My attempt at a paladin build

[Eternity25]

I never made a paladin before but made what appears to be a good paladin build on a character generator.

Race: Elf

the starting stats were

16str,14dex12con,12int,10wis,14cha

At lvl 16 I'll have stats of
16str+4 (ability points)+2(tome)+6(item)=28
14dex+2 tome+6 (tumbleweed)=22
12con+2tome+6 item=20
12int+2tome=14
10wis+2tome+6item=18
14cha+3 enhancements+3tome+6item=26

Feat Choices

lvl1-Toughness
lvl3-Toughness
lvl6-+3 to UMD
lvl9-Improved Critical Slashing
lvl12-Tower Shields
lvl15-Combat Expertise

I'd have a 35.5 UMD with GH and all UMD enhancing items except +3 exceptional charisma.
Approx a 36 Balance and 40 concentration.

Hp:459 [With every hp enhancing item and some feats]
Sp:235

AC (with +3 barkskin potion as only buff): At minimum a 64

Saves while buffed:
Fort: At the minimum 27
Reflex: At the minimum 23
Will: At the minimum 20

[Aranticus]

why tower? you have no tower shield mastery which mean you max dex is 18 (+4). you listed a dex of 22 (+6). you are better off using a heavy shield and free up a slot

next is toughness, way too much. 1 is all you need. you could get extend to beef up your fighting prowress

you might also want to show the breakdown of your number

[bobbryan2]

Not to mention that without intimidate, no amount of AC is really that great, because using a shield, you'll never pull aggro from anything.

Best to go TWF if you want DPS... or splash a rogue or fighter level for intimidate ranks if you want to go intimi-tanking.

Those are pretty much the two obvious routes for paladins now.

[Inspire]

why tower? you have no tower shield mastery which mean you max dex is 18 (+4). you listed a dex of 22 (+6). you are better off using a heavy shield and free up a slot

When the Defender PrE comes out, which we already know about they get bonuses to increase the max Dex on Tower Shields/Heavy and even Medium armor, I think the best potential Ac for the Defender is a 22 Dex whereas it IS currently 18.


next is toughness, way too much. 1 is all you need. you could get extend to beef up your fighting prowress

Take Power Attack before Extend. You should take Extend at level 18, IMO of course.


you might also want to show the breakdown of your number

Qft.

[Inspire]

Not to mention that without intimidate, no amount of AC is really that great, because using a shield, you'll never pull aggro from anything.

350% hate generation on a critical Smite.


Best to go TWF if you want DPS...

Everyone and your co-workers nephew should take 2wF. :rolleyes:


or splash a rogue or fighter level for intimidate ranks if you want to go intimi-tanking. Those are pretty much the two obvious routes for paladins now.

Someone missed the Paladin Capstone...

[Aranticus]

When the Defender PrE comes out, which we already know about they get bonuses to increase the max Dex on Tower Shields/Heavy and even Medium armor, I think the best potential Ac for the Defender is a 22 Dex whereas it IS currently 18.



Take Power Attack before Extend. You should take Extend at level 18, IMO of course.



Qft.

some very good points here but at this juncture, the heavy shield is a much better option and if he really decides to make a defender, he can always respec a feat or 2

power attack is really a good choice but he needs the extend feat together. the main reason is he is going to be very dependant on buffs coupled with -2 from TS, he might have some problems. from my experience, non-extended pally buffs sux big time. too much toggling

[Noctus]

power attack is really a good choice but he needs the extend feat together. the main reason is he is going to be very dependant on buffs coupled with -2 from TS, he might have some problems. from my experience, non-extended pally buffs sux big time. too much toggling


I concure.


Power Attack is for the times where AC is unimportant, but DPS is key. (Portal whacking in the shroud, kobold endfight, basically everytime you fight against a caster, ....)

[jmonty]

could you get intimidate up enough with just taking ranks as a pure pally?

[EazyWeazy]

could you get intimidate up enough with just taking ranks as a pure pally?

Trash mobs, yes.

Boss fights, no.

[Khurse]

IS it important enough to be able to intimidate the trash mobs that every Pally should be able to do it?

I didn't take Intimidate on my TWF Pally, wondering if I should.

[jmonty]

IS it important enough to be able to intimidate the trash mobs that every Pally should be able to do it?

I didn't take Intimidate on my TWF Pally, wondering if I should.

i'm not sure, if you are a pure pally. the character generator i tried only allows 1/2 rank per level in that case.

[Khurse]

Sorry (both for confusion and kinda ongoing hijacking of thread)
What I meant was- should all pure Pally's take Intimidate? Given that it will be a max of 9.5 ranks I wasn't sure if being able to only intimidate trash mobs was worth it or not.

I took UMD and am kinda bouncing between jump and balance for the other skills. Just don't want to stat getting into high level groups and having people snicker because I don't have Intimidate. I'd break down into tears, they'd laugh harder, it'd be a mess..

[bobbryan2]

Someone missed the Paladin Capstone...

Nope, I saw it.

That said, if you want to sword and board it... you need intimidate ranks. If you want intimidate ranks, you're going to have to splash. Unless you have some clever ways of getting a cross-class skill up to 60-65 without splashing a level.

And yes... about the 350% hate smites... please show me how your S&B tank will hold Aggro on things like the Hound and Suulomades without intimidate. I really want to see it. And even if you did, you'd take a lot more damage than the next guy because you wouldn't be able to attack and shield block at the same time.

S&B paladins that lack intimidate lack overall direction. It's one of those classes that's awesome up through level 11 or so... and suddenly has nothing to do in parties after that point.

And had I missed the capstone, you think I'd reccommend TWF? Let's see, S&B and THF gets 4d6 damage... TWF gets 8d6 from the capstone. Knights of the Chalice gives 4d6 damage to S&B and THF, 8d6 damage to TWF. Divine Might at its highest level gives 8 damage to S&B and THF, it gives 16 to TWF. Using one of your smites with a S&B gives you one attack, TWF gets two exalted smites. Divine favor gives S&B and THF 3 to hit and 3 damage, it gives 3 to hit and 6 damage for TWF.

Maybe you missed the capstone...

[Eternity25]

I modified my build with the advice given.

Race: Elf

the starting stats were

16str,16dex12con,12int,10wis,14cha

At lvl 16 I'll have stats of
16str+4 (ability points)+2(tome)+6(item)=28
16dex+2 tome+6 (tumbleweed)=24
12con+2tome+6 item=20
12int+2tome=14
10wis+2tome+6item=18
14cha+3 enhancements+3tome+6item=26

Feat Choices

lvl1-Toughness
lvl3-TWF
lvl6-Extend
lvl9-Improved Critical Slashing
lvl12-ITWF
lvl15-GTWF
lvl18-+3 to UMD

I'd have a 32.5 UMD with GH and all UMD enhancing items except +3 exceptional charisma at lvl 16.
Approx a 36 Balance and 40 concentration at lvl 16 with all the necessary items.

Hp:441 [With every hp enhancing item and some feats]
Sp:235

AC (with +3 barkskin potion as only buff): At minimum a 62

Saves while buffed:
Fort: At the minimum 27
Reflex: At the minimum 23
Will: At the minimum 20

I'd use scimitars instead of rapiers for my radiance weapons and smiters.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)
Level 16 Lawful Good Elf Female
(16 Paladin)
Hit Points: 229
Spell Points: 235
BAB: 16\16\21\26\26
Fortitude: 18
Reflex: 15
Will: 12
Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 16 20
Dexterity 16 17
Constitution 12 12
Intelligence 10 12
Wisdom 10 10
Charisma 14 16
Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 1
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 1

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 3 10
Bluff 2 3
Concentration 5 22
Diplomacy 2 3
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 2 3
Heal 0 2
Hide 3 3
Intimidate 2 3
Jump 3 5
Listen 0 2
Move Silently 3 3
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 1 1
Search 1 3
Spot 0 2
Swim 3 5
Tumble n/a 3.5
Use Magic Device 4 12.5

Level 1 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 2 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 3 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting

Level 4 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 5 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 6 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell

Level 7 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 8 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 9 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons

Level 10 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 11 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 12 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting

Level 13 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 14 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

Level 15 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Undying Call
Enhancement: Follower of the Undying Court
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good III
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good III
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Righteousness I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice II
Enhancement: Paladin Exalted Smite I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Redemption I
Enhancement: Paladin Concentration I
Enhancement: Paladin Concentration II
Enhancement: Paladin Heal I
Enhancement: Paladin Heal II
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion I
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion II
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar I
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar II
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar III
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II

Level 16 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)

[bobbryan2]

That's looking like a serious DPS machine.

Only other thing I'd mention is the power attack feat. That's a pretty huge boost in DPS itself. I'm struggling with which to take on my Paladin too, which two of extend, toughness, and power attack.. and I figure I'll just take the third one at 18.

Something to keep an eye on if you hit cap and aren't doing quite as much as you'd like.

[Inspire]

I'd use scimitars instead of rapiers for my radiance weapons and smiters.

Elves have Rapier/Longsword enhancements I would suggest going Rapiers for that reason. Undying Court only gives you a +1 to-hit with Scimitars which is ok but not all that great, unless you are using it for the KotC pre-req.

Still, Rapiers with the enhancements if you can squueze them is would be pretty cool on this build, and allow you to use W/p very functionally at endgame.