Forum Wipe Repost: High AC Ranger

[Gol]

As anybody who knows me would tell you, I don't do pure class builds, and this is no exception. The purpose of this build is to hit max non-shielded (aka TWF or bow) AC using Ranger as the primary class. Please note, this build is currently just a hypothetical build, as it relies on the Monk class (eventually) being released and it assumes that the "Wisdom bonus to AC" class feature from PnP carries over into DDO. The idea here is that after you hit level 15, you can still reach the XP cap of 16.9999 even without taking your 16th level. If Monk comes out before the cap is raised again, take your first level of Monk. If not, you're not a bit behind. For the sake of this post, though, I'm going to assume Monk comes out before the cap goes up again.

Also, I know AC is considered to be largely worthless at high-level content. My hope is that we can reach numbers that will at least make a difference. 55 AC with only 1 self buff is nothing to sneeze at.

Race: Halfling
Class breakdown: Ranger 12 / Paladin 3 / Monk 1

Stats
Str 10 (4) + 6 item/tome = 16
Dex 18 (10) + 6 item + 2 halfling + 3 ranger + 4 level + 1 tome = 34
Con 14 (6) + 6 item/tome = 20
Int 8 (0) + 0 = 8
Wis 16 (10) + 6 item + 2 favor tome = 24
Cha 10 (2) + 1 paladin + 1 tome + 6 item = 18

At 34 dex with a bunch of Ranger levels, your offensive tactics should be obvious. TWF or a Bow, duh. I'm not going to address that any more, there are plenty of other threads for that.

Feats
1) Finesse
3) Dodge
6) Mobility
9) Spring Attack
12) Imp Crit of your choice
15) Two Weapon Defense

AC breakdown
10 Base
01 Halfling Size
02 Paladin Aura (self)
05 Natural (self cast Barkskin)
12 Dexterity
01 Dodge
01 Two Weapon Defense
01 Parrying weapon
07 Wisdom Mod (from Monk, see above)
02 Chaosgarde
06 White Dragonscale Robe
02 Ranger Tempest I
05 Protection
55 AC while TWF (51 Bow) with no Raid loot and only 1 self buff.

The Chattering Ring from the Titan obviously gives you 3 more, and we've yet to see the "upgraded" Abbott loot, so that may help too.

Why no shield, you ask? In PnP, a Monk loses his Wisdom bonus when using a shield. You also lose the Two Weapon Defense, Tempest, and Parrying bonuses. Equipping a shield actually means you lose 4 AC in this case.

Regarding Tempest II - devs have indicated it will be a level 15 enhancement and may grant even more bonuses to AC while wielding Two Weapons. My ideal level 20 build is Ranger 15 / Paladin 4 / Monk 1, but I may move 1 Paladin level to Ranger or Monk depending on enhancements.

1/5/2008: edit to upgrade to White Dragonscale Robe, which has a higher armor bonus than the others

[Strakeln]

Does the shield spell take away the monk's wis bonus? Shield 1 wands are cheap and easy to UMD, shield 10 wands are relatively easy to come by if you can UMD it.

[WeiQuinn]

Does the shield spell take away the monk's wis bonus? Shield 1 wands are cheap and easy to UMD, shield 10 wands are relatively easy to come by if you can UMD it.

No, I don't think the Shield spell adversely affects Monks, since you're not burdened physically with a shield strapped to your forearm.

[Gol]

No, I don't think the Shield spell adversely affects Monks, since you're not burdened physically with a shield strapped to your forearm.
True, however it would overlap with TWD and/or the Tempest bonus. TWD is labeled as a shield bonus, and we obviously won't know how Tempest works until we see mod 6.

[WeiQuinn]

This is thinking way ahead, but here goes...

Take a Ranger/Monk hybrid with Weapon Finesse and the Tempest Enhancement. Weapon Finesse considers Unarmed to be Finesseable, so would an Unarmed Fighting Monk reap the bonuses of the Tempest Enhancement?

[Benjai]

True, however it would overlap with TWD and/or the Tempest bonus. TWD is labeled as a shield bonus, and we obviously won't know how Tempest works until we see mod 6.
Wrongo, but even if it did, if you were going for AC the shield spell would be far better. But no, shield stacks with TWD, as I just did it in game just now.

Also why not max dex? Thats 1 more AC (and to hit and reflex save). You could sacrifice the con for it.

[kensihin_Himura]

You would lose alot of dps and some ac if you went unarmed if your only going to take one level of monk. I believe that you would only get a d6 for damage per attack. I would stay with dual-wielding light weapons or start looking for kamas so that way you can keep any special abilities the monk has.

[Gol]

Wrongo, but even if it did, if you were going for AC the shield spell would be far better. But no, shield stacks with TWD, as I just did it in game just now.

Also why not max dex? Thats 1 more AC (and to hit and reflex save). You could sacrifice the con for it.
That's odd. Bonuses of the same type are not supposed to stack. Interesting.

I opted for non-max Dex to pump Wisdom. And, due to the style of how I play, I prefer to have higher Constitution. If anything, I'd lower Con by 2 and put it into Charisma. I just can't see going -4 Con and -2 Cha for +2 Dex.

[WeiQuinn]

You would lose alot of dps and some ac if you went unarmed if your only going to take one level of monk. I believe that you would only get a d6 for damage per attack. I would stay with dual-wielding light weapons or start looking for kamas so that way you can keep any special abilities the monk has.

I would make it a Ranger 15/Monk 5 or something like that... depends on what Tempest II is like I suppose. As for Kamas, I've started saving the better ones I've found in anticipation of the Monk's arrival.

[Osharan_Tregarth]

That's odd. Bonuses of the same type are not supposed to stack. Interesting.

I opted for non-max Dex to pump Wisdom. And, due to the style of how I play, I prefer to have higher Constitution. If anything, I'd lower Con by 2 and put it into Charisma. I just can't see going -4 Con and -2 Cha for +2 Dex.

Hey Gol.. What're your thoughts on dropping wisdom down, and pumping int for combat expertise?

[ArkoHighStar]

Hey Gol.. What're your thoughts on dropping wisdom down, and pumping int for combat expertise?

dropping wisdom down to 14 would give you 4 points to pump into int plus a +1 tome, would give you 13 int.

Basically the cost would be 1AC 1 will save

for +4 AC and -4 to hit plus you would have to switch out one of your feats

final tally +3 to AC -4 to hit and loss of one feat

edit looking at the feats the only one that could really go in this build would be 2 weapon defence whic would bring the tally to
+2 to AC -4 to hit

[Strakeln]

True, however it would overlap with TWD and/or the Tempest bonus. TWD is labeled as a shield bonus, and we obviously won't know how Tempest works until we see mod 6.You are correct in the PnP world but not the DDO world.

d20srd:

When wielding a double weapon or two weapons (not including natural weapons or unarmed strikes), you gain a +1 shield bonus to your AC. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.

When you are fighting defensively or using the total defense action, this shield bonus increases to +2.

DDO compendium:

Grants you a +1 bonus to your AC when you wield two weapons.
Prerequisite: Two Weapon Fighting

I wonder if they made it an untyped (or dodge, or whatever it's listed as) bonus since they don't have the defensive fighting increase to AC.

That said, based on previous actions, there is potential that TWD could become a shield bonus at some point in the future.

No idea regarding the tempest bonus.

[Gol]

I'd drop Str and Cha by 2 each before dropping Wisdom. And, as was posted, you have to drop TWD for it either way. I'm not a fan of doing that, but I suppose you could. All it really gives you is +2 AC compared to Defensive Fighting with TWD. If I had to drop a feat, I'd get Precision over CE, too.

[Gol]

Heh, forgot the White Dragonscale robe was 6 armor. 55 now, 59 with a shield clicky.

[jakeelala]

throw a daggertooth belt in there from Crucible for Fighters Armor Mastery 2, and add 2 more AC.

Woot!

[adrinor]

throw a daggertooth belt in there from Crucible for Fighters Armor Mastery 2, and add 2 more AC.

Woot!

No max dex bonus on robes...

[jakeelala]

oh my bad i just figured he had KDS or MBP/MCS

[Soul-Shaker]

Nice build gol. It sure does max the solo AC/tohit out of TWF standing but without CE capabilities due to both lack of feat and int.

I thought about the same type of build but decided not to take pala route just because my wisdom was high enough and so many ways to boost willsave over 20 min now days for PvE. This also saves me a item slot since I wont need to keep a cha item on. Also went with elf just because I cant stay away from rapier enhancements. But halfling would be little less dps due to str/enhancement but 1 ac and tohit with any weapon is nice to.

my build is 14/18/12/11/14/9 elf 15rgr/1ftr mod6 and splash 1 monk later since monks will probably come with new level and not due for half a year minimum :(. This allows me to fit in STWF at mod6 release with 1 ftr feat and CE instead of TWFD. Ill have the same ac: +5 ce vs +1 TWFD +1 wis diff +1 halfling + 2 pala aura(if no other pala). And when and if STWF is added to Tempest II for 15 rgr I hope, then I can swap out STWF for TWFD. You would have to wait for level 19 to get STWF from Tempest II or at level 18, unless you take it at 15/ instead of TWFD.

[Gol]

The thing about not having Wisdom is that it removes the purpose of taking Monk. Wisdom will count to your AC just as much as Dex will by only taking 1 Monk level. The kicker is that it only works when you don't have a shield on, which is where this build really picks up slack. There's no other way in D&D (yet) to make up for that significant +7 free AC from a shield, and this build even lets you stack it with a shield clicky.

Of course, it all depends on Monk, unfortunately, so we're looking at April at the earliest until this build is reality.

[Soul-Shaker]

The thing about not having Wisdom is that it removes the purpose of taking Monk. Wisdom will count to your AC just as much as Dex will by only taking 1 Monk level. The kicker is that it only works when you don't have a shield on, which is where this build really picks up slack. There's no other way in D&D (yet) to make up for that significant +7 free AC from a shield, and this build even lets you stack it with a shield clicky.

Of course, it all depends on Monk, unfortunately, so we're looking at April at the earliest until this build is reality.


Yep I understand to make up for +7 ac shield free. But paying 4 points for 1 more mod in wis is a bit high. Im only guessing but by the time monks come out, I bet the cap will be raised to 18. If you could have fit in CE at 18 you could have much more AC. Currently by 18 cap I would have +1 more ac then your build with CE running and no pala around. +3(or +4 if pala aura gets boost) if pala is around. Although I guess it cant be helped since your behind in feats and you wouldnt be able to get STWF if not at 15/18 since you have to wait for lvl 15 rgr (level 19 for you) to get STWF with Tempest II.

[Yaga_Nub]

Why Paladin 4? SP and the spells?

[Gol]

Paladin 4 vs Monk 2 vs Ranger 16. None of those really jump out at me, honestly. Take your pick.

[Yaga_Nub]

Paladin 4 vs Monk 2 vs Ranger 16. None of those really jump out at me, honestly. Take your pick.

Well personally I'm still a little worried about Ranger 17. I think that Hide in Plain Sight will be implemented and that it currently is in the game now. But I'm still not sure how useful it will be so I'm just going to be happy using it on my 19 Ranger/1 Barb.