Whirling Dervish

[~Jules921]

So I was re-reading the thread/book of the barb vs ftr and an idea came to me at work last night. How much damage would a twf tank be that used whirlwind attack? It is even do-able? I think it would have to be a human fighter for all the feats you would need. Off the top of my head:

TWF
ITWF
GTWF
IC
PA
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack
Combat Expertise
Whirlwind Attack

Or would you just get the same effect by taking the full line of twf? Or would ranger be the better choice as it gives you the TWF line - you would just need to invest in the wwa line? Has anyone done this - what do the damage numbers look like?

Jules

[bandyman1]

So I was re-reading the thread/book of the barb vs ftr and an idea came to me at work last night. How much damage would a twf tank be that used whirlwind attack? It is even do-able? I think it would have to be a human fighter for all the feats you would need. Off the top of my head:

TWF
ITWF
GTWF
IC
PA
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack
Combat Expertise
Whirlwind Attack

Or would you just get the same effect by taking the full line of twf? Or would ranger be the better choice as it gives you the TWF line - you would just need to invest in the wwa line? Has anyone done this - what do the damage numbers look like?

Jules

Delani is a halfling Rogue2/Fighter12

Str is only 26, but she's a finesse build with a 32 Dex, and dual-wields light picks.

Feats are;
Weapon finesse
Dodge
Mobility
Spring att.
Whirlwind att.
TWF
ITWF
GTWF
IC: pierce
Toughness
Combat expertise ( I swap this situationally with power att. Makes for more versatility )
Power att.

Dual-wielding bursting light picks of greater bane ( have a very impressive collection of them :D ) with a bloodstone, DPS potential is excellent. Although I should point out, that you don't get a hit with both weapons on a whirlwind. Only with the one in your main hand.

At one time, I was getting random on which weapon was hitting ( I noticed this when using whirlwind with a paralyzer in my off-hand ), but apparently the Devs corrected this.

[~Jules921]

So only hitting from main hand, but if you don't take the whirlwind line you do get the extra damage from both - correct?

Jules

[bandyman1]

So only hitting from main hand, but if you don't take the whirlwind line you do get the extra damage from both - correct?

Jules

Not sure I understand the question. You mean from PA? Yes, it applies to both weapons, regardless of if it's a whirlwind attack or not.

Whirlwind works like cleave and greatcleave; It is a single attack vs. all targets in range ( whirlwind allows you to hit targets behind you, can't do that with the cleave feats ). Then there is a cooldown of a few seconds before you can use it again. It doesn't do any extra damage by it's self, it simply allows you to hit multiple opponets with one attack.

[nbhs275]

whirlwind is the gimp cousin of cleave.

Cleave takes just PA to get. Feat savings. And its cooldown is only 5 seconds. Use on of the feats you saved on great cleave, for a AoE damage very often.

Also, TWF and whirlwind have no special bond, and actually dont work tegether well for DPS. And dropping Str for high intel and dex is killing your DPS even more.

[~Jules921]

I was hoping they would work together - they seems like they should. I'm starting to think the price may be too high when you include the INT cost even on a 32 pt build - specifically for tanks.

Thanks for the info
Jules

[bandyman1]

whirlwind is the gimp cousin of cleave.

Cleave takes just PA to get. Feat savings. And its cooldown is only 5 seconds. Use on of the feats you saved on great cleave, for a AoE damage very often.

Also, TWF and whirlwind have no special bond, and actually dont work tegether well for DPS. And dropping Str for high intel and dex is killing your DPS even more.

Not so sure bro. Taking high Dex worked well for a couple of reasons. I benifited from the dex bonus and enhancement lines as a halfling, I hit as well as any fighter with a 32 Str ( weapon finesse ), I had to have a good Dex anyway as a TWF, and with a shield wand ( UMDed ) and a BS pot, I can pull a 50 AC on Del while TWFing. Arua pally, ranger's BS, haste, and recitation puts her at 59. " Want me to tank the reaver " ? " Sure :D " ( ever seen how big a boom an anarchic burst light pick of greater giant bane + a bloodstone makes on him? ) . Not to mention evasion with a +30 reflex save.

That's with no raid gear other than the Stormreaver's amulet. Give me a KDS, and a chattering ring, and I'd be an extremely happy little halfling :D.

As halflings take a -2 to Str., the extra points I put into a 13 Int, wouldn't really have helped her Str. score much.

I agree with TWFing and whirlwind having no special bond, but I don't see what your saying about them not working together well for DPS. It hits for exactly the same damage Del would hit for with cleave and great cleave. It just hits in a much wider AOE. As far as the feat cost, I usually take spring att. on my melees anyway, so it really wasn't a case of overspending.

[sigtrent]

Cleave, great cleave, and whirlwind are kind of a third combat line.

In some ways it follows the pattern of THF and TWF.

I think in DDO they make the most sense for one handed fighters who like to use effect weapons like vorpals paralyzers etc... very nice on a defensive tank type build to pull agro and apply defensive state effects.

[nbhs275]

Cleave, great cleave, and whirlwind are kind of a third combat line.

In some ways it follows the pattern of THF and TWF.

I think in DDO they make the most sense for one handed fighters who like to use effect weapons like vorpals paralyzers etc... very nice on a defensive tank type build to pull agro and apply defensive state effects.

very true, i have it on my offensive paladin and its great. Smiting scimitar can take out alot of constructs fast, and the choasblade can really add up with alot of adjacent targets. Though being able to take alot of mobs out with the two combine cleaves from a big weapon like a SoS is great too.

[Vodac]

No dought WW works best with effect weapons power attack and 2hand weapons like a great sword My fighter has cleve great cleve and WW its not as strong as i would like but its fun to play. also if you have a high intemadate.

[~Jules921]

So you all would recommend going thf not twf? Been trying to use intimidate on my tanks recently as well

Jules