Portable party fort

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Blazer]

In groups where you don't need to be a portable fort, what purpose do you serve?

Intimidate has a 10 sec cooldown, allowing for a 6 sec aggro lockdown. thus 4 sec where you don't have aggro on you. With no damage capability whatsoever, how do you get aggro back or maintain the aggro you have?

What kind of AC are you reaching with this build? To that end, why any Fighter's Armor Mastery enhancements with no real DEX to speak of?

No Combat Expertise? Tough to tank without CE.

Bullheaded and SF: Intimidate = overkill and unnecessary?

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[JelloMold]

While I love to encourage "funky" builds, I think this would have some limited appeal. This much specialization would make PUGging difficult. Even aggro magnet/turtle up tanks are often expected to dish out some hurting every now and then. For this build to shine it would have to be in a static group who was prepared to take advantage of the nuances of your build. Otherwise, you'd have to explain to each group you join how you plan to play the character. I'd imagine you'd have several folks who wouldn't want to adjust their playstyle that much, even if you are raising their chances of success.

[teddok]

I cant really seeing this build working out to well. I belive it would function right but the whole not doing any damage and just sitting there isnt going to work. There are very few quests were this build would be useful at all and he would be a hinderance in most.
Sorry man i just cant see it working out.

[Blazer]

My point about what purpose do you serve when you're not needed to intim everything in sight was directed towards play on normal and hard settings. Say you are level 5-6 and you're doing SC on normal/hard. There is no reason to intimidate and shield block stuff in there, it's an easy enough quest to DPS through. However, DPS is not what you can do. The intimitank builds presented on the fighter forums always start with more STR and take all the appropriate WF and WS feats. The point it they can dish out decent DPS when tanking is not necessary; not as much as a DPS build, obviously, but they can do fine. With this build, you cannot make that claim.

This build cannot double as a backup healer. Your SP pool is miniscule, you have no healing feats/enhancements, and you can't wand whip fast enough with a cure serious wand to actually have it make a difference.

I don't think you should count on the Paladin Divine Righteousness to compensate for the downtime between the 6 sec lockdown and the 10 sec recycle. That enhancement boosts the hate you generate with your attacks, but with no Weapon Focus, no Weapon Specialization feats, and a 14 STR, you're going to have a hard time actually hitting anything to generate said hate.

If you want CE, however, you'll need 13 INT. So a tome or a stat redistribution is necessary.

+6 DEX item puts you at 14 DEX (8 base), which is only +2 DEX in +5 FP, not +3. So you'll only need FAM I to fill this out. +15 from armor is all you're getting. And you'll need to strive to reach the pinnacle of AC since you'll be fighting in a globe meaning the usual buffs of Blur/Displacement/Recitation won't be present to boost your defenses.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Wizzly_Bear]

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[teddok]

Nope globe has always been like that.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Wizzly_Bear]

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[MeNorel]

Sounds like a very unique build, and would be great in a good bit of lower to mid level quests for keeping melee types at bay from the group but with mobs getting more and more powerful this would come far behind saving the party as Comet fall rains down, Disruption, Inflict serious wounds and other high level, high damage out put type spells that reach way beyond the affects that you portable fort could block.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Blazer]

May not be built for fighting, but even the tankiest tank CAN fight. You can not. Your class is titled FIGHTER after all. With 14 STR and full attack progression, you will dish out as much damage as an unbuffed bard, which while not negligible, is in fact marginal. Even bards that don't want to fight much take an Improved Critical feat. You did not.

You mentioned being a backup healer, nothing about a buffer. Your healing ability is limited since you've only got 7 levels of pally and no MT/IMT feats. Unless you're wearing the Sup. Dev. IV necklace that drops from the desert, your cure lights and mods are weak and you have very limited mana. You mention buffs but you really can't hand out any useful buffs either, since your Resist Energy only goes up to 20 pts.

+1 INT tome is not hard to come by, for sure. But now you're talking about a +2 DEX tome which means getting favor, raiding, or hoping that you can get an unbound one from somewhere.

Getting in the way of mobs? How exactly are you going to position yourself to be in the way of all the mobs, protecting your party at all times? Unless you're backing your party into a corner at every quest, I just don't see this happening. Something is going to slip by eventually, it's going to happen. There are some quests where you simply can't do this - Irestone comes to mind, Stormcleave too.

Globe has always worked that way, as Teddok pointed out.

Listen man, I'm not trying to rain on your parade, so please don't take it as such. I'm not attacking you, just pointing out what I see as large flaws in this design, that's all. I think a 7/7 split can be a solid intimidate/AC build, just not the way you are envisioning it. Ditch the dragonmarks since the globe doens't work the way you want it anyway, drop the CHA and CON a bit, reinvest those points into STR and DEX, take some combat feats, and I think you'll be better off.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Blazer]

*sigh*

I guess anytime someone points out shortcomings in a build of yours, you will take offense, won't you. Constructive criticism, you may have heard of it. Tone down the sensitivity man. If you're inferring "derision and detest" in my posts, then you are reading more into them then is really there. Or maybe you're just having a bad day, who knows. Whatever the case, my posts were not made with that feeling behind them.

Yes, resists and other buffs can be cast from wands, but they are cast at the lowest level and the lowest duration. They also therefore have the lowest possible DC when it comes to dispelling.

A "raid day with pop"? POP isn't a raid, it's a quest, and +2 tomes only dropped there during the +1 loot weekend. I'm guessing you misphrased your sentence here so I'm confused. +2 tomes do drop in raids, but they can be rare in some, not rare in others. I've gone on streaks of DQ raids where I've seen at least 1 tome drop for 5-6 straight raids; other times, a dozen raids without a tome. It's pretty random. The only tome you can ever count on is your 1750 favor tome.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Blazer]

Your build does have shortcomings and they were pointed out. So I'm not to use the word "shortcomings" to desribe them because you may take offense to that word? Shortcomings is hardly a derogatory or offensive word. Were I to have called them flaws or deficiencies, would that have made it any better? Would you have taken less offense to those words? Probably the only reason my posts were taken as offensive by you is because I'm the only one who went into any actual detail with my post, to point out specific flaws in your build. You got two other posts with comments along the lines of "I don't see this working out too well". I apologize for not providing such generic, non-specific replys as this.

I've been buffed by 14th level casters and had many buffs still standing after a dispel, this does happen often. It does indeed matter if the buff is from a caster or a wand.

[Dariuss]

Ok you guys need a time out

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[RandomToon]

The build will be fine for certain low level quests. The again, most builds are fine for low level quests. It will not be useful for most high level quests, not in the way that you are thinking. Simple facts are as follows:

1. You have gaps in your aggro control. You need alternative methods of controlling a crowd beyond intimidate.
2. You will not be able to block your friends forever. For starters, it is hard to block mobs with just 1 guy.
3. Golbe of invuln doesn't work the way you think. It never worked the way you think, and doesn't even work that way in table top. Minor Globe of Invuln blocks thrid level and lower spells, Globe of Invul blocks fourth and lower. You might remember keeping buffs in it because you had higher level buffs active.
4. Spells will kill you, and your friends. What do you do when comet fall, ball lightning, chain lightening, etc. starts to rain down on you? Sure, resist items (not the spell of course, since it would be supressed) help for normal and maybe even hard, but high end, won't work for elite. Also, they will eat up a lot of items for stats - 4 resists (lets assume no sonic) can eat up both rings, cloak, and force you into dragon scale armor. Plus you will need deathblock most likely on a necklace, and the delving boots for freedom of movement. Sounds like a huge item investment.
5. Without elite content, you will be very hard pressed to get the loot you may need for this to work.
6. You are not backup healing if your spells don't work in a globe.
7. When NOT doing the one niche role that you are built for, you are not very useful. Even the most niche, max int, 6 con, trap monkey rogues can still deal a ton of sneak attack damage...

In general, I think your build is junk. HOWEVER, the basic CONCEPT is ok if you do, indeed, play in a static group. To pull it off, you are just not going to be a melee character and you are not going to be the one in the ball. Make a 11Wiz/3Cleric 11Wiz/3Bard since bard songs don't get dispelled, and you can cast spells high enough level to work through globe. You will also get to PK for things that just don't want to stand in it. Cloud kill also works well if the tank can get it to stand in the globe. Get a competant intimitank that can do more than just intimidate, and then cast globe of invuln and him do all the work. It allows for your aggro holder to be effective, he gets to use a good build, you serve as a better backup healer/buffer, and get to have some use in the many many cases where the turtling tactic simply will not work. And if you REALLY think you can turtle "in every quest" then go run An Offering of Blood and tell me how long you can stand still and pull mobs to you...

[teddok]

dude, you say youre not attacking but your tone and sentence structure say otherwise. it smacks of derision and detest.

resists can be cast from wands as well as other spells

+2 tomes not that rare. do a raid day with pop and likely to see one. anyway, its just icing on cake. never seen +1 AC make or break anything

of course SOMEthing will get by SOMEtime. if he died, party didnt stay behind him, fighting in wrong terrain, et cetera. EVERY build has weaknesses and liabilities. if yours doesnt, please tell me what it is.

if teddok already pointed it out, and ive already stated that i tested and confirmed this, what is your point of saying it again unless you are in fact attacking?

and the point of the build was to make a dm viable character (other than halflling healer), not simply another turtle. due to game mechanics it doesnt work nearly as well as i had envisioned b/c i forgot about the exact manner in which globe operated, however, as is it is still far from useless. wouldnt count it as a win for dm viability though.

Ok you post your build on the Forums. Now by posting you open up for comments. We comment. Most of us are a little adverse to the build. You get upset. Why..... You asked our opions and we gave it. If you dont want the critsizem then dont post.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Aranticus]

have already stated that i was moving on from this build, why exactly are y'all pointing already acknowledged flaws? does it make them even more flawed if you, with your uber skills, point them out as well? and iirc, i didnt ask for any opinions. any1 can post if they want, doesnt really concern me who or what says what. and when did i get upset? :confused: lol, as ive told blazer when he brought this up in another area, i posted something, you like it or you dont, matters not to me, you tell me, fine, and when i dont like how you presented what you said, you think im upset.....why? were you upset when you didnt like what i originally posted? did some1 cast softskin on me without my noticing? lol, come on peopleyou'd have to try a lot harder to upset any1 on here. this is a forum....for a game....a pretend world. cant recall the last time i was upset, angry, sad, what have you here.

btw, teddok, it's criticism, not critsizem (read critsizeme? mmmmmm, critsizemy burger and fries please mister giant, lol)

dude, by posting in the strategy DISCUSSION forum, you are asking for comments for your build. if you are not looking for people to discuss your build, then do not post here! simple as that

what most pointed out is the most OBVIOUS flaw which you DID NOT acknowledge. you made your "tank" to be able to hold agro. there are 2 ways to do so, (a) intimidate and (b) massive damage. once your intimidate wears off and cool down is not over, how are you able to hold agro? if so how can you be a fort? now if you can address this issue, then you got it.

now on your build. i've done some preliminary calculations and arrived at an unbuffed ac of 45, prolly 49 with raid loot. this is hardly an ac should you wish to hold agro in elite GH quests. as mentioned in many threads, for ac to be significant in GH, a 55 or so is the bare minimum. to also try to get all the agro with 334 hp (assuming gtr false life and +6 con) is also hardly reliable. while heavy fort will help, mobs do an average of 20-40 damage per hit. the cleric will be having a hard time trying to keep you up when you are not avoiding any hits. with a high ac, 334 may be sufficient thou.

last but not least, i'm not sure if you know about this but intimidate has a limited radius centered about your char. did you factor this in?

[Staedtler]

Did I miss the memo about it becoming acceptable to assume a full set of +3 tomes?

[teddok]

Did I miss the memo about it becoming acceptable to assume a full set of +3 tomes?

In his defense he did admit that was a mistake when he was playing with the Char Gen.

[teddok]

have already stated that i was moving on from this build, why exactly are y'all pointing already acknowledged flaws? does it make them even more flawed if you, with your uber skills, point them out as well? and iirc, i didnt ask for any opinions. any1 can post if they want, doesnt really concern me who or what says what. and when did i get upset? :confused: lol, as ive told blazer when he brought this up in another area, i posted something, you like it or you dont, matters not to me, you tell me, fine, and when i dont like how you presented what you said, you think im upset.....why? were you upset when you didnt like what i originally posted? did some1 cast softskin on me without my noticing? lol, come on peopleyou'd have to try a lot harder to upset any1 on here. this is a forum....for a game....a pretend world. cant recall the last time i was upset, angry, sad, what have you here.

btw, teddok, it's criticism, not critsizem (read critsizeme? mmmmmm, critsizemy burger and fries please mister giant, lol)


Dude its stuff like this that makes us think your ****ed, that or you are baiting us on purpose to flame you. And then that blatiant insult about my spelling, OMG i post alot of my treads i cant spell worth ****. who cares really. It does not make me a lesser or dumber, it just means i cant spell for ****. You posted your build, we commented, u did not like what we said, fine big deal, coming out with BS like this though is not a good way to get you Infraction points and loss of respect.

[Wizzly_Bear]

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[Jaysensen]

i dont see how it would be a hard feat for some1 to have a full set anyway.

The droprate on +3 tomes is really low. REALLY LOW.

[RandomToon]

and with the soloability of the reaver, i dont see how it would be a hard feat for some1 to have a full set anyway.


The droprate on +3 tomes is really low. REALLY LOW.


You are right, Jaysensen.
Let's say that the drop rate is roughly 5% (but could be lower) of getting one in a chest. That is with both drops (at least, given my experience - your luck may vary).

So, we have to run the raid approximately 20 times to get 1 +3 Tome, assuming we win the roll (but for the sake of ease, let's say the build that REQUIRES a group to work and has no offensive ability can solo it, or he has really nice friends that are willing to give up all the tomes).

Now, that is for ONE tome. We need 5 more, but since we already have one, we have a 1 in 6 chance of getting a duplicate, then 2 in 6, etc. Given your dimishing odds of return, it could take Y E A R S to get all of them. Of course, if you run the raid on 3 different characters, and only bring this one in in the case of a needed tome, you can reduce that time to about 11 months.

Then again, you could get all six you need in your first six runs, or you could never get them - ever. Of course, there will be other ways to get those precious tomes - but that is not the issue here.

Do you see how it could be pretty hard to get a full set, even "given the soloability of the reaver raid"?

[Aranticus]

wow




just....wow




already stated, now multiple times, that i junked the build, and yet people still feel compelled to critique it. i assure you i am not upset, or offended, or ****ed as you said. and i was not insulting you. your spelling error (which we all make many of, including myself) just so happened to be in such a format that i thought of a joke that amused myself and i felt compelled to post it in hopes that you all would lighten up. apparently i missed the memo where this was to be a serious discussion only thread. as this thread is seriously lacking in humor qand interest i have unsubscribed from it and will leave it to its own devices.

and yes, my first time using character generator so i was having fun playing with tomes. never seen a build where tomes were a 'make or break' situation. and with the soloability of the reaver, i dont see how it would be a hard feat for some1 to have a full set anyway.

READ the forums guideline!!!!!

"1. While participating in The Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach Community Forums, you must respect the rights of others to participate in the community. To this end you may not harass, defraud, threaten or cause distress and/or unwanted attention to other members. This includes, but is not limited to:

-Name-calling or other insults
-Posting with the intent of provoking another user or users
-Flaming another user for their spelling or grammar
-Bringing disagreements with someone into unrelated threads"

Quote from Cubey

[Staedtler]

Do you see how it could be pretty hard to get a full set, even "given the soloability of the reaver raid"?

Don't forget that in mod5 the mechanic for raid loot makes it even harder to get a full set by soloing.

To be specific, "harder" = "pretty much impossible"