Share your input - Cleric building!

[Seylene]

There are a lot of good clerics out there with many different builds and play styles. Perhaps you can share your wisdom (lol) with me as I have recently rolled a 32-pt human (sorry, didn't want a female dwarf :(, can't stand the thought of having to stare at my own chunky butt :p). I still have time to reroll her as she's just a baby if I find I have already utterly messed her up based on your input here.

Main goal is to be well rounded - good healer and can kick some butt with offensive spells :D (EDIT: forgot to add, will have some DVs :))

Many thx!

[Ministry]

I'm hoping that you get a whole whack o' great responses and kudos to you for asking for assistance. There are a number of very good clerics out there and well... even more that think they are good.

I have a cleric that I think is okay, but I wouldn't post my build because he is not a "prototypical" uber build.

There are so many directions you can go, but the best I've seen are Human or Dwarf.

My point is... love what you do and you will do it well.

I've seen what people say are "uber" builds, but they die and my plain old elf lives on and keeps the party alive.

Seriously... Focus on Wisdom to do what you do best, Con to make sure you can take a hit or 2 and then Cha for the other things a Cleric needs to do.

You are probably going to receive much feedback, but in the end... "IT'S THE PLAYER - NOT THE BUILD".

Trust me and Good luck.

If I were to post a question on this... it would be - "Hey all, what do you think makes a good Cleric" (Playstyle, etc...) - Not necessarily the build. But, that would mean I would have to give a **** about what people thought... and that's not likely going to happen.

;)

[sigtrent]

Caster cleric basics...

Keep your wisdom as high as you can
Find the best potency items you can

Feat choices are one of the more important decisions you can make and fortunately you can swap them out if you don't like them

-Maximize is nice for damage spells, empower if you really want to go crazy with the damage dealing

-Quicken Spell is really good for casting in combat as cleric offense spells are kind of slow and it means you don't need to make concentration checks, I highly recomend it.

-Heighten is good if you like the non-damage combat spells.

-Mental Toughness is nice for extra mana

A lot of playing any caster is learning all the spells and how to cast them. I find a caster cleric is a bit like a general. You keep your eye on your troops and cast spells when they need some help, either healing, killing, or controling the enemy.

[Ringos]

Like others have stated, I'm sure that you will get very good responses from folks here (Impact's response will come soon I'm sure!). No matter what the build is, how good he/she is ultimately depends on you. My main, a capped 14 cleric, has the 28 point game-generated stats. Although he didn't start with the max Wisdom, I still do ok. It's great to shoot for the 'perfect' build, but even if you mess up a bit, you can make it work. Good luck!

(I know the OP obviously knows this, more of a general statement to others who reead the post!)

[Raelg14]

Well I have a capped 14th Human level cleric, 28 pt build. She also didn't have max Wisdom when I rolled her but she does very nicely. My only complaint with her is that some of the CC spells she casts, specifically Greater Command, I had creatures make there save more than I would like. Even with a Enchantment Lore Item and a Spell Penetration Item, until I picked up Heighten. Love it. Impaqt I am sure will be able to give you a lot of great advice. My latest Cleric is a Cleric/Pally Battle Cleric based on one of his builds. So far @ level 4 he is a lot of fun to play.

[sigtrent]

I don't think you need to start with maximum wisdom, 16 is really just fine and usualy makes for a more versatile build, but you do want to always be looking for ways to add to it and genrealy it is the best place to put your level up points.

[Kerr]

I disagree, max out your Wis score at first level, and likely put every point leveling up into it, unless you want to develop another stat a little bit. My reasoning is at lower level the mana is going to limited enough as is and you'll want to be able to have the highest DC possible against resisting your spells later on. If you don't max it out, you can't reallocate your stats at a later time, you can always swap out equipment or enhancements.

Also, by putting enough points into Wisdom, you can instead avoid putting points into the Wisdom enhancement lines and instead put them into the Metamagic cost reduction lines. You only get 20 or so extra mana at a high level from an extra 2 Wis, but you can save yourself several times that by getting the metamagic reduction lines while significantly boosting spell effectiveness.

If you care about Turning or DVs, put at least a 14 into CHA. Otherwise put the bulk of points into CON to give yourself a high save for fort and higher HP. If you’re dead likely no one will be raising you and the party could more easily wipe.

[Braegan]

I only know how to make battle clerics :p

Seriously most of the good stuff was said already.

As far as skills, Concentration is the only one I have seen any use for.

As far as feats: Mental Toughness and Improved Mental Toughness are great staples to have. Empower Healing helps out alot at lower levels when you might not have devotion or potency items. Extend is one I am on the fence on, can be handy but other feats are better imo. As mentioned above Maximize is nice for any spell that involves die rolling which if I am not mistaken includes healing spells.

As far as stats: Everyone seems to think wisdom needs to be maxed out. I guess if you are not gonna be a melee cleric you could do that. But you can start a human off with a 15 wisdom and get a 30 by current level cap ( 15 + 3 from levels 4,8,12 +3 enhancement +1 human enhancement +6 item +2 tome = 30)

As far as gear: Just try and keep up with the best Devotion/Potency Item you can get your hands on as well as a high Concentration item. Some great lowbie ones are the Splinterskull Ring from Tangleroot & the Helmet that comes from Stormcleave can't remember the name of it atm.

As far as class splashing: Adding one level of fighter will give you a bonus feat, martial weapon proficiency and tower shield proficiency. Adding a level a paladin will give you 1 point of ac, martial weapon proficiency and a small amount of mana. Adding a level of Barbarian is not that great an idea as you can't cast when in Rage.

Anyway I am no expert on cleric builds but those are a couple things I learned leveling a couple up - hope it helps and GL!

Brae

[Ringos]

Once I unlocked 32 pt builds I threw together a female elven cleric. I maxed the Wis...I think I did 14, 10, 12, 8, 18, 12. I've got her just shy of lvl 8 and I'm very happy. I also recommend maxin' wisdom. Down the road, you will never be sorry. If you start with a 16, there will be times down the road when things save that you'll wonder "Gee, I wonder what woulda happened if I started with an 18?". :)

[MistressofDeath]

I have two level 14 clerics. One is a hafling and the other is an elf. Both have a nice wisdom score, but not maxed, so that I could take charisma too, because charisma helps with turning the undead and crowd control spells. Also, my elf took an enhancement and was able to rez the dead at level 6. I am different in that neither of my clerics do any battling, they strictly heal and crowd control when necessary!

Also, watch out for those sceptors that will help your spells be more effective and items to help increase stat scores. Skill points into heal is very helpful.

And ask your party for money to help out!

Enjoy!

[Impaqt]

16 Vs 18 Wisdom

10 Spell Points at Creation
1 (Yes, Just ONE) Spell Point Per Level
1 DC to spells like Command.

The thinking that a 16 Starting Wisdom gimps your cleric is a rediculous myth. Look at my 28pt Nullification CLeric build.

On a Human, I kinda like going 17 though since we have the Extra enhancment. Planning for l20 and following the rules of PnP with the Known enhancments we end up like this

17 Base
3 Cleric Wisdom
1 Human Adaptability
5 Level up Points
5 +5 Tome
6 +6 Item
---
37 Max Wisdom

ZOMG! Thats an Odd Number!!!!

Yes, It is, but THat gives me a fudge factor always. Planning for a max 36 Wisdom means I can save 6 Action Points or Use them to even out my wisdom score at any time. Plus, You never know if we'll get WIsdom IV Back at some point...... THat would be nice and move this build up to a 38 Potential.

THe key to being the best cleric you can be is proper use of Metamagics and Know what spels to cast when. On my null cleric, I can throw a destruction at anything and succeed for the most part. But on my MC Clerics, I need to pick and choose a bit. Know what mobs have poor saves against what spells.

On the offensive side:
Destruction is Fort, Greater COmmand is WIll, Blade Barrier is Reflex.

Knowing how and when to use these 3 spells effectivly Is the key to getting out of most every situation.

As far as healing goes, Weigh the benefits of your healing capabilites against what kind of groups you normally run with. Empower Healing is a nice metamagic, but if your not running with a bunch of 50hp Barbarians all the time, you wind up wasting those 10 exra spell points often.

I often suggest taking Empower Healing early in a build, but then swapping it out to Empower or Maximize spell once you gain access to the HEAL spell. Once you have HEAL, theres little reason to use any other single hit cure spell. HEAL and Mass CUres save you TONS of mana.

--------

Depending on your financial situation, dont be afraid to use your offensive spells to excess. A Dead or commanded mob cannot cause damage to your party. commanding a group of 5-6 mobs sure costs a lot less mana than healing the 2-3fighters that rush into the middle of them and start hacing away.

Wisdom is of course the most important Stat... 16-18 Base is always recomended

If you want to swing a weapon now and then I've found that a 14 STR is plenty. 20 with DIvine Power up thi sputs you at over +20 base attack at level 14 with a decent weapon in hand.

You want to max concentration regardless of whether you plan to take Quicken spell or not.

Dont underestimate Diplomacy! Its Instant AOE and with a good score you can shed almost any aggro. (Including the reaver on Elite)

Dont bother with much Dex.

CHR of 12-14 is great if ya wanna DV. Dump stat it if your not worried about Turn based Abilities.

Good luck, and if you have any specific questions dont be afraid to ask. My cleric guide is around here somewhere as well... I should link that in my sig I guess....

[Impaqt]

I have two level 14 clerics. One is a hafling and the other is an elf. Both have a nice wisdom score, but not maxed, so that I could take charisma too, because charisma helps with turning the undead and crowd control spells.

Enjoy!


Charisma has no effect on any Cleric Spells.

[juniorpfactors]

last week I deleted my original 28 point 1750 favor toon...jrpfactor

32pt rerolled him with this style in mind.....in 1 week I am at midway through lvl6

s12 then ate +1 tome @ 16 now
d 9 then ate +1 tome @ 10
c 15 then ate +1 tome @ 18
i 8
w18 then ate +1 tome @ 24
ch 11 @12

max wis, its nice thowing around heitend Soundboursts and Commands....also have emp healing and bastard swords feat for fun while soloing(advantage of being human, extra feat) and mental toughness...down the line i will take Necro feat

[Seylene]

Thanks for the all the replies so far!

These are my current stats on Zullah at lvl 3:

Base Str: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Dex: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Con: 13 +1 tome = 14 (I think, or maybe it's 12??)
Base Int: 8
Base Wiz: 18 +1 tome + 1 stat = 20
Base Cha: 13 +1 tome = 14

Sound reasonable so far? I am putting my very few skill pts mainly in Concentration and heal atm. I believe I'm leaving my cha as is in case I have a free spot to wear an item. I put in the dex so I can wear mithral fp. Will work on getting the Con up for sure as well.

[Ringos]

Now hold up there Impact...I may have missed it, but I didn't see anyone screamin' that a 16 Wis Cleric is a gimped Cleric. A couple of us recommended the max, but said that if you don't max it's not that big of deal. Maybe you have us confused with the haters on the main Cleric board?

[juniorpfactors]

Thanks for the all the replies so far!

These are my current stats on Zullah at lvl 3:

Base Str: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Dex: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Con: 13 +1 tome = 14 (I think, or maybe it's 12??)
Base Int: 8
Base Wiz: 18 +1 tome + 1 stat = 20
Base Cha: 13 +1 tome = 14

Sound reasonable so far? I am putting my very few skill pts mainly in Concentration and heal atm. I believe I'm leaving my cha as is in case I have a free spot to wear an item. I put in the dex so I can wear mithral fp. Will work on getting the Con up for sure as well.

lots of different ways to mix the numbers ... I personally like higher CON if you like to be offensive its nice to get con to22, but 20 is still goood...but looks good to me have fun

[binnsr]

Thanks for the all the replies so far!

These are my current stats on Zullah at lvl 3:

Base Str: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Dex: 11 +1 tome = 12
Base Con: 13 +1 tome = 14 (I think, or maybe it's 12??)
Base Int: 8
Base Wiz: 18 +1 tome + 1 stat = 20
Base Cha: 13 +1 tome = 14

Sound reasonable so far? I am putting my very few skill pts mainly in Concentration and heal atm. I believe I'm leaving my cha as is in case I have a free spot to wear an item. I put in the dex so I can wear mithral fp. Will work on getting the Con up for sure as well.
That looks fairly similar to my offensive caster cleric (although, as Ringos can attest - I suck at clericing :))
My feat advice is similar to Impaqts - except that I planned for Maximize (and added Empower for Mod5). I started with:
MT / Empower Healing
Extend
IMT
Maximize
Empower (I hit lvl12 shortly before mod5, so took this in anticipation of the new metamagic system but didn't really use it - I couldn't really justify 175sp blade barriers :))

After mod5 came out, I dropped Empowered Healing for Quicken and haven't looked back since (other than to wish I had spent my skill points somewhere other than in concentration :(). If I wasn't using Extend for blade barriers semi-regularly, I would drop it for Spell Focus: Necromancy for that little extra oomph to my Destructions - and will probably end up taking it as my lvl15 feat anyway.

Running in offensive mode, she's typically got Quicken, Maximize and Empower turned on all the time - and only uses Heal or Mass Cure Moderate. With those three feats turned on, CSW actually costs more than Heal since Heal isn't affected by Maximize or Empower. Something else to keep in mind with that mindset is that your party members need to get used to having about 50% health before the Heal hits (which, incidentally, coincides with my tendency to not pay enough attention to their health all the time anyway :cool:)

[MysticRhythms]

I say this in almost every post asking for build advice.

Paying 6 points to take a 16 to an 18 in a starting stat (or an 18 to a 20 for some races) is often a waste of build points.

I'd much rather spend 6 points to raise another meaningful stat (like Con) from 8 to 14.

[Ringos]

I say this in almost every post asking for build advice.

Paying 6 points to take a 16 to an 18 in a starting stat (or an 18 to a 20 for some races) is often a waste of build points.

I'd much rather spend 6 points to raise another meaningful stat (like Con) from 8 to 14.

I know what you are saying and it makes sense, but to me going from 16 to 18 is like getting a +1 to all spell DC (like a Feat for those extra stat points) and a few extra spell points. Droppin' to a 17 is usually what I do on most alts. On other servers where I still only have 28 pt build, I never max out a stat. At that point it can really weaken the overall build.

[Impaqt]

I disagree, max out your Wis score at first level, and likely put every point leveling up into it, unless you want to develop another stat a little bit. My reasoning is at lower level the mana is going to limited enough as is and you'll want to be able to have the highest DC possible against resisting your spells later on. If you don't max it out, you can't reallocate your stats at a later time, you can always swap out equipment or enhancements.
THis makes no sense.... Your worried about SPell Points and DC with your Initial Stats, but then say you dont need to take the cleric Enhancment line as well? 18 + No Enhancments = 18 16 + WIS II = 18 It the same in the end THe person who started with 16 has the exact same Spell points and DC's. If yourt going for max Wisdom, GO for max Wisdom. Dont mess around

Also, by putting enough points into Wisdom, you can instead avoid putting points into the Wisdom enhancement lines and instead put them into the Metamagic cost reduction lines. You only get 20 or so extra mana at a high level from an extra 2 Wis, but you can save yourself several times that by getting the metamagic reduction lines while significantly boosting spell effectiveness.
What Metamagic Reduction Lines? Clerics only one ONE metamagic reduction line.... and thats for Empower Healing..... a Meta that is not recomending very often..... Especially for a Offensive caster type build

If you care about Turning or DVs, put at least a 14 into CHA. Otherwise put the bulk of points into CON to give yourself a high save for fort and higher HP. If you’re dead likely no one will be raising you and the party could more easily wipe.



COnfused COmments WIthin

[Kerr]

16 Vs 18 Wisdom
Yes, It is, but THat gives me a fudge factor always. Planning for a max 36 Wisdom means I can save 6 Action Points or Use them to even out my wisdom score at any time. Plus, You never know if we'll get WIsdom IV Back at some point...... THat would be nice and move this build up to a 38 Potential.

That's my thinking. Even so, assuming Wisdom IV comes back, I don't believe that the 8 APs that may require would be worth the 8 APs you could put into Metamagic enhancements. You come out effectively with more times you can throw a metamagicked spell having spent those 8 on the metamagic enhancements than you get mana for that extra 1 point of Wisdom from the enhancement.

[Impaqt]

That's my thinking. Even so, assuming Wisdom IV comes back, I don't believe that the 8 APs that may require would be worth the 8 APs you could put into Metamagic enhancements. You come out effectively with more times you can throw a metamagicked spell having spent those 8 on the metamagic enhancements than you get mana for that extra 1 point of Wisdom from the enhancement.


What metamagic Enhancments?

[Kerr]

COnfused COmments WIthin

I hate it when people do that, now I can't quote exactly what you said for easier replies.

But to what you said, maxing the stat at first level covers your bases. Enhancements come and go, you can respec your enhancements at any time if you want to get max Wisdom for best DC. Your stats chosen at first level however are immutable. The Devs have indicated they have no intention to allow respecing of levels or creation, you have to reroll if you want to change those stats. Take max Wis stat and then play with your enhancements as you like until you get what you want, but be safe and take the best you can on character creation.

[Kerr]

What metamagic Enhancments?

The Empower healing one, and the others that may or may not come down the line later as enhancements continue being tweaked.

Not to mention the boosts to healing from the lines of healing, smiting, greater life crits etc.

[MysticRhythms]

I know what you are saying and it makes sense, but to me going from 16 to 18 is like getting a +1 to all spell DC (like a Feat for those extra stat points)
But going from an 8 to a 14 Con is a gain of 42 hit points (which increases to 60 at level 20) and a +3 to Fortitude saves and Concentration skill checks - more than "two feats worth of stuff." It's like you just took:

Toughness
Toughness
Toughness
Skill Focus(Concentration)
Great Fortitude+ (since the improvement is +3 instead of +2)

I think 18's are tremendously overrated.

[binnsr]

I went with an 18 Wis because, frankly, I didn't *need* the build points anywhere else.. I agree that you can be effective with a 16 Wis, but if you're going to be an offensive caster, wouldn't you want your DCs to be the highest you can justify (and I understand some folks just can't justify using 6 build points for a +1 to all DCs - I can since adding +1 to a single spell school costs a feat)

I started Zhelda with 12 / 10 / 12 / 8 / 18 / 14 (or 4/2/4/0/16/6 build points). I have 230 hit points (with only a +4 item and no tome), use Quicken almost exclusively (discounting any concentration bonus to a higher con), have 9 DVs (from a 20 end cha) and a 30 Wis (+1 tome, +5 item and +3 enhancements (vice +4) - with the potential for 34 with better gear)
With a +4 str item, I've got all the carrying capacity that I need, and as an offensive caster, I'm not terribly worried about my AC (although I would carry a shield if I could find a 1-h superior potency VI item)

[sigtrent]

I went with an 18 Wis because, frankly, I didn't *need* the build points anywhere else..

That is pretty much my reasoning when I take an 18 as well, that or I'm just trying to push the envelope for a particular build feature for the sake of being "the best".

But If I look at a buidl with an 18 and think... dang I just need a couple more points of X to make this work right... then I take the 18 down a notch or two to get the points and it doesn't much hurt the build in the end.

[binnsr]

That is pretty much my reasoning when I take an 18 as well, that or I'm just trying to push the envelope for a particular build feature for the sake of being "the best".

But If I look at a buidl with an 18 and think... dang I just need a couple more points of X to make this work right... then I take the 18 down a notch or two to get the points and it doesn't much hurt the build in the end.

Agreed -- I start with 17 or 19 much more often than I start with an 18 :) (or in the case of my drow rogue, 3 16s :))

[DoctorWhofan]

WWWWRRRRROOOOONGGGGGG Server for this question!:p:p

I think half of Thelanis Forum are expert clerics builders

Mine, lvl 14 Drow cleric. No, I did not max out my WIS, she started with a 17. Now sitting at 30 with a +5 item on
CHA started as a 15, now a 20, +1 tome and Ring of the Silver Concord (I got that on my first raid with Mistressofdeath and beat her on the roll for it!:p)

My INT was a 12, so I got 3 skill points per level. SUnk them in UMD, Concentration, and Heal

My CON and STR are 16

My DEX is 14, just because I have a +4 item on, not because I need it.

I have Empower, but a so very rarely use it. I am not a huge fan of metamagic, on clerics or on casters. You will have to ask someone else for advice on that.

1295 spell points
She's a healbot, buffer, and offensive caster; in that order.

Enhancenments i would reccommend: DV, Stat WIS, STat CHA, extra turning, and the healing (not the skill) enhancements.

[Ringos]

But going from an 8 to a 14 Con is a gain of 42 hit points (which increases to 60 at level 20) and a +3 to Fortitude saves and Concentration skill checks - more than "two feats worth of stuff." It's like you just took:

Toughness
Toughness
Toughness
Skill Focus(Concentration)
Great Fortitude+ (since the improvement is +3 instead of +2)

I think 18's are tremendously overrated.

But how many people take ALL from Con to put into Wis? I know that I never said to do that. I skimp on Int and Dex. It seems like a couple of folks are getting worked up (I may be wrong) over this issue. I really could care less what someone else's Wis is, I am just giving opinions and I state it that way. I'm not trying to come accross as the Guru nor do I claim to be. I like what I have built so I shared it and stated multiple times that there is no one 'right' way to do it. That's why you probably won't catch me trying to hard to sway people to the way I think. I'll pass my opinion and that's about it. I like to be functional in my role and have a good time running quests. It doesn't require sitting down and calculating formulas (although I do enjoy reading other people's findings and thoughts on many matters). I get a lot out of threads like this and I have gained a lot of information by reading Impacts Cleric posts.

As far as Kerr's logic, it seems as though he is saying no matter what they do in the future (feats, enhancements etc.), maxing out your Wis will ensure that you won't get hosed (hey, it COULD happen).

[Kerr]

As far as Kerr's logic, it seems as though he is saying no matter what they do in the future (feats, enhancements etc.), maxing out your Wis will ensure that you won't get hosed (hey, it COULD happen).

Essentially. A primary casters's attribute can never suffer by being too high.

[Memnir]

I do have one question for the Cleric experts out there concerning a build I'm pondering...

Which would be the better route to focus on concerning offensive cleric spells: take a Necro focus and amp up my Negative spells via Life Magic - or take the more enhancement costly path of taking Cleric Smiting & an Evocation focus to boost up alignment based spells? I'm conflicted because I know that Slay Living and Harm are necro, while I've seen some pretty nasty damage come from Searing Light, ect... heck - I've seen the STK Guardian taken down with Nimbus of Light when the Sorc dropped. Also, Blade Barrier is an Evocation spell, so a focus there may help prevent saves.

While it would not be the primary objective of my build to use spells offensively - I would like to know which is more effective should I chose to go down that path. Thanks in advance for any advice you can lend on the matter. :)

[Ringos]

I've never really focused on anything and do ok at most things...I can Banish and Destruct air elementals about 50% of the time on Reaver elite. I have used enhancements to boost my light spells (don't use them much), but haven't gotten around to swapping out my extra turn feats for the necro focus yet, but I want to get that done as it should help my Destruction hit more opten. BTW, I think I started at a 15 Wis and I can only get it to 29, just for a frame of reference. Impact is an expert on building for negative spells so he should have some good insight there.

[Uamhas]

Take a look at how many necro spells do stat damage, (like, for instance, contagion) and factor in having baddies that share your alignment (marut = one example of order's wrath tanking.)
I do have one question for the Cleric experts out there concerning a build I'm pondering...

Which would be the better route to focus on concerning offensive cleric spells: take a Necro focus and amp up my Negative spells via Life Magic - or take the more enhancement costly path of taking Cleric Smiting & an Evocation focus to boost up alignment based spells? I'm conflicted because I know that Slay Living and Harm are necro, while I've seen some pretty nasty damage come from Searing Light, ect... heck - I've seen the STK Guardian taken down with Nimbus of Light when the Sorc dropped. Also, Blade Barrier is an Evocation spell, so a focus there may help prevent saves.

While it would not be the primary objective of my build to use spells offensively - I would like to know which is more effective should I chose to go down that path. Thanks in advance for any advice you can lend on the matter. :)

[DoctorWhofan]

I do have one question for the Cleric experts out there concerning a build I'm pondering...

Which would be the better route to focus on concerning offensive cleric spells: take a Necro focus and amp up my Negative spells via Life Magic - or take the more enhancement costly path of taking Cleric Smiting & an Evocation focus to boost up alignment based spells? I'm conflicted because I know that Slay Living and Harm are necro, while I've seen some pretty nasty damage come from Searing Light, ect... heck - I've seen the STK Guardian taken down with Nimbus of Light when the Sorc dropped. Also, Blade Barrier is an Evocation spell, so a focus there may help prevent saves.

While it would not be the primary objective of my build to use spells offensively - I would like to know which is more effective should I chose to go down that path. Thanks in advance for any advice you can lend on the matter. :)

While I use the enhancement paths on most to boost my healing, I hav never taken the feats. It really depends on what kind of cleric you are going to be. For DDO purposes, most of my clerics are not combat people, so i don't focus my enhancements/feats/skills into it. Though, in PnP, they would be considered "battle clerics" Here, I am a healbot/buffer/den mother type, which is fine by me. Going more combative, i.e. dropping feats/enhancements/skill points into an aggressive caster is fine, but the healling may suffer. Going DDO "Battle Cleric" is another direction.

Whatever you do, remember: When someone has an LFM up for a cleric, they want a HEALER. Be prepared to fill that role. If not, or if you lose sight of it in the middle of combat, that may reflect badly upon yourself. That's why "battle Clerics" have such a bad rep. Not because it can't work, cuz there are people you can juggle the two, it's because people hired a cleric but got a tank, thus fustrating everyone in the party, and maybe even causing party wipes.

[Ringos]

Funny DoctorWhoFan...We we on an upper-level quest and the cleric we picked up to fill the slot actually WARNED us that he was a healing cleric! He wanted to make sure we didn't have a problem with that. I couldn't convice him enough that it was perfectly OK with us!!

[DoctorWhofan]

Funny DoctorWhoFan...We we on an upper-level quest and the cleric we picked up to fill the slot actually WARNED us that he was a healing cleric! He wanted to make sure we didn't have a problem with that. I couldn't convice him enough that it was perfectly OK with us!!

LOL!

THat's actually sad. I assume that all clerics are healing clerics, until warned.

THough, as a confession, I did recieve Cloudburst and kept it on Trissa. (FYI, Trissa does NOT have greatsword prof)I did the Reaver pre-raid with jrp, and I was running around with it at the beginning hitting the garden ordenments!!! I did put it away when it can time for the real battles with the dragons.

It was fun, and everyone was laughing at me, but i was still watching the bars, too. Once in a while, getting 20 kills on a pre-raid without using offensive spells is kinda nice for me. :p I wouldn't make a habit of it, though! :D

[TreknaQudane]

I'm probably the worst person to take any sort of cleric information from.

If you've seen Suvene or Oleaceae running around Thelanis, that's me.

And why am I the worst to listen too? Clerics gain maybe one spell a level that directly relates to healing. Why should that one spell each level be their focus? Granted, my clerics do have healing spells loaded and ready for quick use, I won't top someone off, nor heal them if they decide to run off on their own. Nor will I buff a ranger or a paladin for resists if they can cast it. I try to be self sufficient on my and expect others to do so as well. The spells I usually use consist of Mass Cure Light, Mass Cure Moderate, and Heal. The rest of my mana goes to Command, Holy Smite/Orders Wrath, and much Slay and Destruction.

It's also not out of character to see Suvene using her +4 Flaming Burst Longsword of Pure Good, which she has proficiency in thanks to being a follower of the Soveriegn host, and whacking the baddies.

And thats pretty much the same for Oleaceae, except replace Slay and Destruction with Damage based spells since her/its wisdom is a bit lower than Suvene.... oh yeah... and Oleaceae has a Greatsword ... crazy toaster.

On a side note, both of my clerics wear a fearsome item... a must have for any cleric that finds themselves at the end of a blade (In my case its the third rank emerald claw necklace)

[wraith87]

I do have one question for the Cleric experts out there concerning a build I'm pondering...

Which would be the better route to focus on concerning offensive cleric spells: take a Necro focus and amp up my Negative spells via Life Magic - or take the more enhancement costly path of taking Cleric Smiting & an Evocation focus to boost up alignment based spells? I'm conflicted because I know that Slay Living and Harm are necro, while I've seen some pretty nasty damage come from Searing Light, ect... heck - I've seen the STK Guardian taken down with Nimbus of Light when the Sorc dropped. Also, Blade Barrier is an Evocation spell, so a focus there may help prevent saves.

While it would not be the primary objective of my build to use spells offensively - I would like to know which is more effective should I chose to go down that path. Thanks in advance for any advice you can lend on the matter. :)

Write down the various necro spells. Then write down the various alignment-based spells. Write down what can be affected by each underneath, and where this will help you at. Then you can kinda decide based on the findings.

Personally, I took the life magic route since it helps with the healing aspect of my cleric as well as the damage output for neg energy spells. I've also got a Sup Null VI sceptre I pull out when I go into a quest and figure on a lot of time spent with neg damage spells instead of healing.

With the very few number of feats you get as a cleric, I tended to focus less on Spell Focus enhancements, and go for the Spell Points, Maximize, Extend, etc to help out with buffs and damage. Even if they save, it still can do some pretty nasty damage with a Greater/Sup Potency item and Maximize on when you throw out a Blade Barrier.

[gorloch]

Good build suggestions. I would like to put in some gameplay options that could help. The best advice I was given when playing my cleric is to move the party names to jut off the side of the middle. You can see what you are fighting/casting spells against but also able to keep a good eye on the parties health. It might take a bit to get used to it really does help. Learned this by a couple of the best clerics I have ever come across.

[ace_mason]

Arwene please look me up in game. Or I will look for you. I would highly recomend going with a Rev build.

[Uamhas]

*Hugs the lilac warfrog*
I'm probably the worst person to take any sort of cleric information from.

If you've seen Suvene or Oleaceae running around Thelanis, that's me.

And why am I the worst to listen too? Clerics gain maybe one spell a level that directly relates to healing. Why should that one spell each level be their focus? Granted, my clerics do have healing spells loaded and ready for quick use, I won't top someone off, nor heal them if they decide to run off on their own. Nor will I buff a ranger or a paladin for resists if they can cast it. I try to be self sufficient on my and expect others to do so as well. The spells I usually use consist of Mass Cure Light, Mass Cure Moderate, and Heal. The rest of my mana goes to Command, Holy Smite/Orders Wrath, and much Slay and Destruction.

It's also not out of character to see Suvene using her +4 Flaming Burst Longsword of Pure Good, which she has proficiency in thanks to being a follower of the Soveriegn host, and whacking the baddies.

And thats pretty much the same for Oleaceae, except replace Slay and Destruction with Damage based spells since her/its wisdom is a bit lower than Suvene.... oh yeah... and Oleaceae has a Greatsword ... crazy toaster.

On a side note, both of my clerics wear a fearsome item... a must have for any cleric that finds themselves at the end of a blade (In my case its the third rank emerald claw necklace)

[Berryman]

Wow I can't Believe I'm posting here.

[Therbjorn]

Yay! I have been looking for a good idea on clerics for a while.

[Seylene]

Thanks for the input all. Keep posting if anybody has more tidbits to add or recommend. I'll keep checking for new posts. :D

Zullah is just shy of lvl 5 and things have been going well so far, no screw ups yet on my part hehehe

[MysticRhythms]

But how many people take ALL from Con to put into Wis?
I was just illustrating a point. You were trying to defend the increase of a 16 to an 18 by saying "But the 18 is like ... two extra feats for me!" MY point is that for all the 18 gets you that is good, many times people don't weigh what they are giving UP to get that good stuff. It's not like the 18 was free and this is something you absolutely cannot change (as of yet) when you bring your level 1 cleric to a level 14 cleric.


I know that I never said to do that. I skimp on Int and Dex.
That's fine and it's very common for many clerics to do so. You obviously can't put meaningful build points into everything. I'm not advocating that clerics should put 6 points into Intelligence - they have more useful stats. But there is a point of diminshing returns with build points and I jsut like telling players that they don't absolutely HAVE to have a maxxed out stat in ANY build. The other stats all have value. You made it sound like the "free feat" aspect of going from 16-18 was so amazingly impressive that it couldn't compare to the example I gave for Constitution from 8-14.


It seems like a couple of folks are getting worked up (I may be wrong) over this issue.
I don't get "worked up" about it. I see it all the time in builds and I point out the math because people operate off of some bad assumptions (that losing a +1 "gimps" a character). I have said it all along that it's extremely rare for 6 build points to grab a +1 modifier to be "worth it" for ANY build. that's just my opinion - nothing to get worked up about


That's why you probably won't catch me trying to hard to sway people to the way I think.
OK, but I wsn't trying to "sway" anybody. I was pointing out some inconsistencies and offering my opinion that ... because of the math ... 18's are overrated.


As far as Kerr's logic, it seems as though he is saying no matter what they do in the future (feats, enhancements etc.), maxing out your Wis will ensure that you won't get hosed (hey, it COULD happen).
And this is where I step in and say that when you are talking about a Wisdom in the 30's or maybe 40's, the difference between a 34 and a 36 is so marginal that it's not worth 6 entire build points to get it. It's more meaningful when the character's Wisdom is much lower since the individual +1 appears more meaningful.

[juniorpfactors]

But how many people take ALL from Con to put into Wis? I know that I never said to do that. I skimp on Int and Dex. It seems like a couple of folks are getting worked up (I may be wrong) over this issue. I really could care less what someone else's Wis is, I am just giving opinions and I state it that way. I'm not trying to come accross as the Guru nor do I claim to be. I like what I have built so I shared it and stated multiple times that there is no one 'right' way to do it. That's why you probably won't catch me trying to hard to sway people to the way I think. I'll pass my opinion and that's about it. I like to be functional in my role and have a good time running quests. It doesn't require sitting down and calculating formulas (although I do enjoy reading other people's findings and thoughts on many matters). I get a lot out of threads like this and I have gained a lot of information by reading Impacts Cleric posts.

As far as Kerr's logic, it seems as though he is saying no matter what they do in the future (feats, enhancements etc.), maxing out your Wis will ensure that you won't get hosed (hey, it COULD happen).


thats the best part of this Ringos...50 diff ways to do it...and none are right or wrong......Jrp would max wis everytime, con high, points in char and str...for this Style of cleric the op is looking at building....dump stats Int(specially for human) and dex........some would say dumb....jrp would say looks good....great game isnt it.....loot loot loot and making plat keep it fun.....


Jrpfactor

[Ringos]

I was just illustrating a point. You were trying to defend the increase of a 16 to an 18 by saying "But the 18 is like ... two extra feats for me!" MY point is that for all the 18 gets you that is good, many times people don't weigh what they are giving UP to get that good stuff. It's not like the 18 was free and this is something you absolutely cannot change (as of yet) when you bring your level 1 cleric to a level 14 cleric.

*I said 'like getting an extra feat', nothing about 2 extra feats...please don't make things up. Your point on the 16 vs 18 is well taken, as I've stated before. I am not trying to 'defend' going to 18 from 16...that would only be true if I thought that was the ONLY way it should be done, which I don't...as stated previously.


That's fine and it's very common for many clerics to do so. You obviously can't put meaningful build points into everything. I'm not advocating that clerics should put 6 points into Intelligence - they have more useful stats. But there is a point of diminshing returns with build points and I jsut like telling players that they don't absolutely HAVE to have a maxxed out stat in ANY build. The other stats all have value. You made it sound like the "free feat" aspect of going from 16-18 was so amazingly impressive that it couldn't compare to the example I gave for Constitution from 8-14.

*Once again, please read my post. How can anyone get that I said the 'free feat' was 'amazingly impressive' from what I wrote? Geesh.


I don't get "worked up" about it. I see it all the time in builds and I point out the math because people operate off of some bad assumptions (that losing a +1 "gimps" a character). I have said it all along that it's extremely rare for 6 build points to grab a +1 modifier to be "worth it" for ANY build. that's just my opinion - nothing to get worked up about

*Once again, nobody said 16 vs 18 'gimped' anything. Read back.


OK, but I wsn't trying to "sway" anybody. I was pointing out some inconsistencies and offering my opinion that ... because of the math ... 18's are overrated.

*Just because I say that I wasn't trying to sway anybody doesn't imply that you were.


And this is where I step in and say that when you are talking about a Wisdom in the 30's or maybe 40's, the difference between a 34 and a 36 is so marginal that it's not worth 6 entire build points to get it. It's more meaningful when the character's Wisdom is much lower since the individual +1 appears more meaningful.

*As I stated before, the 18 Wis was something that I liked, but the benefits of doing 16 or 17 are obvious.





I'm not much of a posting guru, but I tried to respond above.

[Berryman]

Well I guess its time for me to throw my 2 cents in the pot. I guess I'll start of with Berryman

Berryman (the DDO picked 28pt build)
Start off
14 str
10 dex
10 int
10 con
16 wis
14 cha

I love Berryman, But in the new day and age where we have Sorcs pushing up to 300hp he is outdated. The DDO build is amazing for the overall useful cleric. I tank with him, I heal with him. Couple things i wish I would have changed was his cha. Yeah I have like 8 DV's but I would much rather have that 4 (from cha) go into con instead.

Littleb Evasion Cleric 32 pt (12 Cleric 2 Rogue)

Littleb is my (fairly new) hip Cleric. Some people say "Evasion cleric? Whats your reflex 14?" No its actually around 26 27 area, with Greater Hero 30 31. This cleric build is ideal for: Dragon Raid, Storm Reaver, Lich, and Marilith. Not only is it great for the raids, but some people also have trouble doing the White dragon on Elite (with the constant comet fall). This build is awesome for that situation.

Littleb's start stats

10 str
17 dex
14 con
9 int
17 wis
8 cha

Littleb's End Stats

10 str No item
28 dex
22 con
10 int +1 tome at lvl 1
30 wis
8 cha no item

He's sitting on 252 HP, Not Great but not bad either.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b251/drbassbmd/ScreenShot00025.jpg

[MysticRhythms]

*I said 'like getting an extra feat', nothing about 2 extra feats...please don't make things up.
Fine. You said "an extra feat" and what I said is that going from an 8 to a 14 Con is four and a half extra feats for the same points. We're clear on that now.



*Once again, please read my post. How can anyone get that I said the 'free feat' was 'amazingly impressive' from what I wrote? Geesh.
Maybe by using the same hyperbole that you attributed to my post about "getting worked up?"

I don't get "worked up" about it. I see it all the time in builds and I point out the math because people operate off of some bad assumptions (that losing a +1 "gimps" a character). I have said it all along that it's extremely rare for 6 build points to grab a +1 modifier to be "worth it" for ANY build. that's just my opinion - nothing to get worked up about


Once again, nobody said 16 vs 18 'gimped' anything. Read back.
You can read back too ... I said "people operate off of some bad assumptions." Since your'e being particular about semantics, I never said "Ringos operates off of bad assumptions." You made a sweeping statment about how you said "people get worked up about things." So I made a sweeping statement that people overrate 18's and find 16's gimped.


Just because I say that I wasn't trying to sway anybody doesn't imply that you were.
Please apply that same logic when you analyze my opinions and mistakenly assuem that I'm talking to just you then.


I'm not much of a posting guru, but I tried to respond above.
It's easier whe you leave your own stuff outside of my quotes, but no big deal.

[MysticRhythms]

Littleb Evasion Cleric 32 pt (12 Cleric 2 Rogue)
Race? Halfling?

Edit: Nevermind. I just now saw the screenshot.

[Berryman]

Race? Halfling?

Edit: Nevermind. I just now saw the screenshot.

Yup you got'er

[Kerr]

And this is where I step in and say that when you are talking about a Wisdom in the 30's or maybe 40's, the difference between a 34 and a 36 is so marginal that it's not worth 6 entire build points to get it. It's more meaningful when the character's Wisdom is much lower since the individual +1 appears more meaningful.

That's not the point I'm raising though. My point is that by ensuring your WIS is max on character creation, you get a several fold assurance.

First, if anything ever comes up that requires that high starting stat (which doesn't include enhancements or equipment) you are okay. Case in point, Superior Two Weapon Fighting. Maybe they create or add something that does require the high stat to begin with. We can't predict that, we can only prepare for it by creating the character as is to begin with.

Second, enhancements come and go. They may be updated in the future and cut out some of the bonuses. The difference would then be from a 32 and a 36 or whatever.

Third, taking those stats at character creation allows you to instead of boosting your WIS with enhancements to where you want it frees up those APs to put them into empower healing bonuses, the crit lines for healing/light/good/etc, new prestige class enhancements that may come out, etc.

Fourth, the unknown. Maybe antimagic fields will become active in the future in quests. Walk into them, your +6 Wisdom helm gets negated while you're in it. That's a -3 to your DCs, a lot less mana all of a sudden. Your base attribute can not be affected by an antimagic zone.

So hey, do whatever you want with your build, I'm just trying to make an argument that you can't be hurt by playing it safe and maxing your primary attribute.

[MistressofDeath]

Charisma has no effect on any Cleric Spells. Maybe/Maybe not but it does help with turning undead, and guess what it is a recommended attribute for a cleric. :rolleyes:

[TreknaQudane]

Maybe/Maybe not but it does help with turning undead, and guess what it is a recommended attribute for a cleric. :rolleyes:

It would help were turning worth a **** in this game.

To be remotely -good-, not excellent, just good, you need invest heavily in feats, items and charisma to the point of it being a detriment to the character as a whole.

[Vhlad]

Arwene please look me up in game. Or I will look for you. I would highly recomend going with a Rev build.

Yes I agree.

[ace_mason]

If you are going to be building a heal bot you need to look at what is going to be the best for your play style.A pure healer gets boring after a while and you will end up playing your other toons. If you make a cleric that is speced or just healing you waisted your time. Clerics are the most versatile character in the game. You fill in or any other charcter any be just as effective. From you pm I assume you dont want to melee at all, so dont worry about your str.I would agree with berrymans littleb build with mod6 coming out.
What I would build if I was you:
Human 12/2 Cleric/Rogue
08 Str
15 Dex
14 Con
09 Int
18 Wis
09 Char

Use a +1 char tome and int tome at lvl 1 youll get your extra dv and your extra skill point each lvl.
Cleric lvl 1
Rogue lvl2
Cleric lvl 3-10
Rogue lvl 11
Cleric 12-16
You will end up with the abilty to heal for more hps than a barbarian would need, Have a low 50's standing armor class.Saves all in the mid to high 20's, Evasion, around a 40umd,Blade Barriers that do between 250-300 damage a tick non crit the abilty to buff the party with GH and Stonekin,And you should be able to open any lock in the game.I have been on risia and the 8lvl cleric spells suck.And if you want you can still cast them from scrolls.
If you go straight cleric you will miss out on the umd,open lock,evasion, have less Ac and a lower reflex save. You will be able to mem more spells and have a little bit higher dc to you spells. But trust me it isnt worth it. Just my opinion, most of the time it isnt worth much:D

[Impaqt]

Maybe/Maybe not but it does help with turning undead, and guess what it is a recommended attribute for a cleric. :rolleyes:


Sorry, I'll say it again, This is not up for debate.

Charisma has no effect on Cleric Spells. It doesnt effect DC. It doesnt effect Spell Points.

CHR is recomended because its recomended for PnP. Where Turning Undead actually works. THe only thing it really does for us in DDO is gives us more Turns touse for DV, DH, DL, or whatever. Some people like that, some people dont use it at all. My Null Cleric has a 24 CHR right now and can turn a few undead here and there. But I cant rely on it at all.

[Valzoric]

There are several different thoughts that should go into a cleric:

Do you want a:

Healer?
A buffer?
A battle cleric?
Or a rounded cleric?

From the OP's post it sounds like he's after a well rounded cleric. Something that can Heal, buff, cast DV's and toss the occasional dmg/resist/other spell to lend a hand.

First and foremost you need a decent Wisdom. Nothing lower then a 16, and an 18 would be the best, but a 17 wouldn't be horrible. At Lvls 4/8/12/(16) you will get Stat bonuses which you can use to increase wisdom, not to mention there is the enhancements for Wisdom.

If you start at wis 16: 16+3(for current lvl bonuses thru 12)+3(from the enhancement line)+6(stat item) = 28 (Add tome of your chosing)
wis 17 : 17+3+3+6 = 29
wis 18: 18+3+3+6 = 30

Second stat you should probably focus on is having a decent con. More con = More hp = being able to stand longer in battle.

Third stat: Cha. Turns per day are based off of Cha. This will give you more DV's, Divine Healing, etc. should you choose to take any.

Unless you're really planning on getting into a battle and whacking stuff, you don't need to worry about str too much. Dex is nice for a little AC bonus, but again, think about what you really want to do with your Cleric.



You should obtain a wizardry/power item for yourself. I myself carry a Magi scepter, which if your going to buff, it's nice to eat up that extra 100 sp in buffs, and still have the majority of your sp for other things

You should also obtain a Devotion/Potency item. Devotion only increases healing spells, where potency helps all spells. It can be difficult to find high lvls of both....so it's always smart to keep options in mind.

[Wotansdottir]

Hell froze over...

Erda is trying Berryman's Littleb build just for ***** and giggles... why is this a big deal... Anyone who knows me knows I hate battle clerics (except for Alandale who is teh rox0r) and am resistant to changing my precious main. So rolling anything other than a healing centric character was pretty much unthinkable until yesterday. Erda (meaning me) is about the most anal retentive healing-centric cleric on the server. Enough of that "I don't heal you between fights." She does. 1XXX point crit heal? Why the heck not? Just for the fun of it. Full red bars (except for Icey) at all times? Umm, duh? The secret to her success lately is a wonderful little thing called maxxed out mass cure light and mod... wield it intelligently... hop into the middle of the fray when you need it, hightail it to the fringe when you don't. Target the head melee and keep them in your sights when they *cough cough Sharm* decide to use their vicious greataxe of greater undead bane and never EVER carry a single pot... Check. Gimped 28 point (I would have given her more CON, more CHA, less STR) might as well have been the game-generated cleric? Mmm hmm. But again... it's the player that makes the cleric. She's necro-specced, and hits her spells (with the rolls of course) as much as any capped's sorc's finger of death.

Fear the Unicorn.

Uma has chimed in here a bit too, and I realized while talking to her that Uma and Erda are very similar builds and mostly in the way we play our girls. I am strictly of the opinion that if you want to melee... Play a melee. I don't play Pen and paper, I don't know what clerics roles are there, and I really don't care. Some people have helped to soften my ice cold heart here and there (such as Alandale and Berryman, mwah!) but I still stand true to this. If I'm on Siggy... and she's tanking the Reaver, I sure as hell don't want my cleric up there thwacking away with their cloudburst. I want to know you've got my back and when the chips are down, my cleric will be there with that crit heal when I need it. Just my opinion. You don't have to agree! :D Ultimately it comes down to the person and not the build... if I know I'm grouped with a certain B.C. and know what their character can do, I will see that they are a competent and well-built character who won't let me down should I need that emergency heal.

With that said, I think the evasion cleric is a really good idea... the only stat I'm a little wary about is having such low strength... so far it takes her about 20 minutes to whittle down a kobold rogue on elite! Yuck! :P But that's what my faithful tank is for, eh? I keep them from dying if they promise to slap around Koboldy McKoboldson for me. We'll see how it ends up. Won't be able to really get a bead on it till the 2nd rogue level, but just from playing my other characters I've come to appreciate the evasion a TON. Good luck!

[Seylene]

If you are going to be building a heal bot you need to look at what is going to be the best for your play style.A pure healer gets boring after a while and you will end up playing your other toons. If you make a cleric that is speced or just healing you waisted your time. Clerics are the most versatile character in the game. You fill in or any other charcter any be just as effective. From you pm I assume you dont want to melee at all, so dont worry about your str.I would agree with berrymans littleb build with mod6 coming out.
What I would build if I was you:
Human 12/2 Cleric/Rogue
08 Str
15 Dex
14 Con
09 Int
18 Wis
09 Char

Use a +1 char tome and int tome at lvl 1 youll get your extra dv and your extra skill point each lvl.
Cleric lvl 1
Rogue lvl2
Cleric lvl 3-10
Rogue lvl 11
Cleric 12-16
You will end up with the abilty to heal for more hps than a barbarian would need, Have a low 50's standing armor class.Saves all in the mid to high 20's, Evasion, around a 40umd,Blade Barriers that do between 250-300 damage a tick non crit the abilty to buff the party with GH and Stonekin,And you should be able to open any lock in the game.I have been on risia and the 8lvl cleric spells suck.And if you want you can still cast them from scrolls.
If you go straight cleric you will miss out on the umd,open lock,evasion, have less Ac and a lower reflex save. You will be able to mem more spells and have a little bit higher dc to you spells. But trust me it isnt worth it. Just my opinion, most of the time it isnt worth much:D

Hehehe, Rev, you know my main is my sorc and that I'm all about spellcasting and nuking :) and I play smart enough not to die :p. No, I do not want to just have a plain healer that is for sure cuz I know I will be bored (already a bit bored at lvl 5 since I'm hungry for more spells). My main goal is to be well rounded and will stick to pure cleric just for the learning experience since this is my first. I am definitely going to work in all the fun stuff like BB, cc and insta-kill spells.

Just to reiterate, my start stats were (after eating +1 tomes): 12/12/14/8/19/14

I'm not going to touch my STR or CHA anymore at this point in time. Will work to max out on the CON, DEX and WIS only. Will max out SP any way I can as well.

What I'm still confused about from reading some of the posts are the cleric feat selections. Something along the lines of dropping empowered healing after you get the heal spell? Is it not worth keeping anymore (I currently have it now, but only turn it on for a boost in sticky situations)? Any more comments on feats would be welcomed.

For enhancements, I'm looking towards the obvious sp, wis, healing ones. Debating on the damage ones (smiting??)... and I'm not sure if I have enuf to go with the wand/scroll line either. Tho I like to alternate spells/wands/scrolls for healing. Comments on this would be useful to me too.

Thx :D

[ace_mason]

Erda
I am so glad you are coming to the dark side and multi classing your cleric. I would love to run some low level quests with you to help you level up. I would like to see more Clogues on the server. I dont think you will regret it. What is your new characters name?

[Seylene]

BTW, my bard gave me a little bit of healing training in preparation for this, so I'm used to using wands/scrolls a lot

[ace_mason]

Hehehe, Rev, My main goal is to be well rounded and will stick to pure cleric just for the learning experience since this is my first. Thx :D

You are breaking my heart:(. From playing with you, I know that what ever build you make it will be uber.I am probably going to bringing up a new toon soon. Hopefully we can run together.

[Seylene]

You are breaking my heart:(. From playing with you, I know that what ever build you make it will be uber.I am probably going to bringing up a new toon soon. Hopefully we can run together.

:( I'm sorry. It's just that I'm not knowledgeable enough to multi-class just yet. I know I'll screw it up if I do it at the wrong place or pick the wrong stuff, etc. Then I'll be mad :D and my delete finger will get itchy.

Thanks for the vote of confidence!! :D I think the cleric will be the hardest class for me to learn and get used to, but I'm so far committed to grinding away at it. And if I succeed I can brag that I can successfully play pretty much any class :D

[Velorn]

Hell froze over...

With that said, I think the evasion cleric is a really good idea... the only stat I'm a little wary about is having such low strength... so far it takes her about 20 minutes to whittle down a kobold rogue on elite! Yuck! :P But that's what my faithful tank is for, eh? I keep them from dying if they promise to slap around Koboldy McKoboldson for me. We'll see how it ends up. Won't be able to really get a bead on it till the 2nd rogue level, but just from playing my other characters I've come to appreciate the evasion a TON. Good luck!

I butchered your post for space:D:D That's what Freebee thinks stunning blow and a tenderizer is for. I stun...you wack and have fun. I think that's why I like the Titan raid so much.:D:D

[weyoun]

Hey Arwene - I sent you two builds- neither were human, but you can adjust accordingly.

[Seylene]

Thx :) Are you sure it's updated? I don't see Quicken in there for Lysol!! :D