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Geonis
09-15-2007, 01:48 PM
I have played almost every different character type to at leat level 8 or so, but not a Ranger. I have been thinking of starting a Ranger, and have been thinking of what I want it to be able to do.

1 - TWF well. I am not a big fan of finesse builds, so I want to go strength. I don't like to "follow the crowd", and think they're ugly as sin, so I won't go dwarf. I could go human, but with their bonus to long swords and bows, as well as rogue skills, I decided on Elf.

2 - Have some use other than combat. All my characters, except my original sorc, can do other stuff outside of combat. I don't feel like I'm contributing if I can't do something besides swing a weapon. (Probably why ny straight Barb is still sitting at level 7.) I decided it shouldn't be too hard to incorporate rogue skills into the build.

3 - Everyone loves Barkskin, so i decided also to be able to spread the love, hence the level of Sorc. Even with a 10 cha, I still have over 300 SPs. Extend amkes the need to recast Barkskin unlikely. The 2 minute Shield spells are just gravy.

4 - I also tried to incorporate the Dragonmarks into the build without gimping it in any way. I think the Extended Displacements will help avoid a ton of damage.

5 - The real downfall of this build is going to be the HPs. I've made do with less on a melee TWf though and done fine through the Elite GH stuff. I will just have to fall back on Old Faithful, Stoneskin. For that, I need a decent UMD. 17 base + 2 cha (+4 item) + 3 (Golden Cartouche) + 4 (GH) + 5 (skill boost) = +31 or Raise Dead on a 5, and with a Heroism pot instead of GH, I can cast my own GH on an 11. Not shabby, and without the boosts can cast Stoneskin on a 2. Also if I decided I don't really need Imp Crit:Ranged, I could swap that out for SF:UMD.

6 - In my builds I try not to count on Raid loot and +2 or 3 tomes, to make them more accessible to everyone. I do normally include +6 stat items and a few +1 tomes, as if you don't have these, then you need to run POP more. That being said, this build includes +1 str, int, wis, and cha tomes; also +6 str and con items, +5 wis item, +4 int and cha items; +5 mithral chain shirt and 2 +1 holy burst long swords. If you don't have this stuff, then adjust your numbers appropriately.

Combat

Dual +1 Holy Burst Long Swords (yes, I have these)

To-hit
+12 BAB
+8 STR
+4 GH (self-cast)
+2 Elf Enhancement
+1 Haste
+1 Weapon
-4 Dual Longsword
----------------------
+24/+24/+24/+29/+29/+34/+34

Buff crazy - includes Full Bard song, Rage spell or pot, Recitation, Divine Power clicky

+33/+33/+33/+38/+38/+43/+43


Damage

1d8
+8 STR
+2 Elf
+1 Weapon
+2d6 Holy
____________

1d8 + 11 +2d6 Main avg-22.5 max-31
1d8 + 7 + 2d6 Off avg-18.5 max-27

crit - 17-20/x2

(1d8 +11)*2 +5d6 Main avg- 48.5 max-68
(1d8+7)*2 + 5d6 Off avg- 40.5 max-60

Buff crazy - includes full Bard song and Rage pot

add +7 to both avg damages and +14 to both crit damages



AC

10 base
+9 +5 MCS
+6 dex
+4 deflection (Deleras item)
+5 Barkskin
+4 Shield spell
+1 Haste
_______________

39 AC TWF (mostly self buffed)


Dream AC - 51
includes
Kundarak Delving Suit
(item that gives Fighter Armor Mastery II, can't remember name)
Chattering Ring
+5 Protection item
Chaosguarde
Full Pally


Buff crazy - includes above plus Recitation and swapping out off-hand weapon for +5 hvy shield

AC - 56

if you swap out Mental Toughness for Combat Expertise plus above

AC - 61



Behind this is almost constant Displacement (>15mins between shrines)

Behind that is Stoneskin, kept up constantly via scrolls.


The combination should keep damage to a minimum.



The Rogue skills may not do the DC68? chest in GH, but should be alright everywhere else.

Disable Device

17 ranks
+4 Int
+4 GH
+7 tools
+13 item
+5 skill boost
+1 Rogue enhancement
____________

+51 Disable Device



Open Lock

14 Ranks
+6 Dex
+13 item
+1 Rogue enhancement
+7 tools
+5 skill boost
+4 GH
__________

+50 Open Lock



Search

17 Ranks
+13 Item
+4 Int
+2 Elf racial
+4 GH
+5 Elf and Ranger enhancements
+5 skill boost
___________

+50 Search

That Search seems a bit low, did I miss something here?




HP

This is the real weak point, as I won't be able to hit the 300+ most people think is needed at GH Elite levels. I think I'll do just fine though, the HPs don't start getting taken away until the mob gets past my AC, then my Displacement, then my DR.

20 Heroic Something
+96 Ranger 12
+4 Wiz 1
+6 Rogue 1
+70 20 Con x 14 levels
+10 Agent Favor
+30 Greater False Life
________________

236 HPs

HPs turned out better than I thought. :)




Okay, after some input from my fellow forum go-ers, I switched the Sorc level to Wiz. I also changed the enhancements around a little and swapped Listen to Spot (not sure why I didn't go with Spot to begin with.)

Most numbers should remain the same, except for a few skills.

Anyway, here's the build.





Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.70
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 14 Lawful Good Elf Male
(1 Rogue \ 12 Ranger \ 1 Wizard)
Hit Points: 154
Spell Points: 334
BAB: 12\12\17\22
Fortitude: 10
Reflex: 14
Will: 5

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 14)
Strength 16 20
Dexterity 16 18
Constitution 14 14
Intelligence 13 14
Wisdom 8 9
Charisma 9 10

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 1
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 1
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 1
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 1

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 14)
Balance 7 8
Bluff 0 0
Concentration 2 2
Diplomacy 0 0
Disable Device 6 20
Haggle 4 4
Heal -1 -1
Hide 3 4
Intimidate 0 0
Jump 7 10
Listen -1 1
Move Silently 3 4
Open Lock 7 19
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 2 2
Search 6 29
Spot 3 21
Swim 3 5
Tumble 7 8
Use Magic Device 4 17

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Shadow
Feat: (Automatic) Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Elven Keen Senses
Feat: (Automatic) Enchantment Save Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Heroic Durability
Feat: (Automatic) Immunity to Sleep
Feat: (Automatic) Light Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Longbow
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Longsword
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Rapier
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortsword
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortbow
Feat: (Automatic) Simple Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Trapfinding
Feat: (Automatic) Trip

Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Automatic) Bow Strength
Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Shield Proficiency (General)
Feat: (Automatic) Sunder
Feat: (Automatic) Wild Empathy

Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Search
Feat: (Automatic) Rapid Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Two Weapon Fighting

Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (1): Camouflage
Spell (1): Jump
Spell (1): Longstrider
Spell (1): Resist Energy
Spell (1): Summon Nature's Ally I
Spell (1): Tumble

Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Shadow

Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Manyshot

Level 8 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Wild Empathy

Level 9 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Spell (2): Barkskin
Spell (2): Bear's Endurance
Spell (2): Camouflage, Mass
Spell (2): Cat's Grace
Spell (2): Cure Light Wounds
Spell (2): Hold Animal
Spell (2): Owl's Wisdom
Spell (2): Protection From Energy
Spell (2): Snare
Spell (2): Spike Growth
Spell (2): Summon Nature's Ally II

Level 10 (Wizard)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
Feat: (Automatic) Inscribe Scroll
Feat: (Automatic) Magical Training
Spell (1): Feather Fall
Spell (1): Shield
Spell (1): Detect Secret Doors
Spell (1): Expeditious Retreat
Spell (1): Nightshield

Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Automatic) Evasion (Ranger)

Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness

Level 13 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Precise Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Precise Shot
Spell (3): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (3): Neutralize Poison
Spell (3): Remove Disease
Spell (3): Summon Nature's Ally III
Spell (3): Wild Instincts

Level 14 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Fluidity I
Enhancement: Elven Arcanum I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elf Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Elf Melee Attack II
Enhancement: Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Elf Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Elven Perception I
Enhancement: Elven Perception II
Enhancement: Elven Keen Eyes I
Enhancement: Elven Keen Eyes II
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark I
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark II
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark III
Enhancement: Extra Dragonmark IV
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Ranger Search I
Enhancement: Ranger Search II
Enhancement: Ranger Search III
Enhancement: Ranger Spot I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I

QuantumFX
09-15-2007, 02:58 PM
Someone in the dragonmark thread mentioned that Extend works with dragonmarks. Might that be a little bit more effective? You could grab a level of Wizard instead of Sorc and take advantage of the INT synergy there. Also later on you could take a 2nd level of Wizzay and get the INT boost to help with rogue skills.

Geonis
09-15-2007, 03:04 PM
Someone in the dragonmark thread mentioned that Extend works with dragonmarks. Might that be a little bit more effective? You could grab a level of Wizard instead of Sorc and take advantage of the INT synergy there. Also later on you could take a 2nd level of Wizzay and get the INT boost to help with rogue skills.

****, how did I forget Extend? It was planned to be in there. I guess I will swap out for Wiz.

Geonis
09-15-2007, 03:05 PM
Someone in the dragonmark thread mentioned that Extend works with dragonmarks. Might that be a little bit more effective? You could grab a level of Wizard instead of Sorc and take advantage of the INT synergy there. Also later on you could take a 2nd level of Wizzay and get the INT boost to help with rogue skills.

Why did you scare me like that? I do have Extend in there. :eek:

As for why Sorc over Wiz, 120 SP.

Xyfiel
09-15-2007, 04:11 PM
Just doing the math to see why sorc over wizard

Both get magical training so that is moot
Sorc base 100sps+30EODB I + 1/20 item bonus at L20
Wiz Base 50sps+20EOS I +feat +20 modifier difference +arcanum I

Why not take extend as wiz feat and take mental toughness in extend's place?

Assuming 300 sps item at L20 for a extra 15 mana, sorc gives you 145 total for 1 ap. Wiz gives 205 for 2 ap, or 105 and an extra feat.


Lesser mark requires L6, I have my Ranger up to L7, and will have to wait till L12 before I get extend or wait on imp crit. You don't have a L12 feat listed.

Gl with the build, I took a fresh look at Elf after marks came out.

Jaysensen
09-15-2007, 04:33 PM
Dont forget the changes to Extend.

Are you really gonna need like 400 SP (with a Magi item)?

Geonis
09-15-2007, 04:41 PM
I'm doing some comparisons with Wiz vs Sorc now.

My real question, does the Search seem excessively low? Isn't the Crucible Elite (I think this is the right quest.) chest like a DC65? Is this this including the d20 or not? It has been a while since I've played a Rogue.

Jaysensen
09-15-2007, 04:47 PM
+13 item with G Hero is enough to find most traps. Dont even sweat "the trap." Building for that trap alone gimps you in other areas.

Dont forget things like Luck bonus (up to +2), Find Traps (+1 via scroll). Even Bard buffs.

Geonis
09-15-2007, 05:27 PM
+13 item with G Hero is enough to find most traps. Dont even sweat "the trap." Building for that trap alone gimps you in other areas.

Dont forget things like Luck bonus (up to +2), Find Traps (+1 via scroll). Even Bard buffs.



Well I did "find" 3 more points, +2 racial all elves get, and was able to get the 3rd rank of Ranger Search. This brought my total to +50, should be plenty.

QuantumFX
09-15-2007, 08:34 PM
Also for future resisting your build 2 levels of Wizzy will net you a +1 INT enhancement. Mix it with a Favor tome and voila a +1 to your DD and Search skills. Also, you'll have a reason to wear an INT item rather than having to remember to switch it out.

Hvymetal
09-17-2007, 06:41 AM
50 Search should be fine, no there is no d20 roll to search and "The Trap" is a 61 search DC.

tc12
09-17-2007, 12:49 PM
You list 4 starting tomes, none of which are CON. It'd be slightly more efficient to start with 13 CON plus a tome there for 14, to free two points to put across INT/WIS/CHA to not start with tomes there. Congrats if you're a powergamer who can start with 4 tomes on each new char, but thought you might care to save one however. :)

Also, the 14 INT base instead of eating the tome after creation gives you 4 more points. Then if as someone mentioned you later take a 2nd level of Wiz and the INT Enh, you could end up at 16 with the +1 tome. Or if you loot a +2 INT, etc. Either way, the 14 non-tome start gives you room to take what is the most important rogue stat up to the next level later. whereas 13 +1 locks you in there (excepting a still-rare +3 tome).

TC

Zenako
09-18-2007, 12:59 PM
You list 4 starting tomes, none of which are CON. It'd be slightly more efficient to start with 13 CON plus a tome there for 14, to free two points to put across INT/WIS/CHA to not start with tomes there. Congrats if you're a powergamer who can start with 4 tomes on each new char, but thought you might care to save one however. :)

Also, the 14 INT base instead of eating the tome after creation gives you 4 more points. Then if as someone mentioned you later take a 2nd level of Wiz and the INT Enh, you could end up at 16 with the +1 tome. Or if you loot a +2 INT, etc. Either way, the 14 non-tome start gives you room to take what is the most important rogue stat up to the next level later. whereas 13 +1 locks you in there (excepting a still-rare +3 tome).

TC


Agree a lot with this. Have no regrets with starting my Ranger/Rogue with a 14 base INT. Comes in real handy in lots of low level quests on Runes, gives more Skill points to play with and helps with a number of skills.

I gave up a little on starting CON. Not planning on being the main recipient of attacks, at least those that could hit me and with Evasion, most damage spells are reflex based so save = no damage = no worry about HP.

Geonis
09-30-2007, 07:34 PM
You list 4 starting tomes, none of which are CON. It'd be slightly more efficient to start with 13 CON plus a tome there for 14, to free two points to put across INT/WIS/CHA to not start with tomes there. Congrats if you're a powergamer who can start with 4 tomes on each new char, but thought you might care to save one however. :)

Also, the 14 INT base instead of eating the tome after creation gives you 4 more points. Then if as someone mentioned you later take a 2nd level of Wiz and the INT Enh, you could end up at 16 with the +1 tome. Or if you loot a +2 INT, etc. Either way, the 14 non-tome start gives you room to take what is the most important rogue stat up to the next level later. whereas 13 +1 locks you in there (excepting a still-rare +3 tome).

TC

Hmm, I don;t have the Con tome, but if I can trade a tome for one, then that frees up 2 points and let's me not need a tome for Int or Cha. I'll have to do some looking around.