What weapon damage is best for your new green steel?

[redoubt]

I know holy burst of pure good has long been considered one of the best all around weapons. What about now that we have some new elemental burst types.

What damage type would you pick for a single weapon? (and why of course)

What damage type(s) would you pick for dual weapons?

[MysticTheurge]

Holy/Acid Burst then something Earth or Positive at tier III (+4 AC, Holy Blast, Acid Blast, my cleric might even get +2 Wisdom) to get the Mineral bonus.

That also makes it Keen, Transmuting and Slicing (an extra 1d4 damage). Plus you get a nice stoneskin clicky.

[ChildrenofBodom]

Isn't the acid burst not good for this mod? I believe all devils have like 10 resistance to acid making 1d6 acid do nothing. So I don't think holy/acid burst is very good atm. I know the pit fiend at least has resistance to acid.

[MysticTheurge]

Isn't the acid burst not good for this mod? I believe all devils have like 10 resistance to acid making 1d6 acid do nothing. So I don't think holy/acid burst is very good atm. I know the pit fiend at least has resistance to acid.

It's still transmuting, which means it's going to bypass his regular DR (which is going to make a bigger difference than the acid damage, I'm told).

You could swap Holy for Acid and Acid Burst for Good Burst, I suppose (in theory).

You could go with the Lightning combo instead, I guess (Holy, Shocking Burst, Good Blast with the Lightning proc) if you want a devil fighting weapon.

[Drider]

It's still transmuting, which means it's going to bypass his regular DR (which is going to make a bigger difference than the acid damage, I'm told).

You could swap Holy for Acid and Acid Burst for Good Burst, I suppose (in theory).

You could go with the Lightning combo instead, I guess (Holy, Shocking Burst, Good Blast with the Lightning proc) if you want a devil fighting weapon.


I just made my holy/shocking burst bow.. and I was getting yummy numbers on the Pit Fiend.

[MysticTheurge]

I just made my holy/shocking burst bow.. and I was getting yummy numbers on the Pit Fiend.

That's really ideal, because you can use silver arrows and still bypass his DR.

It won't be true for Lightning based melee weapons though.

[ChildrenofBodom]

I just made my holy/shocking burst bow.. and I was getting yummy numbers on the Pit Fiend.

Same, I'm going for Lightning II. I have my 2 supreme shards, I just need my 24 ingredients now, heh. Only have 5 so far. :(

[ChildrenofBodom]

It's still transmuting, which means it's going to bypass his regular DR (which is going to make a bigger difference than the acid damage, I'm told).

You could swap Holy for Acid and Acid Burst for Good Burst, I suppose (in theory).

You could go with the Lightning combo instead, I guess (Holy, Shocking Burst, Good Blast with the Lightning proc) if you want a devil fighting weapon.

True, but getting transmuting and all that jazz takes too long for the average player. So I think you should mainly focus on just the first two tiers. Which would be holy + acid burst, which isn't great for this module and I believe the next one will be devils also?

[MysticTheurge]

So I think you should mainly focus on just the first two tiers.

Well in that case, then no, it's not ideal for the Vale/Shroud, since most of the devils do have some acid resistance.

But still, the Vale/Shroud isn't the entirety of what you're doing, even at the cap.


...and I believe the next one will be devils also?

I haven't heard anything to suggest that. What are you basing that theory on?

[Snoggy]

Isn't the acid burst not good for this mod?

Yeah, for this mod. But there's still a lot of older content. And the next mod or two might have other options. Acid on a whole tends to do damage to a lot of mobs across the span of the game. So it's not a horrible choice. You really have to consider what you're making the weapon for you know? Making it focus solely on the content you're currently running or making it a more general use item. The Mineral II weapon is definitely a general use item due to the tier 3 "super" upgrade.

[Vizzini]

Going straight through for Acid Blast Kopesh ;)

Come to think of it - I might make a blasting type of each - just so I can be prepared for any circumstances.

[MysticTheurge]

You really have to consider what you're making the weapon for you know?

Plus, for me, even the Tier II combo abilities are worth considering.

A 2/day 16th level stoneskin is more useful to me than a 1/day True Resurrection.

[efreet5]

I believe the next one will be devils also?

If I remember correctly, the devs said something about demons in module 7 and not devils again, but as my guildmates and family frequently tell me....I am an idiot...:p


Plus, for me, even the Tier II combo abilities are worth considering.

A 2/day 16th level stoneskin is more useful to me than a 1/day True Resurrection.

What's with all these people wanting stoneskin clickies? Do the DQ there's been one there for more than a year now...if you're gonna do all that farming just run DQ instead, same result, prolly same amount of time

[ChildrenofBodom]

Well in that case, then no, it's not ideal for the Vale/Shroud, since most of the devils do have some acid resistance.

But still, the Vale/Shroud isn't the entirety of what you're doing, even at the cap.

In my case, this isn't true, and is also the case for most of both of my guilds. The only thing we do if not the vale is the reaver. I'm not going to waste a green steel wep and 2 upgrades worth of ingredients for the stormreaver. Could it be more useful in the future? Definately. As of now, acid burst isn't that great.

I haven't heard anything to suggest that. What are you basing that theory on?

Not a theory, that's just what I heard. Never said it was true or that is what I believed.

Red.

[Yaga_Nub]

Between Acid and Lightning, which one is resisted the least?

[ChildrenofBodom]

Yeah, for this mod. But there's still a lot of older content. And the next mod or two might have other options. Acid on a whole tends to do damage to a lot of mobs across the span of the game. So it's not a horrible choice. You really have to consider what you're making the weapon for you know? Making it focus solely on the content you're currently running or making it a more general use item. The Mineral II weapon is definitely a general use item due to the tier 3 "super" upgrade.

Huh?

I would take an effect that does 600+ damage (I don't care how often it works) and the DPS that is best for this mod over transmuting + slicing + keen anyday.


Plus, for me, even the Tier II combo abilities are worth considering.

A 2/day 16th level stoneskin is more useful to me than a 1/day True Resurrection.

I agree the clicky is nice, but you could also carry wands of stoneskin and have a caster cast it on you or just ask for it since most casters that I know pass it out anyways. That's my experience though.

[Laith]

What's with all these people wanting stoneskin clickies? Do the DQ there's been one there for more than a year now...if you're gonna do all that farming just run DQ instead, same result, prolly same amount of time
now that we know what mineral II does, i'm willing to bet most people that go this route are more interested in the transmuting than ANY clicky.

[Borror0]

I'll probably go Mineral II, Transmuting and Slicing is just too nice to skip. However, not sure if I go Holy/Acid burst or Acid/Good Burst yet. Holy is more damage, but there are a bunch of neutral mobs in the Vale... and considerating how long those are to craft. ;)

[MysticTheurge]

Not a theory, that's just what I heard. Never said it was true or that is what I believed.

Uh, right. Where did you hear it?


Between Acid and Lightning, which one is resisted the least?

Most Demons are immune to Lightning.

Most Devils don't even have Lightning resistance.

Both of them generally have some amount of Acid resistance.

As for other stuff, I think, on average, more things are immune to lightning than are immune to acid. And on average more things have higher Lightning resistance than they have Acid resistance.

[ChildrenofBodom]

Between Acid and Lightning, which one is resisted the least?

To be honest, I think I'm going with lightning. Call me crazy. I think all devils and demons have resistance to acid. Aren't flensers demons? If I remember correctly, they have resistance to acid.

[ChildrenofBodom]

Uh, right. Where did you hear it?


Why does it matter....?

[MysticTheurge]

What's with all these people wanting stoneskin clickies? Do the DQ there's been one there for more than a year now...if you're gonna do all that farming just run DQ instead, same result, prolly same amount of time

Except I don't have to get re-flagged for the Shroud. Or keep hoping my 1 in 6 chance of getting a raid loot item results in the one that I want.


I agree the clicky is nice, but you could also carry wands of stoneskin and have a caster cast it on you or just ask for it since most casters that I know pass it out anyways. That's my experience though.

Yes, it's certainly not imperative that I get a stoneskin clicky right now!!! But it would be nice to have for when I'm soloing stuff or there isn't a casting who feels like handing it out to everyone.

[Snoggy]

I would take an effect that does 600+ damage (I don't care how often it works) and the DPS that is best for this mod over transmuting + slicing + keen anyday.

A sad byproduct of the lack of DPS calculations found on these forums. Big numbers sure are flashy. But Damage Per Second? Transmuting might have a weeeeeee bit more use in upping actual DPS than you are giving it credit for.

[Borror0]

I haven't heard anything to suggest that. What are you basing that theory on?

I'm pretty sure they said that module 7 would be the continuation of the Shavrath assault...

[MysticTheurge]

Why does it matter....?

Because I could say that I heard Mod 7 was going to include the introduction of Giant Fire Beetles, but it would be kind of deceptive of me to do so if the place I "heard" it was from my senile grandfather who doesn't even really know what DDO is.

>.>

<.<

You made a claim about what was coming in Mod 7. I just wanted to know what you were basing that claim off of: random hearsay, guild chatter, a secret dev interview, an official announcement I just hadn't seen yet, etc.

[ChildrenofBodom]

Yes, it's certainly not imperative that I get a stoneskin clicky right now!!! But it would be nice to have for when I'm soloing stuff or there isn't a casting who feels like handing it out to everyone.

Haven't you heard MT? Soloing is for noobs. :p

Sure, of course it's useful if you are soloing. As of now though that's pretty much all that weapon is used for in the vale is that clicky. Unless you are fighting gnolls or sumtin.

I'm just saying, I would WAY rather have a weapon that works on almost all the mobs DPS-wise and get the mineral wep later. Because, you can get both. ;)

[MysticTheurge]

I'm pretty sure they said that module 7 would be the continuation of the Shavrath assault...

Hmm maybe this will work better...

Do you remember where they said that?

[Borror0]

Do you remember where they said that?

Errr.... it was in an interview, one of the most recent ones.

[MysticTheurge]

Errr.... it was in an interview, one of the most recent ones.

See, that's the problem with all those crazy interviews coming out at the same time! I can't ever figure out what was in which one. :D

[ChildrenofBodom]

Because I could say that I heard Mod 7 was going to include the introduction of Giant Fire Beetles, but it would be kind of deceptive of me to do so if the place I "heard" it was from my senile grandfather who doesn't even really know what DDO is.

>.>

<.<

You made a claim about what was coming in Mod 7. I just wanted to know what you were basing that claim off of: random hearsay, guild chatter, a secret dev interview, an official announcement I just hadn't seen yet, etc.

Wasn't a claim, I put a question mark so it was sort of a question. I hardly call that a claim.

Anyways, if you must know, I could have sworn I read it somewhere and have takled about it with guildies.

EDIT:


Errr.... it was in an interview, one of the most recent ones.

I KNEW it!

[ChildrenofBodom]

See, that's the problem with all those crazy interviews coming out at the same time! I can't ever figure out what was in which one. :D

Heh, totally agree on that one.

[MysticTheurge]

Wasn't a claim, I put a question mark so it was sort of a question. I hardly call that a claim.

Anyways, if you must know, I could have sworn I read it somewhere and have takled about it with guildies.

I wasn't trying to say that you were wrong or anything. Just that I didn't remember that and I was hoping to be pointed in the right direction for figuring out where you had gotten that idea.

[redoubt]

Three parts:

1. I'm hoping to find the sword of shadows of green steel.
.....a) What one combo of damages on a single weapon will work on the most stuff?
.....b) What two combo's dual weilded will work (best dps) on the most stuff?

2. clarification on some of what you guys have been saying. Now, if I'm following correctly, the smart and early crafters have found out how to put transmutting on weapons. That being Acid blast combined with Good blast in a "super" tier three shard (cost double the ingredients to do.) The transmuting (thus far) seems to outweigh any of the other teir three effects in terms of granting consistantly higher dps to all mobs.

3. That leaves a few effects in the tier one and two to look at. Leaders seem to be true resurection, stoneskin and the earth elemental.
.....a) True resurection comes from holy, good burst combo. Thats 2d6 verus evil + 1d6 versus non-good + 1d10 versus non-good on a crit. This looks like a very good (no pun) combo versus evil creatures. That's maybe 33% of the mobs??? Then versus nuetral you still pick up the good damage, but its only about half what it is against evil, but you pick up another third of the mobs (wag on the percentage of mobs)
.....b) stoneskin from acid with good burst or holy with acid burst. For evil creatures the former should be better by picking up the 2d6 holy. For a wider cut of mobs go with the later and get 1d6 acid and 1d6 good + 1d10 good crit.
.....c) earth elemental pet from acid with acid burst. This one can hit the most mobs because it does not depend at all on alignment. The flip side is the potential for resistance to acid. (Though it sounds like acid is currently the least resisted element in the game.)

That said I think my answers so far would be:
Single weapon: acid, acid burst, acid&good blast. Looks like the most consistant DPS to the most mobs.
Dual weapon: The above plus either a second of the above or the holy, good burst, acid&good blast. Mainly due to the large percentage of mobs which are undead (and I think mostly evil too!)

If one was to go crazy, set up pairs of the true res weapons and acid weapons. Use the holy, good combos against evil and the acid on everything else.

Did I miss anything? (Other than the totally insane amount of time required to build such combos!! ;) )

[Arbaal9111]

See, that's the problem with all those crazy interviews coming out at the same time! I can't ever figure out what was in which one. :D


I remeber seeing it as well. So he isn't making it up.

I think it was more along the lines of more of the blood war tho.. So may be demons and devils or just demons.. who knows.

[MysticTheurge]

Single weapon: acid, acid burst, acid&good blast. Looks like the most consistant DPS to the most mobs.

You don't get both of the third tier abilities from the combo shard, you just get one of them and the combo benefit.

So you can make acid/good burst/Acid or Good Blast or holy/acid burst/acid or good blast and either combo will be a stoneskin clicky that's transmuting, keen and slicing.

But you can't get Acid and Good Blast. Just one or the other.

[redoubt]

You don't get both of the third tier abilities from the combo shard, you just get one of them and the combo benefit.

So you can make acid/good burst/Acid or Good Blast or holy/acid burst/acid or good blast and either combo will be a stoneskin clicky that's transmuting, keen and slicing.

But you can't get Acid and Good Blast. Just one or the other.

Good to know. So how do you make it one or the other?

You could also do: acid, acid burst, acid blast (buried good blast) and get the elemental clickie and transmuting right?

[MysticTheurge]

So how do you make it one or the other?

No one's entirely sure.

It looks kind of like one of the two focuses will be dominant (in the case of Mineral it appears to be Earth) and that's what will give you the Tier III effect. But it also seems, from a theoretical standpoint, odd that they'd force you into a certain effect just to get the combo, so there's some theorizing that there might be other ways to make the other focus dominant.


You could also do: acid, acid burst, acid blast (buried good blast) and get the elemental clickie and transmuting right?

No one's actually tested it, but the standing theory is no. We're pretty sure you have to get Mineral I (i.e. the Tier II bonus: stoneskin clicky) before you can get Mineral II (i.e. the Tier III bonus: transmuting, keen, slicing).

[Snoggy]

Three parts:
Did I miss anything? (Other than the totally insane amount of time required to build such combos!! ;) )

Yeah, Mineral II also has Keen and Slicing. The Slicing damage isn't much, but it's there. The Keen part though, shouldn't be overlooked. It's also a nice bonus to DPS.

[redoubt]

No one's entirely sure.

It looks kind of like one of the two focuses will be dominant (in the case of Mineral it appears to be Earth) and that's what will give you the Tier III effect. But it also seems, from a theoretical standpoint, odd that they'd force you into a certain effect just to get the combo, so there's some theorizing that there might be other ways to make the other focus dominant.



No one's actually tested it, but the standing theory is no. We're pretty sure you have to get Mineral I (i.e. the Tier II bonus: stoneskin clicky) before you can get Mineral II (i.e. the Tier III bonus: transmuting, keen, slicing).

Okay. Also good to know. Binnsr's spreadsheet had it show up with either combo, but I'll keep watching to see how it actually plays out.

Thanks.

[redoubt]

Yeah, Mineral II also has Keen and Slicing. The Slicing damage isn't much, but it's there. The Keen part though, shouldn't be overlooked. It's also a nice bonus to DPS.

True enough. Average 2.5 damage to any bleeders.

Though I'm suspect of the value of keen on a weapon like this (unless it stacks, then its uber). My reason? I would think almost everyone who goes to the trouble of making these weapons will already have improved crit in the applicable type. I know I already do.

[Snoggy]

True enough. Average 2.5 damage to any bleeders.

Though I'm suspect of the value of keen on a weapon like this (unless it stacks, then its uber). My reason? I would think almost everyone who goes to the trouble of making these weapons will already have improved crit in the applicable type. I know I already do.

I think I'm mixing Keen up with Seeker again. Sorry.

[adamkatt]

Going straight through for Acid Blast Kopesh ;)

Come to think of it - I might make a blasting type of each - just so I can be prepared for any circumstances.



This is ideal, but it just takes a lot of time.

[MysticTheurge]

Though I'm suspect of the value of keen on a weapon like this (unless it stacks, then its uber). My reason? I would think almost everyone who goes to the trouble of making these weapons will already have improved crit in the applicable type. I know I already do.

Actually, I'm planning a mineral weapon on my cleric, who doesn't have Improved Crit, so the Keen is kind of nice for him.

[Tanka]

My first weapons on every character will end up being Holy/Shocking Burst/Shocking Blast/Lightning Strike combo. I'm mostly running stuff in the Vale/Shroud now, so a good devil smacker will come in handy.

I do plan on getting Shocking/Acid Burst/Acid Blast at some point however, if only for the rest of the quests that have oodles of creatures who have no resistance to Acid whatsoever.

[sirgog]

For melee, I cannot think of anything better than Holy//Acid Burst//Mineral 2.

The transmuting effect is basically 10-15 free damage on every single swing at current endgame (that's like 3-4 copies of Pure Good). Holy works on most endgame mobs. Acid Burst, Slicing and Acid Blast are unspectacular, but add a small amount of damage on average to foes at current endgame, and a large amount to unprotected foes.

This applies to all one-weapon fighters. To people using two weapons, one of the random proc effects may be more attractive (the 1-2% chance of a 600 damage lightning bolt, or the 1-2% chance of Slay Living, or the 2-5% chance of a 250 damage-over-time Crushing Wave, although these seem weaker than Vorpals in general).

For a ranged weapon, Holy//Shocking Burst//Lightning 2 seems optimal, as Transmuting is less important (a Green Steel bow can fire silver arrows after all), and Manyshot with the uber lightning proc of DDOOOOOMM! could be very scary.