Powergamming and D&D

[insania2016]

In pnp we called em 'munchkins'. What do you call them in DDO?

Wouldn't it be interesting if there were an emote command such as /strangle ?

/strangle munchkin ... dude strangles the life out of munchkin in the hopes that they will shutup.

You feel like your more of an NPC in a single player game.

OK done ranting, sorry. More and more this game seems to cater to the powergamers and encourages this behavior. If there were some random elements to quests maybe, bah... who knows.

*flame on!*

[jjflanigan]

Have you tried asking them to stop?

When I get in a PUG I always ask if they want a "guide" or if I should just keep my mouth shut about things. Whichever they choose determines what I do. I'm happy to just tag along and "know my role" but I also don't mind giving tips i.e. "Don't jump on that pillar" - "Watch of for the blade trap to the right" - "Careful of the landmines in this hallway." Try asking them, politely, not to spoil the surprises or what-not and see how it works for ya.

[insania2016]

Works sometimes... They never ask. Of course there's more to the story then what I'm saying but... I like to limit drama ya know?

[DemonMage]

What do you call them in DDO?


Your average MMO player.

[insania2016]

Your average MMO player.

I suppose that's right. ;)

I understand it is a video game and not tabletop but dang, half of the appeal is being able to go through the quests and enjoy the experience (gold) and agony (death traps) of discovery.

I've been playing for a year and I noticed DDO transforming more into a EQ/WoW clone. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but the differences is what prompted me to leave EQ2 and come play DDO over the others.

[EKKM]

Actually powergamers are people that usze the existing rules to achieve the most powerful character possible, generally in on e specific area, ie damage dealing.

A munchkin on the other hand is someone who exploits the rules or ignores certain rules to make better characters. For, example, in PnP the dodge feat only applies to one opponent, but the munchkin will often overlook that unless confronted on it and will then claim they just made a mistake.

I guess in DDO the powergamers would be those that optimize and twink while munchkins would be those that use exploits to enhance their characters on beat quests.

In either version, powergamers don't bother me but munchkins do.

[Yvonne_Blacksword]

...
kill the VC.
Mute my headset.
/squelch
remove my headset.
...
BTW.
Not all powergamers have the power button on on their mouths.
And some of us...fix those that do.

They need a new word. As powergamer means so much more.

Chatterers?

We are speaking of the ones who incessantly discourse their many successes, their uber gear, and what a great player they were in XXX game... Chatter chatter chatter until their words are just a sound effect you wish you could turn off.

I am still waiting for individual party member volume controls...up the important or the shy...down the inconsequential and the rude.

Edit: My bad!!! You mean when the quest is over almost before it is begun. Someone runs ahead on a quick run and finishes it while everyone else is planning, buffing and setting up the best places to fight...and Ta Da...XP gained...Sorry.
I do try to stay with the group...But when they are fighting the mobs I agro'd on purpose to drag them to a good spot instead of the spot they spawn due to the snipers....or they (the mobs) can do me no harm... or it is easier for everyone if I take care of the next ambush... Or my barbarian finds the traps on purpose... or they try to keep up with my bard to slap all the members of the mob I am trying to fascinate so that they can increase their kill count rather than play smart.
Don't know their strengths/weaknesses (my pali can't use CLW wands!). Not take the lead when they don't know the quests or the traps or the ambushes or the maps...

Sorry...I misunderstood...And will politely...sit back...and keep my mouth shut... about that trap... you are about to walk in to.. for the third time today. I believe in allowing everyone to play the way they want to. As long as they only hurt themselves...lol. So...If my Zerg'n self suddenly stops..and madly swings his axe for no apparent reason...Ignore him. As I am definately not trying to warn you about death.

[insania2016]

How about, turd muffins?

Turd Muffin - An annoying mmo player that feels the need to explain every little bit of a quest in detail so as to spoil the fun for other players. A turd muffin will ignore requests to shutup and doesn't have a clue as to whether their "advice" is wanted or not.

[Horrorscope]

More and more this game seems to cater to the powergamers and encourages this behavior. If there were some random elements to quests maybe, bah... who knows.

*flame on!*

Yes it's not perfect but this game still beats all the others I have tried in the grind dept, which is basically what you are saying without using the G-Word. Yes I have shared ways on how to make it better and random elements were one of those things. The devs know, they either will do it or not. Still less grind then the others.

[dragons1ayer74]

...
I am still waiting for individual party member volume controls...up the important or the shy...down the inconsequential and the rude.

This would be a huge boon to the game, I love voice chat but even amoungst our guild we often have players that mics are set too soft (and can't be made louder) or others who are too loud and blast the speakers.

[insania2016]

...
Edit: My bad!!! You mean when the quest is over almost before it is begun. Someone runs ahead on a quick run and finishes it while everyone else is planning, buffing and setting up the best places to fight...and Ta Da...XP gained...Sorry.[/COLOR][/I]
I do try to stay with the group...But when they are fighting the mobs I agro'd on purpose to drag them to a good spot instead of the spot they spawn due to the snipers....or they (the mobs) can do me no harm... or it is easier for everyone if I take care of the next ambush... Or my barbarian finds the traps on purpose... or they try to keep up with my bard to slap all the members of the mob I am trying to fascinate so that they can increase their kill count rather than play smart.
Don't know their strengths/weaknesses (my pali can't use CLW wands!). Not take the lead when they don't know the quests or the traps or the ambushes or the maps...

Sorry...I misunderstood...And will politely...sit back...and keep my mouth shut... about that trap... you are about to walk in to.. for the third time today. I believe in allowing everyone to play the way they want to. As long as they only hurt themselves...lol. So...If my Zerg'n self suddenly stops..and madly swings his axe for no apparent reason...Ignore him. As I am definately not trying to warn you about death.

Actually - no and yes.

I'm talking about the people who point out traps in before the poor rogue has a chance to click on search after making the spot check. That kind of person... or those who feel their strategy is the only one that works when in fact others do work.

If some dork keeps walking into the same trap then there's a point where you say, hey idiot, there's a trap there...

[Staedtler]

How about, turd muffins?

Turd Muffin - An annoying mmo player that feels the need to explain every little bit of a quest in detail so as to spoil the fun for other players. A turd muffin will ignore requests to shutup and doesn't have a clue as to whether their "advice" is wanted or not.

Passive aggressive - a player who gets so worked up about what other people do they ignore the obvious solution (i.e. talk to offending player) and instead choose an obtuse one (i.e. complain on the forums)

[Yvonne_Blacksword]

<snip>
If some dork keeps walking into the same trap then there's a point where you say, hey idiot, there's a trap there...

Actually, when we are all gathered for the rogue to disarm the trap and up walks the guy that has been complaining for the entire quest that we never wait for him so he can heal/buff/etc...and we are all at full HP...because we took care of ourselves...lol...then he keeps going on about how he hates it when everyone runs ahead and then he asks us why we stopped then he walks right into the trap and dies...

Or the one who got mad because I refused his kind offer of a weapon due to my personal
1.) need to familiarize myself with a particular build before twinking it.
2.) Wanting on a new server to see the difficulty for new players to get lowbie gear that gets on the AH for several hundred thou GP...
Untwinked...Untwinked...Untwinked...he kept repeating. He got mad ..madder...maddest...talked of quitting the game...had, before that filled the airwaves with his tales of raid loot...on his capped toon...while playing his level 3...talk talk talk...I am big...I am bad...I am sooo experienced...I am one of the best players on any server...
Watching him go the wrong way in STK, complain about the trap not disabled...mobs spawning...died. Killed 4 other players demanding someone carry his stone...Then demanded my untwinked kill himself too...so that we would all be even...even though he was going to quit the game over my untwinked insistance.
I begged him not to force me to take his gear...he demanded it. or he would not continue...

Guess I shoulda left the group...Would have saved me an unnecessary death...<sigh> But after he called me several names...ok...hinted at them...took exception to my personal choice... Took it as a personal attack on him...never meant that...lol...Dude! I don't want your gear...I can find my own! I have been fairly successful...lol...lol...lol...

lol.

Sometimes..the noisy one...get the trap!

[insania2016]

Passive aggressive - a player who gets so worked up about what other people do they ignore the obvious solution (i.e. talk to offending player) and instead choose an obtuse one (i.e. complain on the forums)

Well, see, that would create more drama than necessary - without getting into all the details.

Abe Lincoln would write letters venting and then not send them. He got it off of his mind and was able to remain diplomatic.

While I would have no issues doing so, and have done in the past, I have to consider others who might take heat for my abrasiveness.

[insania2016]

Actually, when we are all gathered for the rogue to disarm the trap and up walks the guy that has been complaining for the entire quest that we never wait for him so he can heal/buff/etc...and we are all at full HP...because we took care of ourselves...lol...then he keeps going on about how he hates it when everyone runs ahead and then he asks us why we stopped then he walks right into the trap and dies...

Or the one who got mad because I refused his kind offer of a weapon due to my personal
1.) need to familiarize myself with a particular build before twinking it.
2.) Wanting on a new server to see the difficulty for new players to get lowbie gear that gets on the AH for several hundred thou GP...
Untwinked...Untwinked...Untwinked...he kept repeating. He got mad ..madder...maddest...talked of quitting the game...had, before that filled the airwaves with his tales of raid loot...on his capped toon...while playing his level 3...talk talk talk...I am big...I am bad...I am sooo experienced...I am one of the best players on any server...
Watching him go the wrong way in STK, complain about the trap not disabled...mobs spawning...died. Killed 4 other players demanding someone carry his stone...Then demanded my untwinked kill himself too...so that we would all be even...even though he was going to quit the game over my untwinked insistance.
I begged him not to force me to take his gear...he demanded it. or he would not continue...

Guess I shoulda left the group...Would have saved me an unnecessary death...<sigh> But after he called me several names...ok...hinted at them...took exception to my personal choice... Took it as a personal attack on him...never meant that...lol...Dude! I don't want your gear...I can find my own! I have been fairly successful...lol...lol...lol...

lol.

Sometimes..the noisy one...get the trap!

Feel better? lol :)

Hehe I know exactly how you feel.

[Yvonne_Blacksword]

lol....:p

[Delt]

In pnp we called em 'munchkins'. What do you call them in DDO?

Wouldn't it be interesting if there were an emote command such as /strangle ?

/strangle munchkin ... dude strangles the life out of munchkin in the hopes that they will shutup.

You feel like your more of an NPC in a single player game.

OK done ranting, sorry. More and more this game seems to cater to the powergamers and encourages this behavior. If there were some random elements to quests maybe, bah... who knows.

*flame on!*

This game caters to nothing BUT what you choose to allow. Chances are, the slow-and-steady-treat-every-quest-like-its-a-first ****es off more people than vice-versa (lord knows, with my limited game time, I don't WANT to run that way). Group with like-minded people and practice proper communication - it'll usually ensure everyone is happily on the same page.

As for your question, What do you call them in DDO?, I call them experienced. The reverse, I call noobs...and I generally do my best to avoid em.

[insania2016]

This game caters to nothing BUT what you choose to allow. Chances are, the slow-and-steady-treat-every-quest-like-its-a-first ****es off more people than vice-versa (lord knows, with my limited game time, I don't WANT to run that way). Group with like-minded people and practice proper communication - it'll usually ensure everyone is happily on the same page.

As for your question, What do you call them in DDO?, I call them experienced. The reverse, I call noobs...and I generally do my best to avoid em.

No, a little off point here. We've agreed already that there is a difference between a powergamer and what I am describing.

Anyhow, you're talking the other extreme. When it is a new quest sure you do it slow and steady (though not pokey - there's a difference).

When it is one you've done a few times then the slow and steady is obviously not needed. However, in the case of it being played 100's of times already you certainly don't need someone else pointing out the obvious either. That's for another thread, for another day.

So you call them experienced in MMO? I like to point that I've been gaming for 20 years - both video and table top. I've been playing DDO for over year.

I've actually played Ultima Online when it got started, then on to Anarchy Online when it started, skipped EQ and went to EQ2. Played Star Wars Galaxies, WoW, and a few others. So I'm hardly a noob. I don't have time to powergame, i.e. play for hours on end. While I don't enjoy taking forever to finish a quest as I understand is a rare thing, neither do I care for going through quests in a blur.

At any rate, it boils down to this - simply being discourteous.

As I have said before, communicating the displeasure would step on toes other than the ones I want to step on.

[Delt]

So you call them experienced in MMO? I like to point that I've been gaming for 20 years - both video and table top. I've been playing DDO for over year.

I've actually played Ultima Online when it got started, then on to Anarchy Online when it started, skipped EQ and went to EQ2. Played Star Wars Galaxies, WoW, and a few others. So I'm hardly a noob. I don't have time to powergame, i.e. play for hours on end. While I don't enjoy taking forever to finish a quest as I understand is a rare thing, neither do I care for going through quests in a blur.

At any rate, it boils down to this - simply being discourteous.

As I have said before, communicating the displeasure would step on toes other than the ones I want to step on.

-When I said experienced, it was in regards to the game, not MMO's in general. I was around in UO when magic arrow was a PKs bread and butter and I was there when some smartass FW'd Lord British to death. I was still a noob when I first came to DDO.

- When I am doing the same quest for the 10+ time, it is a chore for me, not fun. Levelling alts is like grinding favor...a pain in the...
People view quest running differently...fact of life.

And your final line says it all - you say nothing to the person, do nothing to effectively resolve it and instead just come on the forums to complain vaguely. No one to blame but yourself.

[insania2016]

-When I said experienced, it was in regards to the game, not MMO's in general. I was around in UO when magic arrow was a PKs bread and butter and I was there when some smartass FW'd Lord British to death. I was still a noob when I first came to DDO.

- When I am doing the same quest for the 10+ time, it is a chore for me, not fun. Levelling alts is like grinding favor...a pain in the...
People view quest running differently...fact of life.

And your final line says it all - you say nothing to the person, do nothing to effectively resolve it and instead just come on the forums to complain vaguely. No one to blame but yourself.

1 - OMG you're old too! All MMO's should do allow you to clone your character like it Tabula Rasa. That would be very nice.. Ugh, PK's, you bring back memories of my naked miner getting shanked all the day long...

2 - Actually, come to think of it, in the past I have said something. It gets forgotten. I would LOVE to say something but as I said, while that would benefit me, it would cause consternation for others as it would put them in the awkward position of having to agree.

At any rate, it was just a vent. It's easy to say this or that on the forum but when it comes down to it, you have accept what you need to and kick the rest in the arse.

[winsom]

"Just turn up your gamma" -- Rainbow quest

Some people don't get the point of adventuring like the rest of us do.

Then again, if they want to pretend that their drow/dwarf should be able to see in the dark (turn up gamma) then I can't argue with them :)

[CSFurious]

who you play with in this game

that is the great thing about this game IMO, i.e., finding people who you enjoy questing with

i would simply suggest that you keep on looking for similar players as you & utilize the squelch feature when you meet those you wish to strangle (i love it)

later

[Luthen]

1 - OMG you're old too! All MMO's should do allow you to clone your character like it Tabula Rasa. That would be very nice.. Ugh, PK's, you bring back memories of my naked miner getting shanked all the day long...

2 - Actually, come to think of it, in the past I have said something. It gets forgotten. I would LOVE to say something but as I said, while that would benefit me, it would cause consternation for others as it would put them in the awkward position of having to agree.

At any rate, it was just a vent. It's easy to say this or that on the forum but when it comes down to it, you have accept what you need to and kick the rest in the arse.

You had me for awhile. Unfortunately you just started making to many "I've said something before but I won't repeat it", or "I could say something but it might affect others", or "I would love to say something but...". Sheesh... why did you bring this here? Abe Lincoln wrote letters to himself to vent... yes. But remember.... HE KEPT IT TO HIMSELF. The second you posted it here you're just being passive aggresive. hoping others might do your dirty work. I may or may not be classified as one of those power gamers you speak so fondly of but I can tell you this... if I have an issue or concern that I feel is big enough to bring to an open forum you can bet I am not going to mince words and tip toe around it.

You seem like a decent person and have some legitimate concerns but these are a reality of this kind of community. You put a few thousand personalities into an environment you're going to get clashes. You either accept that this is going to happen and either put your head down and keep playing how you enjoy playing or you step up and speak your mind.

There are definately jerks out there with big mouths. I have been one of those on a few occasions I am sure, whether I realized it or not. Some people say that power gamers are just rude people. Some feel they just prefer to be efficiant. then there are those who truely are just rude obnoxious jerks. That's what squelching is for. I have only squelched one person in the 2+ years of playing this game and he hasnt even been in game for the past 8 months or so. Just learn to take a little more control. If it's your group that you started and they're being pushy just tell them... here's how WE want to run this. If it isn't for you then you know where the door is.

Sorry if this comes off a bit crass but I am just to straight forward to read to a bunch of passive aggresive chatter.:D

[TommyBoy]

How about, turd muffins?

Turd Muffin - An annoying mmo player that feels the need to explain every little bit of a quest in detail so as to spoil the fun for other players. A turd muffin will ignore requests to shutup and doesn't have a clue as to whether their "advice" is wanted or not.

thats not a power gamer a power gamer are those that tend to play 40hours a week. usally have the best gear and often assume you know what your doing. often accused of zerging

Zerger person running through as fast as possible

average player 15ish to 20ish hrs a week

casual 15 and less

min/maxer are those that play with the stats to get the best possible effect for what they want to do. eg ranging wizard that dumps everything in to int and dex and forsakes everything else

randon dumbA** know it all / most non adult player / Turd Muffin - An annoying mmo player that feels the need to explain every little bit of a quest in detail so as to spoil the fun for other players. A turd muffin will ignore requests to shutup and doesn't have a clue as to whether their "advice" is wanted or not.

hope this helps you with identifying players.

[dungeonrat07]

You had me for awhile. Unfortunately you just started making to many "I've said something before but I won't repeat it", or "I could say something but it might affect others", or "I would love to say something but...". Sheesh... why did you bring this here? Abe Lincoln wrote letters to himself to vent... yes. But remember.... HE KEPT IT TO HIMSELF. The second you posted it here you're just being passive aggresive. hoping others might do your dirty work. I may or may not be classified as one of those power gamers you speak so fondly of but I can tell you this... if I have an issue or concern that I feel is big enough to bring to an open forum you can bet I am not going to mince words and tip toe around it.

You seem like a decent person and have some legitimate concerns but these are a reality of this kind of community. You put a few thousand personalities into an environment you're going to get clashes. You either accept that this is going to happen and either put your head down and keep playing how you enjoy playing or you step up and speak your mind.

There are definately jerks out there with big mouths. I have been one of those on a few occasions I am sure, whether I realized it or not. Some people say that power gamers are just rude people. Some feel they just prefer to be efficiant. then there are those who truely are just rude obnoxious jerks. That's what squelching is for. I have only squelched one person in the 2+ years of playing this game and he hasnt even been in game for the past 8 months or so. Just learn to take a little more control. If it's your group that you started and they're being pushy just tell them... here's how WE want to run this. If it isn't for you then you know where the door is.

Sorry if this comes off a bit crass but I am just to straight forward to read to a bunch of passive aggresive chatter.:D

Thats right!

[query]

Well, technically not old by society's standary of young and middle age...but close enough.

I played this game for over thirty years and we used the no sense rules and LIKED it that way!


Wait...the Gumpy old Gamer is next month.......

Oh right, power gamer vs Munchkin....

I want the two classes card, since it was FIRST in Elf and Dwarf!
(Yeah another red box D&D Munchkin crossover joke, but D&D was too...)

But seriously, let's go over why power gamers ane not necessarily munchkins, and why many munchkins rush in stupidly thus should be named after yet ANOTHER race in a DIFFERENT game.....


I am a role player.
I am a power gamer.

At first glance, those sententes seem contradicing. It's not possible to make a fully fleshed out character and yet be built for maximum effectiveness using the build concept, right?


Wrong.


If I have an idea that I think the hills are pretty and say, what if some artificer made my PC because of that sunset and he wanted to show a different kind of type of class can be done with the race and what if I made him self sufficient.....


Thus Cerulean was born. Then it wasn't going to likely be a long time, but I planned it out just in case....

well, I continued to like DDO after my first few deletions after all, and about Cerulean: thanks, you're welcome and my apologies for all you have experienced, had me experience, and suffered when I am/was anything but nice (bashfully looks down in embarassment.)

But I planned my character...long before those planners existed. It was through simply writing down and playing what if...finding what worked and what didn't, then literally taking it from paper to live testing...and seeing what happend (the only conceptual change I actually ever made was the mithral plating was too penalizing and I allowed fred to swap that feat out.)

But don't think this was easy. As much as any person spends building a ship in a bottle, a painted work of art, a presentation of artistic experssion of any dramatic venue, this took a lot of planning, a lot of work, and the artist is never fully satisfied with their "final" product, always modifying making new experessions as they become revealed (or available in the case of mod updates.)
Whenever I get a new medium or canvas, don't think I sit content using terms like leet and uberest. I literally have my character grow, both in abilities and in character development.

Oh, we're using evil to fight the devils in the form of greensteel? Items crave blood, but have no satiation? I'm LG? You BET there is gong to be conflict and struggle there!

Sure, I can write up several sentences and it's my "bio." Or I can allude to what somebody can figure out or take on a first impression and use posted storyarcs to reveal both their past, present and future (I was most inspired in seeing this venue by a Guild member called Sho'Drizzen...whose bloodline and then present choices affected the future we saw become of him in these two years...)

But that doesn't mean I have to sacrifice general usefulness like being practically immune to any reflex for 1/2 saving throw with insightful reflexes, be able to melee as well as spell many enemies alays having the right weapon available, or simply showing yes the rainbow elite activated Fire elementals are now surrounding us, yes I can show you how to solo them...no I like this weapon over magic that may or may not be saved...... now watch as I kill these six ones here.....yes I am a rogue 2 wiz 14, no I don't currently miss L 8 spells including polar ray. If you want, I can mainly do the end boss too...yes I appreciante the irony I am specced in fire yet it's one of my top resistances reflex aside....(lava exempted)


And none of that means when we have a person or group open to role playing I'm not able to slip into character, all strengths and flaws portrayed. (You wanted to be more human? Congratulations you ARE...SUFFERING AND DARK EMOTIONS INCLUDED!)

I waited almost an entire year just for the hinted then promised ranger updates to be available. It wasn't so my PC would be uber, it just gelled with a storyline and a very very dark character I wanted to make for a while on DDO...mission accomplished, and look, it interrelates my story and other character's backstories too! And I'm happy to say his sniperness meant I could get kobold assult elite over with at 7'th for a non tank ranged ranger and I was pretty much the last one standing using over 500 arrow shots and it was worth it!

You think that's long? I have a PC I have played in literally one incarnation or another for 18 years. Now that monks are out this April, his story continues.....and it's very very very thought out and enlightening. Does that mean I will never break character? heck no! I can be me if I choose to relay and not have to be always on either. It's our choice and others who munchkin seem to miss the idea of CHOICE over, "The best way is x and the only way."

Just to have that moment of accomplishment that yes, it works both on a story AND game level, that's a hard balance to do, and I feel happy if i can acheive both. If not, I just go and use the path that works or try try again.

But there are those that aren't simply happy enough to be the best they can acheive in RP or builds or whatever here. People with dragon in their name may never stop talking how uber powerful they are like their powerful name, yet end up dead first. Others can kick your but and never let you forget or insist they MUST PvP you to show the awesomeness of their toon...even though it's completely against the build and character concept.....certain melee bloodlust PCs exempted of course.
And then there is that type A of the type A who has to say EVERYTHING about the so called quest when we are DELIBERATELY role playing it or enjoying the mystery, yet the Summer's Eve person somehow has no end of killing themselves yet blaming all of US for their...well, begins with an f and ends with a p maybe and usually plural.


THAT is the Munchkin we mean when we post here. That never shutting up except when the mic burns out, yet somehow finds the time to drain all of OUR resources dry keeping THEM alive, then blame OUR method for THEIR failings....that take this item or else brings back scary DDO memories...like how I would "never do the Reaver since I had no L 7 spells. It's impossible without Disco Ball and Fingering".....same dumb a** thinking that kills the REST of the party if their playbook isn't perfect and this game never is.....
[Major rant on]
(And they can't even Type or say Otto's Dancing Sphere or Finger of Death because all they do in the class they NEVER PLAYED is watch ONE person do it their way. Shocking PK seems to kill things too and we didn't need Abba to do so and you weren't complaining with the haste jump tumble stoneskin and constant firewalls in the end about gimpyness, especially when windy kicked YOUR butt but didn't get through to MINE.)[/Major rant off]


We have a word for the loud, populous charging sucking resurces of doom lemmings...besides lemmings.
We call them Zergers.

Born from StarCraft they are a not so strong race that attacks by rushing in swarms. So whenver we see dumb rushing into their doom, or any dumb running ahead, we nickname them Zergers. They are the one who will never call their character anything but a toon, and are insulted when you exlain why YOU PERSONALLY do not call your PC's toons. They scream into the mics everything they think they know, yet rush into said trap time number five and have no idea why you're witholding healing and class support all of the sudden. While some of us may not get to play with others from personal dislike or even some pc's baning others, this kind of top ranking zerger often has people screaming "I HAVE HAD IT!" and watch groups leave if for some reason they simply are not dropped first, and their name is whispered as if Leroy Jenkins had incarnated in them.

They assume since they learned to play X...all things are played like X including DDO, see I got lewt and am uber and got to level x/did quest x in Y Z. (Not like some of us ever intentionally NOT advance for reasons they would never understand....) We types of our playing don't need to worry about kill counts rather completions of the quest....raids are nice but the number (short of the almighty 20 if you absolutely need X for somethng but that's not as much a priority) is not important as the feeling of completing it with friends and guild...yes even in character...(Cerulean broke down in helpless wracking sobs after he killed the Titan...again. It was MUCH worse role playing time number two...)


But that doesn't men we must forsake raid loot either, but be advised many of us will have a backstory about it...like how my Treason was intelligent and like an egotistical narcissicistic child believing all other Treasons were pale imitations until I got Treason #2 and he found out about the OTHER Treason....the PC was ground zero in a battle of bratty telepathic egotistical children with the bad tendancy to whine ask at the same time and sounding like Tachoma from Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex.

And yes, sometimes a Tenderizer, is just ...well, a tenderizer. (But it CAN be fun seeing which you down quicker in the Tor with: Tenderizers, Gr Giant banes or wounding puncturers...power gaming can be fun too!) And when those spells fail and you JUST liVe with your Gr bane, BOOYA is okay to shout OOC too.


But it's also fair to ask what quest x will do to the character plotwise. Will this open up story arc x looking for a trigger or be a completely new thing...or jjst a run with nothing at all?


So we role players can be power gamers gallore (right Zoltando Sevenmoons Mc'Stabby? :p)


But we normally avoid over self-uber ZERGERS who Leroy Jenkins the Munchkin to...oops, deleted a DDO name here since that would be negative so and so. but you know that barbarian, wizard, cleric, etc that is a so called expert yet always demands something FROM YOU until you are dry them blames you for their no self-sufficienncy. Then no matter what their age you learn to say "Quiet kid, ya bother me" or in some way that means you are not their personal resource pool! Amazingly how bad or they learn how to do it themselves they become......


As long and verbose as that was, I hoped it illustrates why we roleplayers and/or powergamers don't want to be grouped in with the lollypop kids.


Right now my main is almost freeing himself from the taint's influence, and tonight is his 20th reaver run (no not a single +2 or +3 tome from his other 19 attempts.) I hope you can wish him luck both in character and for me the player getting that phat loot too.

Now what the heck am I doing here? I got a PC to load!

[transtemporal]

Actually powergamers are people that usze the existing rules to achieve the most powerful character possible, generally in on e specific area, ie damage dealing.

A munchkin on the other hand is someone who exploits the rules or ignores certain rules to make better characters. For, example, in PnP the dodge feat only applies to one opponent, but the munchkin will often overlook that unless confronted on it and will then claim they just made a mistake.

I guess in DDO the powergamers would be those that optimize and twink while munchkins would be those that use exploits to enhance their characters on beat quests.

In either version, powergamers don't bother me but munchkins do.

Well said. Everyone wants to be successful and earn the admiration of ones peers. Generally, you can't do this by randomly creating a character and hoping for the best (and coincedentally building a great toon, then bragging about it isn't the way either). You have to invest the time into investigating what the best options are for your particular build concept and playstyle. If that makes me a powergamer, then hell, I'm proud of it! :)

[Borror0]

If it's your group that you started and they're being pushy just tell them... here's how WE want to run this. If it isn't for you then you know where the door is.

Exactly. Nicely said Luthen. That tips works on both sides.

If you join a group and it's not for you, leave, don't stay. Make your own group and advertise "no spoilers" or stuff somehing&#233; that.