wiz 7/cleric 9?

[wrinyn]

Hey all.....I have a capped wiz 16 and a battle cleric 1 fighter/15 cleric.....I am now on to a 7wiz/9 cleric. I made him a dwarf and I just want some opinions on starting the build feat-wise and enhancements. I wanted PK/WoF from the wiz with buffs as well, and I wanted raise dead/slay living from the cleric line....Please don't make fun of the build and its end game gimpness. Just help me out...i'd greatly appreciate it. I am 2 wiz/1 cleric now and it's a blast to play....Give me some comments and starting stats. I can reroll him as of now....

[iruka41]

Not gonna say it's effective, but anyone can build as they are pleased. No need to flame at all.

What you have to admit, though, is that those PK and Firewall is less effective than those with higher level Wizards. (Of course, right?)
PK's DC is low, since your highest spell level is low, and Firewall's damage is gonna be like half the full wizard.

Can't say I reccomand it, instead try this:

Halfling 1 Bard / 15Wizard.

You can get the Greater Dragonmark of Healing, whch grants you a nice ability to top up around 1000HP/rest.
You can max your UMD, so you can use rez scrolls without failure, and Heal scrolls with nice success rate.

Still you maintain top level PK DC and Firewall Damage, along with nice level8 arcane spells.

Or you can go 1 Rogue / 15 Wizard to become an efficiant Trapmonky at the same time.

Just my thought.

[Kalanth]

Well, definetly scrap any melee aspects of the character and invest in your Int and Wis. Always a good thing for this. You could potentially split the 4 ability points you get on your way to 16 between Int and Wis as well. Sure, wont be in the 30's but still. Its the DC's that will be tough, and I would not expect much out of PK to be honest. Two saves needed, low Int, more than likely the enemy will save on it. Though you will have the Wall of Fire and Solid Fog which is good, and two feets to use for Metamagic feets free of charge thanks to wizard levels.

Its hard to say, really. In PnP it could be smooth, but in DDO it may be rough going.

[Dexxaan]

Not gonna say it's effective, but anyone can build as they are pleased. No need to flame at all.

What you have to admit, though, is that those PK and Firewall is less effective than those with higher level Wizards. (Of course, right?)
PK's DC is low, since your highest spell level is low, and Firewall's damage is gonna be like half the full wizard.

Can't say I reccomand it, instead try this:

Halfling 1 Bard / 15Wizard.

You can get the Greater Dragonmark of Healing, whch grants you a nice ability to top up around 1000HP/rest.
You can max your UMD, so you can use rez scrolls without failure, and Heal scrolls with nice success rate.

Still you maintain top level PK DC and Firewall Damage, along with nice level8 arcane spells.

Or you can go 1 Rogue / 15 Wizard to become an efficiant Trapmonky at the same time.

Just my thought.

Good advice.

IMO (and actual experience) go 14 Wizard and 2 Rogue for evasion, Skill points (I took 2nd Rogue level at L15 to max UMD and such).

You´d be surprised how survivable a caster is due to evasion, (Insightful Reflexes makes u an Evasion Save Beast), + MAX- EMP- Extend and if your concerned of being 2 caster levels below the non Evasion/Skills Casters then you compensate by using the Napkin from the Reaver and voilá your only 1 behind. Arkkanoz my Evasion Trap-Monkey Wizard has 208 HP´s 34 INT (No GS weapon) and AC 39 when toting a shield....Survivability is key in my play style...not min-max, unskilled uber DC builds.


Hope this helps.

[Gratch]

Can't say I reccomand it, instead try this:

Halfling 1 Bard / 15Wizard.

If you've already made a wizard... one adjustment to this might be to make a bard1/sorc15. Both use Charisma and it's fun to be a spell cannon.


Still you maintain top level PK DC and Firewall Damage, along with nice level8 arcane spells.

Which of them are nice? :)

[wrinyn]

I've seen the bard/wiz builds and of course the rogue/wiz builds but I am trying to stay away from the almost pure wiz builds because I already have my main wiz. My arcane death priest was an idea over too many blue moons and it's been fun. I don't really plan on using PK as much as the buffing spells and damage mitigation from the wiz line and the secondary healing role of the cleric. He's going to turn into a heavy support role player but it's different than what i'm used to.....

[doodooman]

invest more in wis than int, since your going more clr, youll need the wis for the sp and the save dcs, greater command will be decent, bestow curse, contagion, blindness, bane are all clr spells too and will probably have a higher dc than the arcane versions and slay living is only a fort save the higher wis will be nice. i wouldnt bother with dex or cha since youll be spread thin, take insightfull reflexes to make up for the dex take maximize, empower with your free metamagic feats, and heighten, extend, and mental toughness spell focus enchantment with the others

[krud]

At high levels you might have a hard time getting thru mob spell resistance. Maybe if you took spell pen and greater spell pen, and maxxed your spell pen enhancements, you could manage. One way to overcome your low DC is to enervate, enervate, enervate. On creatures with no SR you can always spam scrolls of enervate, and save your own enervates for those with SR. might be worth a try.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

Offensive spells that have a saving throw, need you to have a very high (maxed) casting stat. Int/Wiz.

I would do this build a little different. I would forget offensice cleric spells. And take minimal Wiz. 14 at creation, and add 1 somewhere along the line. I would make Int very high, but maybe not maxed. And I would put other points into combat stats.

Use divine power in combat and melee. Use low lvl Wiz spells for CC. Hypno, Web, Ottos.....etc. Also use WoF.
And have all the cleric cure-alls....plus rez. And some decent healing.

Spend plat for heal scrolls and this is a actually a viable char.

Now you just have to convince everyone else of that.

[geoffhanna]

I think this is very doable. I've thought about it myself. You can 't do everything, but you can do a lot, and some of them are things that no other single character can do:


you can haste
you can raise dead
With scrolls, you can Heal
You can use every wand in the game

You'll have blur, you'll have all the resists and protects, and some CC ability too. You'll get mana from INT and from WIS. And you'll have a Cleric icon, not a Wizard icon, which is probably a good thing for getting this build into groups.

I imagine you are going to want a lot of UMD. Extend is required, as is Empowered Healing.

On the downside, you'll have limited nuking, and be missing spells that PUG players may expect to find on their cleric. You're going to have to cast that Haste very frequently due to short duration. And you may find yourself standing around a lot waiting for someone to buff or heal (but then, so does every cleric :) ).

I have a PnP character that is cleric7/necromancer7 and I'd love to bring him into DDO. But the bottom line for me is that every time I go down this mental path I end up thinking... "wait, this is exactly what a bard does except with without songs".

Good luck, I'm rooting for you, please update us on your progress.

[Dexxaan]

Just a quick comment regarding Empowered Healing....don´t take it, and take normal Empower since you can use it for either path you have chosen.

[MrWizard]

Hey all.....I have a capped wiz 16 and a battle cleric 1 fighter/15 cleric.....I am now on to a 7wiz/9 cleric. I made him a dwarf and I just want some opinions on starting the build feat-wise and enhancements. I wanted PK/WoF from the wiz with buffs as well, and I wanted raise dead/slay living from the cleric line....Please don't make fun of the build and its end game gimpness. Just help me out...i'd greatly appreciate it. I am 2 wiz/1 cleric now and it's a blast to play....Give me some comments and starting stats. I can reroll him as of now....

I would give up on the PK...or anything that has a saving throw on it.

Your levels for each will be at such a low DC for caster level...and most likely your int and wis are not super high either.

I would stick with buffs for wiz and clr spells...or direct damage spells. I would not use PK unless on a low level dungeon.
Go 10 clr for more power there and there is no need for wiz 7...the clr levels will get you 20 resists.

I dunno...sounds fun, but yes, at end game people will not be happy unless you do something uber with the build. Unfortunately casters of all kinds are killed in effectiveness the further you take them from a max level...not fair, but that is how it is..

ask my dead rerolled 5ftr/5 sorc....lol-

[VirieSquichie]

The weakest thing about that build is the lack of Heal. Scrolls just don't cut it in a large combat. Mass Aid, Mass SoF and Mass SR aren't that big of a loss, or shouldn't be if your party is good. When the level cap goes up (to 18 presumably) the 7 Wizard / 11 Cleric has some real potential.

Some other things you'll also miss out on are Banishment/Destruction/FoD/greater command/otto's sphere, which may or may not matter to you. I find that other than buffs, in the upper levels not having those would make me far less useful to the group. Some things are better immobilized or removed, or the injuries and interference they inflict get quite costly.

[geoffhanna]

Just a quick comment regarding Empowered Healing....don´t take it, and take normal Empower since you can use it for either path you have chosen.

As someone who dislikes clericing and has therefore never taken one past 9th level... why not?

Please elaborate.


I would give up on the PK...or anything that has a saving throw on it.
...

Agreed. Or spell resistance. I was rather curious as to which 4th level spell was driving the 7 levels of wizard?

[Lymnus]

Hate to play devil advocate, but what about a 15 Bard/1 Rogue, or 14 Bard/2 Rogue? This would have a higher UMD, longer haste, with scrolls can cast heal and rez (with more success at that), but loses the ability to cast resistances/protections. Though, to counter that, you could wand whip that. And, beyond that, you'd have nice little bardy abilities with trap monkey skills, and could throw in the Spellsinger enhancement for more SP and UMD, along with extending the party's SP.

You wouldn't be an offensive caster, but you could support heal, buff, crowd control. And all the while, you're a build that won't be difficult to level nor will be debatable by the party.

[wrinyn]

As someone who dislikes clericing and has therefore never taken one past 9th level... why not?

Please elaborate.



Agreed. Or spell resistance. I was rather curious as to which 4th level spell was driving the 7 levels of wizard?

I was hoping to have the following spells at wiz 7: Stoneskin, Solid Fog, wall of fire, curse, contagion......I needed the stoneskin and wall of fire. I like curse and contagion as debuffs to help others and myself and of course solid fog for added mitigation (slow moving). I wanted Raise Dead from the cleric line to help raise others. The goal of the build is similar to the bards "do everything but superior at nothing, Jack of all trades thing". This character will be mostly used as a support caster and support healer. I want to take some of the brunt off of the traditional cleric and caster. I also want to be able to throw out buffs to those around me. I severely doubt I will be able to take a pounding in melee despite all of the mitigation spells and buffs I can through on myself, but it was something different than my traditional necromancer I have....

I do appreciate all of the ideas and information that were given. To answer the questions about the bard builds...I just don't have the experience with the class to create a viable character. I have built some great wizards and clerics before. This just seemed like an interesting combo......

[Aranticus]

I think this is very doable. I've thought about it myself. You can 't do everything, but you can do a lot, and some of them are things that no other single character can do:


you can haste
you can raise dead
With scrolls, you can Heal
You can use every wand in the game


You'll have blur, you'll have all the resists and protects, and some CC ability too. You'll get mana from INT and from WIS. And you'll have a Cleric icon, not a Wizard icon, which is probably a good thing for getting this build into groups.

you wont have much groups in the higher levels as most people will think you as a liability rather than an asset. haste is good, but a 1 min haste.... meh. heal scrolls are good, but it means you are exclusively healing from scrolls as your cure light, mod, serious cannot keep up with the damage. raise is a non issue as many people have access to shroud res clickies and if u have umd, from scrolls. the lack of mass cure mod also mean your versatility as a healer is limited. instead of mass healing a whole group, you need to individually scroll/cure everyone up. use of sp is inefficient

I imagine you are going to want a lot of UMD. Extend is required, as is Empowered Healing.

yes empowered healing is a definate must as you want the most efficient healing possible. this means points into the empower healing enhancements as well

On the downside, you'll have limited nuking, and be missing spells that PUG players may expect to find on their cleric. You're going to have to cast that Haste very frequently due to short duration. And you may find yourself standing around a lot waiting for someone to buff or heal (but then, so does every cleric :) ).

nuking is not limited, its non existant. w/o access to the enhancements, the ability to produce huge damages is almost non existant. btw, normal clerics have nuking spells, not everyone assumes clerics to be heal/buff bots like you do

I have a PnP character that is cleric7/necromancer7 and I'd love to bring him into DDO. But the bottom line for me is that every time I go down this mental path I end up thinking... "wait, this is exactly what a bard does except with without songs".

Good luck, I'm rooting for you, please update us on your progress.

with 2 main stats, it would be very hard to keep up the DC of spells, esp when in ddo, the saves are inflated

[Aranticus]

imo the wiz7/clr9 build is more of a support build that a main line class and these are my reasons

nuking
cant nuke, lacks enhancements and the base dice damage, ie fireball = 7d6 (max is 10d6)

buffing
simple buffs like blur, fom are extremely helpful. resist is a 20pt not 30pt (avail at L11) and hence less useful. high level spells are almost by scrolls ie GH

healing
limited healing due to no heal spell or cure mod. almost all healing done have to be empowered to keep up with end game damages

instant kill
limited due to low SR and DC. lacks the higher level destruction (clr) or finger of death (arcane)

like what you predict, your role will be more of a support buffer and support cleric. alot of your play will be mitigating incoming damage rather than heal. at lower levels, the efficiency is not alot different from typical arcanes or divine healers, infact with your variety, you may even excel. however, at end game play becomes limited as deep multiclassing has a large impact on your spells as mobs are tougher (your firewall will do zilch), have better saves (your insta kill sux) and deal more damage (you cant heal as fast). gameplay for you past GH quests becomes severely limited (you will be a party filler, parties w/o clerics or caster will not bank on you)

[Aranticus]

As someone who dislikes clericing and has therefore never taken one past 9th level... why not?

Please elaborate.



Agreed. Or spell resistance. I was rather curious as to which 4th level spell was driving the 7 levels of wizard?

in order to make emp healing viable, the only way is to max out the enhancement. only then will empower heals be cost effective, else it takes more to sp to heal per point of sp

[RavenStormclaw]

I read that you don't want yet another arcane caster but consider this. I put a lot of thought into the wiz/cleric combo and found that going any where with near equal levels didn't seem to be effective. So after much tinkering I came up with the druidic wizard concept. The full build is actually listed in the wizard forum.

Basic idea is 13/3 wizard/cleric dragon marked halfling. Full heal even if limited via dragon marks. Access to 1st and 2nd level cleric spells (mainly for self buffing) but also emergency healing with cure mod. The healing aspect is for last ditch save the party situations not ever primary. 13 levels of wiz should be sufficient even at end game for most spell d/c. Lastly can use every wand in the game. The only thing missing is level 8 arcane spells but for the moment without potency 8 items not a huge loss. Will get them when level cap goes up to 18.

He's currently 3rd level and seems to be doing fine.

[Aranticus]

one point to note for cleric players, for L9, one of the main spell is mass HEAL...... :)

[geoffhanna]

with 2 main stats, it would be very hard to keep up the DC of spells, esp when in ddo, the saves are inflated

Agreed. But I thought the whole point would be to avoid attempting spells that require level-based DCs?


in order to make emp healing viable, the only way is to max out the enhancement. only then will empower heals be cost effective, else it takes more to sp to heal per point of sp

Thank you!

[Aspenor]

I disagree with the people pushing a caster build here.

I would be a high-str melee character with this build, self-buffing with displacements, hastes, stoneskins, and a nearly unending supply of divine power....

But that's just me I guess....

[Lifespawn]

I disagree with the people pushing a caster build here.

I would be a high-str melee character with this build, self-buffing with displacements, hastes, stoneskins, and a nearly unending supply of divine power....

But that's just me I guess....

i agree decent int decent wis and if going halfling for the marks just go dex and weapon finesse dp and df will give u enough to hit maybe halfling guile to add in some extra damage kick

[Aspenor]

i agree decent int decent wis and if going halfling for the marks just go dex and weapon finesse dp and df will give u enough to hit maybe halfling guile to add in some extra damage kick

I'd not go weapon finesse, I'd use 2 handers and strength as the to-hit mod. Save a feat. Forget AC. Enough INT and WIS to be able to cast spells.

Important to note that this specific build could pass with 10 int and 10 wisdom if it went melee, since items count towards enabling casting spells. Only need 10+ spell level.

[Aranticus]

Agreed. But I thought the whole point would be to avoid attempting spells that require level-based DCs?



Thank you!

not from this


I wanted PK/WoF from the wiz with buffs as well, and I wanted raise dead/slay living from the cleric line

[Aranticus]

I disagree with the people pushing a caster build here.

I would be a high-str melee character with this build, self-buffing with displacements, hastes, stoneskins, and a nearly unending supply of divine power....

But that's just me I guess....

that is where i'll go too but the OP prefers a casting line :eek:

[Cendaer]

This just seemed like an interesting combo......

It is interesting, and while perusing your ideas, I was suddenly overcome by the notion that this character could be Warforged to make it even more interesting. It would have nice resists, would never really need to sacrifice an equipped gear slot for an Underwater Action item, and it could use the majority of healing/repair items and spells on either yourself or others.

If it were me, I'd probably make this into an all-out support character, buffing heavily, and using LOTS of wands, but I'd also probably never let anyone fool themselves into thinking it could ever be a "main-healer" for the more intense dungeons and raids.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I was hoping to have the following spells at wiz 7: Stoneskin, Solid Fog, wall of fire, curse, contagion......I needed the stoneskin and wall of fire. I like curse and contagion as debuffs to help others and myself and of course solid fog for added mitigation (slow moving). I wanted Raise Dead from the cleric line to help raise others. The goal of the build is similar to the bards "do everything but superior at nothing, Jack of all trades thing". This character will be mostly used as a support caster and support healer. I want to take some of the brunt off of the traditional cleric and caster. I also want to be able to throw out buffs to those around me. I severely doubt I will be able to take a pounding in melee despite all of the mitigation spells and buffs I can through on myself, but it was something different than my traditional necromancer I have....

I do appreciate all of the ideas and information that were given. To answer the questions about the bard builds...I just don't have the experience with the class to create a viable character. I have built some great wizards and clerics before. This just seemed like an interesting combo......

Then make sure you have a high Wis.
You will need it as high as you can afford to land your offensive spells and have the baddies fail their saves.

Healing, buffs, and damage spells don't need high casting stats. (although most damage spells have a save for half dmage)

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I disagree with the people pushing a caster build here.

I would be a high-str melee character with this build, self-buffing with displacements, hastes, stoneskins, and a nearly unending supply of divine power....

But that's just me I guess....

I like that as well. Avoids a lot of the problems.

[Kurlore]

Not gonna say it's effective, but anyone can build as they are pleased. No need to flame at all.



Well to add on to this, he might be wanting to start the all around cleric, healing wf and fleshies.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

It is interesting, and while perusing your ideas, I was suddenly overcome by the notion that this character could be Warforged to make it even more interesting. It would have nice resists, would never really need to sacrifice an equipped gear slot for an Underwater Action item, and it could use the majority of healing/repair items and spells on either yourself or others.

If it were me, I'd probably make this into an all-out support character, buffing heavily, and using LOTS of wands, but I'd also probably never let anyone fool themselves into thinking it could ever be a "main-healer" for the more intense dungeons and raids.

I created a char a while back who will eventually be a WF, Clr9/Wiz5/Rog2 Lord of Blades.....Great sword and power attack. I went high str and minimal Int/Wis. Not sure if I got the right balance figured out, but I think he will eventually be a fun build when I get him lvled up.

You can tweak this idea a few different ways. But the basic idea is WF, Blade, PA, Divine Power, Blur, Displacemt, Haste.....and stoneskin from wands. Plus more from scrolls.....and able to cure anything and rez........and evasion.

Won't out DPS a raging barb, but it will be a very fun build.

[wrinyn]

I started with a wis and int of 16. I find this to be too high because my con is at a 14 but str at an 11. I do want to wade into the melee when I get to the appropriate level. Right now, I use CC's (due to my DC's being comprable) and I heal if necessary (only lvl 3). I wanted to get the sp's early on but I do agree with Asp, I should have minimized my wis and int to a 13 and put the points into strength. I will keep everyone updated on how it is going. I am enjoying the dwarf toughness enh's. Right now, I am not leading the kill counts, but we don't die and it's a BLAST commanding shamans on hard and elite before they can scorch or electrocute me.....I will say that I just go for group cohesiveness not kill counts and UBA-NEss...ha,ha...

[Wizzly_Bear]

..

[Xanstrollinoax]

Heres the idea I came up with to make it decently effective end game while retaining the original concept for the build. Also very interesting idea :).

Stats
Str: 10 base + 6 item = 16 +3
Dex: 10 base + 6 item = 16 +3
Con: 14 base + 6 item = 20 +5
Int: 16 base +2 lvl +2 enhancement +6 item = 26 +8
Wis: 16 base +2 lvl + 2 enhancement + 6 item = 26 +8
Cha: 10 base = 10 +0

HP
020base
028 Wizard
072 Cleric
080 Con
030 GFL
010 Argo favor
+018 Minos helm
258 standing

SP
1032 base
+ 200 Tier 2 goggles
1232 total

SP's worth in dragon marks
225 Full heal with empower healing
470 CSW with Max+Emp+Emp healing
+540 CLW with Max+Emp+Emp healing
1235sp total

Total effective sp
2467 total sp worth of spells+dragonmarks

Saves
18 fort
10 reflex
24 will
With just a +4 resist item

Feats

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing

Level 2 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Healing Spell

Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell

Level 4 (Wizard)

Level 5 (Cleric)

Level 6 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing

Level 7 (Cleric)

Level 8 (Cleric)

Level 9 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing

Level 10 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell

Level 11 (Cleric)

Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell

Level 13 (Cleric)

Level 14 (Cleric)

Level 15 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness

Level 16 (Wizard)

Enhancements

Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark I
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark II
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark III
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark IV
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life II
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: WWizard Force Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation III
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot II
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot III
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality II
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality III


Hope this suits ya

[wrinyn]

Interesting thoughts with the halfling. I've gone dwarf and have been having fun. I've been maxing hp's with dwarven toughness. I'm at level 4 right now (3wiz, 1 cleric), and have been having fun. Like I've stated, I'm not getting kills in a group but people don't die either.....Well, except on STK on hard with levels 3-5 without a rogue...God I hated those traps (i was level 3 at the time without resists for group). I am soloing things at level (haven't twinked him except for a +1 acid maul). Thanks again for all of your help in ideas and builds. Right now I find that command, charm, and glitter are my friends. My next two levels will be in cleric to help more in healing as a back up and to extend my level 1 cleric buffs. Although is there an advantage for taking two more levels immediately of wiz for hero, displacement etc?

[Kurlore]

What you have to admit, though, is that those PK and Firewall is less effective than those with higher level Wizards. (Of course, right?)
PK's DC is low, since your highest spell level is low, and Firewall's damage is gonna be like half the full wizard.





I laugh at you... this comment is nothing, my pk on my 9 ranger 7 wize seems to work just fine... actually im kinda known for being a ranger to pk stuff =]

[Wizzly_Bear]

..

[wrinyn]

i assure you that you are not pking much of anything in the vale or the subterrane.

If he uses heighten in the vale would that give him an effective level of 16 or still 7. If the latter is true, he could effectively PK like anyone else assuming his intelligence is sufficiently high, OR he's selective on what mobs he uses it on. Mobs with low will saves have a better chance of failing (despite having to get through fort as well). With my capped wiz I am selective with PK in the vale (never use it in the subterran). I love using PK on the Gnolls but would never use it on the devils (banishment is soooo sexy). Who knows....I'm glad the poster is enjoying something different than the splash pcs of the majority......

[Aranticus]

I laugh at you... this comment is nothing, my pk on my 9 ranger 7 wize seems to work just fine... actually im kinda known for being a ranger to pk stuff =]

try pk stuff in shroud, anyone can pk the kobolds in harbor :cool:

[Aranticus]

If he uses heighten in the vale would that give him an effective level of 16 or still 7. If the latter is true, he could effectively PK like anyone else assuming his intelligence is sufficiently high, OR he's selective on what mobs he uses it on. Mobs with low will saves have a better chance of failing (despite having to get through fort as well). With my capped wiz I am selective with PK in the vale (never use it in the subterran). I love using PK on the Gnolls but would never use it on the devils (banishment is soooo sexy). Who knows....I'm glad the poster is enjoying something different than the splash pcs of the majority......

heighten make it at your highest level spell you can cast. a L11 wiz with heighten will cast a pk as a L6 spell. a L7 wiz with heighten does zilch to the spell level. another consideration is the int of the toon. int mod adds to the DC of the spell. with single save spells, the DC is not as hard to bypass but pk has a fort save AND a will save. overcoming both saves without max spell level and max mods will be difficult for any stuff past GH

[iruka41]

Quote:
Originally Posted by iruka41 http://images.ddoforum.turbine.com/images/buttons/red/viewpost.gif (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=1817920#post1817920)
Still you maintain top level PK DC and Firewall Damage, along with nice level8 arcane spells.

Which of them are nice? :)


Otto's Irresistable Dance, Power Word: Stun, two of the the best PvP spell!

And who knows if we'll get some more when the new mod comes out? :D

Edit: Yeah personally I'd go with 2 level splash too. Or even 3 in case of Wizzy.

[iruka41]

I laugh at you... this comment is nothing, my pk on my 9 ranger 7 wize seems to work just fine... actually im kinda known for being a ranger to pk stuff =]

Laughing is good :)

Yes you can PK anything that a level 7 wizard can PK. Good for you. :cool:

I have heard so many "what? mine is doing fine!" comments and not bothering with them anymore.

[wrinyn]

I took my 1cleric/3 wiz on an irestone quest with 5 others. All of us were between levels 3 and 4. I was the only healer although people did have pot's. I sucked it up and got some CMW wands because my little CLW spell wasn't going to cut the mustard. We ran through it on normal with little difficulty. We then said, "let's try it on hard". We had to change tactics considerably. Let me tell you, we had the times of our lives running it. I armed myself with web/glitter/hyp and command. We used terrain to set up the mobs for a walk between a glitter/web and it went so smoothly. Our sorc would charm anything that would get through unscathed with anything and we used the mobs against each other. We had only one death (mishap on a shrine heh) and it was fun. Actually recruited one member into our guild. The members of the group didn't think that it was possible to be successful as a wand wipping wiz with a touch of cleric....well for all of you naysayers....the trip has been fun so far....

As a side note, there is nothing more rewarding then watching irestone ogres get commanded and slaughtered...ha,ha....

Thanks for the great times today in Thelanis.....

[Aranticus]

I took my 1cleric/3 wiz on an irestone quest with 5 others. All of us were between levels 3 and 4. I was the only healer although people did have pot's. I sucked it up and got some CMW wands because my little CLW spell wasn't going to cut the mustard. We ran through it on normal with little difficulty. We then said, "let's try it on hard". We had to change tactics considerably. Let me tell you, we had the times of our lives running it. I armed myself with web/glitter/hyp and command. We used terrain to set up the mobs for a walk between a glitter/web and it went so smoothly. Our sorc would charm anything that would get through unscathed with anything and we used the mobs against each other. We had only one death (mishap on a shrine heh) and it was fun. Actually recruited one member into our guild. The members of the group didn't think that it was possible to be successful as a wand wipping wiz with a touch of cleric....well for all of you naysayers....the trip has been fun so far....

As a side note, there is nothing more rewarding then watching irestone ogres get commanded and slaughtered...ha,ha....

Thanks for the great times today in Thelanis.....

no one is saying Xclr/Ywiz or any other combi wont work at low levels, we are saying if you want to attempt shroud, vod and other high level content, you will find it hard to function with BOTH roles.

ie 15clr/1wiz - good as cleric
ie 14clr/2wiz - still ok
ie 13/3 - still no problem
ie 12/4 - passable
ie 11/5 - might make it (since you have access to heal spell)
ie 10/6 - will find it hard (resist are 20 pointers so no real actual use too, healing is by heal scrolls)
ie 9/7 to 7/9 - very difficult to be of real use
ie 6/10 - no real function as wiz (poor buffing)
ie 5/11 - can do some real buffing (extended GH, 30 point resists)
ie 4/12 - passable wiz but dun expect to excel in insta kills
ie 3/13 - now have finger of death
ie 2/14 - not bad
ie 1/15 - almost as good as full wiz

[Geonis]

I would think more Sorc/Clr, the Cha is a bit more synergistic, and gives more SP.

Something like below I would think. With future plans to add 3 more Cleric levels (to hit 11), and 1 more Sorc level.





Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 True Neutral Human Male
(8 Cleric \ 8 Sorcerer)
Hit Points: 166
Spell Points: 987
BAB: 10\10\15\20
Fortitude: 10
Reflex: 5
Will: 15

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 16 21
Dexterity 12 12
Constitution 14 15
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 14 16
Charisma 14 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 1 1
Bluff 2 3
Concentration 2 2
Diplomacy 2 3
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 2 3
Heal 2 3
Hide 1 1
Intimidate 2 3
Jump 3 5
Listen 2 3
Move Silently 1 1
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair -1 -1
Search -1 -1
Spot 2 3
Swim 3 5
Tumble n/a n/a
Use Magic Device n/a n/a

Level 1 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Feat: (Human Bonus) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Greataxe
Spell (1): Magic Missle
Spell (1): Shield


Level 2 (Cleric)
Spell (1): Bane
Spell (1): Bless
Spell (1): Cause Fear
Spell (1): Command
Spell (1): Cure Light Wounds
Spell (1): Divine Favor
Spell (1): Doom
Spell (1): Inflict Light Wounds
Spell (1): Nightshield
Spell (1): Nimbus of Light
Spell (1): Obscuring Mist
Spell (1): Protection From Evil
Spell (1): Remove Fear
Spell (1): Shield of Faith
Spell (1): Summon Monster I


Level 3 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell
Spell (1): Jump


Level 4 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Sorcerer)
Spell (1): Ray of Enfeeblement


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Spell (2): Aid
Spell (2): Bear's Endurance
Spell (2): Bull's Strength
Spell (2): Close Wounds
Spell (2): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Deific Vengance
Spell (2): Eagle's Spendor
Spell (2): Find Traps
Spell (2): Hold Person
Spell (2): Inflict Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Lesser Restoration
Spell (2): Owl's Wisdom
Spell (2): Remove Paralysis
Spell (2): Resist Energy
Spell (2): Seek Eternal Rest
Spell (2): Soundburst
Spell (2): Spawn Screen
Spell (2): Summon Monster II


Level 7 (Sorcerer)
Spell (2): Blur


Level 8 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Spell (2): Scorching Ray


Level 10 (Cleric)
Spell (3): Bestow Curse
Spell (3): Blindness
Spell (3): Contagion
Spell (3): Cure Serious Wounds
Spell (3): Dispel Magic
Spell (3): Glyph of Warding
Spell (3): Inflict Serious Wounds
Spell (3): Magic Circle Against Evil
Spell (3): Mass Aid
Spell (3): Prayer
Spell (3): Protection From Energy
Spell (3): Remove Blindness
Spell (3): Remove Curse
Spell (3): Remove Disease
Spell (3): Searing Light
Spell (3): Summon Monster III
Spell (3): Water Breathing


Level 11 (Sorcerer)
Spell (3): Haste


Level 12 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 13 (Cleric)
Spell (4): Chaos Hammer
Spell (4): Cure Critical Wounds
Spell (4): Deathward
Spell (4): Dismissal
Spell (4): Divine Power
Spell (4): Freedom of Movement
Spell (4): Holy Smite
Spell (4): Inflict Critical Wounds
Spell (4): Mass Shield of Faith
Spell (4): Neutralize Poison
Spell (4): Order's Wrath
Spell (4): Poison
Spell (4): Recitation
Spell (4): Restoration
Spell (4): Summon Monster IV
Spell (4): Symbol of Flame
Spell (4): Unholy Blight


Level 14 (Sorcerer)
Spell (2): False Life
Spell (3): Displacement


Level 15 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Spell (4): Wall of Fire


Level 16 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Maximizing I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Maximizing II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Subtle Spellcasting I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Subtle Spellcasting II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality II
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning I
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning II
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery I
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery II
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery III






With a bit of high level character support (2 +1 tomes and 2 +2 tomes), it would look something like this.




Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 True Neutral Human Male
(8 Cleric \ 8 Sorcerer)
Hit Points: 182
Spell Points: 1021
BAB: 10\10\15\20
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 5
Will: 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 16 22
Dexterity 12 12
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 14 18
Charisma 14 18

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 16
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 16
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 16
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 1 1
Bluff 2 4
Concentration 2 3
Diplomacy 2 4
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 2 4
Heal 2 4
Hide 1 1
Intimidate 2 4
Jump 3 6
Listen 2 4
Move Silently 1 1
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair -1 -1
Search -1 -1
Spot 2 4
Swim 3 6
Tumble n/a n/a
Use Magic Device n/a n/a

Level 1 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Feat: (Human Bonus) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Greataxe
Spell (1): Magic Missle
Spell (1): Shield


Level 2 (Cleric)
Spell (1): Bane
Spell (1): Bless
Spell (1): Cause Fear
Spell (1): Command
Spell (1): Cure Light Wounds
Spell (1): Divine Favor
Spell (1): Doom
Spell (1): Inflict Light Wounds
Spell (1): Nightshield
Spell (1): Nimbus of Light
Spell (1): Obscuring Mist
Spell (1): Protection From Evil
Spell (1): Remove Fear
Spell (1): Shield of Faith
Spell (1): Summon Monster I


Level 3 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell
Spell (1): Jump


Level 4 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Sorcerer)
Spell (1): Ray of Enfeeblement


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Spell (2): Aid
Spell (2): Bear's Endurance
Spell (2): Bull's Strength
Spell (2): Close Wounds
Spell (2): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Deific Vengance
Spell (2): Eagle's Spendor
Spell (2): Find Traps
Spell (2): Hold Person
Spell (2): Inflict Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Lesser Restoration
Spell (2): Owl's Wisdom
Spell (2): Remove Paralysis
Spell (2): Resist Energy
Spell (2): Seek Eternal Rest
Spell (2): Soundburst
Spell (2): Spawn Screen
Spell (2): Summon Monster II


Level 7 (Sorcerer)
Spell (2): Blur


Level 8 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Spell (2): Scorching Ray


Level 10 (Cleric)
Spell (3): Bestow Curse
Spell (3): Blindness
Spell (3): Contagion
Spell (3): Cure Serious Wounds
Spell (3): Dispel Magic
Spell (3): Glyph of Warding
Spell (3): Inflict Serious Wounds
Spell (3): Magic Circle Against Evil
Spell (3): Mass Aid
Spell (3): Prayer
Spell (3): Protection From Energy
Spell (3): Remove Blindness
Spell (3): Remove Curse
Spell (3): Remove Disease
Spell (3): Searing Light
Spell (3): Summon Monster III
Spell (3): Water Breathing


Level 11 (Sorcerer)
Spell (3): Haste


Level 12 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 13 (Cleric)
Spell (4): Chaos Hammer
Spell (4): Cure Critical Wounds
Spell (4): Deathward
Spell (4): Dismissal
Spell (4): Divine Power
Spell (4): Freedom of Movement
Spell (4): Holy Smite
Spell (4): Inflict Critical Wounds
Spell (4): Mass Shield of Faith
Spell (4): Neutralize Poison
Spell (4): Order's Wrath
Spell (4): Poison
Spell (4): Recitation
Spell (4): Restoration
Spell (4): Summon Monster IV
Spell (4): Symbol of Flame
Spell (4): Unholy Blight


Level 14 (Sorcerer)
Spell (2): False Life
Spell (3): Displacement


Level 15 (Sorcerer)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Spell (4): Wall of Fire


Level 16 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: STR
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Maximizing I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Maximizing II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Subtle Spellcasting I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Subtle Spellcasting II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality II
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning I
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning II
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery I
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery II
Enhancement: Cleric Wand Mastery III








Based on the second setup:



HP
20 Heroic
32 Sorc
64 Cleric
96 Con
10 Draconic
30 GFL
_______
252 HP

45 Shroud (pos,neg, pos/neg for HP and Concordant Oppositon)
18 False Life
16 Mass Aid
________
331 HP



AC
10 Base
4 Dex
7 AC Bracers
4 Shield Spell
3 Barkskin
5 Deflection
1 Haste
______
34 AC
(****, but with Displacement and Stoneskin plus Self-Healing, shouldn't be an issue)


To Hit

16 BAB (Divine Power)
2 Luck (Divine Favor)
9 Str (with Divine Power)
5 Weapon
4 GH (via scroll on a 8 or better)
1 Haste
1 Rage spell
________
+37/+37/+42/+47

or

+32/+32/+37/+42 with Pwr Atk



Damage

1d12 Base (or 3d6 GS)
15 Str (30 with Rage spell or pot)
10 Pwr Atk
5 Weapon
2 Luck
______
1d12 + 32 (+ effect[burst, etc.])


Spell DCs will be about 4-5 points behind, so don't use save spells, also Caster Level is funked, so no SR spells.

Firewall and other no save spells will be the staple, combined with self-buffing/healing.

[crisisphat]

lol this is exactly why they need presige classes, Mystic theruge FTW!!

[sirgog]

I laugh at you... this comment is nothing, my pk on my 9 ranger 7 wize seems to work just fine... actually im kinda known for being a ranger to pk stuff =]

You'll be completely fine at PKing anything without spell resistance. Eg. Gianthold stuff. That'll keel over dead when you make a scary face at it.

Then you'll try something with SR 26, and suddenly not only do you need to roll a 19 on your SR check (16 with good gear), the mob also needs to fail its saves.