Adjust the ****ing drop rates

[spyderwolf]

just completed 80th titan raid....belt has never dropped for anyone in the aprty not jsut me on any of thsoe 80 raids and on 3 end reward lists the titan belt hasnt been there either....80 runs and 3 end rewards is jsut ****ing ******** for not seeing a specific item drop 1 time for anyone in party. and for anyone who has a witty response you go do 80 ****ing raids ..thats 12 months of raiding one quest and then you say how fair it is with drop rates :)

[brshelton]

its so the clerics dont have 30 more hp to heal on also :D

[spyderwolf]

do you jsut watch the forums sergod? go run a quest man and stop trolling so **** much

[Warrax23]

That's pretty much Bs, the loot change was to HELP people get raid items but this is poo. 80 runs that's just ********... the end loot HAS to be changed for 20 runs... make it so whatever you've gotten doesn't show up... jesus... 80 runs.... on 1 char...

[brshelton]

do you jsut watch the forums sergod? go run a quest man and stop trolling so **** much

i do it while I'm dead lol and right before I log on and off

[Tanka]

That's pretty much Bs, the loot change was to HELP people get raid items but this is poo. 80 runs that's just ********... the end loot HAS to be changed for 20 runs... make it so whatever you've gotten doesn't show up... jesus... 80 runs.... on 1 char...
I got mine on Honos on my 20th reward.

Didn't get it on Tanka.

It's rarer, but that doesn't mean its drop rate isn't horribly skewed.

[jjflanigan]

It's random. It's luck. Whatever you want to call it -- I've gotten the belt on 3 of my characters and many of my guildies have also gotten it.

Sorry you have bad luck at the rolls, but the drop rate is fine.

*EDIT*

And for clarification -- I do not have over 11 titan runs on any of my characters

[Eudimio]

Yep, belt of brute strength is very shy these days. I stopped doing the titan raid after my blank on my 40th completion. I have since restarted :(. It has been the one constant complaints about 20th completions. I'd like to think it's randomness, but I don't hear the same things about chattering rings and such.

Good Luck.

[Jondallar]

Reminds me of mod 1 when the dragon belt would never ever drop, or the dang cleric helm...lots of dual ruby guantlets though

[Warrax23]

Sorry but 80x12+4 should drop ANY raid item at least once. Since there is no LUCK because it doesn't exist in comupter games, since everything is ran by an algorythm. Something is wrong with the raid loot tables the 1-4 elite we were told is a lie I've personally ran over 100 raids since this came out and I have pulled 3 raid items that's 3% a LONG way from 25%

Nice try, but I'd rather have the 2 guarenteed items back....

[query]

but I'm only on my...28'th run. I could not play as much and that was my year of play too. My luck on other raids and items is mixed so I'll stop there.

[jjflanigan]

Sorry but 80x12+4 should drop ANY raid item at least once. Since there is no LUCK because it doesn't exist in comupter games, since everything is ran by an algorythm. Something is wrong with the raid loot tables the 1-4 elite we were told is a lie I've personally ran over 100 raids since this came out and I have pulled 3 raid items that's 3% a LONG way from 25%

Nice try, but I'd rather have the 2 guarenteed items back....

When I see numbers like this I always have to call BS. 3 items total out of 100 runs is OBVIOUSLY exaggerated to try to make your point. Just because you get raid items you don't want or need doesn't mean they don't count.

[Warrax23]

You wanna call bs fine, come raid with me. I've only pulled 4 vorpals and I've played since beta and loot run all the time. Ask anyone that knows me.

[query]

so don't discount his claim either.

[jjflanigan]

You wanna call bs fine, come raid with me. I've only pulled 4 vorpals and I've played since beta and loot run all the time. Ask anyone that knows me.

Well, if it's true that out of 100 raids you've pulled 3 raid items TOTAL (including giving things away and what-not) then I apologize for disbelieving. But every other person who's posted things like that has been exaggerating to some extent or another so I assumed.

I know people can have horrible luck. I was the one with over 200 turn ins of the whisperdoom collectible items without ever getting a single one of the named items. I even documented every single turn in with a screenshot of the reward list to show how insane it was and to prove that I was getting horrible loot.

That having been said, 1 or 2 people having horrible luck at getting raid items doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the distribution if there are other people that are constantly getting raid loot (which there are). It just means some people are having bad luck and others are having good luck...which is always going to happen with randomly generated loot.

[spyderwolf]

It's random. It's luck. Whatever you want to call it -- I've gotten the belt on 3 of my characters and many of my guildies have also gotten it.

Sorry you have bad luck at the rolls, but the drop rate is fine.

*EDIT*

And for clarification -- I do not have over 11 titan runs on any of my characters

i have it on my fighter and barb.....the 80 runs is just on my paladin. thats a solid year it has never dropped for one character..thats not luck.

[Warrax23]

well I'm sure there are people out there that have pulled like 45 out of 100, just not me... the only raid items I get are given to me. I've actually pulled 3 myself. I have like no luck in pulls... I almost died when I got a +2 tome out of an end reward the other day. I save my pennies and have to buy what I need.

[gunhoe]

When I see numbers like this I always have to call BS. 3 items total out of 100 runs is OBVIOUSLY exaggerated to try to make your point. Just because you get raid items you don't want or need doesn't mean they don't count.

I haven't counted, but I know I've personally only pulled about 3 raid items since they changed it. Between my toons I probably have run about since then ( and that's low because I took about 3 months off).

[Deriaz]

i have it on my fighter and barb.....the 80 runs is just on my paladin. thats a solid year it has never dropped for one character..thats not luck.

Assuming each item/tome is independent (Pulling one item doesn't raise the probability of another dropping, which is how I know understand it works). . . That's luck. That's statistics. Just because an item has "x" chance of dropping doesn't mean there isn't a variability to it dropping.

Assume it drops 10% of the time (Before you say anything. . . Yes, I know. . . It probably isn't even close.). You can get people whose luck leads them to believe it drops 15% of the time. Others will get it to drop 5% of the time. . . Even further still, you can get outliers, meaning that your luck/roll falls outside the expected spread.

If it isn't luck, then I dunno what you call it. There's a random chance for items to fall, some get them more than others. . . It sounds like luck to me. You might have terrible luck, but that doesn't disprove the fact that it's still a probability, and it's still luck. (Another example: Cards. You play for a year, never had a Royal Flush. Another person comes along, gets it in 4 hands. It's all luck.)

Least, that's my view on it.

-D

[Whippy]

I haven't run titan that much, think my ranger is at the highest count at 12, so can't say how bad the drop rate is, but from what I have seen its not that bad... sorry for your bad luck OP, i feel the same about reaver with over 180 runs in between characters and a distinct lack of +3 tomes... 1 to be exact, +3 cha on my pure fighter... awesome LOL.

I got my pali titan ready last week and ran the raid on the weekend, so her first time, and the belt dropped for her, so I was insanely happy. Also have it on my fighter who has only got about 6 titan runs in. I also know of a couple of guildies who have it. Again sorry for your bad luck, I feel your pain, but I can assure you it is dropping.

[Strakeln]

Yep, belt of brute strength is very shy these days. I stopped doing the titan raid after my blank on my 40th completion. I have since restarted :(. It has been the one constant complaints about 20th completions. I'd like to think it's randomness, but I don't hear the same things about chattering rings and such.Ahem. The titan is like my ranger's boyfriend, afraid to commit and give her a ring.

Give me my ring.

I want it now.

[LOUDRampart]

I've sorta given up on raids. I have NEVER pulled a raid loot item on any of my characters. Of course I don't raid every day or even once a week but still I've done most of the raids at least a few times now and never got a raid item. Seems no matter how anyone wants to justify the drop rate, it just doesn't seem right.

So my solution... when I cap a character, I start building another. And now I'm on my final class... well at least until Monks come out. :) After I cap out a monk, I'm not sure what I'm going to do...

[noneou]

bad drop rates = DDO grind

they want you to keep going for it over and over and not get it

please enjoy your +3 shortsword of utter worthlessness

that will be $15 please

j/k j/k sorta

80 runs and no joy? man that is messed up, some bad dice there bro

[query]

never got big ticket really on Titan, yet got the Gyroscopic boots the second raid try. I have both the Jerkey and the Staff of Arcane Power (the latter given to me actually for once winning a roll off) from DQ. And while I have no tome or a certain cloud weapon, I have pulled almost every other raid item in Reaver. Can't find anybody to pre-raid the Abbot, and I got one item in VON: Vellah's necklace. And tempest...I get nice items....not able to be used by that class at all.


But to answer the OP and Der's postings, they need to adjust the standard deviation to a more narrow level of possible high end of the curve percentages.


Luck is luck, but statistics are also skewed based on other so called 'random" factors that may affect certain accounts more than others even with a so called "randomizer' which is really just a very very detailed logic program. Heck, even chaos has certain patterns of repeating as "Random" as people thing chaotic selection is. That is the "Dummy's Guide to Chaos Theory" for you all, no charge.


So, to summarize, perhaps an investigation on this instance's treasure tables' algorithms is in order?

[Kargon]

Kargon just pull the titan belt 20 miniminutes ago. Maybe because kargon score actuamal kill on titan, maybe because kargon opened loot chest first, maybe because 12 runs are kargon lucky numbamer, maybe because kargon leading party, maybe because Kargon just win at life ;)

<_<

>_>

*runs from angry mob trying steal kargon belt*

[query]

even the end chest is afraid to anger Kargon :D

[jkm]

When I see numbers like this I always have to call BS. 3 items total out of 100 runs is OBVIOUSLY exaggerated to try to make your point. Just because you get raid items you don't want or need doesn't mean they don't count.

i've been running solo elite reaver raids to try to figure out the drop rate and while i agree that is exagerated, the numbers i've compiled thus far are, um, unsettling.

27 raids ran
4 raid loot drops (told you it would drop on the next one qwijy)

current streak: 1 run(s) with
longest streak no loot: 13 (6,3,1)
longest streak loot: 1 (1,1,1)

[Vhlad]

i've been running solo elite reaver raids to try to figure out the drop rate and while i agree that is exagerated, the numbers i've compiled thus far are, um, unsettling.

27 raids ran
4 raid loot drops (told you it would drop on the next one qwijy)

current streak: 1 run(s) with
longest streak no loot: 13 (6,3,1)
longest streak loot: 1 (1,1,1)

Gotta love how pre mod 5 that would have been 54 drops. (An increase of 1350&#37;)

Just the thought of re-rolling a new toon and grinding out 60 of each raid again (and possibly still not getting what I'm looking for!) is just urgh. What a waste of time.

Anyway, what you got is pretty close to the 1/6 chance. Anything based on a random chance will have a distribution curve. The chance to get nothing is (5/6)^#runs.
i.e. (5/6)^27 = 0.0072795
In other words 1/137.37 people who do 27 runs get nothing from the chest. How discouraging would it be to be that person, especially if what you're looking for is not in the 20th reward list? Therein lies the problem. The people at the lower end of the distribution curve end up feeling quite sad, and probably just quit DDO. So we keep losing that bottom % as they get fed up. Not good IMO.

A complete list for the 20th reward would make things seem much less dreary.

[spyderwolf]

im not disputing that the belt drops. my fighter and barbarian both have th belt. im saying that more than a year has gone by and the belt hasnt dropped for that toon in any party he has been in. nothing should be on a drop rate that if you farm it for a year , you still dont have it. and having the generated lists at 40 , 60 ,and now 80 not have it is ridiculous. so 32 raids pre mod 5 means : 64 items,48 1/6 chances for an item and 3 basically 50% chances on end rewards at that item and still no item after a year is horse ****.

[jkm]

Gotta love how pre mod 5 that would have been 54 drops. (An increase of 1350%)

Just the thought of re-rolling a new toon and grinding out 60 of each raid again (and possibly still not getting what I'm looking for!) is just urgh. What a waste of time.

Anyway, what you got is pretty close to the 1/6 chance. Anything based on a random chance will have a distribution curve. The chance to get nothing is (5/6)^#runs.
i.e. (5/6)^27 = 0.0072795
In other words 1/137.37 people who do 27 runs get nothing from the chest. How discouraging would it be to be that person, especially if what you're looking for is not in the 20th reward list? Therein lies the problem. The people at the lower end of the distribution curve end up feeling quite sad, and probably just quit DDO. So we keep losing that bottom % as they get fed up. Not good IMO.

A complete list for the 20th reward would make things seem much less dreary.

assuming my pattern doesn't continue and i get 27 more runs without a loot drop, then the reaver is not 1/4 on elite...

[gunhoe]

im not disputing that the belt drops. my fighter and barbarian both have th belt. im saying that more than a year has gone by and the belt hasnt dropped for that toon in any party he has been in. nothing should be on a drop rate that if you farm it for a year , you still dont have it. and having the generated lists at 40 , 60 ,and now 80 not have it is ridiculous. so 32 raids pre mod 5 means : 64 items,48 1/6 chances for an item and 3 basically 50% chances on end rewards at that item and still no item after a year is horse ****.

Spyder also did not mention that our guild still rolls on raid loot, so if it had dropped for *anyone* he would have had a shot at it.

[Vhlad]

im not disputing that the belt drops. my fighter and barbarian both have th belt. im saying that more than a year has gone by and the belt hasnt dropped for that toon in any party he has been in. nothing should be on a drop rate that if you farm it for a year , you still dont have it. and having the generated lists at 40 , 60 ,and now 80 not have it is ridiculous. so 32 raids pre mod 5 means : 64 items,48 1/6 chances for an item and 3 basically 50&#37; chances on end rewards at that item and still no item after a year is horse ****.

Well each item does not have the same chance of dropping. You don't roll randomly and evenly out of all the available raid loots. It's weighted. For example, something like the torc might have a 5% chance to drop out of the pool of raid loot while a choasblade may have a 15% chance. So raid loot has its own distribution curve. That transfers to the 20th reward list too, because the loot in that list is generated by rolling as if you were pulling raid loot out of the chest, but with no chance of doubles.

Again, the drop rate of these items is probably OK, on average. But that is on average. You have a distribution curve, and there WILL be people who are doing raids 40, 60, 80 times ++ and still not finding the item they want (just as there are people who may do under 10 raids and get exactly what they want).

[LOUDRampart]

Spyder also did not mention that our guild still rolls on raid loot, so if it had dropped for *anyone* he would have had a shot at it.

Still roll on raid loot? How 2007 of you :D

[spyderwolf]

Well each item does not have the same chance of dropping. You don't roll randomly and evenly out of all the available raid loots. It's weighted. For example, something like the torc might have a 5% chance to drop out of the pool of raid loot while a choasblade may have a 15% chance. So raid loot has its own distribution curve. That transfers to the 20th reward list too, because the loot in that list is generated by rolling as if you were pulling raid loot out of the chest, but with no chance of doubles.

maybe i missed something and your trying to explain what i missed , but did ya read the title of the post? im sure i said something about adjusting drop rates :)

[JFeenstra]

last 7 titan runs i've done on my caster there has been 0 raid loot drop

and i don't mean just for me

i mean everyone in the party of 12 had no raid loot in the chest

thats 7x12 = 84 possible items dropping

theres no way it's 25% on elite

[Vormaerin]

I thought it was well understood the drop rate on reaver elite was not the full 25%? The Devs said that the rate could increase up to 25% but it wouldn't reach that on the raids that don't scale up in difficulty as much. Reaver clearly has to be the raid they are talking about with that comment.

[Attomic]

i have it on my fighter and barb.....the 80 runs is just on my paladin. thats a solid year it has never dropped for one character..thats not luck.

You obviously haven't seen the way my PnP character makes dice rolls. :D

[Tanka]

theres no way it's 25&#37; on elite
You're right, it isn't (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=1535433&highlight=1%2F4#post1535433).

[aldan]

You wanna call bs fine, come raid with me. I've only pulled 4 vorpals and I've played since beta and loot run all the time. Ask anyone that knows me.

Yeah I am a stranger to fab 5 myself. I seem to pull **** but the other day I got a mask of the royal guard so I guess thats it for a while.

[Rrend]

just completed 80th titan raid....belt has never dropped for anyone in the aprty not jsut me on any of thsoe 80 raids and on 3 end reward lists the titan belt hasnt been there either....80 runs and 3 end rewards is jsut ****ing ******** for not seeing a specific item drop 1 time for anyone in party. and for anyone who has a witty response you go do 80 ****ing raids ..thats 12 months of raiding one quest and then you say how fair it is with drop rates :)

Angry Sypder.

Unclench dude. Your toons are so pimped out what the heck are you all wound up about?

-Rrend

[Aspenor]

The drop rate on the belt is intentionally low...

IMHO the Belt of Brute Strength is more valuable than any +3 tome.

[UriahHeep]

After 80 runs it's unfortunate you didn't get the belt, but it's not entirely impossible just like any odds. Displacement gives you 50% concealment bonus but there is a chance that you will get hit 10 out of 10 times....about 0.1%, but it's still there.

I have no idea what the actual drop rate numbers are for that raid, or any really. There are 16 items that drop in the warded chest so the odds of that particular item dropping are only 6.25%. I believe it has been stated that on the 20 completion only half the items appear: 50%*3 does not equal 100% chance of said item dropping. When you start to add up all those percentages it's truly amazing you haven't won the belt......ouch!

Even the old way of having two items drop still would not have guaranteed you would have recieved the belt. Still would have only been 12.5% of it dropping in each run. Even with 80 runs there is no guarantee it would have dropped. Even if it did drop there would only be a 16.6% chance that you would have won the belt. 1item/6players

The joy of %'s I guess, they add up only to increase a chance but never give certainty. I don't think they need to increase drop rates at all, they seem to be just fine to me. I sure would be curious to know how many multiples of raid items you have out of that raid though...wowzee!

[JFeenstra]

You're right, it isn't (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?p=1535433&highlight=1%2F4#post1535433).

it's not even 1/6 (16.7%)...at that rate we'd have seen ~14 pieces of raid loot for a group of 12 doing 7 runs...we've got 0, unless the next one drops 12 items (not likely) the drop rate is considerably lower, maybe 3-5% on titan

[Aspenor]

After 80 runs it's unfortunate you didn't get the belt, but it's not entirely impossible just like any odds. Displacement gives you 50% concealment bonus but there is a chance that you will get hit 10 out of 10 times....about 0.1%, but it's still there.

I have no idea what the actual drop rate numbers are for that raid, or any really. There are 16 items that drop in the warded chest so the odds of that particular item dropping are only 6.25%. I believe it has been stated that on the 20 completion only half the items appear: 50%*3 does not equal 100% chance of said item dropping. When you start to add up all those percentages it's truly amazing you haven't won the belt......ouch!

Even the old way of having two items drop still would not have guaranteed you would have recieved the belt. Still would have only been 12.5% of it dropping in each run. Even with 80 runs there is no guarantee it would have dropped. Even if it did drop there would only be a 16.6% chance that you would have won the belt. 1item/6players

The joy of %'s I guess, they add up only to increase a chance but never give certainty. I don't think they need to increase drop rates at all, they seem to be just fine to me. I sure would be curious to know how many multiples of raid items you have out of that raid though...wowzee!

FYI there is no way the Belt and some of the other items have the same drop rates.

I imagine the drop rate of the belt of brute strength is approximately the same as the drop rate of individual +3 tomes in the reaver.

[OrganGrinder]

Actually, I agree that it's ridiculous that the belt didn't drop, c'mon devs fix the drop rate ohh..and while your at it, fix the exploit so that we have to always complete the first part of the quest instead of getting to end guy and not getting success. I don't know how many times I have had to not go on a raid because the group wasn't going to finish but instead exploit, at least most groups are up front about it.

[elraido]

It is random. I know guildies that have never seen a dream splitter drop. I have seen it a LOT...I mean a LOT. It took me 20 runs to see a madstone shield...and that was my end reward. Took me till my 40th run to get a +3 tome. I have a freind who has 3 +3 tomes on his toon in around 25 runs.

[Killbilly]

I recently got one of my character's 20th run of the titan. Out of the entire list, there were 7 items I'd have been happy with (belt, gloves, ring, STR, CON, WIS or INT tome). Exactly none of those items dropped. I was upset to say the least.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Still running the Titan in our guild, every Tuesday.
Still not getting any drops.

Last one we ran, granted we shorted it by two or three, but we got one drop, the ring.

Time before that nothing, and the 8 before that maybe a total of four or five items.

I still stand by the claim that the Titans raid drop % is borked.

[Gunga]

just completed 80th titan raid....belt has never dropped for anyone in the aprty not jsut me on any of thsoe 80 raids and on 3 end reward lists the titan belt hasnt been there either....80 runs and 3 end rewards is jsut ****ing ******** for not seeing a specific item drop 1 time for anyone in party. and for anyone who has a witty response you go do 80 ****ing raids ..thats 12 months of raiding one quest and then you say how fair it is with drop rates :)

If this is true, than I think the devs should really look into this. This kind of stuff could get you to stop playing...I'm not sure I even want to keep running for the belt now. If it is currently possible to run a quest 80 times and not get what you're there for, than maybe it's time to introduce a stoploss. Maybe at 40 runs you get a choice of everything?

[Gunga]

I recently got one of my character's 20th run of the titan. Out of the entire list, there were 7 items I'd have been happy with (belt, gloves, ring, STR, CON, WIS or INT tome). Exactly none of those items dropped. I was upset to say the least.

4 of these 7 are really 1.

[Killbilly]

4 of these 7 are really 1.

No, it's possible to have more than 1 tome drop in a single list, which means that each one has an individual chance of dropping.

[Gunga]

No, it's possible to have more than 1 tome drop in a single list, which means that each one has an individual chance of dropping.

Gotcha.

[Kiranselie]

Ive ran 29 titan runs since Mod 5, out of those 29, we've had exactly 15 w/ no drops whatsoever. We always run full, and in those 29 runs, the gloves have dropped 0 times, period. I dont pretend to be a statistic's guru, but that seems a tad bit off from what was advertised when the change was proposed. On a side note, if we have rewards based on class, can we take class into account on 20th raid completion. I mean c'mon the drow pure rogue getting both full plates, and the docent, what gives. Well, at least there are only 11 more runs til i get the ole shaft again.

[Delzon]

In our guild the montra is "It's all about the 20th" because you are really lucky if you can pull anything you want on the 1-19th runs. In fact the 20th is usually a let down too. I am closing in on 60th run on 3 characters and 40th on 3 others for reaver and I honestly don't have high hopes of getting anything I want. It all comes down to risk (time) vs reward, and I think the balance is still lacking. This is why people take "a break" and say they will be back in a few months but another game gets their attentions and they are gone forever. They are tired of trying and getting nothing in return.

What the game needs to do for the 20th reward is look at what raid loot you have gotten or has been traded to you and eliminate it from the list. That way you can get a reward that is equal to the time and effort you have gone through. This might need work if you traded away something that you may want later but at least it is a start.

[spyderwolf]

If this is true, than I think the devs should really look into this. This kind of stuff could get you to stop playing...I'm not sure I even want to keep running for the belt now. If it is currently possible to run a quest 80 times and not get what you're there for, than maybe it's time to introduce a stoploss. Maybe at 40 runs you get a choice of everything?

oh its true log on to sarlona nad ask anyone in caffeine, or basically anyone who has been on sarlona for the past year and a half and has grouped with me .

[spyderwolf]

Angry Sypder.

Unclench dude. Your toons are so pimped out what the heck are you all wound up about?

-Rrend

its the principle i dont even need the **** belt on its it just allows my umd to go from +37 to +42...turbine always does silly **** liek this and then are amazed and have to do free weekends to entice people back cause they alienate they core base.

[Gunga]

oh its true log on to sarlona nad ask anyone in caffeine, or basically anyone who has been on sarlona for the past year and a half and has grouped with me .

I didn't mean to cast doubt, but to motivate the devs to investigate the possibility. I think at some point, it should be 100&#37; possible to get what you want. Make it a crazy high number, but make it possible. It will get me to play more, not make me want to do something else because I can't seem to get an item. I know I ain't doin countless runs per toon.....make it 100% at some point.

[nbhs275]

Im at about 150 pieces of raid loot among my 5 characters i play. About 80 where before the loot changes.

Its all luck. Did a 6 man DQ elite run, and 2 items dropped, but had done a 12 man the 3 days before and 1 dropped. ITs completely random, though for some people, some items drop more. My ranger is at 7 pairs of madstone, with only 21 completions.

[Gunga]

Im at about 150 pieces of raid loot among my 5 characters i play. About 80 where before the loot changes.

Its all luck. Did a 6 man DQ elite run, and 2 items dropped, but had done a 12 man the 3 days before and 1 dropped. ITs completely random, though for some people, some items drop more. My ranger is at 7 pairs of madstone, with only 21 completions.

Just did my 38th reaver and finally got my first pair...I had given up on them. If I had really wanted this piece of gear for my toon, 120 days is a long wait, wouldn't you say?

[redoubt]

It's random. It's luck. Whatever you want to call it -- I've gotten the belt on 3 of my characters and many of my guildies have also gotten it.

Sorry you have bad luck at the rolls, but the drop rate is fine.

*EDIT*

And for clarification -- I do not have over 11 titan runs on any of my characters

Its random and your lucky so it doesn't need to be changed??? Are you kidding? Spyder is not the only person running that quest over and over and not getting the belt and the ring. Those are two of the most sought after items in the game and the titan has horrible loot drop rates.

I mean, seriously, just because some people go to Vegas and leave with more than they went with does not mean that Vegas is not bought and paid for with the money of losers (which vastly outnumber the number of winners.)

Also, if you've never exceeded 11 runs on any character, I question your ability to talk about drop rates. I don't think you have a large enough sample to constructively add to the conversation. But then I'm not a statistician, so what do I know.

Bottom line: I think Spyder is right and the loot drop rate in the Titan is FUBAR. (Yeah, it may not be real difficult for a group of level 16s, but it still takes a long time since you have to through the twighlight forge on the way.)

[redoubt]

When I see numbers like this I always have to call BS. 3 items total out of 100 runs is OBVIOUSLY exaggerated to try to make your point. Just because you get raid items you don't want or need doesn't mean they don't count.

Your experience of being incredibly lucky (you said you were lucky, not me) is coloring your opinion here. Unfortuantely you are the minority here. Most people do not have that luck. I run the titan with lots of people every week who do not have your kind of "luck".

Don't get me started on loot distribution and how to count duplicate items. Can you honestly tell me that you think getting a 4th set of ventilated bracers is just as good as that +3 tome you want? Cause that where that discussion goes...

[Vengenance]

I don't know how rare it is, I've seen it drop in the raid 3 times in about 40 runs between all of my characters and it showed up on my loot list on run 20. My guildie has had an opposite problem with trying to get the chattering ring, the belt has shown up each of his three 20th runs, but the ring has been a no show. I haven't heard of anyone in my guild that is looking for the belt that hasn't had it pop on their 20th run. IMO it's just bad luck. :( I have two other characters that are getting close to twenty as well, but there looking for the gloves and not the belt.

[Twerpp]

How many people here have done hundreds of raid loot rolls /d100,and never rolled 100? I havent. You never got a Titan Belt. Each raid was a chance to get it. You had no better chances to roll it on the 100th raid than you did on the 1st raid.

[redoubt]

How many people here have done hundreds of raid loot rolls /d100,and never rolled 100? I havent. You never got a Titan Belt. Each raid was a chance to get it. You had no better chances to roll it on the 100th raid than you did on the 1st raid.

lol...

Don't need to roll 100 to win...

When you compare the old system to this one... oh my... it becomes a mess.

I do believe that the new system is meeting one of Turbines goals: that is increasing the oportunity for puggers to get into raids. We used to run a lot of raids short manned to increase the odds of getting what we want. (That does not mean I like the change, just that I believe it meets one of Turbines goals.)

As far as the chances of getting an item don't increase with the number of repeats: True.

However, if you ran short man raids in the old system you had much better chances of getting your loot.

[geoffhanna]

I am at somewhere near 40? runs overall, all characters together. I have a grand total one piece of Titan raid loot. I am somewhere around 100 total Reaver runs and I am full up on Reaver raid loot - my Barb still seeking her boots, and of course everyone needs 3 tomes, but I have at least ten pieces of Reaver raid loot. At least.

The Titan effective drop rate seems significantly lower than it is on Reaver.

But to be frank I'm kind of glad its hard. Otherwise, why do it?

[Glenalth]

40th run end reward for me. But I know others that received theirs on their 1st and 2nd runs.

[Drekisen]

or even anywhere near close to malnourishment. You dig for gold yet the apples are falling off the trees hitting u on the head.

[Tanka]

The only thing in Titan that scales on Elite are the WF in the crystal rooms. Nothing else. So of course the drop rate is going to be pretty close to 1/6, if not exactly 1/6.

DQ is close to 1/4, but isn't quite 1/4. Easily 1/5, since I've been in 7-man groups that have gotten 3-4 items each time.

Reaver is a cakewalk now. It's down to an exact science. 1/6 on Elite, easily.

Dragon and Abbot have already been stated as the only two at 1/4. Abbot has yet to be beaten on Elite post-patching (AFAIK -- if anyone wants to provide screenshots feel free to do so). Dragon is consistently beaten on Elite, but obviously 1/4 doesn't mean guaranteed 3 drops. It just means each group member has a 1/4 chance to get raid loot.

[Chelsa]

Come on gang, all the cussing and gloom is getting old. No matter what game you are in, somebody will always get the short end of the straw. It is unfortunate but nothing you can do about it.

If you think somehow its any different in any other game then go read some other forums and you will see similar posts about similar subjects.

*Anybody who has played this game since beta should know that all twinking a toon does is speed up play and allow for smaller groups. Even then, a good player shouldn't need any raid loot to complete any of the quests, even on elite.*

[debo]

well I just did my run #60... and I didn't get a belt in my end reward list either.... and yea I am ****ed.

[Blazer]

The only thing in Titan that scales on Elite are the WF in the crystal rooms. Nothing else. So of course the drop rate is going to be pretty close to 1/6, if not exactly 1/6.

And sometimes you get **** lucky. :D

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w294/kirvan_ddo/4for4Titanelitewxpreport.jpg

[Deriaz]

And sometimes you get **** lucky. :D

Argh! Titanic Docent! *Wishes he was in the picture.* XP

-D

[Strakeln]

And sometimes you get **** lucky. :D

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w294/kirvan_ddo/4for4Titanelitewxpreport.jpgLucky? I see no belt or ring! :p

[Blazer]

Argh! Titanic Docent! *Wishes he was in the picture.* XP

-D

Yeah, our ranger was kinda upset his WF barb was still on timer.

[Blazer]

Lucky? I see no belt or ring! :p

I know, I was aiming for the belt too. Still though, 4 people on elite at an assumed drop rate of 1/6 is what, like 0.08% chance (by my math anyway) for all four people to get an item to drop?

[GlassCannon]

And put them in the garbage. All of the pretty dice the DM keeps in that shiny chrome case.

The loot for 20th completions should NOT be ROLLED but instead LISTED from a STATIC list of ALL possible rewards. Throw the dice away.

[DoctorWhofan]

just completed 80th titan raid....belt has never dropped for anyone in the aprty not jsut me on any of thsoe 80 raids and on 3 end reward lists the titan belt hasnt been there either....80 runs and 3 end rewards is jsut ****ing ******** for not seeing a specific item drop 1 time for anyone in party. and for anyone who has a witty response you go do 80 ****ing raids ..thats 12 months of raiding one quest and then you say how fair it is with drop rates :)

All I can say is, I stopped playing for two months, did a TS run and got two named items and a tome. Me myself and I did. Maybe you have destroyed your loot tables by over running. I dunno about the other party members, though.

[Gunga]

All I can say is, I stopped playing for two months, did a TS run and got two named items and a tome. Me myself and I did. Maybe you have destroyed your loot tables by over running. I dunno about the other party members, though.

Don't think we're quite talking about the same thing. If the loot tables in TS were the same as Titan, even my bard would have the belt.

[Glenalth]

And put them in the garbage. All of the pretty dice the DM keeps in that shiny chrome case.

The loot for 20th completions should NOT be ROLLED but instead LISTED from a STATIC list of ALL possible rewards. Throw the dice away.

But then people would have exactly what they want, and that's not how this game works.

[Rog]

hey man i am feeling your pain i went OVER 60 RUNS ON THE REAVER ON MY BARD LOOKING FOR THE +3 CHAR TOME and on the other hand i went over 40 runs on my rog and got a +3 con +3 dex and a +3 int tome really helped silentfoot stats i think on the 100th run it should be a list of all tomes by that time really what else are you running for p:)
lunarsong

[Hambo]

You wanna call bs fine, come raid with me. I've only pulled 4 vorpals and I've played since beta and loot run all the time. Ask anyone that knows me.

I've played since beta as well, non stop, and have only pulled 1 vorpal... What's your point? :confused:

[debo]

It's just really frustrating...anyone who knows me on Sarlona ... Spyderwolf for that matter also... knows how much we have run the Titan hoping we can get the belt. When you invest that much time and effort into something and fail to land it because of a bad "roll"... it ****es you off...trust me. My ranger has run the titan 40 times... on his 40th run...he didn't get the belt either. I know for every case like me and sypderwolf...there are those that get lucky and get what they want on there first try. Still... I think there should be some ultimate goal .. .say run 50...where the full raid item list is there to prevent these cases. I mean sheesh...50 runs is A LOT of completions... is it really going to be that game breaking ?