1st 32 pt build want pure fighter with umd.

[tomto]

i may be out in left feild,but i don't think so.i am close to my 1750.i have spent some time thinking of what i want.i would like to get input on a possible,pure/human fighter with enough umd to use heal wands.i want to dual weild,with emphasis on peircing /crit.i am hoping to make use of several trasmutting weapons,bows,rapiers,the likes.would like to achieve a powerhose,self sufficient,but adverse character.any,and all input would be appreciated.thnx

[ArkoHighStar]

going pure fighter will only allow you advance .5 UMD points per level, so a decent chr will be a must and spending a feat on skill focus UMD will help but you will be hard pressed to get passed 20 UMD

quick calculation a fighter with 12 chr can get a 9 UMD at lvl 14 add skill focus UMD it hits 12 add a +6 chr item 15, then golden cartouche +3 to 18, then greater heroism another 4 , get you 22 at lvl 14 fully buffed, juts enough to hit cure light wands with 100%.

1 level of paladin, ranger or cleric will get you the use of all healing wands

[tomto]

i thought there was going to be something,lol.so pure may not be the best then.what could i do a splash of to help?rogue?pally? i was hopin for the extra feat,etc.

[Impaqt]

i thought there was going to be something,lol.so pure may not be the best then.what could i do a splash of to help?rogue?pally? i was hopin for the extra feat,etc.
Well, a 2 level splash of rogue can give you a lot of skill points and evasion if you have enough dex to make it worth it. Splashing Paly gives you all the wands you would really need without a UMD check.

Then theres Ranger.... If all you want is to be able to use cure wands, you can slash 2 levels of ranger... You gain TWF for free, some nice Bow feats and dont hurt your BAB at all.

Of course, you could do wha the rest of us do and after thinking really hard about a 32pt build, the character you ultimatly create next will be a drow..... lol

[ArkoHighStar]

i thought there was going to be something,lol.so pure may not be the best then.what could i do a splash of to help?rogue?pally? i was hopin for the extra feat,etc.


If your only goal is to be able to heal using wands then cleric might be a viable solution as you get a few decent first level spells like nightshield, and bless and divine favor

[Averroes]

going pure fighter will only allow you advance .5 UMD points per level, so a decent chr will be a must and spending a feat on skill focus UMD will help but you will be hard pressed to get passed 20 UMD

8 ranks + 3 cartouche + 4 gh + 1 rabbit gloves + 3 feat + 1 stat (12 cha) = 20

Although, really, if you want umd, you might as well take a couple of pally levels and start with a decent charisma. Potentially:

8 ranks + 5 titan gloves + 4 gh + 2 reaver trinket + 3 feat + 8 stat (26 cha -- 17 base + 1 enhance + 2 tome + 6 item) = 30 umd. (and, fwiw, I actually play a drow 12f/2p with this umd breakdown -- don't need it for wands with the pally levels, but it's nice being able to use restoration/spell resistance/raise dead/ and even greater teleport scrolls when I have to.)

[tomto]

i think that i would prefer rogue,for things like the umd,evasion,etc.i don't like the lack of strength in the elves.evasion would be better.99% of the time i use returning daggers,axes,etc

[ArkoHighStar]

Well, a 2 level splash of rogue can give you a lot of skill points and evasion if you have enough dex to make it worth it. Splashing Paly gives you all the wands you would really need without a UMD check.

Then theres Ranger.... If all you want is to be able to use cure wands, you can slash 2 levels of ranger... You gain TWF for free, some nice Bow feats and dont hurt your BAB at all.

Of course, you could do wha the rest of us do and after thinking really hard about a 32pt build, the character you ultimatly create next will be a drow..... lol

looking at his choices he want to go TWF then 2 lvls of ranger might do the trick. However be careful as you need the base dex to support improved and greater TWF, which means a dex based build possibly, drow halfings and elves work nicely there as they all have a racial bonus to dex

[ArkoHighStar]

i think that i would prefer rogue,for things like the umd,evasion,etc.i don't like the lack of strength in the elves.evasion would be better.99% of the time i use returning daggers,axes,etc


please remember the following

the one thing to remember about evasion is light armor only, If you are using throwing weapons then your to hit is dex based not str based. Halfings are the best choice for throwing weapons unles you are using shurikens then it is drow

[Impaqt]

looking at his choices he want to go TWF then 2 lvls of ranger might do the trick. However be careful as you need the base dex to support improved and greater TWF, which means a dex based build possibly, drow halfings and elves work nicely there as they all have a racial bonus to dex
Yes, But the 2 levels of ranger are not only for TWF. Yes, the build still has to be dex based.. Or at least Dex Heavy. Taking 2 levels of rangers makes up for the lost feat from losing 2 levels of Fighter on a TWF Build, and then some... CUre wand, Bow STR, Rapid shot, Favorite Enemeny, +1 DEX frm ENH, its a very sound decision for ANY twf build.

[tomto]

i think your idea of ranger through me off at first.i never thought of doin ranger builds,i like to get in there.ranger never struck me as way to go.i think i will try that.any suggestion on what levels to add ranger?

[tomto]

i am wanting to go true nuetral,stability?

[sigtrent]

If you want healing wands, 2 levels of ranger and 12 fighter is a great way to go. Take the ranger levels early, 1 and 2 are good. You get more skill points at level 1 that way, and you get the ranger TWF feat which you can build off of with your fighter bonus feats. It also gives you some bow feats which are handy from time to time. Basicaly you get 3 good solid combat feats for two character levels.

If you had wanted UMD for scrolls or Race Restrict items I'd suggest taking rogue or bard at level one to make it a class skill. In the long run that woudl be less detrimental to your build than trying to level up a cross class skill and keep a relatively uselless attribute (for most fighters) high enough to make it work. <Yes, for an intimidater charisma is important.>

[Impaqt]

I would add ranger early and often. THis opens up your progression in TWF faster and gets you wand usage faster than UMD would.

1 Ranger 2 FIghter 3 Ranger 4+ FIghter.

You get bonus Skill points for taking Ranger at Level 1 Which is nice This setup also gets you a Feat at Every Level up to 4.

[tomto]

i would like to say thnx to all the people who have helped me.you have been great.scholar,i like ur last reply.i will do that.make very good sense.what about feats?do i do like +twf,crit piercing,i think i want to use rapiers,maybe short swords and lt maces.

[Strykersz]

i am wanting to go true nuetral,stability?

Stability doesn't stack(I think it's a deflection bonus?).

[tomto]

so if i go ranger lvl's 1&3,i don't need to take any umd feats?

[sigtrent]

so if i go ranger lvl's 1&3,i don't need to take any umd feats?

When you take ranger levels has nothing to do with whether you take "skill focus UMD"

Skills in DDO are either "class" or "cross class"

If you have any levels in a class that has a particular skill as a "class" skill then it is a "class" skill for your character ever after.

Rogue and Bard are the only classes that have UMD as a class skill. So if you want a truly strong UMD score you need at least one level of one of those classes. Generaly folks will take them at first level because both are high skill classes and you get bonus skill points at first level based on your class. Some will wait untill later to take the level and not have any UMD until they multi-class. It all depends on your goals etc...

I recomend taking them early for most characters.

[neoanderthal]

When you take ranger levels has nothing to do with whether you take "skill focus UMD"
If you have any levels in a class that has a particular skill as a "class" skill then it is a "class" skill for your character ever after.


Hmmm, I seem to remember after taking a barbarian level for my rogue, rogue skills like DisDev, OpenLock, and UMD were cross-class for the barbarian. Can anyone else confirm or deny that taking a class opens the skill selection from that point forward?

edit: DDO wiki mentions that skills and multi-classing works like PnP (class/cross-class applies to the current class you've gained a level in, not past classes), though I don't know how authoritative DDO wiki is ;)

[Twerpp]

Yes, But the 2 levels of ranger are not only for TWF. Yes, the build still has to be dex based.. Or at least Dex Heavy. Taking 2 levels of rangers makes up for the lost feat from losing 2 levels of Fighter on a TWF Build, and then some... CUre wand, Bow STR, Rapid shot, Favorite Enemeny, +1 DEX frm ENH, its a very sound decision for ANY twf build.

Nice skill points too.

[tomto]

ok.i was going to ask bout the umd thing.now do i have to spend skill points when creating,or can i wait till i lvl and spend points elsewhere.also thinkin of longsword,short sword twf,with focus slashing?

[tomto]

this is how i am thinking of starting.ranger.points 15,14,14,9,8,14.+1 tome for intel brings it to 10.bullheaded,umd for 1st feats,evil outsider is fave enemy.lvl2 go 1st lvl foghter with crit accuracy,lvl3 ranger with action boost.slashing weapon focus,twf.

[trptim]

Hmmm, I seem to remember after taking a barbarian level for my rogue, rogue skills like DisDev, OpenLock, and UMD were cross-class for the barbarian. Can anyone else confirm or deny that taking a class opens the skill selection from that point forward?

edit: DDO wiki mentions that skills and multi-classing works like PnP (class/cross-class applies to the current class you've gained a level in, not past classes), though I don't know how authoritative DDO wiki is ;)

The COST of skills is based on the the current class, and if it was Cross-Class for that class, then it will always cost the Cross-Class cost.

However, what taking a class that has the skill as a Class Skill, is that you can now continue to MAX that skill out


For example, a pure fighter can only get .5 UMD per level (2 at first level) for a max of 8.5
If you splash one level of rogue or bard, you can now spend the skill points to max it to 17
However, the cost will be significant (2 skill points per 1), so you better have the INT to support those skill points


Now for my question, is it better to splash Rogue or Bard?
Does Bard get to use healing wands, similar to Rangers, Clerics and Rangers listed above?

I have a Fighter 3/Rogue 1 just for UMD, and the failure rate on Cure Wands is still annoying.

[tc12]

this is how i am thinking of starting.ranger.points 15,14,14,9,8,14.+1 tome for intel brings it to 10.bullheaded,umd for 1st feats,evil outsider is fave enemy.lvl2 go 1st lvl foghter with crit accuracy,lvl3 ranger with action boost.slashing weapon focus,twf.

These stats seem problematic. You're building a fighter with both a low STR and low DEX? You're not gonna hit much at end-game content with these stats. You need to decide whether you're gonna be a STR-based build or DEX-based and adjust accordingly. If you want TWF, the 2 ranger splash gets you the first as a class feat, but you need to meet the DEX requirement after that. Which is 17 for improved and greater. And that's base + level ups + inherent (tomes) -- NOT enhancement from items. I think the 14 CHA just for UMD is killing your build. Really if wand use is enough, splash the Ranger levels and drop UMD altogether so you can drop your CHA to minimum and use those points elsewhere.

Aside from that, you mentioned bows and rapiers in your OP, which seems like a more a dex/finesse build. You didn't mention race, but Elf would help you get the dex you need for 2wf. Elves get bonuses to both rapier and longsword, but it's problematic to use both as the rapier is piercing and the longsword slashing (and not finessible). So weapon focus/spec and improved crit feats can only be chosen to boost one of those. If you went Elf and took the full +2 racial enhancement, and focus/spec/IC in piercing, you could use two rapiers better than two different weapons. If you didn't want elf, then you probably want a different weapon to focus on. And if you didn't plan on weapon finesse, well then you need to start with a lot more STR.

If you post more build details we can all help you more with this. But as a well-known former poster on this board used to say, this build lacks focus. You need to decide what's most important and focus on that to have a build really shine in end-game content, try to do too much and not doing any of it well might not make you happy with the end result. And you don't want to get something to double-digit levels to realize that.

TC

[Solmage]

The COST of skills is based on the the current class, and if it was Cross-Class for that class, then it will always cost the Cross-Class cost.

However, what taking a class that has the skill as a Class Skill, is that you can now continue to MAX that skill out


For example, a pure fighter can only get .5 UMD per level (2 at first level) for a max of 8.5
If you splash one level of rogue or bard, you can now spend the skill points to max it to 17
However, the cost will be significant (2 skill points per 1), so you better have the INT to support those skill points


Now for my question, is it better to splash Rogue or Bard?
Does Bard get to use healing wands, similar to Rangers, Clerics and Rangers listed above?

I have a Fighter 3/Rogue 1 just for UMD, and the failure rate on Cure Wands is still annoying.

Yes, for umd a bard splash is better. You get a song which is a bit useful when soloing or a real bard isn't around, a nice little spell, and access to all healing wands umd-free. A rogue only becomes a better choice if you add a second level of rogue to get evasion, and have the dex to back it up (you need light armors for evasion, which require decent dex and also to have an useful reflex save)

[reziel_deadshot]

8 ranks + 3 cartouche + 4 gh + 1 rabbit gloves + 3 feat + 1 stat (12 cha) = 20

Although, really, if you want umd, you might as well take a couple of pally levels and start with a decent charisma. Potentially:

8 ranks + 5 titan gloves + 4 gh + 2 reaver trinket + 3 feat + 8 stat (26 cha -- 17 base + 1 enhance + 2 tome + 6 item) = 30 umd. (and, fwiw, I actually play a drow 12f/2p with this umd breakdown -- don't need it for wands with the pally levels, but it's nice being able to use restoration/spell resistance/raise dead/ and even greater teleport scrolls when I have to.)
can always start out gimping it a lil and going 18 cha :P

[mi'kmaq]

i start a fighter on a 32 point build human, started with 8 chr 2 level rogue 12 level fighter i got his umd to 40,
level 14 19 umd, human adapt 1 point chr, +3 chr tome, and 6 chr item is another +5 umd, titan gloves +5, head of good fortune +2 umd, and a 20 sec boost for another +5 umd, and a greater heroism +4 umd
my fighter wears +5 mithral chain shirt and the gloves provide a -10&#37; to spell failure.
+19
+5
+5
+2
+5
+4
40 umd not bad for a duel fighting fighter.


titan gloves are not easy to get the necklace from deleras give you a +3 and the +3 chr tome is not easy to get as well, you may have to eat a +1 chr tome, the head of good fortune is fairly easy to get but may have to settle for the rabbit gloves, and a +6 chr item may be hard to find you may have to settle for +5 chr item , your total will be 35 umd with a boost.

[Elleron]

I went with 2 levels of rogue spread out to get my umd high.

Now 7 fighter/2 paladin/2 rogue

14- 10 fighter/2/2

Umd at 11th is 29 -self buffed - 20 char (+5), cartouche(3), rogue boost (2)
I need to roll a 7 to use a raise dead scroll. And I have saved the party in being able to raise the cleric when something bad happens.

Can I dps like a straight fighter - usually no, but sometimes.
Can I heal myself - o' yes
Can I remove disease/curse/blindness - lesser restore - umm yes again

So there are many ways to go around to be able to heal yourself, but umd is great because it allows you to do many things with race required items and the such.