How many of you do not Barkskin others?

[Puke]

And why?

I play Rangers about 90% of the time. In fact, my only other characters is a Fighter who I've not been playing all that much lately but did get him Shroud ready just last night.

Ok then, so I get my Fighter into his first Shroud group and am suprised we actually have not one Ranger in the group, but two! Ii certainly have trouble finding groups that'll allow a Ranger in. But soon I am stunned that we have two Rangers who each Barkskins only himself and then sits and waits for the mission to begin. (One of the Rangers put Camouflage on everyone... Camouflage? What the heck for!?) I didn't think much of it because in Shroud1 it's not really needed because you should mostly be attacking the portals while the casters take out the Trogs and such, though it will still help a little bit. Now what really stunned me is that after we finished part 1 and are getting ready to go into Shroud 2, both Rangers shrine with a majority of their mana bar (I'd guess one guy had 70% and the other around 85%) and then again buff only themselves leaving a huge blue mana bar and then stand around with their thumbs up their noses waiting for part-2 to start. Maybe I am way off base, but I was stunned! If you are going to throw away your SP by shrining, at least throw some goodies out. +5 to AC can help a lot of people and it should help the Cleric by requiring slightly less heals. Again, I was stunned though maybe I am off base? Anyway, I figure at least get a Magi item and throw some of that extra SP around to at least a couple melees and help out a little bit.

My Rangers always, always, always Barkskin everyone at the start of a mission and right after shrining and then doles it out after that as SP allows always keeping a small reserve just for myself. My Rangers can Barkskin everyone in the Shroud at least once.

Since Rangers have a bad wrap, it's incredibly rare I quest with a second Ranger. Is this pretty much the common way to handle spell points?

[Hafeal]

Did anyone ask for a barkskin?

Although it is nice to it as a matter of course, some players do not hand out certain buffs unless asked.

[Strakeln]

They might be MC rangers, in which case their barkskin may or may not do more than items that the tank-types are likely to have.

Regarding the camo, L1 spell slots are tight, but L2/L3 are not. So mass camo is easy to fit in while single-target camo is difficult. I agree that there is no point to it in the shroud, but I generally cast it out of habit regardless of where I am.

I agree, though: there were times when the only reason rangers were let into groups was the barkskin spell, all rangers should be in the habit of doling it out frequently.

[Puke]

Did anyone ask for a barkskin?

Although it is nice to it as a matter of course, some players do not hand out certain buffs unless asked.

Nope. Nobody asked. So Rangers prefer to be asked. I play mine wrong, then.

One guy was 14/2 and the other pure 16 levels. Both should have the full +5 Barks and they should last a while. And judging by how little their mana bars went down, they had quite a bit of SP. (And if they hold a Magi item at least in the very beginning, can throw extras out.)

[Puke]

Why would Camouflage be something cast out of habit? I bet you that your sneaking around is less than 5% of what you do and in that case, Camouflage can easily be cast right before you know you have to sneak/hide somewhere (all it does is give a +10 to your hide/sneak skill.) But overall, I have no issue with that one.

[Zenako]

Well on my Ranger, I routinely cast three spells on my self (Bark, Rams and Wild Instincts) and the perhaps a Resist if I think I might need it, followed by Barks on any and all melee types I see in the group.

As for Rangers in the shroud, I guess you missed the memo, but they are seriously liked in there, especially those with the right favored enemies. nice to dual wield greater construct banes with Construct favored enemy damage tossed in. Can help make short work of the portals. Toss in the right Devil killing FE and you have the making of serious serious DPS. On Part 4, with good ranged weapons, you can likely evade most DBF damage anyway making the healers life easier and still dish out nice hurts on the Fiend and friends.

[Turial]

The only time I dont hand out bark is when I say that I'm going to do it and about half way though buffing the party someone drinks a pot of it. So I end up skipping that player, playing a buffing ranger for as long as I have can make one bitter.Thats the only time I skip people...heck I even bark the other rangers.

[Reisz]

Did anyone ask for a barkskin?

Although it is nice to it as a matter of course, some players do not hand out certain buffs unless asked.

Am I off base, or do we need to ask fighters and barbarians to swing their weapons too?

[Zenako]

Barkskin is very situational. Casting it on everyone, can be a royal waste, just like casting Fire Resist can be. A lot of people have Greater Fire resist somethings (cloak, shield, whatever) so all you do is burn spell points.

Casting Barkskin on an AC 20 characters running Shroud Elite is like wizzing in the wind. Casting it on a AC50 character might matter. So yah, hopefully the player knows what really helps them or not, so I usually ask in quests like that who wants a Barkskin. I have 100 Spell points to burn (Magi Weapon) before we get started everytime. Use or lose them. In a normal quest I am more likely to Bark everyone, since many of the trash mobs still have sucky to hit bonuses and that 5 AC might make a difference along the way.

[Puke]

Depending on my level, I always cast on myself: Ram's Might, Barkskin, Freedom of Movement and my own Protects and Resists. But with a buffed 18 Wisdom and a Magi Robe, I am able to hit everyone with Barkskin and a couple other things depending on the circumstances.

Even if someone uses a Barkskin potion, I will cast over it. My spell will last much longer and the potion is only a +3 to AC whereas my spell is a +5. The better the group is able to survive, the better I am able to survive.

My hierarchy of casting is melees, cleric then wiz/sorc. It's my understanding that most Wiz/Sorcs have pretty low AC as it is but even if not, they are doing their best to avoid standing amongst a bunch of melee monsters whereas that's right where the Ftr/Barb/Pal is standing. If I see the Rogue and Bard doing a lot of melee, I consider them equal to the melees.

I never wait to be asked for a Barkskin to throw them out. This is exactly what my Magi item is for. I will throw those spells out right away so I can then switch out to my regular robe or weapon. Also, I will try to throw out the last of my spell points *BEFORE* I shrine. I mean, we are all in the adventure together...let's help each other out.

Zenako, Khyber missed that memo. If you had any idea how many do not want Rangers in their Shroud groups. I kid you not. I have even seen the leader put in the LFM, "Experienced only and you will be interviewed." How much does it cost to switch my account to a new server?

[Zenako]

Zenako, Khyber missed that memo. If you had any idea how many do not want Rangers in their Shroud groups. I kid you not. I have even seen the leader put in the LFM, "Experienced only and you will be interviewed." How much does it cost to switch my account to a new server?

Check out the almost all ranger shroud runs Kargon et all pull together (They let one bard in for good company) on Sarlona.

Routinely see shroud runs with a handful of Rangers in them...

[Desteria]

Depending on my level, I always cast on myself: Ram's Might, Barkskin, Freedom of Movement and my own Protects and Resists. But with a buffed 18 Wisdom and a Magi Robe, I am able to hit everyone with Barkskin and a couple other things depending on the circumstances.

Even if someone uses a Barkskin potion, I will cast over it. My spell will last much longer and the potion is only a +3 to AC whereas my spell is a +5. The better the group is able to survive, the better I am able to survive.

My hierarchy of casting is melees, cleric then wiz/sorc. It's my understanding that most Wiz/Sorcs have pretty low AC as it is but even if not, they are doing their best to avoid standing amongst a bunch of melee monsters whereas that's right where the Ftr/Barb/Pal is standing. If I see the Rogue and Bard doing a lot of melee, I consider them equal to the melees.

I never wait to be asked for a Barkskin to throw them out. This is exactly what my Magi item is for. I will throw those spells out right away so I can then switch out to my regular robe or weapon. Also, I will try to throw out the last of my spell points *BEFORE* I shrine. I mean, we are all in the adventure together...let's help each other out.

Zenako, Khyber missed that memo. If you had any idea how many do not want Rangers in their Shroud groups. I kid you not. I have even seen the leader put in the LFM, "Experienced only and you will be interviewed." How much does it cost to switch my account to a new server?

A TWF ranger with the right FE is a beast in the shroud, a Pure dex bow ranger with the wrong FE is gimpy well purty much everywere the problem is telling them apart if you don't know them, sadly khyber has a history have havign a LOT of HORRABLE rangers...
As I've been leveling my new one up recently I've sene delars groups wanted every melle but a ranger, I'd sned a tell sayign i have 30+ buffed ac I have the right weaposn give me a try otu a few group accepted me, Buy the end of the quest they were all singing my praise, note both times my kill count was 3-4 Times the next higest person, mm favored enimy undead ;) my weaposn were not amazign no supper fancy GUB just a pair of Warhammers one +4 flametouched iron the other +1 PG, nto bad but bopth were dirt cheap on the AH.
The problem was I had to break the sterotype of bad ranagers on khyber, and some times that hard history is long and often onyl the bad is rembered.

[Milolyen]

First off ... only 2 rangers in your shroud run? I think the majority of them I have seen have 3 to 4. Now when I go with my ranger I generally only cast bark on the high ac types because as others have posted generally speaking the only time ac really makes a difference is when you get 50 + ac. So I look through and if I think you are in the 45 + ac range I will hit you with a barkskin otherwise I do it on request only. My ranger has almost 600 sp and I am more than happy to cast it on who ever asks but if you don't have the time to ask for a bark then I don't have the time to cast it. Also my mana is precious to me (despite haveing that much) because I can swap out weapons really quick and cast CSW for a range of 48 - 64 hps a cast which makes me very self sufficient.

Milolyen

[Puke]

First off ... only 2 rangers in your shroud run? I think the majority of them I have seen have 3 to 4. Now when I go with my ranger I generally only cast bark on the high ac types because as others have posted generally speaking the only time ac really makes a difference is when you get 50 + ac. So I look through and if I think you are in the 45 + ac range I will hit you with a barkskin otherwise I do it on request only. My ranger has almost 600 sp and I am more than happy to cast it on who ever asks but if you don't have the time to ask for a bark then I don't have the time to cast it. Also my mana is precious to me (despite haveing that much) because I can swap out weapons really quick and cast CSW for a range of 48 - 64 hps a cast which makes me very self sufficient.

Milolyen

On Khyber? All I play are Rangers and I will sit for hours waiting for an invite to a Shroud group. I am telling you and I have the experience, it is rare that anyone will let a Ranger into their Shroud group on Khyber. Let me be more clear though, pure Ranger. None of this 10Ftr/4Rgr/2Rogue stuff.

600 SP is a LOT. You have no reason whatsoever to be miserly with your Barkskin. I have about 350'ish SP and I can hit the entire twelve people with Barkskin and have plenty to buff myself with everything I need from my own spell selection and still have mana to spare. And the resources for more SP are plentiful (shrines, trees, water, etc.)

But point is, many of you do Barkskin others even if maybe it's restricted to only melees. I experienced a group with two Rangers who didn't drop a single SP on others and who, in fact, would Shrine with more than half their mana bar and still not throw anything out to help the group.

And I bet you guys think I'm joking about switching to a new server. I am seriously contemplating it. That's how bad it is for my Rangers (at least) on Khyber. I'm sick of it. Shoot, it's gotten to where I pitch and moan all the time in guild-chat about it and I bet they are sick of hearing me go on about it.

edit: and it's also why, as of today, I plan to let my account expire in August. I do not find it enjoyable spending more time trying to find a group than I do actually playing in group.

[Westerner]

At midlevels I used to barkskin automatically. In the Shroud... it's not likely to be useful except on very high AC characters. Sword & Board Fighters or Paladins might be good candidates. Otherwise, I keep my mana back for 50pt. CSW's so I can be self sufficient.

[Westerner]

And I bet you guys think I'm joking about switching to a new server. I am seriously contemplating it. That's how bad it is for my Rangers (at least) on Khyber.
Wow. Come over to Thelanis, bro. We can't get enough rangers on our shroud runs.

Rangers are absolute beasts in the Shroud. Tempest TWF w/FE Construct and Evil Outsider dishes out serious melee DPS, and ranging gives you the best DPS:healing ratio on the fiend.

[Turial]

Puke, On another note I see clerics, bards, and other casters doing the same thing and they have plenty of sp to go around atleast once. Its not just a ranger thing, not that you said it was but just saying.

[reefhut]

I have several toons, but mostly play my 14 rngr / 2 fgtr. I just wanted to say that I buff everyone, always....without discretion or provocation, it's just the way I play. In raid groups I have enough SP to buff EVERYONE (including other rangers) with bark, jump, and FoM (I have FoM loaded to save cleric SP), and still have enough for my self buffs and all resist/prots. In regular groups I have plenty SP to cover all buffs AND resists for entire party (again, saving the much needed SP of clerics/casters). I can see why some players would only buff if asked, mebbe wanting to retain SP for self healing if one should happen to run out of pots or wands. I dont think anyone should ever be EXPECTED to just hand out buffs, but when it happens be thankful you didnt have to ask. In closing, I understand the OP wasnt trying to bash rangers or anything, but it gets frustrating to continually see rangers taking a truckload of sh*t on the forums. Just remember its not the class, but the person who chooses to play said class. It happens to all classes in one form or another, but rangers have had more than their fair share of being on the other end of pointed fingers;)

[Milolyen]

A TWF ranger with the right FE is a beast in the shroud, a Pure dex bow ranger with the wrong FE is gimpy well purty much everywere the problem is telling them apart if you don't know them, sadly khyber has a history have havign a LOT of HORRABLE rangers...
As I've been leveling my new one up recently I've sene delars groups wanted every melle but a ranger, I'd sned a tell sayign i have 30+ buffed ac I have the right weaposn give me a try otu a few group accepted me, Buy the end of the quest they were all singing my praise, note both times my kill count was 3-4 Times the next higest person, mm favored enimy undead ;) my weaposn were not amazign no supper fancy GUB just a pair of Warhammers one +4 flametouched iron the other +1 PG, nto bad but bopth were dirt cheap on the AH.
The problem was I had to break the sterotype of bad ranagers on khyber, and some times that hard history is long and often onyl the bad is rembered.

I love posts like this ... just makes groups I jump in say WOW that much more when they see what I can do with bows. Note I am not a pure bow user just mostly. Have 22str, 34 dex, 20 con, 10 in, 22 wis, 10 cha (+3 dex and wis tomes and +2 str and con tomes used). The guild I am in has alot of members takeing a break right now so I have been pugging more and nearly every group I have been in had 1 if not 2 people asking me what my build is because they are shocked at what I can do and gets down right funny when they find out he is a 28 point "gimp build". I mean if you where to belive all the posts about rangers and all the posts about 28 point builds my char should be the biggest gimp with no one wanting to group with me. Now what I DO does depend on the situation and each situation is unique which is why I love playing a ranger because there is such a variety of what you can do and ANYONE (IMO) restricting their ranger to a single use is gimping themselves and that includes the "TWF Beasts". I mostly range with my new greensteel bow (acid goodburst soon to be acidblast with transmuting) +2 transmuting longbow of lawful outsider bane and w/p longbow(one of the bonuses of playing a char for 2 years like I have with milo is you tend to get alot of nice toys for that char). If i get agroe and don't want it I can turtle up for 50 + ac and shield block and if group is getting swarmed I can wade in twf with my rapiers or vorpal/paralyzing combo easily keeping 2 - 3 mobs paralyzed while waiting for my 20. Then I can also top off hps with my 48 - 64 hp CSW with my 589 sp mana pool.

It is just there is a time and place for each type of fighting and takes a good/experienced person to know when to do what and that goes for every class not just ranger. This is just more noticable with a ranger because there are so many ways a ranger can be played and so many misconceptions on what a ranger can and can not do.

Milolyen

[QuantumFX]

Puke: The reason rangers like to be asked for barkskins is because of the prevaling "AC doesn't matter" attitude of some players. Why should I bother tossing a 25 minute barkskin on the dress wearing THF barbarella with the 20 AC? If it's a M/c build with 11 levels of ranger then they also have to worry about madstone rage overwriting barkskin. If AC matters to your character I'm happy to toss out that 25 minute barkskin. If the rangers in your example wouldn't give you a barkskin after you asked for one then I could see a problem. :)

Straken: May I make a better suggestion for you for a l2 spell in the shroud. Protection from energy. Nothing says "I love my cleric" like refreshing the Protections on the main tanks in part 4. (The same goes for paladins.) Also, a lot of the damage is scaled up in the shroud that resist energy is less useful. Non extended protections will mitigate a lot of damage. Since buffing time is limited and it's cheaper for you to cast you'll see more disco balls/hastes/recitations go up.

Reisz: Strawman arguments don't help. It's a simple resource management issue not a control issue.

[ChildrenofBodom]

First of all, if there are people that don't like rangers in the shroud, they are pure idiots.

Anyways..

My main is a ranger, I never pass out barkskin. 99% of the time it's a waste of mana. Very few people go the AC route anymore, and I don't blame them, in most cases it's pointless. I will GLADLY give them barkskin if someone asks for it, no problem. Pretty sure the robe-wearing barbarian doesn't need a bark.

[esoitl]

as for the original topic at hand - i always buff everyone

i try to hit resists as well to save the cleric/arcanes SP for more important things
i keep jump loaded as well as CLW and CMW with wands to help out healing too


i run a ranged ranger(HAHA one of the few i know) and actually have a decent ammount of SP which is always gone by the time i shrine or else it gets spent before shrine

there was a time when Rangers were thought to be useless but that feeling is mostly gone now, some people still don't realize the actual power of a ranger though and won't post for them which is a shame

[Drekisen]

Having played all classes, I know for certain that unless ur build has a substantial AC to begin with, casting Barkskin is a waste of mana. I would only cast Barkskin on other rangers, fighters, paladins, barbarians (depending on thier build), and clerics, and probably rogues as well. I would definately ask rangers, rogues, and babrarians if they have good AC's already, where as the Clerics, Paladins and Fighters would automatically just get it. Casting on any other class in most cases is a waste. +5 to thier already low AC's is going to make absolutely no difference at all, especially somewhere like the Shroud.
Now elemental resists, that is a different story, wanna save the arcanes and clerics some mana, there u go.

[~True_Knight]

My main is a ranger and I will give out Bark if asked. Sometimes I will ask if anyone wants it...sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Oh, and I never have a problem finding a group, so I don't see that most groups don't want rangers.

[Vengenance]

I rarely cast out bark on people unless someone asks or I see that they're using a shield. I never cast bark on casters (clerics are the exception) or barbarians, their AC is way too low to make a difference at low level and I need those sp for self buffs.

I will however usually cast FOM or resists on party members to save the cleric some mana.

[Milolyen]

On Khyber? All I play are Rangers and I will sit for hours waiting for an invite to a Shroud group. I am telling you and I have the experience, it is rare that anyone will let a Ranger into their Shroud group on Khyber. Let me be more clear though, pure Ranger. None of this 10Ftr/4Rgr/2Rogue stuff.

600 SP is a LOT. You have no reason whatsoever to be miserly with your Barkskin. I have about 350'ish SP and I can hit the entire twelve people with Barkskin and have plenty to buff myself with everything I need from my own spell selection and still have mana to spare. And the resources for more SP are plentiful (shrines, trees, water, etc.)

But point is, many of you do Barkskin others even if maybe it's restricted to only melees. I experienced a group with two Rangers who didn't drop a single SP on others and who, in fact, would Shrine with more than half their mana bar and still not throw anything out to help the group.

And I bet you guys think I'm joking about switching to a new server. I am seriously contemplating it. That's how bad it is for my Rangers (at least) on Khyber. I'm sick of it. Shoot, it's gotten to where I pitch and moan all the time in guild-chat about it and I bet they are sick of hearing me go on about it.

edit: and it's also why, as of today, I plan to let my account expire in August. I do not find it enjoyable spending more time trying to find a group than I do actually playing in group.

Well I would suggest switching servers then. I know on Argo almost all pug shroud runs will have atleast 2 rangers in it. Have seen a alot restrict the lfm to ranger/cleric only and several times had seen it restricted to ranger only. For awhile there I was also getting 2 to 3 tells every time I would log in asking if I wanted to run shroud.

Milolyen

[barecm]

I try to give it out as much as possible and to whom it makes a difference (melee and cleric types etc). If casters ask I will, but its a waste IMHO. I don't for other rangers as they should have it.

[jmonty]

i almost always have a magi item on before the quest, so i just pass out barkskin and swap it out.

[Strakeln]

A TWF ranger with the right FE is a beast in the shroud, a Pure dex bow ranger with the wrong FE is gimpy well purty much everywere the problem is telling them apart if you don't know them, sadly khyber has a history have havign a LOT of HORRABLE rangers...I think you need to re-examine your stance on the pure dex ranger (with/without the "right" FE), especially considering your character list.

I realize you said "pure dex bow ranger", but with the exception of Tempest enhancement, a "pure dex bow ranger" is pretty much the same thing as a "pure dex ranger".

Edit: can't believe I didn't mention this initially: you should really check out what a shroud run is like when rangers are using bows. The best position to check this out from would be the cleric position...

[Milolyen]

I think you need to re-examine your stance on the pure dex ranger (with/without the "right" FE), especially considering your character list.

I realize you said "pure dex bow ranger", but with the exception of Tempest enhancement, a "pure dex bow ranger" is pretty much the same thing as a "pure dex ranger".

Edit: can't believe I didn't mention this initially: you should really check out what a shroud run is like when rangers are using bows. The best position to check this out from would be the cleric position...

Agreed. When in shroud on my cleric ... I cringe if I see a melee heavy group. I know if I see a ranger in there that that should be atleast one char I don't have to worry about healing. Unless roaming in the first part or they are a TWF "beast" build in part 4 and 5, they are a low maintanence/high dps char.

Milolyen

[Puke]

Puke: The reason rangers like to be asked for barkskins is because of the prevaling "AC doesn't matter" attitude of some players. Why should I bother tossing a 25 minute barkskin on the dress wearing THF barbarella with the 20 AC? If it's a M/c build with 11 levels of ranger then they also have to worry about madstone rage overwriting barkskin. If AC matters to your character I'm happy to toss out that 25 minute barkskin. If the rangers in your example wouldn't give you a barkskin after you asked for one then I could see a problem. :)
Now, that does make some sense to me; though, I don't really agree with it. I will always think that an additional five points to Armor Class will be of help to at least some fights in that 10-16 minutes that it lasts. But the reason makes some sense to me how some would see it that way, like I said.



Again though, no one actually asked for a Barkskin in my particular example and so maybe people don't really care about it. But I kind of doubt that. I always Barkskin the entire party initially and there is always someone giving me a thank-you for it. Still, before entering Shroud2 and if you still have 75% of your mana bar, I don't see a big deal in just playing it safe and throwing out a few Barks and THEN shrining. Don't just throw your SP away! It might help and it might not, but it's not loss of SP. But to each his own.

Now why I started this thread is I wanted to see the consensus from the other Rangers. I pretty much only play a Ranger with an occasional Fighter. (I deleted my caster and Barbarian and now only have three Rangers and one Fighter in my stable. BTW, my Fighter was capped at 14 just one-week after Gianthold was introduced and he's currently only 15h-level which shows how little I play him...I'm all Ranger, baby!) And since there is some clear Ranger-hate by many at least on my server, it's rare I'm in a group with a 2nd Ranger and so I do not get to see others' play styles. I have not counted the replies in this thread, but it seems about half Bark when asked but not necessarily automatically.

As far as Camouflage, that is a spell only needed in very specific situations. May as well just carry a couple Camouflage scrolls and switch that out of your spell slot. Shoot, my Ranger has no problem sneaking/hiding as it is and he doesn't put any Feats or Enhancements into it. CSW potions, wands and scrolls will get you through most tight situations too.

I will seriously consider looking into switching servers. For the past month or two I have been planning on letting my account expire but this has the possibility of changing that plan.

[edit: $100 to transfer my four characters to a new server. That seems pretty steep.]

[Puke]

Edit: can't believe I didn't mention this initially: you should really check out what a shroud run is like when rangers are using bows. The best position to check this out from would be the cleric position...

Shroud 4 and 5, yep! I agree with you there.

I love the Ranger, but am kind of anti-bow. It's too slow and monsters come up on you too fast in most quests and you get a -4 to your AC when wielding a bow when a monster swings at you and it's just too slow switching to melee weapons. In fact, my regular Ranger didn't even have the Improved Crit:Range feat but I found out he was certainly doing a gob of damage in Shroud4 and 5 and I never took a lick of damage until I stepped in to fight the Devils that spawn dual wielding my vorpals. Otherwise, Manyshot with the right FEs and Feats and it's gorgeous. Since then, my regular Ranger switched a feat back to IC:Range. Funny thing is, my one and only Shroud completion had me getting the last hit and kill on Big Red. I know it's just luck being the last to hit him, but it was me, the Ranger most people don't want.

I really only melee in the other Shroud quests and most of the time in all other quests unless it's a monster or mob that is up on some cliff and safely away and then it's Manyshot time.

Oh, and also in Sleeping Dust. I go archery there until you get to areas where there are no spiders. Turning off Improved Precise Shot allows me to use my Precise Shot and I only target the Ogres and Magi and I will never hit a spider no matter who is first in th path of my arrow. I usually do stat (curse or paralyzing) there though. One thing I noticed though is you have to be careful because if your target is killed by Finger of Death right as you shoot, your arrow is going to hit whatever else is in its path and if you pop on Manyshot and there is a spider there, watch out. The only time I got the extra chest in this quest is when we only had one Fighter and emphasized he should shield block more and seldom swung his sword around.

[Strakeln]

The only time I got the extra chest in this quest is when we only had one Fighter and emphasized he should shield block more and seldom swung his sword around.You do know there are TWO extra chests, right?

[RazorrX]

First thing I do in a quest is to ask who wants barkskin. Then I ask if anyone needs resists, prots or freedom of movement. I tend to keep Bark, Ram, Wild Instincts and FOM on me all the time.

[Puke]

You do know there are TWO extra chests, right?

Four chests. I'm talking about the one you get when you do not kill any spiders.

[Strakeln]

Four chests. I'm talking about the one you get when you do not kill any spiders.Four? Are you counting the one in the queen's nest?

[Mad_Bombardier]

Four? Are you counting the one in the queen's nest?It's a wooden box with metal strappings and a hinged lid, which may or may not contain good loot... So, yes. ;)

[Xithos]

I shake my head and laugh when I am on my sorceror and a Ranger hits me with a barskin; the difference between 20AC and 25AC is non-existant at end game. However, I do try to find out what kinds of builds have a meaningful AC when pugging and I am more than happy to apply a barkskin to those folks. In addition, your friendly neighborhood barbarian wearing a fearsome robe or what have you would be better off if you used those spell points to drop a small heal on him. Moral of the story: AC is only useful within a certain range and although it works on my build and a few others in most situations, a lot of people have decided to punt on that defensive front and are better served getting displaced/blurred/stoneskinned, etc. Not that there is anything wrong with the robe-wearing barb or fighter, but it is just how the metagame has panned out.

[jjflanigan]

I normally toss barkskin on any melee types that I see wearing armor and a shield automatically. Anyone else will get it if they ask.

I also always, and I do mean always, cast merfolk's blessing right before starting phase 1 of the Shroud. If you don't understand why it helps, try it sometime.

[Tharris]

I made my Ranger into an Arcane Archer, and took a Wiz level to do it.

I got the Enstend feat for free, so I toss out Barks and FoM for 30 minute durations, and have enough SP's left to do the same to myself, plus Wild Instincts, Rams, and resists. Then I pull out my arcane wands and keep buffing. I can fill half the screen with buffs all by my lonesome.

[Strakeln]

It's a wooden box with metal strappings and a hinged lid, which may or may not contain good loot... So, yes. ;)Right, was just checking to make sure there wasn't a way to make 4 chests appear in the last room. I like rooms filled with chests.

[Yaga_Nub]

I have several rangers and it really just depends on my mood. If I'm feeling generous I'll pass out BS and resists without a thought. If not then I do it when asked unless I'm below 100 sp. If I'm below 100 sp and not close to a shrine, I keep those sp for CSW.

On another note, I've been playing for two years now and the only time that I've ever been denied a group is when they were looking for a cleric or a caster and I tried to talk the party leader into letting me join anyway. Rangers have never had a grouping problem. Certain people that play rangers have.

[Borror0]

Part of my sorcerer's bio: Note that Barkskin is a waste on a 10 AC, don't cast it on me unless you feel better looking at me all in brown.

However, my tank loves to have barksin.

If I'd be a ranger, anythnig with a weapon in each hand, or a greataxe and casters (clerics included) would not receive a barkskin. Anything with a shield would. If you've not been casted barkskin on and you feel you need, it'd be your duty to ask for it. Anything under 45 unbuffed AC is not worth being Barkskin on, in the Shroud.

[Mad_Bombardier]

I normally toss barkskin on any melee types that I see wearing armor and a shield automatically. Anyone else will get it if they ask.

I also always, and I do mean always, cast merfolk's blessing right before starting phase 1 of the Shroud. If you don't understand why it helps, try it sometime.The first is sound advice for any friendly buffing Ranger.

The second, well... I'm stumped! :p

[Mad_Bombardier]

Right, was just checking to make sure there wasn't a way to make 4 chests appear in the last room. I like rooms filled with chests.hehe, who doesn't like chests... make that chests AND booty! Yaaaarrrr!

[dragonoffrost]

I just reached level 12 on him last night.

I always barkskin and cast what resists on all party members I can leaving enough mana to make sure I can bark/resist and rams might myself. Then i swap from magi item to two long swords and wade deep into the battle.

I was main tank in 2 GH quests (cabal I was level 11 and trial i was level 12) last night with little issue. I just turned into a whirling blade at every door and let the arcanes and clerics hit from behind me as I spun and dealt death with my swords. I may not have been the ultimate tank but the job got done.

If he needs to use a bow he can but he's an elf built to run a long sword through the enemy's gut.

[Thrudh]

First off, I always cast barkskin on everyone but the wiz/sorcs. This is a habit from the day I made 8th level ranger, and COULD cast barkskins.. I love VISIBLY helping the party this way... so they say to themselves "Ah, cool... glad we have a ranger".. and yeah, maybe they don't all need it, but invariably one or two do...

I also ask if anyone needs resists (I don't automatically cast this on everyone). I have lots of SP (521), but I can self-cast displacement (11/5 ranger/wizard), so I like to save some for myself.

Second, any ranger who isn't using a bow on the Pit Fiend in Part 4-5 of the shroud is a moron... Get a silver bow or a decent Holy bow. a bunch of silver arrows, and go to town on him!

Manyshot works perfectly in Part 4... The Pit Fiend appears, you take a couple of shots, turn on manyshot, do some great DPS without taking ANY damage at all... the Pit Fiend disappears, you're back to TWFing the devils... and when the Pit Fiend comes back, your manyshot timer has reset!! It works out perfectly... I guarentee that during the minute the Pit Fiend is fighting in the middle, the rangers are doing nearly as much DPS (if not more) as the fighters in the middle, and the rangers don't require ANY healing... We evade the blades, we bypass the Pit Fiend's DR easily (very easy to find a good Holy bow and use silver arrows, as opposed to finding a good weapon that is both silver and Holy/pure good), and we're using manyshot for 20 out of the 60 seconds the Pit Fiend is reachable.

Silver bow or Tier II Pos/Pos Shroud bow, Improved Crit: Ranged, Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider, Manyshot, Bow Strength...

Rangers kick @SS againt the Pit Fiend while ranging.

[Slap_Happy]

Am I off base, or do we need to ask fighters and barbarians to swing their weapons too?

you are way off based that makes it sound like they are there just to barkskin people and to be honest ill barkskin whoever asks but i like to save some mana so i can make sure i have enough to cast rams might on myself when it runs out. This whole thing reminds me of the arguement that the cleric should have to heal everyone all the time. People need to relize that taking care of thereself is what they shoudl be worried about not hey what can u do for me.

[Ree]

Just a short somewhat amusing barkskin story...

We were doing guild encounter area stuff and had just moved on from the orchard to gianthold. We had one (extremely excellent!) ranger with us, and he buffed us all up, with the exception of casting barksin on the cleric. The cleric pointed out that it should be obvious from the armor equipped (black dragon plate) and big ugly shield (whatever that reaver shield is) that he would like barkskin cast on him.

Well.

This resulted in much taunting and general sillyness from the ranger (remember this was a guild group just messing around in encounter areas) who still didn't cast BS on the cleric.

So.

The cleric dispelled this silly ranger, much to the delight of everyone (with the exception of the ranger)!

So I suppose the moral of the story is that some people just take their bark skin very seriously :)

[Thrudh]

I always cast barkskin and jump on the cleric... Nothing makes a cleric love you more than jump :)

[Strakeln]

Sorta OT, but the story above reminded me of this:

The other day, I was running Dust in a PUG that Shade was leading. At one point, I cast displacement on him, which he didn't like very much (was trying to get SP with torq). He lightly complained about it.

So I threw a greater dispel on him :D

I'm not thinking he thought it was as funny as I did :D

[Solmage]

Did anyone ask for a barkskin?

Although it is nice to it as a matter of course, some players do not hand out certain buffs unless asked.

Bingo.

Sometimes, I'll actually remember. Ask me, and I'll be glad to give it. Make a stup..endous 'comment' such as 'three rangers and noone has f* given me any barkskin?! what the f* do I need to do to get a barkskin here?!' and you'll be certain to not get one from me.

[Arianrhod]

I've stopped asking who needs what buffs. Most of the time, no one answers anyway....only to make it all too obvious later that they really could have used some buffs, but just didn't bother saying so. Instead, I just cast everything at the entrance, till the blue bar is empty. It's kind of random, but at least no one asks me to cast any later (only rgr 9 now, btw. This policy will likely change once I can cast a more useful cure than CLW).

[totmacher]

BUFFS! bahahaha surely you must be kidding sir

I'm here to shoot things between the eyeballs :D

[Osharan_Tregarth]

I've stopped asking who needs what buffs. Most of the time, no one answers anyway....only to make it all too obvious later that they really could have used some buffs, but just didn't bother saying so. Instead, I just cast everything at the entrance, till the blue bar is empty. It's kind of random, but at least no one asks me to cast any later (only rgr 9 now, btw. This policy will likely change once I can cast a more useful cure than CLW).

Heh.. I will ask at the beginning who needs resists, and then when they don't respond.... Wait until they nearly wipe because four people didn't have resists up. Then, I ask again, with that "oh so smug" tone in my voice, that makes me so many friends....


Back to the original post about barkskin, I'll automatically barkskin anyone who carries a shield, and I'll barkskin anyone who I know cares what their armor class is. Then I'll ask who else wants a barkskin.

[Westerner]

Nothing makes a cleric love you more than jump :)
QFT. Casting jump on the cleric is a very good investment of SP. :)

[Strakeln]

QFT. Casting jump on the cleric is a very good investment of SP. :)If I can cast jump, it goes to every party member except other casters (if they don't have it prep'd, they evidently don't need it :D)

[Ikuryo]

After going arcane on my ranger I have 572sp. As a result I'll Bark EVERYONE in the shroud raid. It hardly does a dent to my sp supply. I also cast jump on clerics and the random fighter if I think they might need it. I'll throw out resists and protect when I deem it needed and will FoM the cleric and casters if I see an earth elemental around. Nothing ends a fight faster then the cleric getting grabbed while the tanks are in need of a heal. I routinely cast Bark, jump, FoM, ram's, and wild sense on myself when I start into a quest unless I know I'll be dispelled shortly. (Part 3)

Even with all the buffs I throw out in shroud I still sit with over half my sp bar free for heals. I'll heal myself and anyone that I deem in danger of falling. The clerics are normally a good choice as they sometimes pay more attention to the rest of the party and don't notice their current HPs. I have the quick draw feat and the club from the invasion token turn in and my heals do 40-60 and crit for about 100 or so. Actually I don't always buff before shrining in the shroud. If I go near to buff people the arcanes start throwing everything on me and I lose them as soon as I shrine back up.

As a ranger is also comforting to be surrounded by all that bark.. makes me feel like I'm in the woods once more. :rolleyes:

If you are having that much trouble on Kyhber getting a group as a ranger feel free to join us on Sarlona. The 11 ranger 1 bard shroud runs are great. Everyone is friendly and helpful in them, we heal ourselves or each other as we see the need. One ranger actually went afk during part 4 and was close to dieing, several of us went out and found him and healed him up to full. At the end of the fight He was still standing there afk for several minutes before coming back and finding himself alive. The only one that routinely dies in the ranger raids in the bard, he got taken out first time big red showed up. It was one of the fastest part 1s I have been in. The portals literally popped as soon as we reached them.

[redoubt]

Puke: The reason rangers like to be asked for barkskins is because of the prevaling "AC doesn't matter" attitude of some players. Why should I bother tossing a 25 minute barkskin on the dress wearing THF barbarella with the 20 AC? If it's a M/c build with 11 levels of ranger then they also have to worry about madstone rage overwriting barkskin. If AC matters to your character I'm happy to toss out that 25 minute barkskin. If the rangers in your example wouldn't give you a barkskin after you asked for one then I could see a problem. :)
It's a simple resource management issue not a control issue.

What he said.

I'll often take a middle road position. I'll cast on melees and clerics (like to have the clerics happy) and ask the robe wearer if they want it.

[Elleron]

I have 2 rangers a strength and a wannabe tempest(11th level-will get tempest @12).

I always cast barkskin on the melee's or everyone if b4 a boss fight - i carry a magi item(robe or item) to use those 100 points b4 I put on my regular stuff to fight - that way I can get the whole party with buffs.

That gives me enough to rebuff and keep my 3 main spells active (barkskin, rams and instinct)

[Puke]

Very interesting replies from everyone. I can understand we all have our different viewpoints and thus play styles and I can respect that.

I don't agree with the Armor Class doesn't matter viewpoint. In general, with most players, it should help at least a little.

I will cast Barkskin in the very beginning onto the casters but they are the first to be dropped in the que when I'm low on spell points and rebuffing everyone. There's usually only one or two casters in the group and fifteen or thirty spell points is no big deal to me and so I just do it automatically instead of interrupting the calls from other players to the casters and Cleric for the buffs from them. Also, hopefully the caster realizes I have his best interest in mind and he's more apt and happy to toss me a blur or some other goody.

I try to never throw away spell points. If I'm about to shrine and have some blue left, I will throw out whatever to those who are not shrining or who already have whether the buff will help or not. It's kind of a pain standing there waiting for everyone to decide to shrine or not but I don't feel right throwing away those spell points.

It sounds like I differ from most in that I don't really dip into my spell points for self-heals. I will click on either a wand, potion or a scroll for a Cure Serious Wound.

It must be rare that I actually ever run out of spell points because I've accumulated so many Mnemonic potions and they keep growing every week. And since I don't really ever have spell point emergencies, maybe that's why I'm more apt to throw Barkskin on everyone, even if the caster needs it or not.


Oh, Ikuryo, I wish I could change servers but at $25 per character (I have four, three Rangers and one Fighter), I just can't see spending $100 on changing to a new server and risk finding out things are misstated or not. I pay yearly in advance, but I think $25 is more than the monthly subscription and that seems a bit wrong to me. Now that I think of it, maybe it's that high to keep people from bouncing their characters around from server to server.