Fix the fraeking death penalty bug already.

[hurricane333]

Why is it taking so long for this stupid annoying bug to get fixed,
its constantly complained about and very annoying to say the least.

Sign here.

[Amaras]

In the developers mind they believe that "prettifying" the harbor takes presidency over the game breaking bugs that are currently within the game.

[Turial]

Because I am not in the know. Which bug are you refering to?

Why is it taking so long for this stupid annoying bug to get fixed,
its constantly complained about and very annoying to say the least.

Sign here.

[hurricane333]

In the developers mind they believe that "prettifying" the harbor takes presidency over the game breaking bugs that are currently within the game.

Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

[hurricane333]

Because I am not in the know. Which bug are you refering to?

On occasion when ressing at a shrine and immediately resting afterwards, the death penalty debuff stays on the
player, the finger disappears you lose a level and it has to be resolved by logging out and back in. It's a perma
level drop of 1 until you log out and back in. Extended play you will notice it its extremely common, I hear it on
almost every single quest anymore.

[Noctus]

Extended play you will notice it its extremely common, I hear it on
almost every single quest anymore.


Never encountered it.

[hurricane333]

Never encountered it.

Thanks for the poast. Duly noted. Perhaps the devs will now avoid addressing this issue because you haven't experienced it.

[Borror0]

In the developers mind they believe that "prettifying" the harbor takes presidency over the game breaking bugs that are currently within the game.

The team working on the harbor isn't not the same that would be worknig on gameplay bugs.

But I agree with the "revamping the harbor could have waited"... let's hope that there's a masterplan we're not awared of related to this.


Thanks for the poast. Duly noted. Perhaps the devs will now avoid addressing this issue because you haven't experienced it.

It's not as comment as you make it sound. I play a lot and have not seen that bug that often.

One way to resolve the issue is to try to not die too often.

[hurricane333]

It's not as comment as you make it sound. I play a lot and have not seen that bug that often.
One way to resolve the issue is to try to not die too often.


It's common, I disagree. I hear "got the dp bug relogging" alot on voice.

I pug, I just started playing, I don't have the plat to load my bags with 1,000 cure serious potions,
or purchase +99 racial specific armor at level 2. Death is frequent for the moment.

[Borror0]

I pug, I just started playing, I don't have the plat to load my bags with 1,000 cure serious potions,
or purchase +99 racial specific armor at level 2. Death is frequent for the moment.

You're awared that there are players in this game that play permadeath and who even leveled themselves to level 10 without dying untwinked!

Don't give me the "I'm new" comment, sorry.

[hurricane333]

You're awared that there are players in this game that play permadeath and who even leveled themselves to level 10 without dying untwinked!

Don't give me the "I'm new" comment, sorry.

The purpose of this thread was to vocalize frustration of a reoccurant annoying bug. This might be annoy some, but not all players. Sorry. If you have something to contribute in the way of how it is negatively effecting your enjoyment of the game, this might call the attention of the developers. I understand your character doesn't die, and the perma death players don't experience the bug due to the fact they never ress. Your comments are completely unconstructive and distract from the point of the post. The focus is the discussion of a bug that is effecting gameplay and lowering enjoyment, and a place for others that are experiencing the same to post.

An example response might look as simple as : "Hey, that happens alot to me also, and I do not like it" or perhaps more informative "That happens to me if I rest before the dialog box for the death penalty goes away". Does this help?

[Krago]

Your comments are completely unconstructive and distract from the point of the post

The tone of your comments are neither constructive nor condusive to receive the feedback you are looking for.

But, I was unaware of that bug, so duly noted of how to correct the problem.

[krud]

I haven't seen the death bug in quite a while. I was under the impression it got fixed, but obviously it is still around. I seem to recall waiting a few seconds betwen rezing and shrining helped to alleviate the problem.

[Turial]

That bug.....I have found that a greater restore takes care of it in the few times I have seen it. Granted I am at the cap so its an easy fix for me for a rare bug in my experiance.

If you have the means try getting a greater restore from a friendly cleric.

[Zenako]

OP, you want to be constructive, provide details, not just a rant.

What server (not that it should matter), what levels, how did you die, how were you raised (shrine, spell, clickie), how long did you wait for the raise (were you still in the non option window of 3 seconds when you took it?), you know, some details that might actually help someone trying to fix the problem you see.

Now, I have personally not seen it happen, and can recall only once in the past month or so having someone in party experience it. So from my perspective, and many others, it is not a frequent occurance. (and yes we die, not a perma death group or anything like that.)

[hurricane333]

The tone of your comments are neither constructive nor condusive to receive the feedback you are looking for.

But, I was unaware of that bug, so duly noted of how to correct the problem.

There is no tone in text posts, although they can be fabricated, and often are, by the reader, absent human vocal inflection. There was a posting recommending death avoidance was equivalent to bug avoidance/fixing. I did not agree with this as a "solution" to the bug, and found it a weak and poor recommendation.

[hurricane333]

I haven't seen the death bug in quite a while. I was under the impression it got fixed, but obviously it is still around. I seem to recall waiting a few seconds betwen rezing and shrining helped to alleviate the problem.

I agree. It appears most frequently when the "death penalty" dialog box is still present on screen and if you take the rest "very quickly" after the ress it seems to happen more often. I have however waited up to 20 seconds, and still catch it sometimes.

[Thrudh]

Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

LOL... tell me this post is sarcastic.... if not, this guy must be middle-management somewhere... sounds like an Dilbert PHB...

[hurricane333]

OP, you want to be constructive, provide details, not just a rant.

What server (not that it should matter), what levels, how did you die, how were you raised (shrine, spell, clickie), how long did you wait for the raise (were you still in the non option window of 3 seconds when you took it?), you know, some details that might actually help someone trying to fix the problem you see.

Now, I have personally not seen it happen, and can recall only once in the past month or so having someone in party experience it. So from my perspective, and many others, it is not a frequent occurance. (and yes we die, not a perma death group or anything like that.)

I have provided all the details in my bug reports submitted. I did not provide them in the original post. The post was made as a rant, guilty as charged. Poor customer service exists in the department of the mere acknowledgement of a problem or workaround to avoid experiencing the bug. I expect bugs, I expect workarounds until they are fixed, and absent that, a timeframe to when they will be fixed is ok.

I was interested in:
1) If anyone has discovered a workaround to avoiding it.
2) Developer acknowledgement and/or feedback to when it will be fixed. The public forums are being used due to non response in game.

[hurricane333]

LOL... tell me this post is sarcastic.... if not, this guy must be middle-management somewhere... sounds like an Dilbert PHB...

It wasn't sarcastic at all. I think that the players should drive the changes made to the game. I also think that responsible software shops should have a lead architect. If you have any personal questions feel free to message me.

[Krago]

I was interested in:
1) If anyone has discovered a workaround to avoiding it.
2) Developer acknowledgement and/or feedback to when it will be fixed. The public forums are being used due to non response in game.

1) You yourself noted that logging off/on corrects this. Is this a good fix? Depends on connection speed/quality I guess. Turial suggested Greater Restore as an alternative.
2) With a workaround and even an in-game fix, Greater Restore, l would not look for this to be fixed in an upcoming Mod/Patch.

[Thrudh]

It wasn't sarcastic at all. I think that the players should drive the changes made to the game. I also think that responsible software shops should have a lead architect. If you have any personal questions feel free to message me.


Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

You really think the players should set the priorities??? Lots of complaints on these boards on game-play... which "fixes" do we implement first?

You really think the developers should just code, and not be creative? (Rather difficult to be a good coder without SOME creativity)

Finally, what do you think draws developers to work for a game company? I bet they get a lot of job satisfaction from "creating" new quests, new mechanics, new items... Man, it would suck to work for somone, especially at a game company, where you were told to stop participating in creative content ideas, and instead to put your head down and just implement what we tell you.

Bug fixes ARE important... Good communication is important as well... Turbine should update and post a list of known bugs, and indicate that they are working on them...

But bug fixing happens side-by-side with creating new content...

[hurricane333]

You really think the players should set the priorities??? Lots of complaints on these boards on game-play... which "fixes" do we implement first?

You really think the developers should just code, and not be creative? (Rather difficult to be a good coder without SOME creativity)

Finally, what do you think draws developers to work for a game company? I bet they get a lot of job satisfaction from "creating" new quests, new mechanics, new items... Man, it would suck to work for somone, especially at a game company, where you were told to stop participating in creative content ideas, and instead to put your head down and just implement what we tell you.

Bug fixes ARE important... Good communication is important as well... Turbine should update and post a list of known bugs, and indicate that they are working on them...

But bug fixing happens side-by-side with creating new content...

Yes the players should drive the priorities. We pay the bills, the game is a service, like water or electricity, a "fun" utility. Good software engineers can find a creative ways to solve problems that they are given. I don't think that content creation has a thing to do with programming. I agree with your statement about the posting of known bugs, priorities and expected fix dates that increases communcation and minimizes confusion.

[Milolyen]

Must not be too common because this was the first I have heard of the bug. Have seen no other posts about it and no one I have grouped with has ever mentioned having or having it happen to them(and I group with several people that die ALOT). Not to say it doesn't exist or shouldn't be fixed. Just think you are exaggerating a bit on how common it is.


Milolyen

P.S. Yes there is a tone that comes across from written/typed messages, be it a post, an article, or a book. What words are used, how they are used, and the order in which they are used combine to give the message a tone. It is how a good author can provoke feelings beyond normal emotions felt from reading the words.

P.S.S The quickest way to ruin this or ANY game is to let the customer have any real say over the development over the game. Most people look for and want instant gratification, then once they get it they are bored and move on. Also with as many customers that play this game the needs and wants vary greatly. What one person wants them to work on another would hate for it to be worked on. Power gamers want more end game content and want it pumped out fast. RPers want more story line and a greater sense of immersion into the world. Char builders and permadeath want more low to mid lvl content so they don't have to run the same quests over and over again. Sorry but HELL NO. The company needs to take in account all the needs and wants of its customers and find their own direction they want to go with the game. Customers generally have no clue about how the product is made, the details of makeing it or how long it takes to make the product. All the customers generally know is that there IS a product and they want it and want it NOW.

[In_Like_Flynn]

On occasion when ressing at a shrine and immediately resting afterwards, the death penalty debuff stays on the
player, the finger disappears you lose a level and it has to be resolved by logging out and back in. It's a perma
level drop of 1 until you log out and back in. Extended play you will notice it its extremely common, I hear it on
almost every single quest anymore.


Never encountered it.I have also never encountered it. I'm sure it's frustrating. I wonder why some people encounter it so often, while others never do.

[hurricane333]

I have also never encountered it. I'm sure it's frustrating. I wonder why some people encounter it so often, while others never do.

I suspect it is related to connection speed. Those that can ress and rest nearly at the same time ( thus faster connections ) experience it more often. That is complete hyperbole at the moment.

[hurricane333]

Must not be too common because this was the first I have heard of the bug. Have seen no other posts about it and no one I have grouped with has ever mentioned having or having it happen to them(and I group with several people that die ALOT). Not to say it doesn't exist or shouldn't be fixed. Just think you are exaggerating a bit on how common it is.


Milolyen

P.S. Yes there is a tone that comes across from written/typed messages, be it a post, an article, or a book. What words are used, how they are used, and the order in which they are used combine to give the message a tone. It is how a good author can provoke feelings beyond normal emotions felt from reading the words.

P.S.S The quickest way to ruin this or ANY game is to let the customer have any real say over the development over the game. Most people look for and want instant gratification, then once they get it they are bored and move on. Also with as many customers that play this game the needs and wants vary greatly. What one person wants them to work on another would hate for it to be worked on. Power gamers want more end game content and want it pumped out fast. RPers want more story line and a greater sense of immersion into the world. Char builders and permadeath want more low to mid lvl content so they don't have to run the same quests over and over again. Sorry but HELL NO. The company needs to take in account all the needs and wants of its customers and find their own direction they want to go with the game. Customers generally have no clue about how the product is made, the details of makeing it or how long it takes to make the product. All the customers generally know is that there IS a product and they want it and want it NOW.

I agree, I beleive anyone not having the problem will think it is exaggerated, and as you pointed out this may or may not invoke an unintended emotional response.

[Zenako]

The other problem from a communication aspect is that for those of us who have been on here some time, we are aware that the powers that be have all but proclaimed that "rants" will basically be ignored and get no actual response, while concerns presented in a more even tone are more likely to be addressed. Experience has shown this to be the case. The way you titled this thread would have put it into the rant class without even looking at the content and probably assured no official reply. That is some of the "tone" issue that others pointed to.

[jjflanigan]

I suspect it is related to connection speed. Those that can ress and rest nearly at the same time ( thus faster connections ) experience it more often. That is complete hyperbole at the moment.

If that's the case then, until they are able to put in a fix, couldn't you just ...wait a couple seconds between being rezzed and resting to completely avoid the bug?

Hopefully they can get a fix for this quickly as I can only imagine how annoying that could be in the middle of a quest.

As an aside, since the OP brought it up, if the devs didn't use creativity and let the player base guide the development path, we'd have "i win" buttons, magic chests that you could just open to get loot, +5 tomes in normal quests, and don't want to leave out evasion in heavy armor and who knows how many other thoroughly broken game mechanics because they are "fun"

[jkm]

you guys haven't seen this bug? you know how the bees stick on a character who rezzes after the quest is over? this is the same bug. it also causes you to get perma-blur/expeditious retreat/mage armor (that doesn't work) and if you have these phantom spells on you when you rest it will not get rid of your death penalty.

[theblaz]

Never heard of this bug, and I die a lot because we tend to over-estimate which quests we can do on elite without many problems.

That doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but for you to say that it's extremely common and it happens on almost every quest, I find that
extremely hard to believe.

[wamjratl1]

There is no tone in text posts, although they can be fabricated, and often are, by the reader, absent human vocal inflection. There was a posting recommending death avoidance was equivalent to bug avoidance/fixing. I did not agree with this as a "solution" to the bug, and found it a weak and poor recommendation.

OK well that's just wrong. Written language does have a tone. Not that it's really relevant to the thread. Just a comment.

But you may be on to something regarding connection speeds. Mine is pretty pokey and I have never encountered this bug (knocks on wood).

[Turial]

I suspect it is related to connection speed. Those that can ress and rest nearly at the same time ( thus faster connections ) experience it more often. That is complete hyperbole at the moment.

This would be the first time I have seen a bug associated with a good connection. Its likely due to an improper flagging event occuring, similar to what the new death penalty was like on risia.

If you die multiple times when this bug occurs do you get multiple negative levels? or just the one?

[szalkerous]

Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

I take personal offense to this. AS a software developer, I also have a level of creativity; that is what drives DEVELOPMENT and not simply PROGRAMMING. To think everyone coding software is a simple mindless drone is very mistaken.

I can't tell you how many times I make suggestions of "Hey, while we're at it, let's improve feature X" or even "I revamped the UI for this screen to a more user friendly layout"

Ugh, seriously. You just **** in my morning cereal with that one.

[VirieSquichie]

LOL... tell me this post is sarcastic.... if not, this guy must be middle-management somewhere... sounds like an Dilbert PHB...

Generally, there are Designers and there are Developers. Designers come out with new ideas, storylines, character details and other "creative" stuff. They have no idea how to take their concepts from the storyboard to the game engine. Developers are coders. They flesh out details the creatives didn't specify and resolve logistics problems but they don't sketch whole new areas or create a monster from scratch on their own. They implement.

I've met a few folks who could reasonably do both jobs, though not as well as a dedicated person could do *one* of the jobs. Different skill sets, different mind sets, and usually different temperaments.

A designated Architect provides a starting point for the creatives, gets them headed in what he/she determines is the right direction, and guides them should they deviate. (or decides the deviation is better and guides the rest of the team in the new direction) Said Architect also mediates between the design and development groups because there is often a bit of friction between the two teams. When a particular piece is likely to be a bear of a project to code, the developers get the architect to review it and see if it's worth the resources or if an alternate technique would be acceptable to the designers' plan.

I've only met a couple people who are *good* architects. Usually someone from one team or the other gets promoted into that position, and they retain their tendencies so the other team suffers additional frustration. The architect position, if done right, balances management, creative vision and technical understanding...a tricky thing at best. Oh, and their tails are usually on the line whenever things are behind schedule, over budget or not as popular with the end users as predicted...it's often a thankless job.

[krud]

Never heard of this bug, and I die a lot because we tend to over-estimate which quests we can do on elite without many problems.

That doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but for you to say that it's extremely common and it happens on almost every quest, I find that
extremely hard to believe.

The bug did/does exist. I personally experienced it quite often while leveling my last reroll. I have not seen it since last update, so either they fixed it, or it is specific to certain mid-level quests, which I have not been thru since hitting high level with my reroll.

[DSC]

I got it just last Thursday, so it definitely still exists.

[TreknaQudane]

Out of curiousity, how many people filled a bug report?

[hurricane333]

Out of curiousity, how many people filled a bug report?

Good question does turbine have a outstanding bug list with the number of reporters listed somewhere? It would be a pleasant suprise if they were this transparent.

[Dawnblade]

Why is it taking so long for this stupid annoying bug to get fixed,
its constantly complained about and very annoying to say the least.

Sign here.



An example response might look as simple as : "Hey, that happens alot to me also, and I do not like it" or perhaps more informative "That happens to me if I rest before the dialog box for the death penalty goes away". Does this help?

I never heard of this bug, is that not a valid response? It's obviously not as common as you are saying since a lot of people on this thread seem to not be aware or bothered by it.


There is no tone in text posts, although they can be fabricated, and often are, by the reader, absent human vocal inflection. There was a posting recommending death avoidance was equivalent to bug avoidance/fixing. I did not agree with this as a "solution" to the bug, and found it a weak and poor recommendation.

There is no tone in text posts? I'm sorry but that is just not true. If you can't sense a harsh tone on "Fix the freaking death penalty bug already" I trully feel bad for you.


Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

That is perhaps the funniest thing I've read in the message board.

[TreknaQudane]

Good question does turbine have a outstanding bug list with the number of reporters listed somewhere? It would be a pleasant suprise if they were this transparent.

So, you didn't report the bug

And you come here complaining about it


If someone else reported it shouldn't matter, if you run into something you think is a bug, report it.

[Borror0]

There is no tone in text posts? I'm sorry but that is just not true. If you can't sense a harsh tone on "Fix the freaking death penalty bug already" I trully feel bad for you.

I think that what he meant was that written text doesn't have the same feel as a real conversation where you can hear the other person's voice. That's why sometimes written then may lead to confusion. Someone may sound rude to you for the words he used, but he wasn't. That comes from the lack of intonation in written text. There's a lot of information that cannot be conveyed or at least easily conveyed by written text.

Smiley helps to deal with that sometimes, but there are not enough smileys for every tone you would want.

[hurricane333]

Generally, there are Designers and there are Developers. Designers come out with new ideas, storylines, character details and other "creative" stuff. They have no idea how to take their concepts from the storyboard to the game engine. Developers are coders. They flesh out details the creatives didn't specify and resolve logistics problems but they don't sketch whole new areas or create a monster from scratch on their own. They implement.

I've met a few folks who could reasonably do both jobs, though not as well as a dedicated person could do *one* of the jobs. Different skill sets, different mind sets, and usually different temperaments.

A designated Architect provides a starting point for the creatives, gets them headed in what he/she determines is the right direction, and guides them should they deviate. (or decides the deviation is better and guides the rest of the team in the new direction) Said Architect also mediates between the design and development groups because there is often a bit of friction between the two teams. When a particular piece is likely to be a bear of a project to code, the developers get the architect to review it and see if it's worth the resources or if an alternate technique would be acceptable to the designers' plan.

I've only met a couple people who are *good* architects. Usually someone from one team or the other gets promoted into that position, and they retain their tendencies so the other team suffers additional frustration. The architect position, if done right, balances management, creative vision and technical understanding...a tricky thing at best. Oh, and their tails are usually on the line whenever things are behind schedule, over budget or not as popular with the end users as predicted...it's often a thankless job.

Couldn't agree more. The best coders usually don't make good designers and vice versa. Very true.

[hurricane333]

I think that what he meant was that written text doesn't have the same feel as a real conversation where you can hear the other person's voice. That's why sometimes written then may lead to confusion. Someone may sound rude to you for the words he used, but he wasn't. That comes from the lack of intonation in written text. There's a lot of information that cannot be conveyed or at least easily conveyed by written text.

Smiley helps to deal with that sometimes, but there are not enough smileys for every tone you would want.

Funny you say that. I guess a lack of smileys indicates extreme hate or anger. Too many is "emo". It really seems the world has a problem with communicating in medicore. Everything has to be "maxed" out. I blame popular media and MySpace.

[GrayOldDruid]

It's common, I disagree. I hear "got the dp bug relogging" alot on voice.

I pug, I just started playing, I don't have the plat to load my bags with 1,000 cure serious potions,
or purchase +99 racial specific armor at level 2. Death is frequent for the moment.

Nope. Never heard that, never encountered it myself. Don't die all that much, even at low levels.

Still, IF it is happening, it would be nice to have fixed so I never encounter it at all. :D

[Dawnblade]

I think that what he meant was that written text doesn't have the same feel as a real conversation where you can hear the other person's voice. That's why sometimes written then may lead to confusion. Someone may sound rude to you for the words he used, but he wasn't. That comes from the lack of intonation in written text. There's a lot of information that cannot be conveyed or at least easily conveyed by written text.

Smiley helps to deal with that sometimes, but there are not enough smileys for every tone you would want.

I think it's pretty standard that the use of swear words implies anger. But *shrugs*

[hurricane333]

So, you didn't report the bug

And you come here complaining about it


If someone else reported it shouldn't matter, if you run into something you think is a bug, report it.

I have to assume you missed the purpose of that question entirely. The question was : Does Turbine have a outstanding bug report list somewhere that the user community can view? First, it shows the users when bugs are reported they are real. They get categorized somewhere. Secondly, it can show the particular severity of the problem based on the incidents of the reports. The more frequently reported bugs afflicting the most users should in essence be given the highest priority. Thirdly, we can then, as users, know when to expect a fix, or adapt a work around to the problem. And I disagree with your, get a bug, report a bug, rank and file acceptance of problems without feedback. As a paying customer, I feel I deserve to know that my problem has been acknowledged, assigned a priority, and a fix date, if any is warranted.

[hurricane333]

This would be the first time I have seen a bug associated with a good connection. Its likely due to an improper flagging event occuring, similar to what the new death penalty was like on risia.

If you die multiple times when this bug occurs do you get multiple negative levels? or just the one?

It's just one level, the "finger" with the timer disappears. The effect of negative one level stays. I have had it do 2 negative levels one time.

[Alavatar]

Generally, there are Designers and there are Developers. Designers come out with new ideas, storylines, character details and other "creative" stuff. They have no idea how to take their concepts from the storyboard to the game engine. Developers are coders. They flesh out details the creatives didn't specify and resolve logistics problems but they don't sketch whole new areas or create a monster from scratch on their own. They implement.

I've met a few folks who could reasonably do both jobs, though not as well as a dedicated person could do *one* of the jobs. Different skill sets, different mind sets, and usually different temperaments.

A designated Architect provides a starting point for the creatives, gets them headed in what he/she determines is the right direction, and guides them should they deviate. (or decides the deviation is better and guides the rest of the team in the new direction) Said Architect also mediates between the design and development groups because there is often a bit of friction between the two teams. When a particular piece is likely to be a bear of a project to code, the developers get the architect to review it and see if it's worth the resources or if an alternate technique would be acceptable to the designers' plan.

I've only met a couple people who are *good* architects. Usually someone from one team or the other gets promoted into that position, and they retain their tendencies so the other team suffers additional frustration. The architect position, if done right, balances management, creative vision and technical understanding...a tricky thing at best. Oh, and their tails are usually on the line whenever things are behind schedule, over budget or not as popular with the end users as predicted...it's often a thankless job.

So, a Developer is a coder? That's what I thought, but just recently I was told that Developers do not code, that's what the Coders do, and that Developers are more akin to Project Managers...

All of these terms are so confusing. Why can't we just say Software Engineer?

[Borror0]

I think it's pretty standard that the use of swear words implies anger. But *shrugs*

It's not as simple as that.

[Daedalis]

On occasion when ressing at a shrine and immediately resting afterwards, the death penalty debuff stays on the
player, the finger disappears you lose a level and it has to be resolved by logging out and back in. It's a perma
level drop of 1 until you log out and back in. Extended play you will notice it its extremely common, I hear it on
almost every single quest anymore.

Yep, I've had this happen....and it's extremely annoying. I avoid using the shrine until all my penalities are gone now. Almost as annoying as clicking on a spell and the timer going off but the spell doesn't. :eek: Hate that one too....:D

[Blagrak]

Thought I'd put out there that I've waited for the death penalty to wear off, only to have the counter reset and start over at 59 seconds. I've had it restart like that multiple times. And I've also beena victim of the post-rest death effect.

I'd say the death penalty system needs a good examination before long. It's more of an anooyance to me, but it would still be nice to ahve it go away.

[Turial]

It's just one level, the "finger" with the timer disappears. The effect of negative one level stays. I have had it do 2 negative levels one time.

Sounds similar to the death penalty issue that occured on risia before it was changed live. On risia players would die and have a permanent death penalty that accrued and never capped out. Best screen shot I saw was like -40 to saves.

As I said before it sounds like the game is incorrectly flagging you with a death penalty (perma) rather then death penalty (timered) dispite a timer showing up.

As far as turbine posting a set of bugs and a time line....not going to happen. Bugs can lead to exploits and turbine doesn't want people to find out about those any faster then the current speed. And they don't like having a commited or even the illusion of a commited timeline on fixes as some bugs can be amazingly difficult to fix. Do I as a player like that? No, but I know why they do it.

[Falco_Easts]

Well that could be a problem, developers should be paid to impliment not think or be creative. Players or player base should set the priorities and desire coders figure out how to execute. That equals a good game. Players = specifications = code to do. I wonder what their EA path looks like. Sounds like they need an architect if the actual developers are creating anything rather than coding.

That would be like letting the children run the Kindergarten.
Would you rather the Dev's fix 20 bugs that they can fix easily while working on another 3 big bugs or just ignore those other 20 bugs while they focus on the 3 bugs the players want fixed? A lot of the time priority is given to the easy fixes to get them done and out of the way so they can work on the big ones.

I had the bug a on a character I made. Every time, and I mean every time he died, the death penatly was permanent until I logged. Mentioned it in party chat and a bloke told me it happened to him, he put in a bug report and the GM's fixed it for him so it didn't happen any more. I did the same. Didn't even have to be logged on for them to fix it. Never got the bug on that character again.

[Jadeare]

Do not fix this bug!

It is great and i love it, just so i can come to the forums and read the ranting.

Rant on baby yeah!

[GlassCannon]

GET RID OF THE NEGATIVE LEVEL NONSENSE ON DEATH!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

IT IS KILLING MY ENJOYMENT OF THIS GAME!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

It is also ruining my character's ability to pay their Repair bills(After EVERY death? COME ON....). :(


Thank you, that is all.

[Alavatar]

I prefer financial penalties to XP penalties, personally. That way, my lowbies do not suffer from dying too much and capped characters still have a penalty for dying. The negative levels are just an annoyance that I don't really mind.

[MissErres]

I've had the "death penalty bug" before, but only once or twice, and I haven't seen it in a long time. Nor have I heard anyone mention it in a while either. I'm not saying it's not still happening, just that I've not encountered it lately.

(...and I have a rather high-speed connection, so I don't think that is the issue...)

[ehcsztein]

<QA HAT>
Can anyone who has experienced this bug (i have not) absolutely define steps to reproduce the issue?
</QA HAT>

With respect to the folks that know software development in this thread etc ... how actionable is a bug without absolute steps to reproduce?

Chasing ghosts (ie. bugs without solid repro) wastes resources unless the issue driving the work is business critical.

Is this issue business critical or end-user annoyance?

[Uska]

Thanks for the poast. Duly noted. Perhaps the devs will now avoid addressing this issue because you haven't experienced it.

I havent either or heard of it until now but if it exists then it needs fixing even if its only one player getting it

[DSC]

<QA HAT>
Can anyone who has experienced this bug (i have not) absolutely define steps to reproduce the issue?
</QA HAT>

Sadly, no. It only happens when you rest while still under Death Penalty, but I haven't seen it always happen under those circumstances.

[Gunga]

In the developers mind they believe that "prettifying" the harbor takes presidency over the game breaking bugs that are currently within the game.

OMG. You should run for the presidency.