Too much grind for me.

[KiriJolith]

I've been playing since day 1, but I'm also a casual gamer. The appeal for me was D&D online without the natural mmo grind. Alas, enough is enough for me. This game has turned into one big grind fest. It took me 37 Tor runs to finally, through acquiring & trading, get a set of blue scales for my sorc. Only to be utterly disappointed at how flimsy the stupid thing is. Binding it & keeping it from taking perma damage to me is utterly useless because it's always going to be damaged. Thus making you grind for more relics that you had to grind for so that you could grind for more scales with which allows you to grind for more relics.

Ughh..

Time to jump off the merry-go-round.

The entire shroud is the mother of all grinds. No way can I invest the time nor do I want to for grinding purposes. It's just not fun. I know, I know, people will say, "Well you don't have to grind, you can just keep running Tempest Spine for the 3000th time" No thanks.

And no, you can't have my stuff :P

[ENGRAV0]

Where ever you head off to, take care. Never a good thing to lose someone, no matter the reason. Any ideas on what you are going to give a shot at next?

[paintedman]

Best of luck on your next MMO, while there is writing on the wall, currently it is just not in a language I can understand, so I'm gonna keep on playing and just ignore it. If I may suggest, keep your stuff and your account, which is to say renew for a month every now and then, never know when Kalashtars will come out and then things will get real interesting!

-paintedman

p.s. Don’t you worry, some will keep fighting the escalation of hp and power till you return!

[captain1z]

I've been playing since day 1, but I'm also a casual gamer. The appeal for me was D&D online without the natural mmo grind. Alas, enough is enough for me. This game has turned into one big grind fest. It took me 37 Tor runs to finally, through acquiring & trading, get a set of blue scales for my sorc. Only to be utterly disappointed at how flimsy the stupid thing is. Binding it & keeping it from taking perma damage to me is utterly useless because it's always going to be damaged. Thus making you grind for more relics that you had to grind for so that you could grind for more scales with which allows you to grind for more relics.

Ughh..

Time to jump off the merry-go-round.

The entire shroud is the mother of all grinds. No way can I invest the time nor do I want to for grinding purposes. It's just not fun. I know, I know, people will say, "Well you don't have to grind, you can just keep running Tempest Spine for the 3000th time" No thanks.

And no, you can't have my stuff :P

Well I can say in most respects Im right there with you.

- I started playing before day 1 and I like to think of myself as casual.... the factors that make one casual are arguable
- I was also attracted to the D&D online comparison
- the many things in this game that take multiple runs to get, I dont have. (1750, scales, many raid items..do have a few)
- I choose not to make it a grind to get these things (if I did that would also be my choice)
- after binding items no longer take perma damage
- next mod vendors, or at least 1 will be available to fix dragon armor for a gold cost with no relics required (grind over)
- I run the shroud for items..... Ive picked up a lot of ingredients and all of the power shards along the way.


I made a green steel sword just to get an understanding of how it works. I have the means to upgrade it to tier 1-3 if thats what I choose to do. Though I have no plans to do so at this time.

The game is what you make of of it. getting a full set of 25 scales is very difficult... I own 3 scales and have given away 3 more.... thats 6. At my pace I will have 25 scales in about 3 more years of mixed colors. How long did it take you to get yours?

As many have shown by what they have accomplished in the game "If you put your mind to a task, you can have it done in a month"

Im sure I can have everything I dont have within 30 days If I chose to do what it takes. I wanted to get a +2 dex tome really bad, I looked everywhere and advertised in groups and general chat, put up posts on the boards and put it in my sig...... it took 2 weeks, but I was fortunate enough to find someone who was willing to make a trade. Then I had to grind to pay him what we agreed upon that took about 2 weeks also.

The point is its only a grind if you make it so. Dont be in such a hurry to get the best stuff and you can stop and enjoy the game. Your scale armor issue gets resolved next mod........ what you do from there is up to you.

[Impaqt]

I've been playing since day 1, but I'm also a casual gamer. The appeal for me was D&D online without the natural mmo grind. Alas, enough is enough for me. This game has turned into one big grind fest. It took me 37 Tor runs to finally, through acquiring & trading, get a set of blue scales for my sorc. Only to be utterly disappointed at how flimsy the stupid thing is. Binding it & keeping it from taking perma damage to me is utterly useless because it's always going to be damaged. Thus making you grind for more relics that you had to grind for so that you could grind for more scales with which allows you to grind for more relics.

Ughh..

Time to jump off the merry-go-round.

The entire shroud is the mother of all grinds. No way can I invest the time nor do I want to for grinding purposes. It's just not fun. I know, I know, people will say, "Well you don't have to grind, you can just keep running Tempest Spine for the 3000th time" No thanks.

And no, you can't have my stuff :P

No one "Needs" Blue Dragon armor.. You Choose to Grind for it.

And it CANT be Permanently damange.

and you dont NEED to grind relics to repair the TEMP damage. You can simply pay the guy in Meridia.

Shroud? Same applies.

Enjoy your next game....

[Joecool19]

good luck with where ever you go next. i'm just starting and ultra casual... i'v ealready noticed how much of a grind it is. i'm still gonna take it super casual.

[Asirin]

This game is far far from being finished and I'm gonna hang around for the Finale.Invested too much time and made too many friends to leave over minor annoyances and the current trend of Turbine hate.

Oh yeah and by the way Turbine a lady rear ended my car today demolishing all my golf clubs in the trunk and she blamed it on you and server lag..hope you have insurance :)

[MageLL]

I agree that it is never good to lose a player. I also know that Turbine is doing a lot with what they have.

Even as a casual player, you have already reached the end game. That is, you are at the point where your character is nearly maxed out on advancement and the only means to achieve further abilities is through in game items. This problem is not one solely seen in DDO rather in ever MMO I've ever played.

I have not polled or asked anybody their opinions on this matter, but I can speak from my personal experience. The best times I've had in any game is working hard to achieve the top level and the few weeks thus after. In some games like Asheron's Call I never actually reached the top, which is probably why I stayed in there for 3+ years. Reaching the end game is a bitter sweet experience. You are proud of your advancement and what you have accomplished; on the other hand you know this is it, what do I do next.

This is where the problem you face also becomes a discussion on the development table. What can a game offer you that will make you want to keep playing? Putting myself in those shoes I can only come up with 3 possible answers. One is to allow players to compete with each other (PvP). Another would be to deploy an honor system which offer rewards for various achievements. Lastly probably the most expensive from a development standpoint would be to raise the max level.

I hate to use World of Warcraft as a model for anything, but they have proven they can grow their game despite the inherent problem every MMO is presented. They built their game with all 3 of these possible solutions in mind. The ability to randomly brawl a person, dedicated PvP grounds, honor systems throughout your advancement and many quest dedicated to such with millions of dollars being pumped into expansions. Working the various honor systems, which can include crafting, favor or faction points, quest completions or any number of atypical advancements you can think of, should keep most people busy while they polish a new box to stick on the shelf of your Best Buy. When the new box hits you'll have your incentive to play again as you can once again advance your character to higher levels.

Now don't get me wrong Turbine isn't a bunch of noobs. They knew all of this way before Warcraft was even done ripping of Warhammer on the tabletop. The problem with DDO is the budget. The company is catering to what now is a niche group of players and it is not in any foreseeable future going to deliver enough content to keep everybody playing happy, let alone draw more people in. So they work within their means. This means we wait longer for less, and play longer to progress. The grind as people will call it, is there to give you something to do, while the next expansion is being polished. Don't expect to see it on Best Buy's shelf when it is ready, rather log in on patch day and get it for free.

DDO isn't a large game, and new things are going to take time. You may opt not to pay for that time, but others will. If you must leave know that the game will continue to expand and when you're ready to come back, there will be new things for you to do. Until then farewell casual gamer.

[FluffyCalico]

I agree that it is never good to lose a player. I also know that Turbine is doing a lot with what they have.

Even as a casual player, you have already reached the end game. That is, you are at the point where your character is nearly maxed out on advancement and the only means to achieve further abilities is through in game items. This problem is not one solely seen in DDO rather in ever MMO I've ever played.

I have not polled or asked anybody their opinions on this matter, but I can speak from my personal experience. The best times I've had in any game is working hard to achieve the top level and the few weeks thus after. In some games like Asheron's Call I never actually reached the top, which is probably why I stayed in there for 3+ years. Reaching the end game is a bitter sweet experience. You are proud of your advancement and what you have accomplished; on the other hand you know this is it, what do I do next.

This is where the problem you face also becomes a discussion on the development table. What can a game offer you that will make you want to keep playing? Putting myself in those shoes I can only come up with 3 possible answers. One is to allow players to compete with each other (PvP). Another would be to deploy an honor system which offer rewards for various achievements. Lastly probably the most expensive from a development standpoint would be to raise the max level.

I hate to use World of Warcraft as a model for anything, but they have proven they can grow their game despite the inherent problem every MMO is presented. They built their game with all 3 of these possible solutions in mind. The ability to randomly brawl a person, dedicated PvP grounds, honor systems throughout your advancement and many quest dedicated to such with millions of dollars being pumped into expansions. Working the various honor systems, which can include crafting, favor or faction points, quest completions or any number of atypical advancements you can think of, should keep most people busy while they polish a new box to stick on the shelf of your Best Buy. When the new box hits you'll have your incentive to play again as you can once again advance your character to higher levels.

Now don't get me wrong Turbine isn't a bunch of noobs. They knew all of this way before Warcraft was even done ripping of Warhammer on the tabletop. The problem with DDO is the budget. The company is catering to what now is a niche group of players and it is not in any foreseeable future going to deliver enough content to keep everybody playing happy, let alone draw more people in. So they work within their means. This means we wait longer for less, and play longer to progress. The grind as people will call it, is there to give you something to do, while the next expansion is being polished. Don't expect to see it on Best Buy's shelf when it is ready, rather log in on patch day and get it for free.

DDO isn't a large game, and new things are going to take time. You may opt not to pay for that time, but others will. If you must leave know that the game will continue to expand and when you're ready to come back, there will be new things for you to do. Until then farewell casual gamer.

I actually agree with most of this. I took 2 years off from the game. Yes 2 years as a couple weeks of killing the dragon over and over got boring. After comming back after 2 years I leveled up 3 drow to cap exploring all the new areas and then 1 -32 pointer to cap. The sads thing is I came back on their 2 year welcome back and now have 4 brand new capped characters, have done everyhing but the abbot. Have 4 tier 3 items and really have nothing left to do of the fun type. So I am mainly waiting on the monk and new stuff next month. After that I will likely be gone for another 2 years.

In short its sad that in 2 years they released enough content to keep you busy for about 1 month. IMO DDO should have released with more content than it has now.

[Borror0]

Shroud? Same applies.

I disagree here.

Say you log on on your capped character... what LFMs do you see? What 90% or more capped characters run non-stop?

Oh, and if it's for his sorcerer... the Tier 3 SP item is pretty much required, as th gap is huge to come by...

[Venar]

After 2 runs of Gianthold Tor, i had 1 black scale.
I came to the forums, and checked the strat for the armors.
I calculated that it was not worth it.
Same for Tome and Shield pieces.

You chose to grind it. Then you complain it's a grind. Sorry man, you got what you signed for.


(tip: a set of 25 scales cost about 500k plat. Do a few varied loot runs, or just run some vale quest. You'll pull something (+2 tomes, vorps, w/p, etc...) to trade for a stack faster then the time to actually farm it.))

[Aranticus]

good luck finding an mmo with 0 grind.............. oh wait..... you can pay your way through :cool:



edit: i'm talking about game cards that you can buy to get you items, gold and xp, not referring to plat farmers

[fatherpirate]

There should be more new content...true, unfortunately....is often happens when 1 company is running 2 games.
This game (as good as it is) is second fiddle to LOTRO

LOTRO has a ton more paying customers, so it gets the luv

[Zedim]

This game is far far from being finished and I'm gonna hang around for the Finale.Invested too much time and made too many friends to leave over minor annoyances and the current trend of Turbine hate.

Oh yeah and by the way Turbine a lady rear ended my car today demolishing all my golf clubs in the trunk and she blamed it on you and server lag..hope you have insurance :)

That was my wife! You better have insurance! I plan to retire with the settlement, you laggy person you! :D

[Impaqt]

I disagree here.

Say you log on on your capped character... what LFMs do you see? What 90% or more capped characters run non-stop?

Oh, and if it's for his sorcerer... the Tier 3 SP item is pretty much required, as th gap is huge to come by...

There are plenty of sorcs without the shroud spell point item that get by just fine. What Gap? If your a Casual Gamer you really shouldtn be looking for gaps to fill....

This guy isnt a Casual Gamer.... He may be somewhere in between, but this isnt about the Grind. Hes bored and needs to take a break.

[llevenbaxx]

I agree they are starting to lean on the grind crutch for "content" a little too much. While I guess Im not the average casual gamer having 7 32pt builds(all level15-16), 5 of which have their 1750, grinding for pieces and parts of pieces drains out all the fun for me. Two of my first 32pt builds have a wide array of raid loot and it does make a huge difference having this equipment in your average dungeon. Imo they shouldve kept this crafting garbage closer to loot you can pull. The shroud is the biggest step away from the casual gamer yet "imo", this is super powerful equipment to which no random loot will ever compare.

They are just throwing "shinies" out there to all those who will grind. What kind of content will they have to start putting out to challenge people with multiple pieces of this equipment? They shouldve waited until max level was reached to put this sort of grind for the best loot in the game "mechanic" ingame imho. It makes running anything else in the game for loot feel utterly pointless(yes I call myself casual and I like loot too).

[Borror0]

This guy isnt a Casual Gamer.... He may be somewhere in between, but this isnt about the Grind. Hes bored and needs to take a break.

How about the grind is boring?
And... never said he was casual gamer. I hate that way to classify gamers.

[Impaqt]

How about the grind is boring?
And... never said he was casual gamer. I hate that way to classify gamers.

He Classified Himself as a Casual gamer.. First Line of the First Post.

And if the Grind is Boring you shoudl take a break from it. Whatever Your Grinding Isnt Required. You've Choosen to run that way.

[Xaxx]

I've been playing since day 1, but I'm also a casual gamer. The appeal for me was D&D online without the natural mmo grind. Alas, enough is enough for me. This game has turned into one big grind fest. It took me 37 Tor runs to finally, through acquiring & trading, get a set of blue scales for my sorc. Only to be utterly disappointed at how flimsy the stupid thing is. Binding it & keeping it from taking perma damage to me is utterly useless because it's always going to be damaged. Thus making you grind for more relics that you had to grind for so that you could grind for more scales with which allows you to grind for more relics.

Ughh..

Time to jump off the merry-go-round.

The entire shroud is the mother of all grinds. No way can I invest the time nor do I want to for grinding purposes. It's just not fun. I know, I know, people will say, "Well you don't have to grind, you can just keep running Tempest Spine for the 3000th time" No thanks.

And no, you can't have my stuff :P

ALL mmos are a grind... its the design of the genre.. its how they keep brining you back to keep paying the 10-15 bucks a month, its just not possible for any game to release 20-100 new hours of content a month, so no matter where you go you grind, here you run the same quest, in wow you kill 10 orce, then 25 orcs, then 3000 orcs for the same guy and its the same orcs... so... good luck with your grind wherever you go.

[Borror0]

He Classified Himself as a Casual gamer.. First Line of the First Post.

Never said I agreed with his post, did I?;)

Honestly, I think grinding irks powergamers and casual gamers equally. The powergamers just have an higher tolerance to grinding, but they hate it as much.


You've Choosen to run that way.

Yes, but Turbine has chosen to implement it. Really, we'd have a game freer of grinding than it currently is, I'd not complain. And I'm pretty sure everyone will agree.

[debo]

The entire shroud is the mother of all grinds. No way can I invest the time nor do I want to for grinding purposes. It's just not fun. I know, I know, people will say, "Well you don't have to grind, you can just keep running Tempest Spine for the 3000th time" No thanks.


Yes it is. It is actually the perfect grinding machine. Like the Matrix :). As soon as you get enough ingredients to make what you want... you then have to keep grinding till you can get an essensce of cleansing so you can equip even more craftable items... which you have to then keep farming and farming and ...

Well you get the point. This is because they know they can not keep up with the demand for content and they have create some type of system that keeps players wanting to play. Not their fault when the game has a limited budget and has to make due with what it has... Still maybe Kommunity Kobald should stop chatting it up in the forums argueing the symantics of exploiting and getting players to turn on players because the development team can not fix a bug...AND instead help the development team create new content.

[Milolyen]

Yes, but Turbine has chosen to implement it. Really, we'd have a game freer of grinding than it currently is, I'd not complain. And I'm pretty sure everyone will agree.

Not really. The "grinds" they put in are content. They would have to pump out like 4 new and original quests a week in order to keep up in the demand for new content by power gamers. For the casual gamers it would be more like 4 new and original quests every 2 weeks. You would have to have a pretty big staff to be able to pump out content like that. Even then people will get bored of questing non-stop. Hence the people that are asking for crafting, guild houses and stuff of that nature. They know they can not pump enough out so they have to include some "grinds" to keep people interested in the game. As I stated in another thread you can not have a completely "grind" free game. The best you can do is to make it so the grinds are not necessary but yet are rewarding enough to do and I feel turbine does this pretty well. Collect a full set of tome and shield pieces ... lot of grind to loot all that is needed, worth the reward but you don't really need. "Grind" out the raid loot you are wanting to get, again not needed and you can be just as effective if you don't use a single piece of raid loot but very much worth the effert. The shroud is not CRAFTING but craft your own RAID LOOT. You don't like the grind to get raid loot then you wont like the grind to get shroud raid loot. Dragon scales ... this was a huge grind when it first came out. Back when it cost like 10 relics to repair the armor once you fineally got it. They then reduced it to 5 relics and now is down to 3 or just a little more expensive to have it repaired in meridia.

All a grind is is deragitory word used when people do not like putting in the time to get a reward. All games will have some form of reward you won't like putting in the time for. The nice thing about DDO is you are not required to do any of them unless you want to and still be fairly effective at endgame content. Unlike several other MMO's I know of.

Milolyen

[Laith]

if you run with the goal of getting loot, you're going to grind: it's the nature of MMOs.

it's better to run with a different goal in mind.
personally, i prefer "fun"... you're never grinding if you're having fun.

good luck out there.

[Josh]

But, on the box it says " Focus on adventure, not on grind". In reality it's more like "focus on grind, because we don't know how to implement adventure". Too funny.

[rimble]

All a grind is is deragitory word used when people do not like putting in the time to get a reward. All games will have some form of reward you won't like putting in the time for. The nice thing about DDO is you are not required to do any of them unless you want to and still be fairly effective at endgame content. Unlike several other MMO's I know of.

I bet alot more people would be less likely to say 'grind' if there were, say, twenty quests that you had to do each of them once to be able to craft your item. I can't imagine anyone that wouldn't prefer that over doing the same quest twenty times. That's a grind. It's not about time investment or being lazy, it's about boring repetitive tasks.

[Laith]

it's about boring repetitive tasks.it's really about players being willing to repeat FUN tasks beyond the point that they become "boring" and "repetitive" for the sake of the carrot in the distance.

In this case (shroud and tor) the rewards could have just as easily been traded or purchased as grinded for.
Heck, i know people that love/repeat/know the Pit enough, that they have been offered money for their expert leadership.

Perhaps the OP could have spent his time running a more personally interesting grind(s) like gird/pop/relic/bloodstone/vale/litany, and traded the fruits for shroud ingredients or tor scales.

[llevenbaxx]

But, on the box it says " Focus on adventure, not on grind". In reality it's more like "focus on grind, because we don't know how to implement adventure". Too funny.

LOL... QFT

[Aspenor]

It's only a grind if you MAKE it a grind.

[Impaqt]

Never said I agreed with his post, did I?;)

Honestly, I think grinding irks powergamers and casual gamers equally. The powergamers just have an higher tolerance to grinding, but they hate it as much.



Yes, but Turbine has chosen to implement it. Really, we'd have a game freer of grinding than it currently is, I'd not complain. And I'm pretty sure everyone will agree.


B... you know I'm a Power Gamer...... I have only ONE tier 3 Shroud Item across 8 Characters. I have Blue Dragonscale armore on 2 of em, White on another.... And to be honest, The White scalers were from a friend who I still Owe for and one set of Blue scales was Purchased fromthe AH. I have a Ton of Reaver Loot, but other than that, Not more than 1 or 2 items from other raids on any other characters. I own just a few Planar Girds.....

I dont Grind because I dont have to. Theres enough loot spread about this game to Equipt your characters to uber status without grinding. I MIGHT of ground the shroud If there were Axes in the craft table..... I doubt it though.

There are Thousands of Players that rarely, if ever Raid. They dont have millions of plat, and ya know what? They have fun.

When you Move yourself above the Fun Line, its a Personal Playstyle Choice. No One Forces any kind of Grind on anyone.

When you CHOOSE to grind stuff out, it leads to getting Bored with what youa re doing. Its NOT the Forced Grind that makes people quit. Its sheer Boredom with the game. You cant please everyone all the time. If you Convince yourself you NEED X or Y, then you have to make a choice. Is it worth my Enjoyment of the game? If the answer is YES! Then Grind away. if the answer is NO, then your only hastening your discontent.

There isnt a Single item in this game that is REQUIRED to have fun. All Requirements are Self Imposed.

[Teech]

But, on the box it says " Focus on adventure, not on grind". In reality it's more like "focus on grind, because we don't know how to implement adventure". Too funny.

You can take people to see the pyramids, the great wall. You can take them to the moon.
And at the end of the trip, someone is gonna say, "Yeah...so what did I get outta it?"

Its only a grind if you see it as one.
Focus on the adventure not the loot.
Your perception defines your reality.

[ENGRAV0]

B... you know I'm a Power Gamer...... I have only ONE tier 3 Shroud Item across 8 Characters. I have Blue Dragonscale armore on 2 of em, White on another.... And to be honest, The White scalers were from a friend who I still Owe for and one set of Blue scales was Purchased fromthe AH. I have a Ton of Reaver Loot, but other than that, Not more than 1 or 2 items from other raids on any other characters. I own just a few Planar Girds.....

I dont Grind because I dont have to. Theres enough loot spread about this game to Equipt your characters to uber status without grinding. I MIGHT of ground the shroud If there were Axes in the craft table..... I doubt it though.

There are Thousands of Players that rarely, if ever Raid. They dont have millions of plat, and ya know what? They have fun.

When you Move yourself above the Fun Line, its a Personal Playstyle Choice. No One Forces any kind of Grind on anyone.

When you CHOOSE to grind stuff out, it leads to getting Bored with what youa re doing. Its NOT the Forced Grind that makes people quit. Its sheer Boredom with the game. You cant please everyone all the time. If you Convince yourself you NEED X or Y, then you have to make a choice. Is it worth my Enjoyment of the game? If the answer is YES! Then Grind away. if the answer is NO, then your only hastening your discontent.

There isnt a Single item in this game that is REQUIRED to have fun. All Requirements are Self Imposed.

A mouse, maybe? :)

[Milolyen]

I bet alot more people would be less likely to say 'grind' if there were, say, twenty quests that you had to do each of them once to be able to craft your item. I can't imagine anyone that wouldn't prefer that over doing the same quest twenty times. That's a grind. It's not about time investment or being lazy, it's about boring repetitive tasks.

Really? You think people would say going through 20 quests to get a reward is less of a "grind" then create your own raid loot? Hmmm how about a reward for doing say 50 different quest? 100? Hmm belive we have a reward for doing just that. Called getting to 1750 favor and you see that LONG thread of people argueing if it is a grind or not? Or how bout the couple posts I saw about haveing to "grind" for collectables out of many different quests for the actual crafting? Any time you have someone that wants the reward but doesn't want to put in the time to get the reward is going to complain about it being a "grind" that is all there is to it.

Like Laith said If you focus on equipment and what others have that you don't and focus on getting that stuff then you are going to turn the game itself into a grind but if you go in have fun and not worry about what others have that you don't then you are going to have a much better time in game and not even see the grinds.

This is one reason I do not like the current forum deffinition of the "casual gamer" and "power gamer". To me a "casual gamer" is one that plays the game for fun and is not obsessed with haveing the best gear possible and max stats. "Power gamer" would be just the opposite, They want the best equipment, best stats and to be well .. the best. Alot of these people that are complaining about "grinds" and such but consider themselves a casual gamer just because they can only play 5 to 15 hours a week does not make since to me. For the longest time the bow I used the most on my ranger was a +1 wounding longbow of pure good where now it is a +1 w/p longbow I finally traded for and I always did just fine soloing, my dps rapiers is +5 acid of pure good and fell ice, my favorite melee combo is +1 vorpal sickle and +1 paralyzing sickle, and again I do just fine out there. I wair all of 1 raid item and that is only part time (head of good fortune which switches out to the bat for ff) untill I upgraded goggles from shroud to teir 2 (which takes what 6 - 8 runs of 1-3 if you are lucky enough to get a power shard).

In my opinion the amount of time you get to play does not discribe the kind of player you are ... your attitude does. (Using my deffinition of power gamer) Oh and don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with haveing the attitude of a power gamer. I just don't like to see a power gamer complain about "grinds" and such because of his limited playing time. Nothing in life is free and in a game it is not nearly as much fun to play if you are just given rewards for paying your 15 a month and logging in. They HAVE to put in rewards to keep people playing otherwise no one would play but for about 2 weeks after each content release.

Milolyen

[Impaqt]

A mouse, maybe? :)

Actually, I know a few folks that Play with nothing but a Gamepad.:)

[krud]

B... you know I'm a Power Gamer...... I have only ONE tier 3 Shroud Item across 8 Characters. I have Blue Dragonscale armore on 2 of em, White on another.... And to be honest, The White scalers were from a friend who I still Owe for and one set of Blue scales was Purchased fromthe AH. I have a Ton of Reaver Loot, but other than that, Not more than 1 or 2 items from other raids on any other characters. I own just a few Planar Girds.....

I dont Grind because I dont have to. Theres enough loot spread about this game to Equipt your characters to uber status without grinding. I MIGHT of ground the shroud If there were Axes in the craft table..... I doubt it though.

There are Thousands of Players that rarely, if ever Raid. They dont have millions of plat, and ya know what? They have fun.

When you Move yourself above the Fun Line, its a Personal Playstyle Choice. No One Forces any kind of Grind on anyone.

When you CHOOSE to grind stuff out, it leads to getting Bored with what youa re doing. Its NOT the Forced Grind that makes people quit. Its sheer Boredom with the game. You cant please everyone all the time. If you Convince yourself you NEED X or Y, then you have to make a choice. Is it worth my Enjoyment of the game? If the answer is YES! Then Grind away. if the answer is NO, then your only hastening your discontent.

There isnt a Single item in this game that is REQUIRED to have fun. All Requirements are Self Imposed.

/signed

[Arianrhod]

As long as all quests remain completable on Normal without raid gear/Shroud Gear/32-point builds/dragonscale gear, I feel it's relatively easy to ignore the "grind" factor. There are still a couple raids that have to be "ground" for (Sigil pieces, relics), but there are those who would argue raids aren't "normal" quests anyway. We'll see how I feel when I get there, I guess.

[DoctorWhofan]

I HATE the shroud and Vale.

Barely do any of it.

It is your choice to grind. you can make a perfectly good character without all the shineys! Play the quests you want, or do some thingelse like permadeath.

Otherwise you will be disappointed in other MMOs. All grind.

[KiriJolith]

It's not about time investment or being lazy, it's about boring repetitive tasks.

Bingo!!

Kiri.

[Serpent]

Will someone name me an MMO that is not a grind. I have yet to find one and I have tried most of them. Not saying anyones wrong or right, I was under the assumption that the grind was an aspect of all MMOs. If someone doesn't like the grind whether it be one quest 100 times or 20 quests 2 times, then maybe MMOs aren't for them.

[Eudimio]

Will someone name me an MMO that is not a grind. I have yet to find one and I have tried most of them. Not saying anyones wrong or right, I was under the assumption that the grind was an aspect of all MMOs. If someone doesn't like the grind whether it be one quest 100 times or 20 quests 2 times, then maybe MMOs aren't for them.

Progress Quest.

[xberto]

I can relate to the OP. I'm kinda tired of the grind too. Aint played much since January and if I hadn't bought a 6 month subscription, I might not be playing at all. I think I can still enjoy the game, I just have not been able to get the latest content, with all the grinding, collecting, and crafting. My desire for the game, character creation, and forum reading is all but gone.

My play time peaked at about 25 hours/week and I have always got in some solid playing since the launch. I might only average about an hour/week for the last 3 months.

[Uska]

B... you know I'm a Power Gamer...... I have only ONE tier 3 Shroud Item across 8 Characters. I have Blue Dragonscale armore on 2 of em, White on another.... And to be honest, The White scalers were from a friend who I still Owe for and one set of Blue scales was Purchased fromthe AH. I have a Ton of Reaver Loot, but other than that, Not more than 1 or 2 items from other raids on any other characters. I own just a few Planar Girds.....

I dont Grind because I dont have to. Theres enough loot spread about this game to Equipt your characters to uber status without grinding. I MIGHT of ground the shroud If there were Axes in the craft table..... I doubt it though.

There are Thousands of Players that rarely, if ever Raid. They dont have millions of plat, and ya know what? They have fun.

When you Move yourself above the Fun Line, its a Personal Playstyle Choice. No One Forces any kind of Grind on anyone.

When you CHOOSE to grind stuff out, it leads to getting Bored with what youa re doing. Its NOT the Forced Grind that makes people quit. Its sheer Boredom with the game. You cant please everyone all the time. If you Convince yourself you NEED X or Y, then you have to make a choice. Is it worth my Enjoyment of the game? If the answer is YES! Then Grind away. if the answer is NO, then your only hastening your discontent.

There isnt a Single item in this game that is REQUIRED to have fun. All Requirements are Self Imposed.



Never have more truthful words been spoken