Recruitment?

[betheljm]

I understand a few things about this whole recruitment stuff, but isn't it taking away the Roleplaying part of the game? I know in Mechwarrior recruitment is a must, you have to find people with at least some skill in simulation piloting, but joining a guild is a little different, in my point of view. A guild needs a leader (High Charisma, but not game wise), and maybe a co-leader, but some of these guilds have officers. Rank in a guild should be limited to a leader and co-leader, because this isn't a military strategy game, so this "recruiting" stuff should be open and have few limitations.

In my view of "guilds", well, it's like a symbiotic relationship between two organisms, people in them only cooperate for mutual benefits, nothing more. As bad as it may seem, the truth behind it is that people band together only to benefit from the others around them and work less to achieve a set goal.

I know I sound negative in this post, but please don't miss understand, I just think this whole recruiting system is a bias approach in selecting members for a guild.

Any thought on how to make it better? I worked too hard last night and kind of spent.

[ArkoHighStar]

Every guild is different and it depends on the focus of the guild. Some guilds are very focused on beating content and will "recruit" those they deem worthy of their guild title, others are a more social thing, and really only care that you fit into the social group, not how good you are. Also it depends on the server, Argo is not a competitive server, our guild are much more like social groups, and even then they bleed out in to channels and friends lists. Servers like Thelanis are much more competitive etc.

[toughguyjoe]

In this game, or at least on this server, Guilds are not as militaristic as you make them out to be. Most high end guilds are groups of friends who want to be able to keep in touch and group with one another with out having to fill their groups with large numbers of PUG spots.

However some guilds function much like you want. This leads to problems though. People get invited to the guild after only a random inspection of their personal character and their abilities within the game. SOMETIMES(Read: Not all the time) this can lead to some of the guilds new recruits acting a fool and getting the guilds name sullied with certain circles.

I understand the militaristic approach, but this game and its players seem far more low key that that. With no need to get 50 players together to fill out hours of raiding like other MMO's have, the close knit group of friends who like to BS and razz eachother wins out over the militaristic guild with its huge number of whoever-we-picked-up-in-the-harbors.

if you are looking for a decent guild, just keep playing. you'll find a guild eventually that suits your needs. If that doesn't work, just make up a guild name, guild all your toons and don't let anyone join :P

[betheljm]

In this game, or at least on this server, Guilds are not as militaristic as you make them out to be. Most high end guilds are groups of friends who want to be able to keep in touch and group with one another with out having to fill their groups with large numbers of PUG spots.

However some guilds function much like you want. This leads to problems though. People get invited to the guild after only a random inspection of their personal character and their abilities within the game. SOMETIMES(Read: Not all the time) this can lead to some of the guilds new recruits acting a fool and getting the guilds name sullied with certain circles.

I understand the militaristic approach, but this game and its players seem far more low key that that. With no need to get 50 players together to fill out hours of raiding like other MMO's have, the close knit group of friends who like to BS and razz eachother wins out over the militaristic guild with its huge number of whoever-we-picked-up-in-the-harbors.

if you are looking for a decent guild, just keep playing. you'll find a guild eventually that suits your needs. If that doesn't work, just make up a guild name, guild all your toons and don't let anyone join :P

It isn't that I want a militaristic guild or join one (I am in the military already), it's just that some of these guilds make it hard for a new person to join. Guilds should be an open oppurtunity for new players or old players to join in a social atmosphere, game, and have fun, instead of pressuring them to make the best PCs in the game.

A guild is a group of who band together out of friendship or social gathering. That is what it should be at least.

[alchilito]

It isn't that I want a militaristic guild or join one (I am in the military already), it's just that some of these guilds make it hard for a new person to join. Guilds should be an open oppurtunity for new players or old players to join in a social atmosphere, game, and have fun, instead of pressuring them to make the best PCs in the game.

A guild is a group of who band together out of friendship or social gathering. That is what it should be at least.

You will be able to find the whole spectrum of guilds here in Argo. Here are a few non-specific examples of the type of guilds you might encounter.

Power gamers / End game oriented - These are usually tight groups of players that have acquired a significant amount of loot and skills, usually running end-game raids and quests.

Casuals - These are the perfect example of your "band of brothers". These are usually medium to large guilds, with a wide spectrum of players, from total newbies to experienced players.

Up and coming - These are medium to small guilds that have either started up their own guild recently or are looking to expand their ranks.

Permadeath - Very cooperative players with strict in-house gaming rules. Check out mortalvoyage for an example.

Elitists - Application forms, trial periods, and massive raiding usually involved. These guilds cater for hard core players with all their gear and knowledge of the game.

I am probably missing out on a couple of flavors.

Oh and of course you cant forget to gather up a massive amount of guilds whose only reminiscence of a guild structure is that they all carry the same tag under the name. Usually avoided in pug groups because of epic apocalyptic failure fame.

[negative]

I feel like I'm missing some sort of backstory to this post (regardless, it's probably just more of the usual argo drama). But, being leader of one of the few remaining founding guilds, I figure I'll put my 2 cents in.

Two big points you seem to bring up is officers and recruitment. As far as recruitment, well, you have to be picky. New guild members need to be screened to assure the fit into guild and will be a valuable addition, wether that criteria is social or skill, or both. It is the same sort of thing that a prospective guild member should be doing themselves. You should not just join the first guild that comes along. Ask and find out what the guild is all about, what the people are like. You have every right to decide wether a guild is the right guild for you, just as much as the guild has the right to decide if you are right for them.

As far as officers, it's clear you've never run a guild before. In-game, there is only one benifit to being promoted to officer. And that is you can invite other people into the guild. While a guild could function with only one or two officers, it is not feasible unless the guild is very small. There was a time in my guild where this was the case (leader was inactive and noone could be promoted). It was very difficult to add new members to the guild, because it was too hard to coordinate getting the officer and new member online at the same time.

Beyond that, depending on the size of the guild, officers can help take some of the load off of the leader. I spend a couple hours each week out of game running my guild, and I have about 5-10 active officers at any point. If I didn't have my officers to assist me, I would not be able to do it all myself. This includes doing things such as inviting new membership, stopping drama before it starts, making sure guild members are getting groups for missions they need to run, and setting up raids. And none of that has anything to do with wether the guild is a social guild, a raiding guild, or a militaristic guild.

[Vorn]

It isn't that I want a militaristic guild or join one (I am in the military already), it's just that some of these guilds make it hard for a new person to join. Guilds should be an open oppurtunity for new players or old players to join in a social atmosphere, game, and have fun, instead of pressuring them to make the best PCs in the game.

A guild is a group of who band together out of friendship or social gathering. That is what it should be at least.

A guild should be whatever those who make it up want it to be. Some are very tight-knit-all-your-characters-must-belong-to-the-guild. Some are groups of friends. Some are all about pushing the game limits to the max. Some have you go to a website and fill out an application, want you to run with a few of the officers first, and so on. Others could care less about such things. Some are highly structured. Some aren't. Some are extremely new player friendly. Some aren't. Some are perma-death. A few are role-playing (though mostly on Thelanis, I think).

I play in Pick-up-groups a lot. There's a tremendous amount of diversity in the guilds on Argo. If you are troubled by requirements or behavior of a particular guild, it may be that you wouldn't want to be a part of that guild anyway?

Take a look at the guild match up or sticky thread above--the information may be dated, but you may find a guild that represents what you're looking for. Or, be bold, daring, and unafraid, and create your own--it can be quite an adventure!

Alternatively, you can remain an independent and work at developing a reputation as a competent, generous player.

[betheljm]

Two big points you seem to bring up is officers and recruitment. As far as recruitment, well, you have to be picky. New guild members need to be screened to assure the fit into guild and will be a valuable addition, wether that criteria is social or skill, or both. It is the same sort of thing that a prospective guild member should be doing themselves. You should not just join the first guild that comes along. Ask and find out what the guild is all about, what the people are like. You have every right to decide wether a guild is the right guild for you, just as much as the guild has the right to decide if you are right for them.


Hold on, you act like I haven't been in a "guild" (we called them Factions) before or ran one before.

My point in this whole thing is that application forms that have "Are you a Spy?" in them is going to far in a simple game. Hell, application forms are to much in a game. As for the "Screening Process" ideal, whether for good or bad, it isn't that bad to let someone in who doesn't truly fit in, that alone can bring variety and interests into the guild that others don't exhibit. Yes, I know, some guild members may leave, but you need to encourage acceptance for ideals and opinions of others. In the long run, the guild may actually start to grow as a whole that way.

[betheljm]

Stop me now if I am not making sense. I have been up for 20 hrs.

[Vorn]

Stop me now if I am not making sense. I have been up for 20 hrs.

Ok.
Stop!!! Go get some sleep!!!
:)

Seriously, if you dislike a particular guild's recruitment/application process, might you be better off somewhere else?

[betheljm]

BTW, I forgot to mention that I solo the game. My opinions don't come from "I can do things myself" attitude either. I was actually thinking of joining a guild but all the ones that I thought I had an interest in were these "fill out an application and prove yourself" guilds. I looked at several and none really fit for me.

THIS ISN'T MECHWARRIOR, I AM NOT PROVING MYSELF TO ANYONE, GAAAAAARGH!

lol

[darkrhavyn]

Hold on, you act like I haven't been in a "guild" (we called them Factions) before or ran one before.

My point in this whole thing is that application forms that have "Are you a Spy?" in them is going to far in a simple game. Hell, application forms are to much in a game. As for the "Screening Process" ideal, whether for good or bad, it isn't that bad to let someone in who doesn't truly fit in, that alone can bring variety and interests into the guild that others don't exhibit. Yes, I know, some guild members may leave, but you need to encourage acceptance for ideals and opinions of others. In the long run, the guild may actually start to grow as a whole that way.

Thats really not true...too many guilds over the last three years have had problems with one person not fitting into the and "personality" of the guild they join and it has lead to lots of acrimony and even guilds being disbanded oves ier the infighting.

Yes its a game. But it is a game that lots of people play very differently from others. Guilds in DDO are NOT like factions in MechWarrior....there are no massive battles or raids where you storm anothers castle, etc etc.

Guilds tend to be people who play in similar ways and have fun talking to one another.....they are social clicks for lack of a better term and do you really want someone who you have nothing in common with either in playstyle or interests or priorities in the game to be in your "click"?

[betheljm]

do you really want someone who you have nothing in common with either in playstyle or interests or priorities in the game to be in your "click"?

I am not one to shun others over a small difference (b/c we are all different). Now if there is in-fighting, that situation needs to be resolved before it goes too far.

Always Agree to Disagree with certain views and leave it at that.

[gamblerjoe]

My point in this whole thing is that application forms that have "Are you a Spy?" in them is going to far in a simple game. Hell, application forms are to much in a game. As for the "Screening Process" ideal, whether for good or bad, it isn't that bad to let someone in who doesn't truly fit in, that alone can bring variety and interests into the guild that others don't exhibit.

read what people are posting. not all guilds are hardcore. not all guilds have recruiting policies. there are guilds that will take anyone. just pick one, and stop frustrating the people that are trying to help u.


I am not one to shun others over a small difference (b/c we are all different)..

not accepting someone into your guild and shunning them are 2 different things.

whatever guild denied you and made u so upset, consider this. if they accepted everyone who came along, they would not be the same guild. just join one of the guilds that doesnt turn anyone down. now that i think about it, u have not given any reason at all why u dont want to join one of these guilds.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Also, you point out this is a simple game, with that comes reputations that are known to the entire server. A guilds reputation goes a long way...the application process can be a way to weed out any trouble before it starts.

[negative]

Hold on, you act like I haven't been in a "guild" (we called them Factions) before or ran one before.

My point in this whole thing is that application forms that have "Are you a Spy?" in them is going to far in a simple game. Hell, application forms are to much in a game. As for the "Screening Process" ideal, whether for good or bad, it isn't that bad to let someone in who doesn't truly fit in, that alone can bring variety and interests into the guild that others don't exhibit. Yes, I know, some guild members may leave, but you need to encourage acceptance for ideals and opinions of others. In the long run, the guild may actually start to grow as a whole that way.
I've ran the Lightbringers for three years now, and I ran a number of other smaller guilds in other games before DDO came out. I can tell you from direct experiance that letting in somrone who doesn't truly fit in, can be a major problem. Whatever the difference, it can lead to a lot of friction. And from either the new member's standpoint, or the guild's standpoint, if it is obivous the two will not be a match it can be detrimental to the guild to try to shoehorn the two together. If the guild is not the sort of guild the new member is looking for, what is the point in joining/inviting?

Now, the Lightbringers do not have an application, and we don't have a formal recruitment policy. We do try/require new members to group with other guild members, if not officers, so that we have *some* idea of who we are letting into the guild, and then we go from there, letting the person be on a sort of probation period, where either side is free to walk away. This protects both the new member and the guild. All that said, thanks to all this, while some have come and gone from LB, I've never had to kick out a single member in three years. *Crosses fingers it stays this way*

My last piece of advice is, if you really truly feel that all the guilds in-game are "doing it wrong", then start your own guild and run it the way you want.

[alchilito]

Also, you point out this is a simple game, with that comes reputations that are known to the entire server. A guilds reputation goes a long way...the application process can be a way to weed out any trouble before it starts.

Evidently, in your case specifically, OSD´s screening process = Epic Fail

[Gol]

Alternatively, you can remain an independent and work at developing a reputation as a competent, generous player.Been there, tried that. I pulled off neither of those reputations in the process. :(

[Heffty_Smurf]

Been there, tried that. I pulled off neither of those reputations in the process. :(

/signed.....i agree that u havnt.:D btw what happened to your sig? i dont see officer of the bloodlords anywhere there.....interesting

[gamblerjoe]

Been there, tried that. I pulled off neither of those reputations in the process. :(

not true, u achieved one of them.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Evidently, in your case specifically, OSD´s screening process = Epic Fail

Our screening process has undertaken an entire revamp...several people were fired, some commited suicide...rest assured it wont happen again!!

[alchilito]

/signed.....i agree that u havnt.:D btw what happened to your sig? i dont see officer of the bloodlords anywhere there.....interesting

Officially requesting Heffty to change his sig to "Best power 5 pally in the game... period".

[Raegoul]

BTW, I forgot to mention that I solo the game.


1) soloing is for noobs
2) knock yourself out with soloing
3) aim to be the best solo player on the server then you might get into a guild

Hope you have fun soloing the game.

[betheljm]

1) soloing is for noobs
2) knock yourself out with soloing
3) aim to be the best solo player on the server then you might get into a guild

Hope you have fun soloing the game.

1) I am soloing to get used to the game
2) My opinions don't change to everyone's wishes
3) Stop all the drama and respect other people opinions aka "Agree to Disagree"

Besides all that, I am going to play the game a little while longer before joining a guild, that way I have a little more experience with how DDO works (I like D&D 3.0 Faerun better though...).

[Raegoul]

1) I am soloing to get used to the game
2) My opinions don't change to everyone's wishes
3) Stop all the drama and respect other people opinions aka "Agree to Disagree"

Besides all that, I am going to play the game a little while longer before joining a guild, that way I have a little more experience with how DDO works (I like D&D 3.0 Faerun better though...).

Keep your opinions to yourself until you have some experience to base them on. I do not respect your opinions, sorry.

Drama is good get used to it :)

[betheljm]

Keep your opinions to yourself until you have some experience to base them on. I do not respect your opinions, sorry.

Drama is good get used to it :)

I didn't like all the drama in High School and I don't like it now, but friendly debates aren't bad at all. ;)

[Heffty_Smurf]

I didn't like all the drama in High School and I don't like it now, but friendly debates aren't bad at all. ;)

friendly debates are when both sides have a point. you dont have a point but in fact refuse to listen to the people who have been there, done that, and do have a point. because you feel that the guilding process is wrong doesnt make it wrong. evidently no guild has issued u an invitation if you continue to post about it, i would assume that one would figure out that crying on the forums isnt the way to get guilded.....but....

[Gol]

/signed.....i agree that u havnt.:D btw what happened to your sig? i dont see officer of the bloodlords anywhere there.....interesting
I've never had a guild tag in my sig, EVER. Though if you want an answer to your question and you have suddenly become capable of an adult conversation, feel free to PM me. I prefer not to air laundry in public.

[Heffty_Smurf]

I've never had a guild tag in my sig, EVER. Though if you want an answer to your question and you have suddenly become capable of an adult conversation, feel free to PM me. I prefer not to air laundry in public.

my bad, i forgot ur sig is all about builds nobody cares about. my apologies build engineer

[Gol]

my bad, i forgot ur sig is all about builds nobody cares about. my apologies build engineer1) Insincere apology ignored.
2) I expected you to come up with something to ridicule me for
3) I'm still perfectly willing to clear up stuff between us if you're willing to have a mature conversation between adults - something you've been resistant to.

[sisterjinx]

By the way OP what is your toon name on Argo?

[Raegoul]

1) Insincere apology ignored.
2) I expected you to come up with something to ridicule me for
3) I'm still perfectly willing to clear up stuff between us if you're willing to have a mature conversation between adults - something you've been resistant to.

I clicked the link in your Sig and well ROFL!

[Raegoul]

I didn't like all the drama in High School and I don't like it now, but friendly debates aren't bad at all. ;)

Get over it! Grow up! People are immature, its normal. Friendly debates are an ideological myth.

[Moonblood]

When you pay my subscription, then i'll take into consideration who you want to FORCE me to play with.