Clerics and Mod 8

[cam0940]

I hope that all of you are enjoying the new content as much as I am. The quests are fun, the dungeons are beautiful, and depending on your toons’ slot setup, the dragontouched armors can be pretty impressive.

However, once again, it doesn’t appear that Clerics’ interests have been addressed.

I wear Blue Dragonscale Full Plate (from Mod 4) and carry a Sup Pot VI light mace. I also carry the Levik’s Champion set from the Hound (which imho is mainly a fashion statement).

Frankly, I’m not farming the Necro for tome pages, or running the Demon Queen (including prereqs) an undetermined amount of times so that I can move Gtr Arcane Lore to another slot. I would also have to rearrange Spell Pen VII. None of the known attributes on DT armor would be worth the tremendous amount of trading, grinding, or plat that would be involved in making a change.

With that said, why would a Cleric flag to run Sor’jek? There is nothing in it for casting Clerics. If you are a battle Cleric, who focuses on melee offense more than casting offense, then you begin to be able to make an argument. But then, I never understood melee Clerics to begin with. Why would I melee something when I can kill everything in the room w/ BB, Destruction, Slay Living, Banishment, or Harm+Searing Light? And I can do it in a fraction of the time that melee Clerics are whaling away. Meleeing as a primary offense is madness on Cleric.

There are 2 known exceptions to everything I just said: Gol is a melee Cleric and he seems to enjoy it and that’s fine. I’ll still kill more stuff and lay more destruction to a quest w/ spells, but as far as melee Clerics go, he’s one of the best I’ve seen. The other is Tinmad (<->), but even Tinmad casts first, and uses melee as secondary offense when his mana is gone. Either of those guys MAY find some usefulness to Dragontouched Armor.

For casting clerics, there will have to be some attribute available that is better than Blue Dragonscale w/ a Sup Pot VI item to make Sor’jek worth running. Otherwise, it will soon be hard to find a Cleric for the end content, and we’ll all have to get used to running w/out one.

[ArkoHighStar]

superior devotion 8 with all 3 levlks pieces armor,shield and necklace

[Samadhi]

Because it's a new/fun quest?

[Jefro]

Lets get a greater arcane ring, then all builds will be happy. Hopefully they add it in next mod, but thats a long wait!

You can bite the bullet and just go with superior healing or void lore items, and blade barrier will just be weak but weigh in the new trade off slots you can use.

[akla_thornfist]

i like my new armor first set i made came out pot viii spell pen viii and greater false life was able to free up 1 slot and went back to useing a shield instead of 2 weapon i had a spell pen vii in my off hand, so im very happy with the armor now i can start on my fighters armor.

[cam0940]

superior devotion 8 with all 3 levlks pieces armor,shield and necklace

Exactly Arko, you hit the nail right on the head. Who in the world would trade Gtr Arcane Lore and Spell Pen VII for better Mass Cure Critical? It's madness.

But it did occur to me that in order to "get" this thread, you do kinda have to understand Cleric offense. Cleric is SO MUCH MORE than sitting in the back of the party throwing heals and buffs.

[Vallin]

For casting clerics, there will have to be some attribute available that is better than Blue Dragonscale w/ a Sup Pot VI item to make Sor’jek worth running. Otherwise, it will soon be hard to find a Cleric for the end content, and we’ll all have to get used to running w/out one.

Interesting ideas - maybe true for some. I have a casting based cleric too but instead am wearing Full Plate of Defender and am getting my spell pen from Glacial Bracers.

I wonder too what will happen and how I will proceed - but I will craft the dragontouched armor and see what I can get out of it. I find that now there are so many options it is sometimes tough to pick what is the best way to go.. Shroud items give an awful lot of flexibility - and I still have other fun items banked from old raids. I think it will be fun to see what shows up on the armor and how I might re-configure things.

In the absence of anything functional for the armor - I pulled some really nice loot out of my first Sorjek run - two +2 tomes and a banishing rapier. My ranger always seems to get those lucky pulls - I hope my cleric will too! And moreso, I can be the cleric for my guildies and then they will swap to their clerics and pull my other toons through.

It all works out in the end.

Vallin

[cam0940]

Because it's a new/fun quest?


Fair enough. But I have 9 other toons to enjoy the new/fun quests with, and 3 of them that might actually get something useful in the process.

[cam0940]

Interesting ideas - maybe true for some. I have a casting based cleric too but instead am wearing Full Plate of Defender and am getting my spell pen from Glacial Bracers.

I wonder too what will happen and how I will proceed - but I will craft the dragontouched armor and see what I can get out of it. I find that now there are so many options it is sometimes tough to pick what is the best way to go.. Shroud items give an awful lot of flexibility - and I still have other fun items banked from old raids. I think it will be fun to see what shows up on the armor and how I might re-configure things.

In the absence of anything functional for the armor - I pulled some really nice loot out of my first Sorjek run - two +2 tomes and a banishing rapier. My ranger always seems to get those lucky pulls - I hope my cleric will too! And moreso, I can be the cleric for my guildies and then they will swap to their clerics and pull my other toons through.

It all works out in the end.

Vallin

How are you getting your crits? You bring up an interesting concept I tried to explain regarding VoD: the only real reason to run the quests are A) because they're fun, and you dont have another toon to play or B) you're basically "pulling a shift" for other people who will in turn play their Clerics when you're on a different class. But in terms of end rewards or purpose...it's just not there.

[Vallin]

How are you getting your crits on Searing Light and BB? You bring up an interesting concept I tried to explain regarding VoD: the only real reason to run the quests are A) because they're fun, and you dont have another toon to play or B) you're basically "pulling a shift" for other people who will in turn play their Clerics when you're on a different class. But in terms of end rewards or purpose...it's just not there.

When I want to deal damage I swap to 'dual wielding' Green Blade and Superior Pot mace. Thank God I can heal myself - as I obviously lose AC when I make the swap! :) I also took Quicken so I wasn't left 'unprotected' for so long a time when I cast BB.

When I melee I use Bramble casters. When I cast I use Glacial gloves. When I Heal I sometimes throw on those Reaver gloves.

These are the kinds of push and pull decisions I am talking about though. While there seems to be a 'best way to go' for many decisions on class building in this game I am still captivated by the range of options.

All this makes for a full inventory though :(

Vallin

[ArkoHighStar]

How are you getting your crits? You bring up an interesting concept I tried to explain regarding VoD: the only real reason to run the quests are A) because they're fun, and you dont have another toon to play or B) you're basically "pulling a shift" for other people who will in turn play their Clerics when you're on a different class. But in terms of end rewards or purpose...it's just not there.

greenblade and skiver

[BlackSteel]

you can get a high level spell pen on the DT armor along with two very nice other abilities that would help a casting cleric

resistance 5 is always good, and would allow you to use a better striding item if u had boots of Inno before

cant complain about greater false life, or +6 to a stat, or +1 exceptional stat, 1 more con or wis/str/dex

either do w/o arcane lore, or grab one of the two other items available, i know i know, both of those are quite a bit of farming, but neither is arcane lore truely needed on a cleric. Shouldnt be relying on crits for healing, and BB has no enhancements to help it, so roughly 1 out of ten BB's will be a crit and speed things up a bit, which may save you from having to cast another.

personally, my casting cleric/monk will be trying for resistance/protection/and dodge +3; I'd drop the protection for something else, but I dont have enough play time to craft another shroud item on that character anytime soon (just not a high priority)

[BlackSteel]

interesting enough my cleric is THE character I want to run thru all the new content first with, and get the armor ASAP. None of my other chars will benefit from the DT armor like the cleric will. Considering it cant replace the Defiance proc, but can give a substantial AC increase, none of my melees will be stepping foot in the new content until my cleric has a new docent ^^.

[moops]

Personally I like my 783pt HARMS ( arcane lore helps this), It allows me to take down most bosses-- solo the fire or the stone in Shroud if I have to, as well as crit Heals allow for me to solo undead stuff, like in the new Eeerie forest Area where alot of it saves on BBs..

I agree with the OP, I'm pretty unhappy of the options for clerics, equipping 3 items for an affect does not work out for me--I duel wield stuff most of the time as well as I like what I have in my neck slot--only time I ever wear lorriks from hound is in Shroud part 5 and VOD.. And then there is the fact that the DT will not look as good as my Blue Dragon Scale Mail

I was hoping for maybe something with an exceptional Necro Focus on it, that would stack with my Spell Focus feats and the Napkin.



you can get a high level spell pen on the DT armor along with two very nice other abilities that would help a casting cleric

resistance 5 is always good, and would allow you to use a better striding item if u had boots of Inno before

cant complain about greater false life, or +6 to a stat, or +1 exceptional stat, 1 more con or wis/str/dex

either do w/o arcane lore, or grab one of the two other items available, i know i know, both of those are quite a bit of farming, but neither is arcane lore truely needed on a cleric. Shouldnt be relying on crits for healing, and BB has no enhancements to help it, so roughly 1 out of ten BB's will be a crit and speed things up a bit, which may save you from having to cast another.

personally, my casting cleric/monk will be trying for resistance/protection/and dodge +3; I'd drop the protection for something else, but I dont have enough play time to craft another shroud item on that character anytime soon (just not a high priority)

[maddmatt70]

either do w/o arcane lore

I think this is the issue right here. A casting cleric unless they are a instakill or enchantment spec can't really do without arcane lore. Since the best aspect of the armor is the lorriks's part 3 for a cleric where you would need the shield to be equipped you would only have one hand free which again for a casting cleric they would need superior potency 6 so no room for greater arcane lore. Now on my casting cleric I might make an armor set to swap to for when I go into a healing mode, but I might not because I might as well wait for mass heal in mod 9 anyway.

There are other builds which have no use for the armor either. You mention docent of defiance for the wf, but there are also the armor wearers who care about ac who have the chattering ring since apparently the chattering ring doesn't stack with the dodge bonus on the armor.

The primary characters that get the most benefit of the new crafting are those that don't care about ac that are not warforged, or are warforged that care about ac, and are not clerics, sorcs, or wiz.

[Gol]

Thanks for the plug Finis ;)

I'm still undecided about what to do with Gol and the mod 8 stuff. Thing is, some of that stuff is cool, sure unless I retool Gol from head to toe to build for AC (can easily top 60), it's all rather pointless even for a melee Cleric. I have blue dragonplate when needed, and the only thing I could even conceivably replace it with is the Lorrik's triple combo (which requires 2 pieces of Hound loot I don't have).

My Bard stands to gain a decent bit more, though. He'll be next after Verbal.

[Gol]

The primary characters that get the most benefit of the new crafting are those that don't care about ac that are not warforged, or are warfoge that don't care about ac, and are not clerics, sorcs, or wiz.and Dwarven Fighters (that is, easy access to excessive Armor Mastery enhancements) that DO care about AC.

[nbhs275]

I hope that all of you are enjoying the new content as much as I am. The quests are fun, the dungeons are beautiful, and depending on your toons’ slot setup, the dragontouched armors can be pretty impressive.

However, once again, it doesn’t appear that Clerics’ interests have been addressed.

I wear Blue Dragonscale Full Plate (from Mod 4) and carry a Sup Pot VI light mace. I also carry the Levik’s Champion set from the Hound (which imho is mainly a fashion statement).

Frankly, I’m not farming the Necro for tome pages, or running the Demon Queen (including prereqs) an undetermined amount of times so that I can move Gtr Arcane Lore to another slot. I would also have to rearrange Spell Pen VII. None of the known attributes on DT armor would be worth the tremendous amount of trading, grinding, or plat that would be involved in making a change.

With that said, why would a Cleric flag to run Sor’jek? There is nothing in it for casting Clerics. If you are a battle Cleric, who focuses on melee offense more than casting offense, then you begin to be able to make an argument. But then, I never understood melee Clerics to begin with. Why would I melee something when I can kill everything in the room w/ BB, Destruction, Slay Living, Banishment, or Harm+Searing Light? And I can do it in a fraction of the time that melee Clerics are whaling away. Meleeing as a primary offense is madness on Cleric.

There are 2 known exceptions to everything I just said: Gol is a melee Cleric and he seems to enjoy it and that’s fine. I’ll still kill more stuff and lay more destruction to a quest w/ spells, but as far as melee Clerics go, he’s one of the best I’ve seen. The other is Tinmad (<->), but even Tinmad casts first, and uses melee as secondary offense when his mana is gone. Either of those guys MAY find some usefulness to Dragontouched Armor.

For casting clerics, there will have to be some attribute available that is better than Blue Dragonscale w/ a Sup Pot VI item to make Sor’jek worth running. Otherwise, it will soon be hard to find a Cleric for the end content, and we’ll all have to get used to running w/out one.

Because its more mana effective, and effects everything. Where BB only works when you can train mobs. If they have evasion, it doesnt work. High reflex saves? nothing. Don't chase, like most casters and archers. Nothing. And all the others are so mana consuming for their effect that they really arent useful in the long term questing. I know that on my battlecleric i can spend 55 SP and kill anything that gets in my way for 2 minutes. Where a max/emp/extended BB will cost you 85 SP, can let you damage anything you can drag through it, for about a minute.

And hell, in the end the reason that clerics are going to run the new content no matter what? Its new, its fun, its what most high level groups and guildies will be doing, and its high level loot.

[cam0940]

When I want to deal damage I swap to 'dual wielding' Green Blade and Superior Pot mace. Thank God I can heal myself - as I obviously lose AC when I make the swap! :) I also took Quicken so I wasn't left 'unprotected' for so long a time when I cast BB.

When I melee I use Bramble casters. When I cast I use Glacial gloves. When I Heal I sometimes throw on those Reaver gloves.

These are the kinds of push and pull decisions I am talking about though. While there seems to be a 'best way to go' for many decisions on class building in this game I am still captivated by the range of options.

All this makes for a full inventory though :(

Vallin

Wow. That's an awful lot of switching around. Cool tho man, whatever works. I just find that when the boo boo hits the fan, I don't have time to be switching around items/armors and what not. Usually on Cleric I'm playing at 100 mph and I don't really see the purpose of switching around several items when I already have everything covered.

[Anthios888]

I agree that this isn't going to be quite the boost to my casting cleric as it will surely be for my battlecleric, but I see many upgrades now possible with this new armor:

I will giving up the blue dragonscale armor and my gloves of the glacier and hopefully picking up greater spell penetration VIII (unique) on the sovreign level. I'd consider the stoneskin proc or some of the other fun options as well. In order to get my lore, I will craft gloves with (pos/neg/pos) lesser good guard, fear immunity/poison immunity, 6 wisdom, superior healing lore, concordant opposition. You could do a similar thing with negative for harm, but that's situational and items are already fairly attainable.

Weapons remain longswords of superior potency VI and +3 exceptional wisdom.

Sucks that I'll no longer see critical blade barriers or cometfalls, or enjoy the cheaper mass heals with gloves of the glacier, but the gains exceed the losses by far. The extra slots (which casting clerics hold precious) make opportunities for new and better greensteel options, for items and loot that didn't fit in before (torc/silver flame amulet in my case, +1 exceptional wisdom for many friends).

I have a greenblade and would farm a skiver if it were necessary, but they'll remain in my bank - even if they look cool. In my eyes, not worth giving up a wisdom bracket even for blade barriers, because of how often things save in these new quests.

Remember that mod 8 also gives many casting clerics (non-dwarven versions, anyway) an extra 20-40 hp to play with if you use minos legens. And think how much time you'll save with mass protection from elements! It's not all bad, but change always makes us have to go back and rethink the things we had taken for granted before.

PS - or, just put in an greater arcane lore ring like Jefro said.

[maddmatt70]

and Dwarven Fighters (that is, easy access to excessive Armor Mastery enhancements) that DO care about AC.

Doesn't stack with chattering ring so much weaker then mithral full plate. I have a dwarven fighter by the way that does care about ac...

[moops]

LOL I had the same thought.


Wow. That's an awful lot of switching around. Cool tho man, whatever works. I just find that when the boo boo hits the fan, I don't have time to be switching around items/armors and what not. Usually on Cleric I'm playing at 100 mph and I don't really see the purpose of switching around several items when I already have everything covered.

[cam0940]

greenblade and skiver


Arko, you're missing the point. Who's gonna go run DQ 20, 40, maybe 100 times to get a greenblade, so they can craft armor w/ Sup Dev VIII on it? Gimme a break. And tome pages? Fuhgeddabowdit.

I already addressed this when I said there was no farming, plat, or grinding worth being able to equip the new DT armor on Clerics.

[nbhs275]

and Dwarven Fighters (that is, easy access to excessive Armor Mastery enhancements) that DO care about AC.

Im not sure how its helping WF that dont care about AC more then the ones that do.

Any way you slice its, they are the best docents in game. Its +2 ac, that we have no work arounds required for. The only other decent docent is defiance, which although it gives good DR, it also plants you in one spot which sucks pretty hard in most quests. So i much rather get a +7 docent of greater false life/Protection 5/ insight 4.

[cam0940]

but neither is arcane lore truely needed on a cleric.

With all due respect, this statement kinda disqualifies you.

[nbhs275]

Arko, you're missing the point. Who's gonna go run DQ 20, 40, maybe 100 times to get a greenblade, so they can craft armor w/ Sup Pot VIII on it? Gimme a break. And tome pages? Fuhgeddabowdit.

I already addressed this when I said there was no farming, plat, or grinding worth being able to equip the new DT armor on Clerics.

Unless those clerics are different from your skewed view, correct?

[ArkoHighStar]

With all due respect, this statement kinda disqualifies you.

It's not, honestly I use maximize and empower to ensure my BB does maximun damage, I certainly do not expect to have the crit go off every time and simply consider a plus when it does, The spell pen is more important for me, and I have a Torc that gives me greater 6 so I can instead put lorriks on tier 3 or maybe the spell point item as I do not do enough shroud to build mutiple tier 3 items, or put potency on my armor and then actually melee with a weapon if I have to.

[moops]

At this point Sup 8 is not needed for anything--all of our spells with a good damage base are level 6 and lower.

I do not know any cleric that uses Mass Cure Critical, in fact most of us still get by with Mass Cure Light and Mass Cure Mod and an occaisional Mass Cure serious.

I play quite a bit, enough to have crafted 4 items for each of my clerics in the shroud, but, I have never been able to get tome pages, and I have the money to buy them if I want. I did not xploit the run when others did.

Never run DQ anymore, not many LFMs, and not many friends or guidlies want to do it and I don't want to run really old content just so I can make use of a sub par new item.



Unless those clerics are different from your skewed view, correct?

[cam0940]

Unless those clerics are different from your skewed view, correct?

My view is not skewed. It's crystal clear. If you have Blue Dragonscale armor, there must be something offered that is compelling enough for you to change it.

Look at the possible outcomes on Dragontouched armor. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 Demon Queens. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 tome page runs OR a tremendous amount of plat or items in trade.

Now you tell me, is there anything offered on DT armor that might even come close to being worth it?

[Ganidel]

Here's a list of what we've seen so far rune wise:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=162707

Im missing as few as I havent confirmed them.

And I dont think theres sup pot 8 maybe imp, best I'v seen or seen posted is greater pot 7.

Also you have to be kidding me if you think this armor isnt great for clerics, yea you get arcane lore with blue armor but thats realy all that makes it good with what items we have now, like shroud and dragontouched.

I guess if your realy more of a battle cleric the blue armor is better as it has spell pen and crit but generaly clerics dont go full attack unless there realy a battle cleric,
I use destruction, slay living, BB, comet fall and harm a good bit but I feal you gain better over all benifit from the dragontouched.


But to each his own.


P.S. also can anyone confirm 95% sure that the 3rd Lorikk's gives sup dev 8?
and is the therne's giving feather fall as the 3rd teir as ppl have posted?

[ArkoHighStar]

My view is not skewed. It's crystal clear. If you have Blue Dragonscale armor, there must be something offered that is compelling enough for you to change it.

Look at the possible outcomes on Dragontouched armor. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 Demon Queens. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 tome page runs OR a tremendous amount of plat or items in trade.

Now you tell me, is there anything offered on DT armor that might even come close to being worth it?

all the lore gives you is 10% chance to crit on dmg that is it, you can't tell me that you rely solely on that to maximize your spell damage

[Vallin]

Wow. That's an awful lot of switching around. Cool tho man, whatever works. I just find that when the boo boo hits the fan, I don't have time to be switching around items/armors and what not. Usually on Cleric I'm playing at 100 mph and I don't really see the purpose of switching around several items when I already have everything covered.

I see clerics doing a lot of switching all the time - I thought it was commonplace. /shrug

It is a disadvantage the first few times a quest is run because of course you don't know what is coming at you. Those times I remain conservative as a healer anyway. However, once you kind of know a quest you know how to best equip at different points and it isn't so hectic. The only thing that I never swap is my base armor - the equipping time obviously makes it impractical.

Have I been caught 'with pants down' re: equipping? Sure. I ran a high level quest yesterday wearing my haggle ring instead of chattering ring. It happens lol!

Vallin

[cam0940]

Here's a list of what we've seen so far rune wise:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=162707

Im missing as few as I havent confirmed them.

And I dont think theres sup pot 8 maybe imp, best I'v seen or seen posted is greater pot 7.

Also you have to be kidding me if you think this armor isnt great for clerics, yea you get arcane lore with blue armor but thats realy all that makes it good with what items we have now, like shroud and dragontouched.

I guess if your realy more of a battle cleric the blue armor is better as it has spell pen and crit but generaly clerics dont go full attack unless there realy a battle cleric,
I use destruction, slay living, BB, comet fall and harm a good bit but I feal you gain better over all benifit from the dragontouched.


But to each his own.


P.S. also can anyone confirm 95% sure that the 3rd Lorikk's gives sup dev 8?
and is the therne's giving feather fall as the 3rd teir as ppl have posted?

In one of my posts I carelessly wrote Sup Pot VIII when I meant Sup Dev VIII. Thank you for correcting me.

I think what we're beginning to see is a great underappreciation of Gtr Arcane Lore on Cleric. Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need Reaver Gloves (free slot). Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need necessarily need Empower, because you're critting twice as much as you would w/out it. Gtr Arcane Lore means you crit very close to 1 out of 5 Heals/Cures/Harms/Searing Lights when you have enhancements, and 1 out of 10 BB. I'm not giving that up for the WORLD. The question is, what slot is it going in? Currently, given that moving it means a gang of DQ runs, a gang of tome page runs, or a gang of plat to BUY tome pages, forget about it.

As far as playing style, I am a casting Cleric who can go to VoD and halfway thru the quest SOLO on Cleric, but can't find a way to deal w/ the chains effect so I've abandoned the effort. I did that FOR FUN, cuz there certainly wasn't anything in it for me loot wise. And actually, lest I be corrected by anyone on technicalities, I went past first bats, past the spinning traps, and then used a Word of Recall scroll because I realized I didn't have enough resources availabe to go further. Then I mentioned it to Tinmad, he also tried it, and HE was the one that got to chains and concluded it couldn't be done. The point is, Clerics w/ Gtr Arcane Lore are badass in a major way, and there's going to have to be a very compelling reason to change the way our slots are arranged.

[maddmatt70]

In one of my posts I carelessly wrote Sup Pot VIII when I meant Sup Dev VIII. Thank you for correcting me.

I think what we're beginning to see is a great underappreciation of Gtr Arcane Lore on Cleric. Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need Reaver Gloves (free slot). Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need Empower, because you're critting twice as much as you would w/out it. Gtr Arcane Lore means you crit very close to 1 out of 5 Heals/Cures/Harms/Searing Lights when you have enhancements, and 1 out of 10 BB. I'm not giving that up for the WORLD. The question is, what slot is it going in? Currently, given that moving it means a gang of DQ runs, a gang of tome page runs, or a gang of plat to BUY tome pages, forget about it.

Everything you say is correct except greater arcane lore doesn't apply to heals only healing lore does, but I agree with your premise even if I were to get a skyver or greenblade I don't see a slot.

[Nick_RC]

Firstly Finis - where the hell is D@mnits mention!!!! Who's been draggin ur sorry @ss through those quests :D (he is primarily offensive casting melee in downtime).

Disclaimer :i swing and cast. Where appropriate i think its dumb not to do so.

Ok setup for ****** including DT armour. (tempest not aquired yet)

Head - Minos
Neck - Torque
Trinket - Bloodstone
Belt - Thoughtful remembrance
Boots - Enervate guard Hp/Sp/Sp (+5 conc.)
Bracers - Vod
R1 - Wisdom 6
R2 - Tumbleweed
Cloak - Napkin
Gloves - (Vod will be replaced with earthgrab fortsave/hp/hp next cleansing)
Goggles - Vod
Body - Dragontouched - GFL/Exc str+1/20hp(replaced with a guard when 2nd shroud crafting done)

Weapon Sets

Mineral 2 Greataxe (Holy/+1 Wis/+2 Wis (keep out for destruction/slayliving command and meleeing on the fly)

Sup 6 and skiver. (BB, cometfalls (basically any dmg spells), healing).

Basically this is my way of thinking. Skiver/greenblade and vod bracers + slot consolidation from DT armour is superior to blue armour.

Its whether you love ur cleric that much to put in the grind for the greenblade. (I agree tome pages are out of the equation at this stage inthe game.)People dont hesitate to do the titan 20/40/60/80 time etc for the ring. You can do all dq pres + adq1 + adq2 in under an hour with experienced competent people and an hour and a half if taking a lil time.

Its a grind either way. Either you grind for blue scales (not to mention the repair and maintenance of it) or grind for the greenblade. To be honest id suggest most clerics get the torque esp aggresive ones. The amount of sp you get back from it is nuts. While ur getting the torque ur getting the greenblade.

Basically it comes down to settling for blue dragon or going for the greenblade to free up for DT armour.

Thats how i see it anyway.

N

[Laith]

Everything you say is correct except greater arcane lore doesn't apply to heals only healing lore does, but I agree with your premise even if I were to get a skyver or greenblade I don't see a slot.arcane lore applies to all spells, just like potency.

you'll have to forgive the poor naming. Think of it as "Magic Lore" or "Spell Lore" if that helps you (hint turbine).

[ArkoHighStar]

In one of my posts I carelessly wrote Sup Pot VIII when I meant Sup Dev VIII. Thank you for correcting me.

I think what we're beginning to see is a great underappreciation of Gtr Arcane Lore on Cleric. Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need Reaver Gloves (free slot). Gtr Arcane Lore means you don't need Empower, because you're critting twice as much as you would w/out it. Gtr Arcane Lore means you crit very close to 1 out of 5 Heals/Cures/Harms/Searing Lights when you have enhancements, and 1 out of 10 BB. I'm not giving that up for the WORLD. The question is, what slot is it going in? Currently, given that moving it means a gang of DQ runs, a gang of tome page runs, or a gang of plat to BUY tome pages, forget about it.


How does 9% turn in to 1 in 5?

[Mhykke]

Everything you say is correct except greater arcane lore doesn't apply to heals only healing lore does, but I agree with your premise even if I were to get a skyver or greenblade I don't see a slot.

Matt, is this definite? I just assumed that since arcane lore affects no type spells like blade barrier, it worked on heals......

[maddmatt70]

arcane lore applies to all spells, just like potency.

you'll have to forgive the poor naming. Think of it as "Magic Lore" or "Spell Lore" if that helps you (hint turbine).

Well I remember testing it out in mod5 (I have the skyver and the gloves from the Reaver on one of my characters) and this wasn't the case unless they have changed it.

Edit: will test tonight then..

[Mhykke]

Its whether you love ur cleric that much to put in the grind for the greenblade. (I agree tome pages are out of the equation at this stage inthe game.)People dont hesitate to do the titan 20/40/60/80 time etc for the ring. You can do all dq pres + adq1 + adq2 in under an hour with experienced competent people and an hour and a half if taking a lil time.

Its a grind either way. Either you grind for blue scales (not to mention the repair and maintenance of it) or grind for the greenblade. To be honest id suggest most clerics get the torque esp aggresive ones. The amount of sp you get back from it is nuts. While ur getting the torque ur getting the greenblade.

Basically it comes down to settling for blue dragon or going for the greenblade to free up for DT armour.

Thats how i see it anyway.

N

What about as an alternative, if you're not going for AC on that cleric, making a blue dragon robe and a dragontouched robe or outfit, that way you can instaswap to fit the situation, and not worry about the grind for the greenblade or skiver (assuming you'd rather get blue scales than greenblade or skiver, which I would.)

[cam0940]

Everything you say is correct except greater arcane lore doesn't apply to heals only healing lore does, but I agree with your premise even if I were to get a skyver or greenblade I don't see a slot.

Gtr Arcane Lore affects all spells.

[Nick_RC]

What about as an alternative, if you're not going for AC on that cleric, making a blue dragon robe and a dragontouched robe or outfit, that way you can instaswap to fit the situation, and not worry about the grind for the greenblade or skiver.

Yeah thatd work for peeps without skiver but i got it and am to much of a poser on D@mnit to instaswap robes. HE WEARS ARMOUR AND CARRIES AN AXE RAWR!!!! (Alszo doing that would sorta negate the benefit of GFL as you lose that 30hp everytime ..only thing id want on that tier.

Also i dont have my sup 6 anywhere so sup6 + arcane for dps spells, Greataxe for instadeath crowd controt and skull smashing.

Could def be an option for other setups.

[cam0940]

Firstly Finis - where the hell is D@mnits mention!!!! Who's been draggin ur sorry @ss through those quests :D (he is primarily offensive casting melee in downtime).

Where you use asterisks and symbols, I spell backward, Tinmad. Trying not to get your name bleeped out.

[Aspenor]

Where you use asterisks and symbols, I spell backward, Tinmad. Trying not to get your name bleeped out.

Personally I prefer to just refer to him as noobstain.

[Nick_RC]

Where you use asterisks and symbols, I spell backward, Tinmad. Trying not to get your name bleeped out.

Oh i see...i was like "who is this tinmad??!!!"

[cam0940]

How does 9% turn in to 1 in 5?

Cuz the 9% from Gtr Arcane Lore stacks w/ enhancements, ergo 18%.

[Nick_RC]

Personally I prefer to just refer to him as noobstain.

I hjate you.

[Nick_RC]

For the record i dont only melee when my sp are out. Often its more sp efficinet to mellee. Ie Frost giants in dragon keen rapier of punct >BB. Kobolds quest is a turkey shoot until last fight, you may as well zerg wih the tanks destuct and whack away with PA. Monastery ... yeah BB win.

Also as a note to all those BB clerics. You can add significant dps by swinging an axe as you are kiting through BB's. You have a ridiculous reach while backpedling is all im gonna say.

N

[nbhs275]

My view is not skewed. It's crystal clear. If you have Blue Dragonscale armor, there must be something offered that is compelling enough for you to change it.

Look at the possible outcomes on Dragontouched armor. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 Demon Queens. Weigh that versus 20, 40, maybe 100 tome page runs OR a tremendous amount of plat or items in trade.

Now you tell me, is there anything offered on DT armor that might even come close to being worth it?

Hmm, on the average healing cleric, your looking at sup dev 8, possible +1 wis, and another open slot from the 3rd bonus. Vs spell pen 7, which is what all a healing cleric gets from blue truly.

To a melee cleric? hmm, better healing, and maybe additional str and hitpoint. Or more AC or saves.

The blue is only going to still be an easy solution still for the small percentage of clerics who run purely bb/cf offence. Otherwise, its going to be a tool. And either way, its still worth cleric to run the quests simply for the loot alone.

[cam0940]

Often its more sp efficinet to mellee.

Y'know I've heard you say that many times, and I take you at your word. It just seems that if you're meleeing, you're also taking more damage, which means more Heals. So in the end, I wonder if it really IS more efficient, but on my build I have no way to test it since I ain't meleein' *****.

[cam0940]

the average healing cleric

Thank you for dropping by and participating in the conversation. In my opinion the concept of a "healing cleric" is a myth. You can use any divine scroll in the game and you are forced to take certain cure/Heal spells that you can't switch out even if you wanted to. Thus all Clerics are healing clerics.

If healing/curing/buffing or otherwise mending your party is ALL you do on Cleric, you're only experiencing a portion of what the class is about.

The distinction is between whether you play as a caster or as a melee. W/ that said, it comes back around to Gtr Arcane Lore.

[nbhs275]

Thank you for dropping by and participating in the conversation. In my opinion the concept of a "healing cleric" is a myth. You can use any divine scroll in the game and you are forced to take certain cure/Heal spells that you can't switch out even if you wanted to. Thus all Clerics are healing clerics.

If healing/curing/buffing or otherwise mending your party is ALL you do on Cleric, you're only experiencing a portion of what the class is about.

The distinction is between whether you play as a caster or as a melee. W/ that said, it comes back around to Gtr Arcane Lore.

Most clerics that are playing as the main healer for say a raid, are focusing on healing. Thats because its often hard to manage the aggro of the 10-15 mobs you can quickly attract with a BB AND keep an entire group up and going. Most of those clerics stick with longer range, one shot spells like greater command and destruction/banishment. Meaning the spell pen is much more beneficial, and isnt nearly as hard to get as the greater arcane lore. The greater arcane lore is useful for 2-3 spells.

[SqtYork]

I don't have the time / patience / understanding to get the right combinations of good loot to make the most of being a capped cleric.
I also don't have the dexterity to make be as successfull with the jumpy jumpy kiting thru the BB as others. I'm getting better though.

High reflex save stuff you have to nail with destruction or command. I haven't really thought about using the maxed out Harm. I haven't spent my point there. Maybe I should rethink that

I really appreciate landing a one shot kill on casters / ranging mobs. Melee mobs I can stop with command if there is enough DPS in the group. Undead I really have BB. Turning Undead is almost useless for me. Or was, anyone having better luck on normal / slayer runs with undead?

Equipment wise, I carry an evoc / necro item with a gtr pot VII item in the shield hand. That way if I use a wand or scroll I can still cast heals / damage with the bonuses.

[moops]

With all the elite newer content, and even some of the newer areas on normal, one needs more than just spell pen to have great success with zapping--I have 4 clerics, 2 that are necro focused with both feats the most Wisdom possible--I know the difference between having the spell focuses and not having them--fully max with everything DC and Spell Pen, there are still some areas that I can't get squat to land----it would be nice to have not only more spell pen, but also another Necro Feat on the armor and Superior Arcane lore.


Most clerics that are playing as the main healer for say a raid, are focusing on healing. Thats because its often hard to manage the aggro of the 10-15 mobs you can quickly attract with a BB AND keep an entire group up and going. Most of those clerics stick with longer range, one shot spells like greater command and destruction/banishment. Meaning the spell pen is much more beneficial, and isnt nearly as hard to get as the greater arcane lore. The greater arcane lore is useful for 2-3 spells.

[cam0940]

Most clerics that are playing as the main healer for say a raid, are focusing on healing. Thats because its often hard to manage the aggro of the 10-15 mobs you can quickly attract with a BB AND keep an entire group up and going. Most of those clerics stick with longer range, one shot spells like greater command and destruction/banishment. Meaning the spell pen is much more beneficial, and isnt nearly as hard to get as the greater arcane lore. The greater arcane lore is useful for 2-3 spells.

If these are your beliefs then I will respect you for them. What I'm telling you as fact though, is that you clearly aren't getting as much out of Cleric as you could be.

[ArkoHighStar]

If these are your beliefs then I will respect you for them. What I'm telling you as fact though, is that you clearly aren't getting as much out of Cleric as you could be.

there are many ways to play a cleric, and there many ways to build one, and while perhaps te armor does not help you, it will help my cleric and many others, so I think it is fair to say that dragon touched armor doesn't helpe everyone equally, but no piece of loot ever does.

[maddmatt70]

Matt, is this definite? I just assumed that since arcane lore affects no type spells like blade barrier, it worked on heals......

Yeah, it works for heals my apologies for the mistake. Tested...

[Tin_Dragon]

Exactly Arko, you hit the nail right on the head. Who in the world would trade Gtr Arcane Lore and Spell Pen VII for better Mass Cure Critical? It's madness.

But it did occur to me that in order to "get" this thread, you do kinda have to understand Cleric offense. Cleric is SO MUCH MORE than sitting in the back of the party throwing heals and buffs.

And how often do you see Shroud runs with more than 3 clerics? Usually its 2 anymore, and out of those, how many of them tank Harry? Who heals the tanks then?

There is more to them, but the bread and butter of D&D clerics, is lifesupport (heals and buffs) and a back up tank. In DDO, in MOST cases, its as lifesupport. Everyone has a role to play, and for good balance, most groups tned to conform to a degree.

That said, it does seem an aweful lot of grinding just for sup dev 8.

Yes, i'mm saying it, more cleric love. cause cleric love equals love for everyone.

[BlackSteel]

With all due respect, this statement kinda disqualifies you.

how so? I only see arcane lore being useful on BB's, nice when they crit, but its nothing to count on since its only 9% (no enhancements for that one) if you're smiting end game mobs then I dont think I'm the crazy one ;)

and healing crits while nice for the epeen, cant be counted on either, cause if u're relying on a healing crit to save party members then you're bound to have some dead laying around.

dont see arcane lore being nearly that important on a cleric, maybe if you like to pvp, or solo lvl 10-12 quests on normal

[Mhykke]

and healing crits while nice for the epeen, cant be counted on either, cause if u're relying on a healing crit to save party members then you're bound to have some dead laying around.



The lore is nice if the cleric is using mass cures. Often, it'll mean that you're crit curing at least 1 party member, which is helpful, in addition to the blade barrier buff.

[maddmatt70]

And how often do you see Shroud runs with more than 3 clerics? Usually its 2 anymore, and out of those, how many of them tank Harry? Who heals the tanks then?

There is more to them, but the bread and butter of D&D clerics, is lifesupport (heals and buffs) and a back up tank. In DDO, in MOST cases, its as lifesupport. Everyone has a role to play, and for good balance, most groups tned to conform to a degree.

That said, it does seem an aweful lot of grinding just for sup dev 8.

Yes, i'mm saying it, more cleric love. cause cleric love equals love for everyone.

I would say in pnp at high levels a cleric cast spells and rarely tank. You can make melee clerics in pnp that are solid for sure, but spells like firestorm in pnp really influence a cleric's options because they are so potent.

[maddmatt70]

It hardly seems worth the grind because if they put the mass heal spell into the game it will almost certainly be more efficient then the mass cure spells even if the max cure spells have superior devotion and the mass heal does not. Only reason to get the lorriks long term is the hope that there will be a 4th piece of the lorriks set and it will be sweet. This is the same case with the tharne's 3rd piece - the feather fall is very underwhelming but who know what the 4th piece will be.

[Auran82]

So does someone actually have a *complete* list of every single bonus that could possibly appear on the armours?

If not, whos to say that there isn't a gtr arcane lore hidden in a rune somewhere waiting to be unlocked?