gimmick tempest ranger

[Gratch]

Trying to see if I can fit in (not-max-str) tempest ranger build these things: CE, Whirlwind, STWF, high(er) AC...

Thinking about 11 ranger/3 paly/2 fighter.

12 int +1 tome for CE qual.
17 dex +2 tome for STWF qual.
Thinking elf for 32 pts and dex... though drow would get the cha bonus that ties to the paly save bonus.

Feat wise you'd have enough for everything, plus 2 extra (improved crit, TWD?)

The 3 paly levels vs. 3 more fighter levels would lose 2 fighter feats, but gets you immunity disease/fear, +2 AC, ~+4-5 saves, 2 60-80 pt LoH's, and 2 smite evils. 3 more ranger levels would give... an extra ac of barkskin and ...

Playstyle wise, you get the tempest ranger feel, but some added ac, ce, and that gimmicky whirlwind to smack around - though that was really just tacked on as all the supporting feats were already there. In fact, I'd guess while standing still, a full round of two weapon attacks far outshines the damage of whirlwind... whirlwind's main bonus being you can fire it off on the move and the glitz/glamor of the super spin. In the end, you serve up the role of initial aggro magnet. You won't hold aggro once the arcanes get involved. Kills will mostly be due to stat/debuff weapons which aren't as dependable against the every-other-red-mob quests.

[Queleri]

Trying to see if I can fit in (not-max-str) tempest ranger build these things: CE, Whirlwind, STWF, high(er) AC...

Thinking about 11 ranger/3 paly/2 fighter.

12 int +1 tome for CE qual.
17 dex +2 tome for STWF qual.
Thinking elf for 32 pts and dex... though drow would get the cha bonus that ties to the paly save bonus.

Feat wise you'd have enough for everything, plus 2 extra (improved crit, TWD?)

The 3 paly levels vs. 3 more fighter levels would lose 2 fighter feats, but gets you immunity disease/fear, +2 AC, ~+4-5 saves, 2 60-80 pt LoH's, and 2 smite evils. 3 more ranger levels would give... an extra ac of barkskin and ...

Playstyle wise, you get the tempest ranger feel, but some added ac, ce, and that gimmicky whirlwind to smack around - though that was really just tacked on as all the supporting feats were already there. In fact, I'd guess while standing still, a full round of two weapon attacks far outshines the damage of whirlwind... whirlwind's main bonus being you can fire it off on the move and the glitz/glamor of the super spin. In the end, you serve up the role of initial aggro magnet. You won't hold aggro once the arcanes get involved. Kills will mostly be due to stat/debuff weapons which aren't as dependable against the every-other-red-mob quests.

One other option maybe to drop whirlwind and pick up the Oversized TWF so you can use a normal weapon in both hands without the penalty. The feat is in the designer notes for Mod 6, so you'd have better DPS to go along with the attacks and the 10% speed increase from Tempest. At any rate that may add some more DPS to the build, and not sure how set you are on Whirlwind. Also not sure if Ranger will get the STWF for free regardless of Dex bonus like all of the other TWF feats, so that's a tough one.

[Gratch]

One other option maybe to drop whirlwind and pick up the Oversized TWF so you can use a normal weapon in both hands without the penalty. The feat is in the designer notes for Mod 6, so you'd have better DPS to go along with the attacks and the 10% speed increase from Tempest. At any rate that may add some more DPS to the build, and not sure how set you are on Whirlwind. Also not sure if Ranger will get the STWF for free regardless of Dex bonus like all of the other TWF feats, so that's a tough one.

Eladrin has said STWF is not free (to his mind) so the 10 dex rangers will miss their 5th standing 2nd weapon attack. 20-30 pages of complaints in different threads haven't changed his mind so far...

I've tried whirlwind on a few other builds. It's a nice punch when you need it. It's mostly useful when you're moving, spring-attacking a group of mobs and want to keep moving while hitting most of them. You can be high-jumping, ffalling and activate it while still moving.... so it plays to those who actually like and use spring-attack back-kiting or mob-chasing tactics.

I figure you could use the 2 extra feats as either (finesse, improved crit: pierce) or (oversized twf, improved crit: slash).

[Benjai]

Whats the difference besides a bit of pally saves than a pure ranger? I'm pretty sure you can still get Tempest, STWF, IC: Piercing and either TW:D,Oversized TWF, or CE (which is meh considering it drops when you do something casty-like, I think even triggering a shield clicky will drop it). I mean on paper pallies have that AC aura, but then again a pure ranger also benefits if theres any other paladin in the group plus the extra favored enemy defense bonuses. Freedom of Movement is a also great benefit.

I see alot that 11 ranger is the most you need, but I think people are underestimating favored enemies. You get another at 15 for 4 total, which if you plan out right can be useful most of the time when you'd need that added boost anyways (8 Base damage plus enhancments, enhancments for 3 more AC, and more to-hit). Plus going pure ranger is sort of a safety blanket. Multi-class builds can become gimped every level cap increase depending on what new class enhancments or other improvements are added.

[QuantumFX]

Gratch: You hoping for a Weapon Master PrE for fighters? ;)

*wink is cause you're not the only one thinking that this is going to have to come for fighters...

[Osharan_Tregarth]

Eladrin has said STWF is not free (to his mind) so the 10 dex rangers will miss their 5th standing 2nd weapon attack. 20-30 pages of complaints in different threads haven't changed his mind so far...

I've tried whirlwind on a few other builds. It's a nice punch when you need it. It's mostly useful when you're moving, spring-attacking a group of mobs and want to keep moving while hitting most of them. You can be high-jumping, ffalling and activate it while still moving.... so it plays to those who actually like and use spring-attack back-kiting or mob-chasing tactics.

I figure you could use the 2 extra feats as either (finesse, improved crit: pierce) or (oversized twf, improved crit: slash).

It looks like they will be giving STWF as part of the second tier tempest ranger enhancements, so that should make a lot of people happier.

[MrCow]

It looks like the second they will be giving STWF as part of the second tier tempest ranger enhancements, so that should make a lot of people happier.

That is providing you have the ranger levels to take the enhancement. A build like this would likely not classify for that second tier of tempest.

[Gratch]

That is providing you have the ranger levels to take the enhancement. A build like this would likely not classify for that second tier of tempest.

Well... if you get that feat back... maybe pure whirlwinding tempest ranger would work.