&D 3.5 in general wasn't made for pvp and there is a lot of imbalance between player classes against each other. No matter how skillful you are at playing class A, class B always has a significant advantage over you, just due to the mechanics. However I know there are a lot of people that do pvp and enjoy it a lot, and if this makes it easier for them then good.

Also, everyone is talking about wanting new quests... There's quests I haven't even seen yet on any of my chars. From level 2 stuff all the way up. There are already tons of quests to do, and people don't do them. I may see 50 different lfms up over the course of a play period, and they are all the same 10 (or less) quests. I'm all for new content, but there are lots of people that have probably never done half of the old content while they rush to the max level and then whine about being bored. And hey, if you are bored.. Try out the new pvp! :p

Dark_Helmet

03-25-2009, 10:00 PM

Ths implies that people left in the past because there was no pvp. People leave this game for a myriad of reasons, not one of which is lack of pvp. Solve the problems and keep the people you do have before you worry about attracting new players, for they too will leave if the problems aren't solved.

Any real businessman knows this...

Actually, there were a couple of people who left because there was no PvP way back before it was added (gotta read all those goodbye threads a bit closer). It was few and far between, but I know people who went to Conan so they could play PvP (glad some of them left actually as they only whined about not being able to solo some adventures;)).

That said, Some DnD "old timers" (like me) have a problem with PvP because DnD is mainly a teamwork vs. the monsters quest (don't get me started about solo content :mad:).

I believe one of the main problems that DDO "old timers" have with PvP was the rule changes that were made to accomodate the PvP and screwed the questers.

So, it isn't such a big deal - unless they make rule changes to accomodate the PvP crowd again!

miceelf88

03-25-2009, 10:39 PM

HOnestly, if people are into PvP in a major way, they'll be playing a different game. There's no way for DDO to have enough PvP content to compete with PVP centric games or with even PVP friendly games. At least not while retaining the focus on team-based PvE stuff that is what drew me to DDO in the first place.

This, combined with the complete lack of update or movement on lag is just a real kick in the pants.

(sigh)

adamkatt

03-25-2009, 10:42 PM

I sure all the players that do pvp wont give up their advantage of the tavern brawl and easy jump out technique.

Bradik_Losdar

03-25-2009, 11:01 PM

You can't be in the same group to challenge the other person

Why not? They are the ones who annoy me the most! :D

Yshkabibble

03-25-2009, 11:19 PM

Meh

tihocan

03-25-2009, 11:38 PM

You can't be in the same group to challenge the other person
Ouch, you just removed pretty much the only hope of me using this system. I'd rather PvP with friends I know and can chat with (for instance while waiting for someone to fill up a group) than randomly click on people who cross my path in Stormreach.

Riggs

03-25-2009, 11:47 PM

The max for the challenge system is currently 6 v 6

When pvp was first announced most people were very against it. As long as it was involuntary essentially.

This idea is actually really cool.

D&D is fundamentally a group game, with group tactics, and every class has strengths and weaknesses etc. One of the nastiest fights wasnt between a party and a monster generally, but between a party and a well played NPC party.

As a chessgame, the possibilities of a 3 on 3, or 6 on 6 battle are huge, and would be a lot of fun to play out.

Tavern pvp is lame, and any time a few ppl jump in to mess around trying to test something out, or beat on each other within like 1 minute a bunch of yahoos pile in and start backstabbing someone for kicks - which is why involuntary pvp is stupid and lame.

This idea will be a lot of fun. Props.

It would be nice to be able to have some kind of chat or voice set up as a 'supergroup', so that you can taunt and make fun of the other side while fighting other than having to send tells or general chat (which is going to get very messy when annoying people start using it to spam insults at each other).

Angelus_dead

03-26-2009, 12:01 AM

Actually, there were a couple of people who left because there was no PvP way back
That is true.

However, the form of PvP that was added won't be enough to satisfy those people. In fact, one could almost call it false advertising: announce PvP so you can pull in players who enjoy that, hoping they won't unsubscribe instantly when they discover how lifeless the PvP gameplay is.

(For a view of the kind of design effort it takes to build real PvP gameplay, walk over to the LOTRO room and ask how the creep vs minstrel balance is turning out. For the amount of development LOTRO has put in, it still has serious problems. Even Warcraft has PvP popularity shortcomings (http://wowriot.gameriot.com/blogs/The-Life-e-Casual/Season-5-Now-65-Less-Popular))

Angelus_dead

03-26-2009, 12:02 AM

Ouch, you just removed pretty much the only hope of me using this system. I'd rather PvP with friends I know and can chat with (for instance while waiting for someone to fill up a group)
That is true. Passing the time while waiting for a group to fill would have been the primary reason for PVP dueling.

Big_Russ

03-26-2009, 12:30 AM

Sorry but I disagree. Limited PVP in the manner that it will be upgraded to will not be enough to attract new players nor keep them. Any pvp centirc player who would try DDO solely because of PVP will soon be dissatisfied with its limitations and leave. They are not changing the pvp mechanic just adding the challenge feature. So if DDO PVP ver. 1 didn't work, what makes you think adding a "challenge" feature will work? At best it will be a diversion to existing players and in a few months about as utilized as the current pvp system. (after all it is the same mechanic just with a different invitation system)

Bingo!

sisterjinx

03-26-2009, 12:45 AM

Just one more thing I've got to remember to turn off on every new character. PVP is so NOT for me.

Dark-Star

03-26-2009, 01:15 AM

so you play with maybe 40 different people and you think that is an accurate picture, of course they have the same opinion, they are in the same guild and you play with like minded players, but to think that you make up the majority of all player types in DDO, is not supported by any actual statistics.
I know people who have been playing this game since the beginning and they are just bringing their first player to cap, why because they have been playing once or twice a week, and they do every quest not just power level to 16 in a week like some of us do, do they make up the majority of the player base nobody knows except turbine, and after looking at all the changes I see coming out with mod 9 and the last year, something tells me the numbers are much different than your average forum goer thinks they are.

Now you are just making facts up to be argumentative. To imply that someone that has been playing the game since the beginning regularly and without interuption to their subscription and does not hava a single capped character makes up even 1% of the population is being rediculous, and you know it.

You know nothing about me, so again making up your own facts only further discredits you. I play with far more than 40 players on a regular or casual basis, and even if you don't, all you would have to do is read the forums lately to see people's frustrations. It does not take a rocket scientist to look at the Who tab and see that a guilded level 16 character makes of the majority by far.

Furthermore, to suggest that the majority does not want the expiditon of new content, or greater amounts of new content over a new way to use the existing PvP system is laughable.

Because if the majority of players wer "Vets" and hardcore and only cared about content, that is what they would have focused on.

Exactly, many of us feel they are out of touch. How is the beautiful yet misdirected work they did in Three Barrel Cove listening to players? That zone and those quests are essentially dead compared to raids and end game quests. Had that been Vale 2.0 instead it would still get consistent play.The fact that DDO has PvP is fine, we just don't need to rehash it at the expense of more meaningful Dev endeavors.

Claver

03-26-2009, 01:53 AM

To imply that someone that has been playing the game since the beginning regularly and without interuption to their subscription and does not hava a single capped character makes up even 1% of the population is being rediculous, and you know it.

I don't have a capped character; I've been playing since the beginning, without interruption. Although I have run the Shroud I have two friends who have not who have also been playing regularly since the beginning.

Milamber69

03-26-2009, 01:59 AM

Uska

03-26-2009, 02:30 AM

Well I know what I am doing as soon as I can turning this nonsense off guess a few will like it but dont like it myself makes this seem more like wow:mad:

Uska

03-26-2009, 02:31 AM

welcome to fight club

if it's your first night, you have to fight

Hated that stupid movie course I dont care for BP anyways

Uska

03-26-2009, 02:47 AM

Please make the default for this set to off to protect new players from idiots who just want to grief people plus to save me the time of turning it off on all my characters.

Raegoul

03-26-2009, 02:56 AM

you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time!

This is my favourite part of the OP please please ensure that this part works!!

Uska

03-26-2009, 03:18 AM

I think it started to get bad around Mod 5. Lots of people were annoyed casters didn't need them.

EDIT:

I think this change could most definitely inspire some roleplaying, as the challenges are not dependent on being in a particular location. So I like it, but I don't think it's enough to actually draw a larger market to the game.

If it inspires any rp it will be poor rp with just some slight excuse to challenge people

I can never see how anyone can claim pvp inspires rp

Uska

03-26-2009, 03:20 AM

DrWhoFan and I are some of the few who monitor general chat to help new players. This is going to be in general as well as the childish taunts about why we have challenges turned off.
For me this is not about growing PVP, as much as it is about annoying me. When I started many young ones still played DDO and even with decline guild invites turned on I was blasted with tells asking me to join a "new" guild. Or, "why would I not join" said guild. Reporting someone falls into the wasting my time area.

They want to grow PVP, fine. It is not something I want to do but I have no problems with others wanting it. I do have a problem when it starts to hamper my having fun, and helping new players is fun for me. That was hampered all ready by removing tells from trial accounts. No matter what you might think not all trial players are plat farmers.

On a side note, I am not a power gamer. I do know we need more quests. That is a fact. Level cap is going to 20. Players are going to need more things to do. Deal with the fact that many are unhappy with the lack of any information about this. Questing is the number one thing to do with DDO. It is why many of us are here. Getting nasty with anyone who is unhappy this will not make you right, or a better smarter person.

Agree with the general chat thing I watch it myself for people asking for help and more clutter there will make it harder to do so

Uska

03-26-2009, 03:22 AM

Uska

03-26-2009, 03:23 AM

Definitely going to need some sort of “Auto Decline” for one-on-one PvP invites. You do know there will be "those" people that’ll just run around spamming them.

They said they will be an option to turn this off at least they are giving us that I just hope it defaults to off to save new players.

Voalkrynn2

03-26-2009, 06:22 AM

SciFiCowboy

03-26-2009, 07:19 AM

Thank You.

"If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time! "

Deadz

03-26-2009, 07:32 AM

Funny how unless something is aimed directly at a person, they complain..

Reading stuff like

Epic Fail (are you kidding me??/ EPIC) NPE for star wars was an EPIC FAIL .. this is just an addition you may not like.

WAHHHHHHHHH!!! i'm taking my subscription and going home.. lol sure you are.. hit that cancel button and put your money where your mouth is.

WHY DID YOU WASTE DEVELOPMENT TIME>.. listen 95% of you have NO CLUE what kinda resources this stuff takes, stop playing Armchair Devolper, your just imbarassing yourselves..

The entitlement makes me sick.. your just 15 bucks, unless you have multiple subscriptions, and i'm sorry, the majority of the vets are more likely to turn off a new player via attitude then attract, so the majority are worth even less then that. If that doesn't apply to you good, if it does, *shrugs*...

I laugh at most of you...

Kingfish

03-26-2009, 07:43 AM

PvP in all forms to me is like pooh in my toilet. Even if I made it, I don’t want to see it, I don’t even want to know its there. And if I DO see it…I flush it!

So, PvP till your hearts are BURSTING with joy but don’t show me your pooh. No tells about it! No requests for it! I don’t even want it in my general chat…make a Pooh vs. Pooh tab where that kind of thing automatically goes and we can delete that tab if we want.

I am not telling anyone how to enjoy their game…but don’t tell me how I SHOULD enjoy mine.

That is all.

RazorrX

03-26-2009, 08:04 AM

Yet another thing to turn off when I log in, and yet another reason to not look at general chat at all.

Remember that in Mod 9, general chat spans across any instance, so if you were standing in the Marketplace when you entered the arena, your general chat will still be seen in the Market. If you have something to say to your PvP opponents that you don't want everyone to hear, you're best to use /say or /tell.

VonBek

03-26-2009, 08:04 AM

If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time!

PVP may appeal to some. However, his option appeals to me. Thanks for the foresight. :)

Voalkrynn2

03-26-2009, 08:11 AM

your just imbarassing yourselves..

I could not have said it better myself...........:p

Elsiah

03-26-2009, 08:40 AM

or maybe we should make about 20-25 new quests...pvp and everything associated is a failure and waist of developer time

jrp

Pvp is a narrowing of the abdomen?

Wow, i never knew.

JakLee7

03-26-2009, 09:29 AM

I don't really ever pvp, but I think is a good addition to the game. Maybe you don't really like pvp, that's fine but lots of people DO - any extra bit to the game to attract more peeps & keep them I am happy with. Who knows, next time one of those annoying people won't shut up in VC while waiting for the peeps to catch up to a quest enterance I can challenge them to a duel & crush their spirit while we wait.....

Grosbeak07

03-26-2009, 09:30 AM

People are reacting as if this was the ONLY thing you are getting in Mod 9. Chill out.

And I echo the statements others have made about the opinions expressed here on the forums are not always representative of a lot of players in game.

PvP can be fun. I'm not big into death matches or tavern brawls, I'm not in it for the kill count. However capture the flag can be really fun for guilds. I would like to see some other "non-violent" forms of PvP, stuff like obsticle courses, puzzle challenges and the like. Do I think a lot of development time should be directed towards this? No. But it would be cool to see.

Kingfish

03-26-2009, 09:33 AM

Pvp is a narrowing of the abdomen?

Wow, i never knew.

Actually to me PvP is a little farther down from the waist...mostly on the backside...but thats just me.

I do hope the turn off feature includes an auto /ignore feature too.

Deadz

03-26-2009, 09:34 AM

I could not have said it better myself...........:p

lol u could have if you spelled it correctly, oops.

lethal413

03-26-2009, 09:52 AM

You guys are all hardcore Carebears. Who cares if they added PVP. I know a lot of ppl like PVP on ghallanda, but they just broke the **** out of it with shroud gear.

Get rid of shroud gear in PVP and PVP will be balanced.

I'm Just saying.

GoldyGopher

03-26-2009, 10:37 AM

If you're not in the mood to accept Challenges, you can turn on/off challenge acceptances in your options panel at any time! Otherwise, you can leave it on and see who picks a fight as you're making your way around the various public spaces!

I must strongly recommend that the default be automatically decline and or that the option to automatically decline all challenges is offered when the first challenge is requested. I see the possibility of way to much griefing with this tool.

Deadz

03-26-2009, 10:41 AM

I must strongly recommend that the default be automatically decline and or that the option to automatically decline all challenges is offered when the first challenge is requested. I see the possibility of way to much griefing with this tool.

I know, taking 2 minutes to toggle in it options is horrible!!!!!!!!

I see the only possibility of griefing being an issue is if people are to lazy to toggle it off...

Beherit_Baphomar

03-26-2009, 11:26 AM

All for PvP and expansion of our current "PvP" system....but this is utter *****.

Have a good day.

DrWorm0

03-26-2009, 11:36 AM

not that i'll use this update much, but I do like it nonetheless.

as for all the complaints about pvp, you guys should know that this isnt the only update their bringing to mod 9 and you should also know that other people love to pvp in their spare time. quit whining about dev time being better spent this, and dev time should be used on that... I'm sure that there will be plenty more mod 9 changes that you will like and as for the ones you dont, just know that there are people out there who are glad to see something for them as well. I feel bad the pvp community hasnt gotten an update in so long.

Hendrik

03-26-2009, 11:38 AM

All for PvP and expansion of our current "PvP" system....but this is utter *****.

Have a good day.

LOL

All for PvP and all for expanding our PvP system, but when they do it's *****?

Just goes to show when they do something that some people will like they will still ***** about it - even when they are for it.

Priceless.

Deadz

03-26-2009, 11:42 AM

LOL

All for PvP and all for expanding our PvP system, but when they do it's *****?

Just goes to show when they do something that some people will like they will still ***** about it - even when they are for it.

Priceless.

/qft

Lorien_the_First_One

03-26-2009, 11:42 AM

I know, taking 2 minutes to toggle in it options is horrible!!!!!!!!

I see the only possibility of griefing being an issue is if people are to lazy to toggle it off...

I see it being a problem for newbies. The solution is if they yes/no box had the following options:

1) accept challenge
2) decline challenge
3) Disable all challenges

And by your logic, 2 minutes to turn it on shouldn't be a problem either...

Deadz

03-26-2009, 11:45 AM

I see it being a problem for newbies. The solution is if they yes/no box had the following options:

1) accept challenge
2) decline challenge
3) Disable all challenges

And by your logic, 2 minutes to turn it on shouldn't be a problem either...
it's more of a problem to start out a feature disabled for a new player, then to have an option to turn it off... by my logic, it is an issue to turn it off by default.

Girevik

03-26-2009, 11:53 AM

Hmm... I'm not a fan of PvP, but the "teleport" to the arena of your choice seems like it has some possibilities.

It seems like a much quicker way to travel from Reaver's Refuge to the Marketplace than running to the giant, flying to the portal, swimming to the fish-dude, and finally teleporting.

ahpook

03-26-2009, 12:23 PM

I am not interested in this feature but if it makes some people happy I have no problem with it. There are lots of features that I have no interest in but other people like and that is cool. However, this is one of those features that has the potential to make me unhappy if improperly implemented.

Actually to me PvP is a little farther down from the waist...mostly on the backside...but thats just me.

I do hope the turn off feature includes an auto /ignore feature too.
By auto ignore, I interpret that if I get a challenge while my challenges are turned off, that user will automatically be squelched.

I must strongly recommend that the default be automatically decline and or that the option to automatically decline all challenges is offered when the first challenge is requested. I see the possibility of way to much griefing with this tool.

These would be nice features along with the user that suggested the Decline All Challenges option should be included on the accept/decline box for those people who have not had a chance to turn it off before they get their first irritant, err I mean invite.

I especially like the squelch option because I don't want to get tells from some idiot telling me what he thinks of the fact I have turned off challenges. The first time that happens, I will report him for harassment. Then second time, I will tell that player what kind of a juvenile moron he is. If I get banned for harrasment for not wanting to put up with that c**p, there are other games to play. Thankfully, I don't actually see that happening based on the current player base we have. I am more concerned about changes in the player base if there is something like an xbox rollout. In short, I am not that interested in playing with people who think it is fun to run around challenging strangers to battles.

Hmm... I'm not a fan of PvP, but the "teleport" to the arena of your choice seems like it has some possibilities.

It seems like a much quicker way to travel from Reaver's Refuge to the Marketplace than running to the giant, flying to the portal, swimming to the fish-dude, and finally teleporting.

It will not. Tolero answered this several pages back. The PvP quest returns you to your original location when you leave.

Archetype

03-26-2009, 12:26 PM

...visiting the nearest Jackson Laws for a match up. That matching system is still in play.

:confused:Umm.....Who is Jackson Laws?:confused:

:confused:What "matching system"? :confused:

No, really.

Never heard of either of these....

[The above questions are from someone who has been playing almost every day for over 2 1/2 years now. Does that indicate how popular and useful this new feature will be for most of the actual players on the servers?]

Pass.
(Where is a link to the "new content discussion" threads again? :p )

Clay

03-26-2009, 12:26 PM

So Deadz... with all due respect... do you think it helps the people making and shaping the game to hear only "yes men" singing the praises of all things DDO? Do you think that complaining about complainers is not complaining yourself? Do you deny those that disagree with your opinion the opportunity to express their own opinion?

You have a counter argument to make to their opinions back it up with something intelligently thought out; debate is always welcome...

Efforts to belittle them is simply trolling.

darthmaul121783

03-26-2009, 12:56 PM

so a nother wow like option for the game

this is just not something that is needed in this game the good thing that came from PVP is that you cna test weapons on your freinds

Vorn

03-26-2009, 01:07 PM

Sigh, another something to turn off on all of my characters, just like I have to remember to 'enable voice chat,' lock the tool bars because things drag off when being used,....

A much more interesting alternative would be a voluntary 'hard core' quest setting with 'friendly fire' enabled. Yes, I'm sure there would be griefing, however, it would make for some different playstyles.

binnsr

03-26-2009, 01:18 PM

Friendly fire in the open spaces is more complex than this. Just getting spell casting in the Market for the devils was an extra level of *ahem* "fun"

But presumably, you've got the tech in place now (having successfully applied it to the marketplace) to extend that to other quests.

I would love to see quests with Friendly Fire on!

Montrose

03-26-2009, 01:54 PM

"Hours" when talking about something Turbine has been working for months is pretty insignificant.

I disagree for several reasons.

1. Any change introduced into a product has a cost outside of dev. In this case, there is a QA hit that I would think is non-trivial. Additionally, new UI had to be created, which presumably involves the art team as well (dev UI is typically... well, let's just call it "functional"). Plus there was presumably PM time spend spec'ing out the behavior. Suddenly your small cost is getting bigger, no?

2. Any change introduced into the product has a regression risk. Even a "simple" addition to the product can have a bug tail that is two or three weeks long. And now your dev is spending time fixing bugs instead of writing new code, and your test time is spending time doing buddy tests and regressing bugs instead of writing new automation. Suddenly your small cost is getting bigger, no?

3. Time spent here represents an opportunity cost. That is to say, the time spent implementing (testing, specc'ing, regressing, developing art for) this feature is time that could have been spent on another feature, or time spent fixing bugs. I will grant that developers are not 100% fungible across a product and so maybe this was the most efficient use of resources, but it seems unlikely.

4. Perception matters. Judging by the reaction from the community, implementing this feature has been fairly controversial. It may be that the amount of anger created by this feature is higher than the amount of joy. I'm unsure, and it'd be tough to gauge that without a lot of research, but the possibility is there. There is a chance that it would have been better overall to not add this feature at all, and not have the developer do ANYTHING. Counter-intuitive, but true. Sometimes the best thing to do is to do nothing.

muffinlad

03-26-2009, 03:32 PM

I don't have a capped character; I've been playing since the beginning, without interruption. Although I have run the Shroud I have two friends who have not who have also been playing regularly since the beginning.

While that is an impressive feat, are you claiming that the majority of people have done the same thing, or that you and your friends have? (Not saying that you are, truely asking)

The problem with both sides on this issue is that no one has the facts, they only have assumptions. Some of those assumptions are based on group observations (Looking at the group lists, looking at the who lists, seeing that most of the LFM's are for 15-16 level characters on most days) and others on personal observation and preference.

Only the Dev's have the stats. And the Dev's have a plan. We just don't know either.

muffincylon

muffinlad

03-26-2009, 03:35 PM

I know, taking 2 minutes to toggle in it options is horrible!!!!!!!!

I see the only possibility of griefing being an issue is if people are to lazy to toggle it off...

The UI being what it is, people may not know where to do so, and suffer frustration based on that. Better to correct the UI before it impacts people, not after. Better to let people opt IN to this kind of system, not out.

It is not a matter of lazy, it is a matter of treating the customer right with the design of the UI from the beginning.

muffinUI

BigBadBarry

03-26-2009, 03:43 PM

so a nother wow like option for the game

this is just not something that is needed in this game the good thing that came from PVP is that you cna test weapons on your freinds

And now you can do your testing even easier without fear of some idjit interupting your testing by trying to kill you both.

No need to even having to find a PvP tavern.

Gornin

03-26-2009, 04:01 PM

*shrug* meh

Clay

03-26-2009, 08:54 PM

It would be interesting to see if you were to put up a new poll:

What do you enjoy most about DDO:

1. Instanced dungeons
2. 6 man groups
3. 12 man raids
4. Explorer areas
5. PvP

or something like it...

You think the majority would be choosing PvP? Interesting.

A couple suggetions for PvP pits... disable Tavern Regen, Disable 1 min tavern reset systems... Allow all spells... Turn off guards...

PvP is now so poorly implemented... its either who has more guards, or what caster has enlarge and powerword whatever and chain lightning. And people were complaining about Bard's fascinate before... at least they have to be fairly close and can be interupted...

Accelerando

03-27-2009, 04:05 AM

Qft
Qft
Qft

i did post it 3 times, I actually cant believe, they just dont seem to get it, its like a bird who just keeps flying into the window at full speed. they never will seem to understand and duplicate the few sucessful modules and build on them, they continually keep adding to failure

jrp

Do you really think they could have coded 20-25 new quests in the time it took to make these small tweaks to an already existing PvP mechanic? That is just about the most ignorant idea I have ever read.

Accelerando

03-27-2009, 04:12 AM

Well I know what I am doing as soon as I can turning this nonsense off guess a few will like it but dont like it myself makes this seem more like wow:mad:

Hated that stupid movie course I dont care for BP anyways

Please make the default for this set to off to protect new players from idiots who just want to grief people plus to save me the time of turning it off on all my characters.

If it inspires any rp it will be poor rp with just some slight excuse to challenge people

I can never see how anyone can claim pvp inspires rp

Agree with the general chat thing I watch it myself for people asking for help and more clutter there will make it harder to do so

Well I guess we are opossing sides of the coin I dont know anyone who regularly pvps in ddo or truly enjoys it

They said they will be an option to turn this off at least they are giving us that I just hope it defaults to off to save new players.

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;)