Zhuggothz

[kaidendager]

A red named undead beholder in an encounter area immune to fire with enough hp to drain a sorcs sp bar...

Well at least it isn't a straight up nerf.

[Josh]

Typical Turbine rubbish really.

[Inspire]

Try disentegrate, magic missle, force missile... but the best way to kill him is to be a cleric.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Typical Turbine rubbish really.

Yupyup. Put in spells and feats/enhancements so powerful you can walk through 99% of the game, then make mobs immune to everything...

We're used to it by now.

[Vorn]

Sounds like a relative of the one in GoP.

I hate being stuck at work.

[kaidendager]

Try disentegrate, magic missle, force missile... but the best way to kill him is to be a cleric.

disentegrate and force missiles were how I did it...after recalling for mana three times. I'm sure there will be an exploit found, but when I saw the first red named I was disappointed, second and third I just kinda shook my head.

[KoboldKiller]

I don't see how this is an issue or rubbish by Turbine. It's a high level encounter thus requiring high level tactics. So what if it's immune to fire who says it can't be? Why is this an issue. Do you only carry fire spells, obviously not since you changed tactics. Why is it every time the game changes tactics, the challenge or forces us to change tactics people complain about how it's unfair or "rubbish" as was stated. We change tactics, resists whatever to fit the situation, why can't the MOBs. I DM'd for years and switched things up all the time to create a new challenge that's all our DM (Turbine) did.

[Tourette]

enervate and feeblemind?

[frugal_gourmet]

I declare shenanigans.

[kchaz]

heal...

[United]

omg you guys think thats bad wait tell you see frost giants there immune to vorpal, FoD PK all cold spells of couse and wounding or weaking as well you need puncturing or enfebbling to hit also dps is gone they have enough hp to burn though 1/4 a sorc sp just in max empower and extended FW lol

[frugal_gourmet]

I was really hoping those frost giants would take a licking from my fire spells.

Also, I don't know what spell or class ability turns my sorceror into a cleric with heal, but I definitely need it for Zhuggothz.

[rimble]

omg you guys think thats bad wait tell you see frost giants there immune to vorpal, FoD PK all cold spells of couse and wounding or weaking as well you need puncturing or enfebbling to hit also dps is gone they have enough hp to burn though 1/4 a sorc sp just in max empower and extended FW lol

I haven't seen any new content, but I assume you're talking about non-red-named Giants, so presumably casters could serve some purpose webbing/dancing/feebleminding or otherwise being useful. Red-named blanket immunities are just a lazy world of suck. They're really anti-tactical, as they only leave raw damage as a viable tactic.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

I don't see how this is an issue or rubbish by Turbine. It's a high level encounter thus requiring high level tactics. So what if it's immune to fire who says it can't be? Why is this an issue. Do you only carry fire spells, obviously not since you changed tactics. Why is it every time the game changes tactics, the challenge or forces us to change tactics people complain about how it's unfair or "rubbish" as was stated. We change tactics, resists whatever to fit the situation, why can't the MOBs. I DM'd for years and switched things up all the time to create a new challenge that's all our DM (Turbine) did.

If yer DM kept telling you everything was immune to everything you'd pack up yer cheeto's and diet coke and go on home...

It's a cheezie solution to firewalls doing massive damage and ya know it.

[Tourette]

yeah but how is the LOOT?!?!?!?!?

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[kaidendager]

I don't see how this is an issue or rubbish by Turbine. It's a high level encounter thus requiring high level tactics. So what if it's immune to fire who says it can't be? Why is this an issue. Do you only carry fire spells, obviously not since you changed tactics. Why is it every time the game changes tactics, the challenge or forces us to change tactics people complain about how it's unfair or "rubbish" as was stated. We change tactics, resists whatever to fit the situation, why can't the MOBs. I DM'd for years and switched things up all the time to create a new challenge that's all our DM (Turbine) did.

I don't really view my post as whining nor necessarily inviting such a condescending retort, though you are as always welcome to voice your thoughts and opinions. Should I have used better tactics indeed, I was soloing in unknown territory on a caster...I don't think tactics get much worse than that actually.

The only frustration I feel is that this issue had already arisen and had been put to rest nearly a year ago (possibly more). History lesson: When cloudkill first came about we used it on everything, including red names and life was good. Then rogues and finessers got puncturers and the SC giant and Sorjek became nothing more than bumps in the road and life was good. The DPS builds didn't like this so much and complained that casters and stat damagers were overpowered and needed to be nerfed so it was that everything that was a unique mob (today purple, red, orange) became immune to all stat damages and conditions. Casters and dex based builds became nothing more than conveniences for traps or haste (overgeneralizing just a bit here). Finally it came to the point that teh DDO community called bollocks on this and said that Witch Doctor Kneeza should not be immune to everything under the sun, but nor should end raid encounters amount to a single spell. A compromise occured and the orange name was born and both sides were happy (or at least complacent).

When you throw red named blankets on everything (particularly here in an explorer area) it is more or less a lazy way of saying "there now you have to party". Personally I won't be doing much else over the next few days but searching for exploits and maneuvers to continue soloing, but I'd prefer to be coming up with spell combos and true caster tactics.

[KoboldKiller]

I don't feel I was being condescending, all I said was what's the big deal. The game adapted just as we do. Yes if everything were immune to everything that would be a problem but it clearly is not immune to everything just what is considered a trued and true tactic. Look powergamers and long term players have been complaining about wanting high level content and more of a challenge well they got it.

[United]

I haven't seen any new content, but I assume you're talking about non-red-named Giants, so presumably casters could serve some purpose webbing/dancing/feebleminding or otherwise being useful. Red-named blanket immunities are just a lazy world of suck. They're really anti-tactical, as they only leave raw damage as a viable tactic.

they giants are immune to dancing as well and feebleminding, all the frost giants have red-named immunities as far as loot eww it was ok but the shroud gives the same loot, all the new quest are the same lvl as the shroud and about 2x harder then the shroud. and dps doesnt work on giants we had 3 tanks beat on them for a good min lol

[Strakeln]

Red-named blanket immunities are just a lazy world of suck.Are you reading, Turbine?

If not, you should be!

[Torron]

frost gaints are not immune to wounding but they do have high con and are resistant to stat damage. I need to find agood maldroit weapon and hope they have a lousy dex:D I had no problem killing them with wounding even with the resistance to stat damge it still was quicker than using my holy dwarven axe of greater gaint bane.

[ArkoHighStar]

all the rare named are red named in the new area's, we beat the beholder with 4 people no cleric he isn't that hard, and considering you have to trigger him, you have to be looking for the fight

[suitepotato]

So they made an explorer area so hard that you really can't solo it easy with a level appropriate toon... Subterrane anyone?

Yeesh.

The big thing is still the lack of nekkid elf girls, the missing free beer, and proper bling.

[ArkoHighStar]

So they made an explorer area so hard that you really can't solo it easy with a level appropriate toon... Subterrane anyone?

Yeesh.

The big thing is still the lack of nekkid elf girls, the missing free beer, and proper bling.

have you tried any of them yet, they are fairly easy to solo, everything has short leashes, and only a few of the named are tough as the beholder.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Its not really a problem with the area's/mob's being hard to kill, easy to solo etc.

Id just rather there were better ways than blanket immunities.

Then a'course I also think mob HP's are over-inflated and is a cheezie way to deal with the massive damage we put out.

I think Id rather play a game where I can use everything at my disposal and still have a good fight, y'know?

Just seems, well, a cheap way to combat our massive damage output...

Thats all.

[Korvek]

Meh, he's just identical to Cholthulzz.

I personally prefer acid fog/acid arrow over Heal against him. It's a slight bit safer, though I suppose few sorcs have those spells.

[mehlinda]

Does anyone think for a minute a lvl 16 character of any type is supposed to be able to easily solo a lvl 17 explorer area...If so, whats the point? It is supposed to be tough and probably supposed to require some semblance of a team or as one poster said, "advanced tactics"...I tried the named lion in the area with the undead on my cleric and burnt most of my bar trying to run him thru bb's which he was mostly able to save against...

I have never liked Turbine's methods of making things blanket immune simply because they are red named and I don't like how they fix some things when we find ways of easily defeating them which they never considered but I don't have a problem with something starting with certain immunuties..I am sure fire is not the only way a caster has to kill things..it is only 1 path...does the beholder take electric damage ??

[Strykersz]

So they made an explorer area so hard that you really can't solo it easy with a level appropriate toon... Subterrane anyone?

Yeesh.

The big thing is still the lack of nekkid elf girls, the missing free beer, and proper bling.

Casters solo the Subterrane...

[Nevthial]

Just turn the frost giants to stone & use stat damagers, curse spewing , destruction,ect.

[kaidendager]

..I am sure fire is not the only way a caster has to kill things..it is only 1 path...does the beholder take electric damage ??

I'm sure he does (though I didn't actually have any lightning spells to try out). It was just a statement that an undead beholder was immune to insta-deaths, stat damage, conditions and fire. My post was just that there is no real excuse for a monster like that unless he was raid buffed by the lion before I killed it...

Again, I apologize if I came off as whining, it truly wasn't so. As my previous post claimed this was just all too reminiscent of the time Turbine made all named creatures immune to everything and nerfed almost 3/4 of the toons in Stormreach.

To all the players saying that a level 16 sorc should not have an easy time soloing level 17 content: I fully and whole-heartedly agree with you. I will party (though most of my fun comes from the challenge of solo/duoing) and I will employ "advanced tactics" and I will, in the end, conquer. I made no claims that running out into an unexplored wilderness on mod day and facing a challenge was ludicrous. It was just the opposite I expected to die, I expected inflated hp, I expected to get torn to pieces within moments of my first encounter truthfully...I simply did not expect the red name and hence the blanket immunities.

I will reiterate for my own sake, I am not whining. I am overjoyed at the new content and explorer areas. I am a little disappointed with red names.

Edited for spelling.

[shells74]

Disintegrate and heal worked pretty well, and took him down quickly ;)

[Milolyen]

My "gimpy" 28 point build ranged base ranger can easily solo the mount and the valley includeing the rares. He does have a tough time in the gardens though.

Milolyen

[Aeneas]

frost gaints are not immune to wounding but they do have high con and are resistant to stat damage. I need to find agood maldroit weapon and hope they have a lousy dex:D I had no problem killing them with wounding even with the resistance to stat damge it still was quicker than using my holy dwarven axe of greater gaint bane.

Check their buffs, pretty sure they are. They are immune to stat damage and death effects (including rogue assassinate and vorpal). Some Sor'jek's slave buff. Very cheesy.

I also think making every named mob a red named mob takes a lot of the fun out of the game. One shotting a named enemy is exponentially more satisfying that taking out some sick, weak dog following it.

[fluffi]

Heal, heal , heal,
well it would have been easier, but I forgot about that spell and after using holy smite liek 5 times for 50ish dmg, I remembered and then it got easy cycling between heal and cure crit. He has loads of hp as I do between 300-600 on a heal and he took around 5 of them (after a beat down). Fun seeing all the eye beams.

[Milolyen]

Check their buffs, pretty sure they are. They are immune to stat damage and death effects (including rogue assassinate and vorpal). Some Sor'jek's slave buff. Very cheesy.

I also think making every named mob a red named mob takes a lot of the fun out of the game. One shotting a named enemy is exponentially more satisfying that taking out some sick, weak dog following it.

No ... was killing all of the frost giants just fine with con dmg.

Milolyen

[Opall]

I healed the Beholder to Death.


In the Frozen area: The Giants do have lots of HP and have lots of immunities, However, they can all be turned to stone (minus the red named) Makes it simple.


Imo, I dont think any of the new outdoor areas are difficult at all.

[Yajerman01]

um flesh to stone anyone?

[Ghoste]

enervate and feeblemind?
Undead laugh at both those spells.

[Aeneas]

No ... was killing all of the frost giants just fine with con dmg.

Milolyen

Hmmm. I know they had something else. Maybe it was immunity to blindness or fear or some junk. Though it said something about stat damage though.

[cpito]

If yer DM kept telling you everything was immune to everything you'd pack up yer cheeto's and diet coke and go on home...

My dm used to do just that to us PnP players and yes, occasionally one of our players would throw thier dice, grab thier cheetos and go home. the rest of us would stay and discover things like said mobs not being immune to cantrips, falling great distances, nor rock to mud/mud to rock... etc. In fact, most of us reveled in our DM throwing the "impossible" at us. :eek:

[Torroth]

I don't really view my post as whining nor necessarily inviting such a condescending retort, though you are as always welcome to voice your thoughts and opinions. Should I have used better tactics indeed, I was soloing in unknown territory on a caster...I don't think tactics get much worse than that actually.

The only frustration I feel is that this issue had already arisen and had been put to rest nearly a year ago (possibly more). History lesson: When cloudkill first came about we used it on everything, including red names and life was good. Then rogues and finessers got puncturers and the SC giant and Sorjek became nothing more than bumps in the road and life was good. The DPS builds didn't like this so much and complained that casters and stat damagers were overpowered and needed to be nerfed so it was that everything that was a unique mob (today purple, red, orange) became immune to all stat damages and conditions. Casters and dex based builds became nothing more than conveniences for traps or haste (overgeneralizing just a bit here). Finally it came to the point that teh DDO community called bollocks on this and said that Witch Doctor Kneeza should not be immune to everything under the sun, but nor should end raid encounters amount to a single spell. A compromise occured and the orange name was born and both sides were happy (or at least complacent).

When you throw red named blankets on everything (particularly here in an explorer area) it is more or less a lazy way of saying "there now you have to party". Personally I won't be doing much else over the next few days but searching for exploits and maneuvers to continue soloing, but I'd prefer to be coming up with spell combos and true caster tactics.

OH GOOD LORD! Oh noes! A sorc is going to have difficulty soloing this area, its the end of the freakin world.

Hmph...or should I say, YAY for undead beholders that are immune to fire and can't be solo'd by sorcs! Woohoo!

[Ghoste]

um flesh to stone anyone?
Um what flesh? We're talking about an incorporeal monster here.

[SableShadow]

Hmmm. I know they had something else. Maybe it was immunity to blindness or fear or some junk. Though it said something about stat damage though.


They blind fine, at least on normal. And I saw a couple of them feared. They did have vorp protection, though, like the giants in the Tor. *shrug*

[Aeneas]

This is gonna bother me now.


Anybody not at work (like me) that can run into the frozen valley and get me the full description of the sor'jek buff that the frost giants have?

[Meriadeuc]

Meh, he's just identical to Cholthulzz.



So is he lawfull good, incorpreal, and immune to all elemental damage like Cholthulzz?

[ShadowFox1978]

This is gonna bother me now.


Anybody not at work (like me) that can run into the frozen valley and get me the full description of the sor'jek buff that the frost giants have?

They are resistant to stat damage. It is kind of like fortification against it. They will resist some hits from wounding, puncture will go through normally, but they can resist a point or 2.

I found Min2 very effective, there hp is not that high.

[croger1520033]

I honestly do not see what the big deal is, I couldn't find a group this morning and was able to solo the new explorer areas with my 28 point ranger. I can't imagine what all of you do when you get to the end fights in these quests with only 3 people. Gl though one day all of the people who laughed at my build cause it was different and didn't follow the Flavor of the month will realize that well built characters have staying power, and do not need to be rerolled every time the new BEST build comes out. I have had this build for a long time never rerolled it and I am still plugging away solo alot of times in quests you guys cry about when the devs change it to something that no longer is to the strength of your build.

Anyways I refuse to use WoP's I think that has got to be the worst thing that was ever added to the game to many people saying I can kill faster than you because I have WoP who get owned by me using normal every day weapons. Takes the tactics and skill out of alot of the player base, instead of playing perma death try playing without your uber WoP's and try different tactics and see how you can become a better player who actually helps the party out.

[Yajerman01]

Um what flesh? We're talking about an incorporeal monster here.


sorry, my response was in regard to the ice giants. not the beholder - got sidetracked

[Yajerman01]

FYI, if some of you didnt already know - I was swimming by the long bridge in the ghost beholder area and there is a regen spot in between two rocks in the water (like the shroud regen areas, i.e. tree) - lots of pretty butterflies :P

[vtecfiend99]

This guy is NO more difficult than in GoP, Less so actually. Beat him with two rangers. Just make sure you kill all trash mobs around his spawn point, many shot FTW. If you need to you can hide in the water while your timer resets.

Also did it later with an acid/elec specced sorc... that absolutely PWNED him. I think acid/elec specced sorcs are damned good really, seems that they are always the "alternative" that works well and they can still smack most everything around as well....

[Phidius]

This is gonna bother me now.


Anybody not at work (like me) that can run into the frozen valley and get me the full description of the sor'jek buff that the frost giants have?

I got Precious ready to go in before the servers went down... I'll try to remember to post an exact quote once they come up.

[Quikster]

Giants were pretty easy, enervation---->FTS----->extend/max firewall----->move on and let him burn. I havent had much of a problem on my sorc soloing the new encounter areas, I did use a lot of pots trying to figure out a good pattern with the shrine but thats about it. The loot is good considering you can burn through all three on a caster in about 20 min, much easier than trying to 1 man the shroud :)

[Phidius]

This is gonna bother me now.


Anybody not at work (like me) that can run into the frozen valley and get me the full description of the sor'jek buff that the frost giants have?

Here you go!

http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/rr282/dkwyss/sorjeks_command.jpg

BTW, I find I can save mana by carrying a Puncturing weapon - they drop like a rock once stoned :)

[Angelus_dead]

Giants were pretty easy, enervation---->FTS----->extend/max firewall
Firewall on a statue, big waste of mana.

[WeaselKing]

So they made an explorer area so hard that you really can't solo it easy with a level appropriate toon... Subterrane anyone?



Its pretty soloable you just need the right tactics, or maybe you mean that we don't have level appropriate toons for a 17th level explorer area yet.

[BattleCircle]

I found Lightning strike to work very well against everything I encountered, of course if it doesn't proc it can take some time. all in all I had a blast last night and can't wait to run again tonite :D

[WeaselKing]

Oops, double post.

[transtemporal]

Er... Web, enervate, feeblemind, beat until dead?

[transtemporal]

Ack. Stoopid phone browser won't let me edit a post. Didn't realise it was incorporeal, disregard comment about web.

[incontinetia]

Did anyone try chill touch for more control?
I realize this is an explorer area and not gop, but it does work on cholthulzz.
I hope he will spawn for me so I can finally try it:)

[Alavatar]

If yer DM kept telling you everything was immune to everything you'd pack up yer cheeto's and diet coke and go on home...

It's a cheezie solution to firewalls doing massive damage and ya know it.

Blasphemy! Where's the Mt. Dew?!

[Impaqt]

Ack. Stoopid phone browser won't let me edit a post. Didn't realise it was incorporeal, disregard comment about web.
Enervate and Feeblemind generally dont work on Red named either.



I was able to get him with about 6 Extended Maximized/Empowered Blade barriers... Just ran him around the yard there.... The posts to a great job of blockng the rays... even though they appear to go right through them.. THey dont.....